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The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,958
It's worth noting that The Verge editor-in-chief complained about Save You A Click back in 2014, which became a minor meme.

This was around the same time that Nilay lost his shit on people making fun of him for wearing those spiked bracelets.

Kudos to Vox in general though for legitimately pivoting away from their trash over the last few years. Nilay, of course, is incapable of long-term thinking but luckily the network has a ton of really talented people and realized that long term there's much less money in clickbait than in legitimate deep dives and interesting articles. So you've seen them make these big investments in Vox, The Ringer, Recode, SB Nation, and other good online brands and that's what's carrying them forward as a leader in online content production... WHile their original brands that they launched with, The Verge or Polygon, have just continued to go down the short term news trash heap.
 

Skiptastic

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,681
Thank you for this thread, because I learned that Expendable/DanielPlainview/whatever from GAF started the SYAC. I was not aware of that!
 

ShadowSwordmaster

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,476
If you check the twitter right now, you can see this account checked on certain websites about the date for Game of Thrones Season 8.
 

SJurgenson

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,239
It's worth noting that The Verge editor-in-chief complained about Save You A Click back in 2014, which became a minor meme.

Nilay Patel said:
Arguing that it's not because the headline is phrased in the form of a question is reductive to the point of absurdity, just like arguing against lists or quizzes or gifs or any specific form of art is absurd.

When your classifying 'lists' as a 'form of art', I'm not sure you on the winning side of the debate.

In the article, Patel's main argument seems to be that SYAC somehow lessened the authors work by summarizing it down to a pithy tweet -- that SYAC is at fault here for taking the authors long-form article and reducing all of it to a simple 'no'.

Nowhere in there is any self-reflection, or any blame whatsoever as to The Verge's culpability in lessening the author's work.

Here's the thing: The Verge (be it the author, an editor, or a headline writer) was responsible for 99% in the reduction of a detailed, informative, and interactive article about The Sopranos to the point where 'no' could somehow be an outright and fatal assault on the piece.

They didn't title the 5,000 word feature "Reflections on The Sopranos by David Chase", or "We talked to David Chase about his feelings on The Sopranos all these years later" -- you know, something that at least hints at the depth and complexity of the work.

They titled it "Did Tony die at the end of The Sopranos?"

It's a good piece! But The Verge covered it in gasoline got bent out of shape when SYAC dared to light the match.

How did we get here? Well, The Internet ad business evolved to the point where all views are equal -- an ad impression on a quality think-piece pays the same as an ad impression on the listicle some intern wrote in 15 minutes.

This leads to marketing the well-written and quality output of an outlet the same as the poorly-written stuff.

Patel got angry that SYAC sniped their think-piece from 1,000 yards, as if it were some low-effort CNET mage gallery or something.

He didn't get angry at the ad market for highly misvaluing the ad impressions in the work, or at the editors at The Verge for dressing down the article to just the clickbait question -- he got pissy at someone just pointing out the obvious.

If your argument is "Waaaaa! The Internet Meanie won't let me get away with marketing my product using low-effort clickbait, which I need to do because the ad market severely misvaluing my work!!!!" -- maybe take a look at what the real problem is.
 
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ODD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,223
I wonder what would happen if they...
...decide to stop being so obnoxious.
 

Cels

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,772
so this is only kind of related, but what do you call "articles" that only ape on another publication's in-depth interview/original reporting or all they do is summarize a series of tweets or something like that?

for example, this happens a lot in the sports world where one publication, say, The Athletic or Sports Illustrated, will publish a story where they interviewed an athlete or got quotes from somebody. Then ESPN, Yahoo, or whoever, will publish short snippets of quotes from that interview/article and reframe it. I feel that these secondary articles add minimal, if any, value to the original reporting, and I'd much prefer to go to the original source. I'm just wondering what you call the secondary articles/stories that do zero original reporting.
 

Chirotera

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
4,267
One Twitter user is embarrassing clickbait article writers. You won't believe what happened next!
 

SJurgenson

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,239


David Chen fundamentally misunderstands the issue. In his article, he posits that headlines must be active misleading to be clickbait. Since "GoT S8 release date revealed" is not misleading, it doesn't count as clickbait.

I - and many other people - disagree with the distinction that clickbait requires duplicity. Clickbait is low-effort content or headlines that intice users into clicking to reveal some info or answers -- info or answers that often could have been given in the headline itself.

It doesn't matter if the headline is misleading, it matters that it is lazily enticing. That is the core problem here.

