According to WSJ we will see the dumbed down handheld revision of the Switch before the "Pro" model which was rumored to be delayed.
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Evidence growing that new Switch models will use die shrunk Tegra X1 variant, same as new Shield TV models.
- Thread starter Inugami
- Start date
According to WSJ we will see the dumbed down handheld revision of the Switch before the "Pro" model which was rumored to be delayed.
Whatever Nintendo is doing, it's absolutely not going to be a PS4 to Pro/One S to One X split. Unless you want to go with the upcoming cheaper option, you won't go wrong with the current hardware.
Sorry it was a mistranslation from USgamer on a Nikkei article
They were referring to a next gen system, no media outlet has spoken about the Pro model being delayed, I think both will be announced at same time.Sorry it was a mistranslation from USgamer on a Nikkei article
Switch Pro is the next gen system cause there is really not such thing as a next gen Nintendo console at this stage, they've been very clear on how long they want this gen to last.
I don't know about that, simply saying Nikkei wasn't talking about Switch Pro but a new gen system, like many many years away and with no project leader.
If you don't care about power, then why not put an RTX 2080Ti and a Ryzen 3950X, consume 300W in the Switch form factor and be done with it?Nvidia has stated the 1.5TFLOPs GPU number for Parker, that requires a 1.5GHz GPU clock for the chip. I'm not talking about power consumption. I'm not interested in arguing with you about power consumption or what is possible with clocks. This is where I got the info: "NVIDIA quotes an FP16 rate of 1.5 TFLOPs for Parker, which implies a GPU clockspeed of around 1.5GHz. This is consistent with other Pascal-based GPUs in that NVIDIA seems to have invested most of their 16nm gains into ramping up clockspeeds rather than making for wider GPUs." What you are talking about is this here:
What you are looking at is a single die "apu" and with both CPUs with max clocks, the GPU is held to 1.302GHz, but that is not to say that the GPU cannot hit a higher profile. Tegra X2 is sold in many places with the specs list of 1.5TFLOPs (fp16) on the GPU, Switch won't use Denver at all, so the performance numbers in this chart is irrelevant.
The Switch is a mobile platform, it runs on a battery, it has limited cooling, power is the single most important metric of them all. And the specs of the Tegra Parker are very clear! You can expect to run the A57 cluster at 2GHZ and the GPU at 1.12GHZ and have a TDP (Which Nvidia uses as the excess heat dissipated by the core, aka the power the chip itself consumes) of 15W. And if you run at 1.2GHZ and 854MHZ, you can expect the chip to consume 7.5W, under heavy load. It's clear as day, there's nothing to interpret.
Of course, you can set the A57 cluster to 2GHZ and the GPU to 1.6GHZ and get the performance of an Xbox One out of the Tegra Parker, but you'd be consuming, what, 30W? and needing a kind of cooling and battery that the Switch cannot even dream of providing.
This isn't a PC. You cannot just clock the chip higher and throw more cooling at it. There's a very real limit that comes from the form factor of the system.
You wouldn't need anywhere near that performance in undocked mode anyway.
384 GF undocked probably makes most PS4/XB1/PC able to run on the Switch, The Witcher 3 can run at 153 TF which is impressive.
It's not about matching a XB1 even spec for spec. Just about opening up more types of games that can come to the platform.
A 12nm equivalent to a Parker chip would consume less power too.
So it's the perfect time for me to jump in on the Switch and I get to buy another Shield TV; sweet.
Reminder that if this is just a 14nm of the X1 like suspected this would have been vastly available in early 2017 when the console launched but we didn't get it because freaking cheap ass Nintendo.
Do we have an idea how many watts the current Switch's CPU and GPU draw? If we do, then that could help get an idea of how feasible that 7.5W power profile is.
Edit: I found this image:
According to Digital Foundry, Switch specs for CPU are at 1020 MHz, so that gives a power consumption of around 1.83W for the 4 A57 CPU cores. Next question is the GPU power consumption, which is probably more difficult to find...
I'm not talking to you about power consumption. That doesn't mean I don't care about it or that it doesn't matter. We don't actually know what Mariko is, it could use an ARM A73 core, which would drastically reduce power consumption, it would be 12nm and not 16nm, which allows the power consumption to drop again. I don't want to throw around guesses about what it can do with you, I had you on ignore until recently because we spent 20+ pages of discussion about it, back and forth, in circles, in the WSJ article, please lets just drop the subject between us until the device specs are revealed, should be announced in ~7 weeks and released mid September if I'm right about the August drought.
The Switch undocked clocks the GPU as high as 460MHz in some games... Zelda, Mario and MK11, I imagine The Witcher 3 is taking advantage of that, offering 235 GFLOPs.
There is a retail release every week of June, July and September. There is nothing after July 26th (Fire Emblem) and before August 30th (Astral Chain). There is an announcement in the first 10 days of August, about the new Switch models IMO. Then it will release in mid September.
