Final Fantasy XIV: Stormblood |OT| A Realm Reset

Oct 25, 2017
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I just hope that adding Blue Mage doesn't mean that we only get 1 new regular job for the expansion.

If Ultimate fights and Limited Jobs like Blue Mage were the result of only having 1 dungeon each odd-numbered patch, then I would say: "Yes, more please.
BLU isn't an expansion job. You don't even need anything beyond the base game to unlock it.
Just got the email for the absurdly expensive mount. That reminds me, does SE do some kind of Black Friday sale for the mogstation?
Black friday? No. They usually hold a sale or two over the year, normally its the anniversary sale and sometimes a christmas sale.
 
May 8, 2018
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Spent most of the day doing quests post 4.1 and boy it was pretty much tv/movie mode...apart from getting my ass handed to me by red chocobos...good thing the story is amazing.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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Black friday? No. They usually hold a sale or two over the year, normally its the anniversary sale and sometimes a christmas sale.
Aw man. I guess I’ll wait till Christmas to see if there’s anything I want. The store is way too expensive.

Are you talking about the motorcycle? I was thinking of buying it at first but then I saw that it was 35$USD and was like nope!
Yeah I clicked on the link thinking it was gonna be like $15. Fuck that lol.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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yeah, they said multiple new jobs for the expansion (haha probably 2, healer and tank) and that blue mage isn't considered as part of the expansion either during the live letter or during the announcement at the end of the keynote.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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USA
It's a cool mount, but $30 seems a bit much to me, especially for a 1-seater mount. Then again, I don't have that much nostalgia for FFVII so I'm probably not the target audience for this.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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The premium price on the mount seems to be for the increased speed you get by default. It also plays Crazy Motorcycle Chase, which is pretty rad. Flying is pretty lackluster, as you just sorta float. I'd say it's functionally worth it if you level a lot of alts (as rare as that may be the case), but otherwise only a nostalgia item.

 
Oct 31, 2017
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It will be too late then. You need to buy it as soon as possible so you can have the increased speed in Shadowbringers zones.
Don't some of the older mounts have the bonus speed too? Odin's horse or whatever.

Anyway seems super pointless to me unless they change how the MSQ goes a lot. There wasn't that much running around in SB MSQ and the rest of the xp you can do in old zones(beastmen tribes/centurio bounties) or queuing for shit. At in the end it doesn't take long to unlock flying in the zones(other than fringes/peaks due to being split in 2 parts). I think you're being sarcastic but some people really do think it's this huge advantage to run a bit faster while questing to cap, when really it's gonna shave maybe an hour out of the 30 or 40hours it takes to clear the MSQ anyway. Most of this stuff is just running in cities(get that BRD/MCH swap macro with Peloton), watching cutscenes and doing dungeons.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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The premium price on the mount seems to be for the increased speed you get by default. It also plays Crazy Motorcycle Chase, which is pretty rad. Flying is pretty lackluster, as you just sorta float. I'd say it's functionally worth it if you level a lot of alts (as rare as that may be the case), but otherwise only a nostalgia item.

The premium price on the mount is because its a fanfest item and they don't want to give the middle finger to the people that got it with their expensive tickets after making the stream free.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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The premium price on the mount is because its a fanfest item and they don't want to give the middle finger to the people that got it with their expensive tickets after making the stream free.
It's almost like they paid extra for something else, I can't quite put my finger on what that was though.
 
Oct 25, 2017
902
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Australia
God damn, 38 Australian dollars for an in-game mount.

I never really thought about it before but it's just hit me that I could literally buy God of War or Horizon Zero Dawn for that amount. The entire Stormblood expansion itself is almost half the price of that single mount right now on the SE store.

More power to you if you're actually buying that thing.
 