In fact, I would argue that style is misleading in and of itself. It misleads the reader into thinking the answer is more complex than it really is. As if the answer could not be simply given in the headline.
 

TAJ

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
12,446
Comicbook.com is fucking atrocious at this and every articles for you thing in existence is at least 80% that site and it's completely worthless garbage.

I feel bad if you need like 40 articles a day for your boss but I'm not surprised its WAY in the lead

Comicbook.com is actually much worse than that. They're also filled with articles based entirely on their own next-level-dumb fan theories that they try to pass off as fact.
 

Rad Bandolar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,036
SoCal
so this is only kind of related, but what do you call "articles" that only ape on another publication's in-depth interview/original reporting or all they do is summarize a series of tweets or something like that?

for example, this happens a lot in the sports world where one publication, say, The Athletic or Sports Illustrated, will publish a story where they interviewed an athlete or got quotes from somebody. Then ESPN, Yahoo, or whoever, will publish short snippets of quotes from that interview/article and reframe it. I feel that these secondary articles add minimal, if any, value to the original reporting, and I'd much prefer to go to the original source. I'm just wondering what you call the secondary articles/stories that do zero original reporting.

I don't know, call it the "secondary rehash market" or something. I agree, the actual content of these articles, in addition to their dumb headlines, is what I define as clickbait.

These sites aren't doing original reporting or synthesizing different sources to offer a compelling point of view or a fresh perspective. They literally just spend 500 words paraphrasing someone else's article, then link to it through various social media to boost their search index rating and get more ad impressions.

If these types of sites are deprived of their SEO ad dollars, because a single twitter account can spike their content in 10 words or less, then so be it.
 

SJurgenson

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,239
Right??? "Imagine if your boss knew you did this." lmaooooooooo

It's a level of Internet entitlement and petulance I live for.

If the value of your content is significantly diminished by a single tweet -- then there was no meaningful value in your content in the first place.

You are not owed clicks just by pressing the 'Publish' button in your site's CMS.
 

SJurgenson

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,239
Some of the tweets from that account posted here were hardly clickbait. In the case of those, did the subject warrant an article to be written?

That's clickbait. Resynthisizing low-information content into articles with no additional information or thoughts in order to drive clicks is the core essence of clickbait.

Don't let these low effort content recycling farms redefine clickbait to mean misleading bait. That's just their excuse-du-jure to defend their lazy rehashing for clicks.

Bait is bait. You still catch the bear in the trap, whether there was a real fish in there or not.
 

Kinthey

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
22,270
He's not entirely wrong. Some of the tweets from that account posted here were hardly clickbait. In the case of those, did the subject warrant an article to be written? No, but it's hardly clickbait.
Yeah, it's kind of funny. It's not really typical clickbait but at the same time does putting the news in the title reveal how meaningless it even is to report. Like who'd care about an article that's titled "James Wan is happy about $1billion boxoffice"
 

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,901
David Chen fundamentally misunderstands the issue. In his article, he posits that headlines must be active misleading to be clickbait. Since "GoT S8 release date revealed" is not misleading, it doesn't count as clickbait.

I - and many other people - disagree with the distinction that clickbait requires duplicity. Clickbait is low-effort content or headlines that intice users into clicking to reveal some info or answers -- info or answers that often could have been given in the headline itself.

It doesn't matter if the headline is misleading, it matters that it is lazily enticing. That is the core problem here.

In fact, I would argue that style is misleading in and of itself. It misleads the reader into thinking the answer is more complex than it really is. As if the answer could not be simply given in the headline.

Completely agree. Does Slashfilm deserve ad revenue for creating an article that simply lists the premiere date of Game of Thrones? Information that HBO willingly announced to the public?

I realize this isn't Twitter-but I think about this on YouTube as well. If I go to search for the "Captain Marvel" trailer-it's not just the official Marvel Studios YouTube channel that hosts it. There are all these strangely named YouTube channels ("KinoCheck" or whatever) that are hosting the exact same trailer. Why do they deserve ad revenue? I guess I understand that for Marvel, it's free promotion-but they can promote that same trailer and get more views on their own site. Why does "Kinocheck" deserve free money for just hosting the same content and doing no effort?
 

Daitokuji

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,602
Clickbait doesn't have to be misleading. Clickbait is usually 1 simple piece of information that is un-necessarily expanded into an entire article and uses a headline to generate intrigue or interest to get someone to "click" on it and read the whole article. When instead it could've just been summed up in one simple sentence.
 