Announcement could be literally every day now that E³ is over. Some speculation that it might be around the date where Nintendo has their financial meeting end of next month, i think it's due before Gamescom, at latest at Gamescom.
Release, pretty sure they're trying to launch prior or together with Pokemon, for the more portable version. Pro ... no idea.
E: Fixed the date as the financial stuff is apparently in July and not June.
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I'll just add that Nintendo's quarterly earnings release is on July 30, and they've announced "surprise" hardware revisions alongside those in recent memory (New 2DS XL).
The Switch consumes 7.1 watts in portable mode while playing Zelda (GPU @460mhz), that is for the entire system with the brightness all the way down. We know that with the Screen on max brightness, it consumes 9 watts, and we know that with the device docked and the screen off, the Switch consumes 11 watts. There is the dock, which consumes over 1 watt when in use.Do we have an idea how many watts the current Switch's CPU and GPU draw? If we do, then that could help get an idea of how feasible that 7.5W power profile is.
Edit: I found this image:
According to Digital Foundry, Switch specs for CPU are at 1020 MHz, so that gives a power consumption of around 1.83W for the 4 A57 CPU cores. Next question is the GPU power consumption, which is probably more difficult to find...
There is no perfect way to know without doing heavy testing, but the screen with minimum brightness is probably drawing ~1 watt, so the consumption of the device when portable and playing zelda is around ~6 watts. There are other components in the Switch which have to draw power too, including the ram, so you are looking at ~4 watts for the Tegra X1 at 1GHz CPU and 460MHz GPU. We can also figure out that the GPU when clocked at 768MHz, and the RAM clocked higher to 1600MHz, consumes 3 more watts than in portable mode.
Yep, this is when I have it being announced, but you can never be too sure with Nintendo, however with the drought, and the large launch of new titles starting September 13th, looking like a launch line up imo. They will have to announce no later than 30 days before then, in order to have preorders go up in Japan.
The Switch runs the GPU at 196 and even 235GFLOPs and apparently can cycle between modes according to Digital Foundry.
We don't know exactly how much the SoC consumes. The Switch itself consumes from the wall (The whole system) up to slightly above 11W when it's not charging the battery, at stock clocks.Do we have an idea how many watts the current Switch's CPU and GPU draw? If we do, then that could help get an idea of how feasible that 7.5W power profile is.
Edit: I found this image:
According to Digital Foundry, Switch specs for CPU are at 1020 MHz, so that gives a power consumption of around 1.83W for the 4 A57 CPU cores. Next question is the GPU power consumption, which is probably more difficult to find...
So considering it has to power everything else, including redundant power delivery, USB, Display port to HDMI, etc. In order to make the dock work, I'd say (And DF said as well in their Warframe video) maybe about 7W for the whole SoC? (Talking about docked here)
The annual meeting of the shareholders is at the end of this month, the earnings report for the April-June quarter is at the end of next month.
It's more likely that they would announce news regarding new products alongside a quarterly earnings report; the meeting of the shareholders is usually more about "business stuff" like passing measures and re-electing people to the board and the like.
People need to stop with this 3ds to n3ds comparison.
The n3ds got double the cores, double the ram, nearly quadruple the clockspeed and a dedicated video decoder.
It wasn't just a "bump".
If anything, the New 3DS's technical advantages were severely underutilized. It would have been nice to see more exclusive/enhanced games.
Man, Nintendo's hardware story was a mess last gen, wasn't it? New 3DS, 2DS, Wii U...I loved their hardware, but I'm glad they've settled on a course of action that's a little more...comprehensible. I could be happy getting a faster/better Switch every other year forever.
I would wait if you can. z0m3le is very clued up and expects a reveal in late July / early August but I suppose they might not be released until Winter.
I'd consider myself quite the snob when it comes to resolution / framerate but tbh in 95% of cases the current Switch is fine. I don't particularly mind sub 720p in handheld mode because the screen is so small and for docked play I literally just move my seat back a few feet and sub 1080p isn't that bothersome. Of course the fact most exclusives target 60fps helps a lot.
Sorry that wasn't much help lol. It's a difficult decision to make at this time especially considering the original Switch has barely dropped price wise. All the best.
It seems mdarcy would contain Mariko, but what's tenuous is that the specs of mdarcy that are available for developers could easily be a placeholder.
We also know from the most recent WSJ article that these new models have both started development, 3+ months until mid September. I could be wrong, but it does seem to line up for that time frame.
I think people expecting a Switch Pro akin to a PS4 Pro will be disappointed. A slightly bigger screen, better battery life and the ability to record more than 30 seconds are likely and games with dynamic resolution / framerate will probably be more stable on Switch "Pro", but it won't be a noticeable bump. Nintendo doesn't care about the spec war.
Remember the New 3DS was advertised first and foremost for the faster loading time on Miiverse / the browser and the Super Stable 3D and only a handful of games were exclusive or were noticeably better.