Oct 31, 2017
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Why was the whale nearly $30, then?
It has twice as many pixels, obviously it's twice as expensive. /s

The XIV shop is interesting because on one hand, the mounts feel horribly overpriced, but on the other buying stuff like seasonal outfits is relatively cheap imo. I want to get Songbird eventually since I wasn't subbed during it and it's "only" 3.50euros, which seems pretty reasonable for cosmetics. I should probably buy a fantasia next time it's on sale too in case I feel like changing appearance at some point. No new character model stuff this expansion it seems though.

Don't care too much about any of the mounts they add because I'm fairly particular about the mounts I use ingame anyway, I want stuff that doesn't do too much noise while flying and preferably while on the ground either. And I got the perfect mount for both a while back, the cloud. Does no noise at all in either, and looks cool too. I don't see myself replacing it for a long time.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Why was the whale nearly $30, then?
I was told the whale was a chinese mount and those are all expensive as shit for some reason.
It's almost like they paid extra for something else, I can't quite put my finger on what that was though.
People paid $30 for the former fanfest items when they were tied to stream access. Its a shitty price but at the same time I can understand there might be legal shit in the background.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Between the whale and the bike I just spent 60 dollars on this game...yikes.

You know, the day the servers go down for good I'll realize I blew a lot of money for nothing lol. better take a lot of screens and videos now.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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The bike definitely has some kind of abnormal surcharge built in, but until we get another mount to establish pattern it's hard to tell what. Usually it's been:

$12 for single-character mounts (old event mounts, the color variant Magitek mounts)
$24 for account-wide mounts (Bennu, Carby, Slepnir)
$30 for account-wide multi-seater mounts (Fat Moogle, The Whale)

So I dunno if it gets the extra price because fast or because Fanfest or because of the BGM (in which case they should be charging more for the whale for 'multi seater that does not play the Moogle Mog song') or what but it definitely breaks pattern.

The Tifa minion is also two bucks more than the regular cash shop minion, but since she's also account-wide it's hard to tell if the markup is because account wide or just because fanfest.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Between the whale and the bike I just spent 60 dollars on this game...yikes.

You know, the day the servers go down for good I'll realize I blew a lot of money for nothing lol. better take a lot of screens and videos now.
Don't forget the money on Odder Otter you'll be getting in the mail hopefully soon. At least, it's a physical product. But people have spent way more on digital assets, like in gacha games.
 
Oct 26, 2017
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Prices for micotransactions are almost always lobsided in comparison to how much you pay for the actual game. A long time ago people scoffed at paying those kinds of prices but now it's a lot more accepted.

No new character model stuff this expansion it seems though.
We're getting Viera so that's definitely going to have unique models.

I'm guessing the two clans will be regular and Feol.

WoW has kinda shit the bed, how's FF XIV doing?
I haven't played WoW in a long time but what's going on over there?

FFXIV is still trucking along. I just resubbed again to do some stuff because the NA Fanfest got me hyped up again for the game.
 
Nov 1, 2017
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I haven't played WoW in a long time but what's going on over there?

FFXIV is still trucking along. I just resubbed again to do some stuff because the NA Fanfest got me hyped up again for the game.
Legion was much loved, BFA is much maligned and justifiably so. Bad ideas like various items on the GCD which is now going to be changed back. Bad stories. A Horde story and Alliance story that doesn't always sync. Bad characters. Much backlash. Supposedly a lot of people stopped playing. Just so many little steps backwards it's beyond perplexing.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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I wish expert roulette would include more than the same two dungeons. It would make families less boring. Then again, I started avoiding Alliance Raids because I got bored of those too, mostly because they’re long.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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Do you guys think we will see a new Eureka in the expansion? But with the world jumping we wont need to "queue" into it instead it could just function as any other zone but for max lv. Which means we could solo stuff while waiting on DPS queues and stuff, would be really great. This world jumping actually opens up the game for tons of world content.
 
Oct 27, 2017
281
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UK
Any end game WAR's here?

Basically I just got the Omega Axe and find it quite underwhelming. I have far too much Skill Speed and my Crit has dropped massively. Is it even better than the Tome i400 weapon?

