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EW: Kevin Feige and Tom Holland talk Spider-Man

Chaos Legion

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,922
Cocksman said:
This guy apparently was the first to report that Spidey would be In Civil War fwiw

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What a load of shit. He essentially didn't say anything that hasn't already been said but now is an insider (who I assume didn't learn ahead of times that Sony/Marvel would split).
 
Richiek

Richiek

Member
Nov 2, 2017
12,063
Daverytimes said:
We will see, Sony's highs are higher than Disney/Marvel and their lows are lower too. What they need is consistency, consistently puting out good movies. That's one thing Marvel has done well, no movie in the MCU is "Great"
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There's a reason why the MCU/Disney is so successful among the public and the box office while Sony Pictures is floundering. Sony doesn't have anybody that can ensure a consistent quality of films like Feige and I highly doubt they can match the MCU's success if they choose to go it alone with Spidey.
 
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Halbrand

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
Eh, I don't know about his Civil War story but in 2015 this guy was saying Marvel and Fox were planning an Avengers/X-Men movie for 2020.
 
Alice

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
I think, when talking about Venom BO Numbers, one needs to remember that there was a whole damn lot of Sony pretending that Venom is MCU, and Disney not doing anything to stop them from doing it. Plenty of casual fans I know went to see it, believing it's an MCU entry.
 

Daverytimes

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,108
Watchtower said:
I mean, director Andy Serkis isn't exactly a proven commodity and screenwriter Kelly Marcel doesn't have the biggest track record either, with her biggest credit admittedly being Saving Mr. Banks. And then of course there's Tom Hardy and Woody Harrelson.

In terms of creatives there's been far bigger red flags, but I'm....not exactly sure where the confidence is coming from? Unless I'm like missing a bit or something
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Maybe you are missing something, maybe not, we will see when the movie comes out.
My confidence comes from Andy, Robert and Woody being well acquainted, they understand each other and that often leads to a better movie.
If andy is involved, Imaginarium could also be involved which would help, Richardson being the cinematographer is perhardps one of the biggest strengths of the movie.
I just have a feeling everything will come together, even if it doesn't it will still be a fun movie.
With the MCU out of the picture Venom could be much darker than it was which will lead to a much better movie.
 
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ArchedThunder

ArchedThunder

Uncle Beerus
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,068
I'm glad to hear that a lot of sources are talking about talks being in a better place now, I just hope a deal can be made soon so this can all be put behind us.
 
Phantom_Snake

Phantom_Snake

The Fallen
Jul 26, 2018
3,778
Montana
Drewton said:
I think it would be too early for Venom, but if it had to be imagine if Peter came home from space after IW with Venom attached to the iron Spider suit
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I like it. I don't know much about Knull besides he's like the first symbiote or their God or something like that. But say we're lucky enough to have Spider-Man properties long term in the MCU, would that be a character anyone would like to see down the line at some point?
 
Cuburger

Cuburger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,975
Seems ironic that Spider-Man get introduced in Civil War in the movies and in the Civil War comics, two sides are fighting over Spider-Man after his identity is revealed to the public.

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Fj0823

Fj0823

Legendary Duelist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,663
Costa Rica
I'd take an Incredible Hulk'd Venom in the MCU were any reference to that movie is kept at the absolute minimum in favor of the better entries
 
Cuburger

Cuburger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,975
Drewton said:
I think it would be too early for Venom, but if it had to be imagine if Peter came home from space after IW with Venom attached to the iron Spider suit
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I was hoping that they were going to do that.

They could have had the symbiote escape from the Collector's collection. It could have been so perfect, but alas, Sony controls Venom and Marvel only was working with Spider-Man.
 
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Halbrand

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
Cuburger said:
I was hoping that they were going to do that.

They could have had the symbiote escape from the Collector's collection. It could have been so perfect, but alas, Sony controls Venom and Marvel only was working with Spider-Man.
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It would also help to bring things full circle with his Iron Man arc. Like how Tony accidentally created so many villains, Venom is Peter's creation. And Venom attaching itself to the Iron spider suit could force Peter to destroy it.
 
Trup1aya

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,363
The Artisan said:
But they can't. Spiderman is one major character with a bunch of supporting characters. The MCU is made up of major characters and supporting characters on top of that. It's not the fucking same.
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Tbf, the MCU is made up of a bunch of characters whom most wouldn't have suspected could lead successful solo franchises. The Spider-man IP has several heroes in it whose mass appeal is less questionable than Thor's, Iron man, Captain America Captain Marvel and Black Panthers would have been 10 years ago.