Palette Swap

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
11,199
Didn't know about this account, subscribed.

If the substance of your writing fits in a tweet and you feel the need to hide it behind a link, I'm not gonna cry for you lost business.
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,876
That's clickbait. Resynthisizing low-information content into articles with no additional information or thoughts in order to drive clicks is the core essence of clickbait.

Don't let these low effort content recycling farms redefine clickbait to mean misleading bait. That's just their excuse-du-jure to defend their lazy rehashing for clicks.

I wouldn't say this article is baiting me into clicking the link:


Everything I need to know seems to be there in the tweet. It's just awful journalism mixed with unoriginal content.


Yeah, it's kind of funny. It's not really typical clickbait but at the same time does putting the news in the title reveal how meaningless it even is to report. Like who'd care about an article that's titled "James Wan is happy about $1billion boxoffice"

Exactly, it's just why bother?
 
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FormatCompatible

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,071
David Chen fundamentally misunderstands the issue. In his article, he posits that headlines must be active misleading to be clickbait. Since "GoT S8 release date revealed" is not misleading, it doesn't count as clickbait.

I - and many other people - disagree with the distinction that clickbait requires duplicity. Clickbait is low-effort content or headlines that intice users into clicking to reveal some info or answers -- info or answers that often could have been given in the headline itself.

It doesn't matter if the headline is misleading, it matters that it is lazily enticing. That is the core problem here.

In fact, I would argue that style is misleading in and of itself. It misleads the reader into thinking the answer is more complex than it really is. As if the answer could not be simply given in the headline.
Agreed, the whole basis of his argument hinges on the definition of clickbait provided by the people at Buzzfeed, which is fine if he believes that but for other people (including some in this thread it seems) believe that clickbait comes from purposely hiding information that could easily be provided in a headline just to artificially lengthen a article that have little to no substance for the purpose of making people click on it. The funny thing is that looking at his example of the new season of GoT you can see on filmclickbait's timeline there are examples of outlets that provide you with the main information (the date) on the headline, they presumably have enough content on their article without having to resort to clickbaiting people.



 

SJurgenson

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,239
I would say this article is baiting me into clicking the link:


Everything I need to know seems to be there in the tweet. It's just awful journalism mixed with unoriginal content.


That is the complete original content of the article. The author actually got a hold of the actor, and wrote a single article about a single question -- a question with a super obvious answer.

It is laziness to the extreme. Why bother with an original interview, and ask/publish a single answer?

I bet that the author went to some publicity event for the home release of the latest film, and was allowed some short amount of time with the actor for an interview.

That is not even original news/content for an article.
 
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BigJeffery

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,338
Even if you think the click-bait account is bad (it's not), you can't stop someone from summarizing the news lol. Is there a part of the Twitter ToS that they're even close to breaking?
 

Kenstar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,887
Earth
how dare google.com snipe my articles about if the sun is up in your city by providing that info on their main results page
my writers over at isthesunup.com deserve to be paid for their hard work of checking bing.com for if the sun is up for x city, and then writing 3 paragraphs of filler and adding a slideshow of sunrises for x city
 

DJMicLuv

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
1,179
"How many legs has Tom Cruise got? You'll be SHOCKED by the answer!"

This man is doing God's work, long may he continue.
 

Telpis

Banned
Jan 17, 2018
1,319
Is there an anti click bait for superhero news for TV movie for dc and marvel only thanks
 
Oct 27, 2017
730
I have been beating on this horse for over half a decade at this point. Advertising as a revenue model for content is utterly flawed because there is no quality control for that content, and as a direct result clickbaity scamming for clicks is the default modus operandi for the majority of content providers on the internet.

It's only going to get worse because at this point in time you can still sort of surmise there's an actual (bastardly) human doing the scammy rephrasing and clickbaiting but at some point it will be bots making content for other bots (and god forbid some actual humans) to click on.

This twitter account is funny but it's also tragic and ultimately ineffective. Outside of bruised egos and a few thousand saved clicks (on the millions they receive monthly) it has 0 impact. Google will continue to be google and will drive traffic towards these sites because they're the biggest earners with the most aggressive advertising strategy. This is at a fundamental level what you get when the biggest search engine on the planet is run by an advertising company.
 
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Kasey

Member
Nov 1, 2017
10,822
Boise
It's genuinely hilarious they tallied these sites and found conspiracy instead of the obvious answer - that they are aggressively clickbaity in all of their stories.