Remember the New 3DS was advertised first and foremost for the faster loading time on Miiverse / the browser and the Super Stable 3D and only a handful of games were exclusive or were noticeably better.
Witcher 3 runs on a 235GFLOPs handheld, it's one of the most demanding games this generation. That current handheld can run at 768MHz as we've seen with hacked Switch units, giving 393GFLOPs, this upgraded unit will be fine, I don't know how powerful it will be, but The Witcher 3 is honestly one of those key pieces of software, if it can run that game, there is very little that the Switch can't run, and I'd say if they do increase to docked clocks on the current Switch, it should handle any game that the current consoles can run. A pro model will just run that same game with something closer to Xbox 1 specs, I don't know how much closer, the current Switch when docked and without mixed precision is somewhere around 42% as powerful, so anywhere from 60% to 85% is reasonable.
As games start using mixed precision more and more, you can see that performance number increase by maybe 50% more. Mariko isn't known yet, but the hope is that Nvidia will detail the new Mariko chip around late July, which is a product for the general market, and not a custom part for Nintendo, it also isn't 210b, it was just part of the same development team's projects, but has completely different profiles.
The 3DS API doesn't allow for automatically better performance from better specs. The Switch API does, and has shown to work that way via the hacking scene. Every Nintendo handheld has had upgraded hardware via it's refreshes, this is the first time that upgrade will automatically be applied to it's entire library of software, I don't think there is any history to stand on here, and even if there was, we are 2 presidents of Nintendo, removed away from the one who launched the n3DS. Frankly, we don't know what we should expect beyond a spec upgrade of some sort, but that upgrade will be translated to games, if it's a 10% bump, that is fine too, you just can't throw yourself into depression because a product doesn't happen to reach your vision of what it should be, it's a bit silly that people try to control other people's expectations so much. Just talk about what you think it is, no need to tell others how they should feel about a product based on your guess about such a product.
Yes, Nintendo tends to focus on upgrading user experience primarily. I sort of expect the Pro/Plus will go this route with things like improved recording options, maybe a built in streaming setup, longer battery life, improved screen with smaller bezels, maybe a camera, maybe 4k output/upscaling, more internal storage, etc. It won't be positioned as a "Switch 1.5" though the way PS4 Pro and XBOX were, more just a improved newer premium model with some new stuff like they did with DSi and n3DS.
Android 16 got crushed by Imperfect Cell. Switch should be Android 17.
I thought it was heavily speculated that the TX1 in this listing was a placeholder.
Whatever you want to think about the Switch pro or next gen or whatnot, the WSJ has reported that both a cheaper, more portable Switch and an upgraded Switch are both currently being produced, so clearly nothing is delayed until next year.
Whatever you want to think about the Switch pro or next gen or whatnot, the WSJ has reported that both a cheaper, more portable Switch and an upgraded Switch are both currently being produced, so clearly nothing is delayed until next year.
The GT1030 is actually 14nm, Samsung's process iirc, but it's the only part I know of like this, just about everything is exclusively TSMC.
z0m3le
After The Witcher 3 running on a 235GFLOPs handheld, anything is possible. That port will shut a lot of people up, no matter what resolution or framerate it runs at as a ton of people said it was "impossible".
Even if the newer model is just a chip shrink we should get at least a 10% GPU bump which will help TW3 get to 720p all the time a ton. I'm hoping for a 2-300MHz clock speed on the CPU aswell as double the memory bandwidth to boot.
Do you think a memory bandwidth increase is likely? Having 50GB/s over 25 would be a big help for higher resolution games as in some cases I don't actually think it's a "flop" issue but bandwidth issue failing to feed the fillrate.
After The Witcher 3 running on a 235GFLOPs handheld, anything is possible. That port will shut a lot of people up, no matter what resolution or framerate it runs at as a ton of people said it was "impossible".
Even if the newer model is just a chip shrink we should get at least a 10% GPU bump which will help TW3 get to 720p all the time a ton. I'm hoping for a 2-300MHz clock speed on the CPU aswell as double the memory bandwidth to boot.
Do you think a memory bandwidth increase is likely? Having 50GB/s over 25 would be a big help for higher resolution games as in some cases I don't actually think it's a "flop" issue but bandwidth issue failing to feed the fillrate.
Nah base cell is what's being referred to. Android 16 had a edge over him in the later half of that fight and Cell had to absorb 17.
I must be the only person excited for the lite version. As someone who hasn't bought a Switch yet, a cheaper version with better battery life sounds great. I do all my gaming handheld in bed anyway.
If that is what the Switch Lite will be, I'll take it.
Cell has the Destructo Disc and Taioken so Android 16 was never going to win.
Well, they realeased the first one in 2015, then 2017, we are in 2019...
Considering also how they sell the current 2017 model with a Frankenstein ZigBee adapter it was pretty much a given we are getting a new 2019 model and I bet with built in ZigBee.
In the speculation thread we were thinking 12nm
The original die shrink was to 16nm for their X2 and that's an outside possibility as well. 12nm seems more likely