Also I'm not the best of players, and also play on PS4 so no ACT and can't read Fflogs properly. Can you give me any advice on how to play better? That's both in terms of DPS, and also better use of CD's to help healers out. Here's some logs from the fights

O9: https://www.fflogs.com/reports/RkDvLmMPJ94TdY1f#fight=1&type=damage-done&start=0&end=0

O10: https://www.fflogs.com/reports/8Zy6Y1W3af2chQnv#fight=2&type=damage-done

011: https://www.fflogs.com/reports/cabFBX3jWLVGwAYf#fight=4&type=damage-done

M/F: https://www.fflogs.com/reports/k4yVRxMz1DKjmaGt#fight=21&type=damage-done

Final Omega: https://www.fflogs.com/reports/qBCPKF6D4HGNkpyn#fight=21&type=damage-done

I know O12 is particular is really bad. I still yolo that fight and haven't figured out timings and when best to line up my moves. End up using upheaval wrong time and holding Inner Release because I didn't prep Eye properly, or need to get rid of some guage first
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
47
0
I'll try at a very generic / broad level so WALL OF TEXT INCOMING. For reference sake, my logs: https://www.fflogs.com/character/id/8569656, though this is my only tier as Warrior for this expansion (WHM for Delta/Sigma prog, PLD for Sigma speed and Ultima). We're now a fairly caster-centric group (DRG/BRD/SMN/BLM) after finishing prog so there's some Trick and Hypercharge timings I'm not as comfortable with in practice so much as theoretically so I may gloss over important alignment situations. I'm pretty bad at GCD-by-GCD-by-GCD type of analysis unless we really need to dig deep but it'll generally just be following normal "best practices" of always be riding your GCD, keep your meter as full as possible, minimize early Eye refreshes, and 5/5 FC + Onslaught + Upheaval your IRs. These are the sort of things you can kind of look at with XIV Analysis but that comes with the disclaimer of that's about all you'll really want to be looking at it for as it doesn't really track gauge use and other finer details. But first:

Any end game WAR's here?

Basically I just got the Omega Axe and find it quite underwhelming. I have far too much Skill Speed and my Crit has dropped massively. Is it even better than the Tome i400 weapon?
It is in fact better, but the margin is within about 1-1.5% total over the i400 Axe. It was close enough that I picked up the i400 Axe after prog was done so I'd end up getting the coffer later (and then got the coffer the same week help my tomes help). Our BiS still gets us to our sweetspot 2.37-2.38 GCD and I'm currently unaware of any fight having some weird SSPD tiering that's better.

Also, I'll mention it here since it looks like it covers every fight: The Onslaught before pot+IR is, technically speaking, costing you an Onslaught under pot. Which, yes, is a super minor thing but the generic opener rotation is this. I will admit since we're not really doing speed this tier I haven't looked into any swanky fight specific things.

It more-or-less works out but is there a reason the opener Trick Attack is so late? Your IR is actually delayed in the opener by about a full GCD's worth and the first FC flat out misses TA to begin with still so it's strange to see. It's not something to harp on a lot because being NIN is suffering enough but you only really get two IRs under TA which hurts a bit. I bring it up because the two missing ones you can in theory fix / match the drift if it's a consistent thing: delaying for the 3:30 TA doesn't mess with your 4th IR and if your fight time is consistent, you can make sure to delay your last IR for when the last TA goes up. That one is more a speedrun min-max thing but it's in general a good practice to get into, you can guarantee your last use of a major buff lines up with as many things as you possibly can. There's a lot to be said that the pattern specifically in here is worse for everyone's DPS (Blaze->Cyclone vs Tsunami->Earthquake) but that is also getting pretty finicky. Looking at it, you rode your IR anyway so you didn't run into the issue with IRing the Cyclone knockback.so it's not like the opening delay hurts your lineups specifically but it's still kind of a standout.