Sony obviously can't replicate the scale of the MCU. But they think the characters they do have can lead billion dollar solo films and garner massive excitement around the inevitable ensemble films.
 
Nightengale

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
BringBackSonics said:
I'm just trying to think of what Sony would want. I thought they wanted venom
In MCU?
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From the perspective where two separate universes co-exist ( the MCU and the Venomverse ) - there is one area of the relationship where I see Sony thinking that they aren't able to maximise the benefits.

Aka "How can the Venomverse movies benefit from MCU/Spider-Man."

Right now, the standalone Spider-Man films benefit from the MCU integration, and MCU as a whole benefits from Spidey. It's a win-win relationship... but only when it applies to Tom Holland alone.

But on the other side, it also means that Venomverse movies are eternally handicapped by them not being able to integrate the core character of the franchise, Spider-Man into those movies. And that will definitely have an effect in terms of building a richer universe and making things click.

The easiest solution to the above - is for select Venomverse characters to b converted/adopted into the MCU, but we know that is harder than it sounds. Marvel/Disney is already unhappy with needing to have the current 95/5 relationship with standalone Spidey flicks, imagine if they double that with Marvel Studios also needing to produce MCU Venom movies.

Or the other alternative.

Is what's happening now - where Spidey breaks away from MCU ( and presumably hurts its box office potential ) - but Spidey in Venomverse would be a boost to other Venomverse movies if suddenly Spidey can meet up with Venom and Black Cat.
 
Alexandros

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
17,812
Manmademan said:
The MCU is literally built on the back of characters no one cared about. Forget Iron Man and Captain America for a second, since most people at least had heard of them.

We got films out of Ant Man, Black Panther, The Guardians of the Galaxy, Dr. Strange, and Captain Marvel. Captain Marvel wasn't just a property no one had heard of, it was a property that had repeatedly failed to get anyone interested in it despite numerous reboots since the 1970s. Carol isn't even the first Captain Marvel, she's something like the 5th or 6th and her books were struggling too before the feature film. Forget "depth of character" this was a character actively loathed by comic fans. Now she's A-list.

We got Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, and an Iron Fist TV show on netflix for multiple seasons each.

We're getting a Black Widow Film, a Hawkeye TV show, a Moon Knight(?!) film, the Eternals, and Shang-Chi.

Saying Black Cat or Morbius "don't have the footprint" for a feature film while Shang Chi and the Eternals do is nonsense. It's about the concept, not name recognition.
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True, but pedigree and the larger existing universe played a huge part in those fringe Marvel characters finding success. Many people went to see them because of the MCU connection, because the universe around them is compelling by itself. Sony doesn't have that factor yet and I very much doubt that they will ever get a successful Spider-man cinematic universe off the ground. Every other studio that tried to do the cinematic universe thing for big properties has failed miserably.
 
Nightengale

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
Alexandros said:
True, but pedigree and the larger existing universe played a huge part in those fringe Marvel characters finding success. Many people went to see them because of the MCU connection, because the universe around them is compelling by itself. Sony doesn't have that factor yet and I very much doubt that they will ever get a successful Spider-man cinematic universe off the ground. Every other studio that tried to do the cinematic universe thing for big properties has failed miserably.
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This is true, but here's also the other thing imo.
Regardless of whether or not Spidey stays in the MCU or not - Sony intends to continue pursuing a cinematic universe of its own.
And the small sliver of chance that a Spidey Cinematic Universe can be successful needs Spider-Man to actually exist within that universe.
 
Trup1aya

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,363
Alexandros said:
True, but pedigree and the larger existing universe played a huge part in those fringe Marvel characters finding success. Many people went to see them because of the MCU connection, because the universe around them is compelling by itself. Sony doesn't have that factor yet and I very much doubt that they will ever get a successful Spider-man cinematic universe off the ground. Every other studio that tried to do the cinematic universe thing for big properties has failed miserably.
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But Sony doesn't doubt themselves the way you doubt them.

Typically, their Spider-Man movies performed as well as or better than MCU films. They think that with a better approach to budgeting and a better understanding of comic book world building they can maintain consistency this time around.