One major thing to note, and it will come down to having to practice it somewhat, you can Onslaught the Cyclone -> Umbral Smash jump and the Tsunami -> Umbral Smash jump without getting yourself killed. It'll help the two bits of downtime you get in the fight (and, realistically, you'll eventually stop seeing the 4th Element anyway so you can luck out of the Cyclone one a lot if RNG is with you) as each one is costing you 1-2 GCDs to cover. Basically, you wait for Chaos' jump away animation to start playing before hitting Onslaught. Here's a visual representation of it on Cyclone:

https://i.imgur.com/9onE4x1.gifv

Defensive wise, there's a few things to note. You outright lose a Vengeance use in this it looks like? You can throw everything at the first Chaotic Dispersion tankbuster and always have it up for when you need it next. It's worth note that many of the best practices here (and, really, for all the fights) is milking Holmgangs and/or Covers a lot when you can get away with it. Cyclone Orbs can safely be done with minimal DPS loss, if any, from a PLD taking both + Hallowed since nothing stops them from having both tethers. This frees up your cooldowns a lot for Cyclone to just throw a lot as generic auto-attack mitigation as you have a looooong time from Cyclone before you get tankbustered again. The Tsunami one is a bit harder to get Hallowed up for so this is more a "if your healers think it's worth it" situation but imo, there's a preference here to Holmgang your tankbuster hit and dump more cooldowns into the orb; you lose the boss anyway so going to 1 isn't a big deal on the tankbuster and it lets you mitigate the orbs down to practically nothing which makes the sequence a bit lower on total GCD healer strain. Again, healer preference trumps things when it comes down to Holmgang use here but it's an option.

Shake It Off use is more-or-less fine, it's largely down to healer preference on the Cyclone / Earthquake ones. I'll note that you can Shake around 20s into the fight safely and it catches the opening Blaze / Tsunami cast (or hold slightly longer if you'd prefer to Shake the Umbral Smash after Tsunami, which is what we do since we position slightly closer for uptime) but that's really the only standout "missing" Shake I'd say.

Reprisals are probably the biggest thing to note, there's a lot of casts that go through unReprisal'd. Pretty much every major AoE set can be covered with a Reprisal so it goes a long way to work out a good Reprisal plan. 10% is 10%! Your only Reprisal here actually overlaps the PLD one so if they're consistent on theirs, you can safely move yours to Blaze #2 and more-or-less keep that same pattern of PLD Reprisal Elemental AoE #1, WAR Reprisal Elemental AoE #2.

Obligatory min-maxing O10S is highly highly highly RNG specific.

This will take some serious looking into so I'll just state it as a generic point: There's safe spots to greed out the GCD for the cardinal/intercardinal mechanic so you don't have to sit on your GCD slightly. It's super small to worry about so don't do it without like ... your healer's knowing you'll probably make them hate you while you test saving yourself a 0.2-0.3s downtime. If you have a run going bad and you want to practice it, or if you feel like braving PF to practice the spacing/timing, it's something you can try to do but still.

ANYWAY. DPS lineups here suffer a bit as Midgardsormr kind of decides your fate for 'add' phase. Generally speaking, you either accept a loss when you're forced to take dragon OR you'll need to have a pre-planned route that hopefully people don't get in your way. There's really not a lot to note here for your cooldowns besides the same as above with adjusting when you IR if you know you can afford the slightly delay due to boss jumps if it helps sync yourself with TA / the end of the fight. I'll be honest, the trend so far is you're pretty consistent with your IRs and not really slipping up on overcapping much which is a large part of WAR. There may be some 7-9s refreshes you can mess with and some meter min-maxing you can work on as, just going over one of my logs, I have a bit more total meter use than you: 57 FC, 17 Onslaught, 14 Upheaval vs 58 FC, 7 Onslaught, 13 Upheaval in the same 8:59 timeframe; 14 vs 13 Infuriates and 29/15 vs 21/18 Path/Eye.