The MCU universe isn't compelling by nature. Marvel put out a string of movies of varying levels of quality that ultimately lead to a universe that viewers find so compelling that they are willing Go see movies about characters they knew nothing about. Marvel made it compelling

I've got my doubts about Sony too, but who's to say they won't find the right people for the jobs this time? From a quality standpoint, I think they got off on the wrong foot with Venom. That said, I think the early years of the MCU weren't perfect either...

Nightengale said:
This is true, but here's also the other thing imo.
Regardless of whether or not Spidey stays in the MCU or not - Sony intends to continue pursuing a cinematic universe of its own.
And the small sliver of chance that a Spidey Cinematic Universe can be successful needs Spider-Man to actually exist within that universe.
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This is true, but does it have to be Peter Parker? I don't neccisarily think so.
 
Trup1aya

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,363
Chaos Legion said:
It's already fallen apart LMAO.

I want MCU Spider-Man. I want Scarlett Spider in the SUMC so the spin-offs can interact with a Spider-hero. I don't know why Sony and Marvel can't get to that understanding.
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Because Tom Hardy's Peter Parker is an already proven entity. For both parties - leveraging this characters values shorting the other party.
 
MoonToon

MoonToon

Banned
Nov 9, 2018
2,029
BringBackSonics said:
I'm just trying to think of what Sony would want. I thought they wanted venom
In MCU?
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I think what Sony wants is their own SCU. They've said this many times, have e-mails leaked where they think the Sinister Six a 2bill idea and they try to make tons of shit anytime a breeze flows through their heads. They clearly don't care about the fact that this latest SM is set in the MCU and even encourage people to think there's a connection with the "oh, Tom's SM is in the MCU but he's also in this world with Venom whose kinda to the side of the MCU .. :3" bullshit but they want to make their own SCU that they control.

Problem is that I think the "Live action Spider-Man?!? Lets go see it!" button only extends as far as Venom. Like the ASM films show that people will show up just for Spider-Man even if it's trash (SM3 did so well as a result of people LOVING SM2 IMO, so good or bad it was always gonna make more than 2).

Sony either doesn't see it this way or are afraid it's the case but wont let go of this SCU dream. I mean ... they've been talking about this Silver and Black and black cat shit for 10 years now with nothing to show for it. Morbus or w/e will be the real test.
 
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Halbrand

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
Tom Holland:

"I'm just so grateful that Marvel changed my life and allowed my dreams to come true and Sony allowing me to continue living my dream. It's a crazy week and it's never been done before so we'll see how it goes and it'll be as amazing and as fun.
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I hate the lack of new news
 
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The King beyond the wall

The King beyond the wall

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
977
I love Tom Holland's Spider-Man and the MCU, but I have to say that, from a business perspective, Sony really do have a lot of potential in terms of creating their own cinematic universe with the Spider-Man properties. There are so many heroes and villains that they could work with, many of whom could easily carry films on their own and contribute to a Spidey/Sony Cinematic Universe (SCU).

Venom seemed to suggest that they were heading in that direction, but such a universe without Spider-Man seems a little redundant. Obviously it appears very difficult for Tom Holland's Spidey to be in both the MCU and the SCU, so I wonder if they could just go ahead and cast a Miles Morales Spider-Man for this, or a Spider-Gwen maybe. Such an action would inevitably scuttle a lot of Feige's plans though, if Spider-Man does indeed remain with the MCU.

The other elephant in the room is that Sony have not been very successful in recent years with their own live action Spidey movies (Amazing Spider-Man 1 and 2 and Venom) so whether they would even have the ability to make this work is another question.

Still, from a selfish point of view, I hope Disney and Sony can come to an arrangement because I really love MCU spidey.
 
Trup1aya

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,363
The King beyond the wall said:
I love Tom Holland's Spider-Man and the MCU, but I have to say that, from a business perspective, Sony really do have a lot of potential in terms of creating their own cinematic universe with the Spider-Man properties. There are so many heroes and villains that they could work with, many of whom could easily carry films on their own and contribute to a Spidey/Sony Cinematic Universe (SCU).

Venom seemed to suggest that they were heading in that direction, but such a universe without Spider-Man seems a little redundant. Obviously it appears very difficult for Tom Holland's Spidey to be in both the MCU and the SCU, so I wonder if they could just go ahead and cast a Miles Morales Spider-Man for this, or a Spider-Gwen maybe. Such an action would inevitably scuttle a lot of Feige's plans though, if Spider-Man does indeed remain with the MCU.

The other elephant in the room is that Sony have not been very successful in recent years with their own live action Spidey movies (Amazing Spider-Man 1 and 2 and Venom) so whether they would even have the ability to make this work is another question.

Still, from a selfish point of view, I hope Disney and Sony can come to an arrangement because I really love MCU spidey.
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Sony's Spiderman movies were well liked enough by viewers. While they weren't fantastic from a quality standpoint, The problem For Sony was that they were spending too much money producing them.

ASM2 cost the studio $255 million to make.
Homecoming cost the studio $175million to make and FFH cost just $160.

If Sony could have kept their budgets in check, they would have happily carried on with Amazing Spiderman. Venom was, by all accounts except critical reception, an undeniable success.

I'd argue that their last 3 films without Marvel and the last 2 with Marvel show a consistency to do well at the box office, and that they've learned how to budget. The lingering question, IMO is whether or not they've learned from Marvel how to improve the quality of their comic book story telling.
 
The King beyond the wall

The King beyond the wall

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
977
Trup1aya said:
Sony's Spiderman movies were well liked enough by viewers. While they weren't fantastic from a quality standpoint, The problem For Sony was that they were spending too much money producing them.

ASM2 cost the studio $255 million to make.
Homecoming cost the studio $175million to make and FFH cost just $160.

If Sony could have kept their budgets in check, they would have happily carried on with Amazing Spiderman. Venom was, by all accounts except critical reception, an undeniable success.

I'd argue that their last 3 films without Marvel and the last 2 with Marvel show a consistency to do well at the box office, and that they've learned how to budget. The lingering question, IMO is whether or not they've learned from Marvel how to improve the quality of their comic book story telling.
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Absolutely, and the fact that each of the ASM movies and Venom made $700-850 million at the box office, despite all being panned critically, shows that there is very much an audience for these movies, whether or not they are in the MCU.

Obviously with Homecoming and Far From Home Sony made a lot more money on smaller budgets ($900 million -1.1 billion), showing that the Feige and MCU factor have a strong effect (and also the fact that these were great movies) - but still, if Sony are able to produce quality movies without Disney's input there is no reason not to believe they could approach these numbers.

But the problem is that there is minimal evidence at the moment that Sony could produce a SM film to the same quality as the MCU entries. However, even if they can't, they are still looking at a property that will yield them at least $700 million regardless of quality per film, and then there is all the other Sony Cinematic Universe movies to think about too.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 28, 2017
9,377
Trup1aya said:
This is true, but does it have to be Peter Parker? I don't neccisarily think so.
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I really don't think Marvel's contract with Sony for MCU Spider-Man allowed any alternative Spider-Man in the Sony movies, otherwise they'd have inserted something in Venom. It's pretty telling that they're considering spin-offs with random characters before other Spider-men. Maybe if Marvel had stepped back on that and allowed Miles, 2099, Superior or Scarlet Spider to be in those then they'd have an easier time at negotiations.

Trup1aya said:
Sony's Spiderman movies were well liked enough by viewers. While they weren't fantastic from a quality standpoint, The problem For Sony was that they were spending too much money producing them.
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They were on a downwards trajectory after rebooting too, which likely played into that.
 
Trup1aya

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,363
NeonZ said:
I really don't think Marvel's contract with Sony for MCU Spider-Man allowed any alternative Spider-Man in the Sony movies, otherwise they'd have inserted something in Venom. It's pretty telling that they're considering spin-offs with random characters before other Spider-men. Maybe if Marvel had stepped back on that and allowed Miles, 2099, Superior or Scarlet Spider to be in those then they'd have an easier time at negotiations.



They were on a downwards trajectory after rebooting too, which likely played into that.
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I'm not sure whether or not the original deal allowed other spider-men. But if there is another deal that allows Holland's Parker to return to MCU, then it would be unwise for Sony to not ensure they have have the ability to use other iterations, I'm there own movies

There was a downward trajectory for the reboot movies - but that's a lot easier to stomach if they weren't spending obscene amount of money on productions. If they were making huge profits despite the downturn, then they would just be trying to tweak the formula rather than running to marvel for help
 
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