Defensive wise, we're in for a lot of preference / healer vote. I'd make the argument for throwing cooldowns at the first tankbuster -> cover the second -> Holmgang / Hallowed the third. I assume your plan here is normally Vengeance the opener so it's up for Tail End #3 and just happened with this log to miss it? I just prefer the cooldowns up front in the event I end up as dragon tank as it guarantees I can cooldown everything no matter what RNG throws at me. Either way, this is probably mostly a wash and your kill time fixes the major tank cooldown crunch in the fight as you don't have to deal with 4x Tail End as a possibility at the end. I'll note you can also just roll cooldowns for the hell of it if you have the boss post-add phase anyway while Flame Breath stuff is going on. You have enough time to get everything back before you'll need it again (or, in the case of this log, you never need it again!).

Also, again, healer mileage may vary here but imo, opener Akh Morn is less of a potential strain than the first Earth Shaker. It's another bonus for cooldowns on the first Tail End as there's the option of getting Vengeance+Raw Int Shake up for the Earth Shaker hit. That said, looking over the log I think they just Assize + Indom the Earth Shaker so this is probably not of any importance at all.

Reprisal - I'll be honest, I tend to Reprisal the tankbuster a lot. It's admittedly a lot harder to get good mileage out of Reprisal here so I'm not going to complain too much at it. Your current ones are basically fine, you can probably squeeze another one for some value in phase 1 and another during the Bulwark passes but it's really just for a 10% mitigation on ~2 autos so don't take this to heart as anything besides "might as well hit it because +1 cast per minute padding?" really.

This is super nitpicky and I haven't actually crunched the numbers to be sure how much it gains but if you can delay the GCDs slightly, I do believe it's a gain to finish the Omega phase 1 hitting Maim @1:30-1:32 and then Storm's Eye as soon as the Level Checker appears. As it stands right now, you miss slashing on an extra hit under IR AND you'll lose Eye while doing tethers. You have 1 GCD of space here without messing with tethers so there's no harm in getting it if you can. I'd also have to check exactly the amount of meter you can spend in p1 but you should be able to make sure to go into Level Checker at 40 with an extra Onslaught or so. It's a fairly static 90s rotation so you can usually crunch it out precisely, especially when you're sitting at 2.37 / 2.38 GCD tiering.

Defensive wise, and this applies to all fights but I'm throwing it here specifically because Mustard Bomb makes for some real big gains from it and O12S will be a different focus, you really should be getting more Interventions? I know you're looking for advice for yourself but 0 Interventions in every fight is leaving a lot of mitigation on the table. Every ~30s, PLD generates a Sheltron or Intervention use and the little bit of mitigation goes a long way, especially in spots where they can double up cooldowning themselves and you with it (Mustard Bomb + HP- Atomic Ray, basically everything in O12S).

As for your own, I'd throw out you can get a Shake It Off out in the opener @20s or so to catch the first Flamethrower. It's essentially free and since you're doing Cover - Hallowed, you basically can just do whatever with your cooldowns and feed it Vengeance Thrill Raw Int for the Flamethrower. The other notable big spot to Shake is during the Big Fists -> Electric Slide (stack) marker; prep your Raw Int + Thrill (or save Thrill for IR Upheaval coming up :D) when you go to the marker and Onslaught + Shake to get back in. Besides that, Omega auto attacks. A lot. There's a lot of periods with extended auto windows like after Big Fists, and, really, the entire period between Panto 1 and Panto 2 is ~5 auto attacks between mechanics. It's not reliable but it's a good spot to just throw Anticipation, Conva, etc. at. I'll note you have a free Vengeance around the 6m mark, but it's fairly low value as it'd only really catch Panto 1 and maybe 2 auto attacks. Just a random mention as you can pop Vengeance a little earlier for the Mustard Bomb you take and it'll catch maybe an extra auto. NOT A HUGE DEAL but just something I caught that I'll probably look at doing myself lol.

Likewise with the above notes on Reprisal for other fights, you can Reprisal all of the Flamethrowers and Atomic Rays so working out some plan helps a lot. Flamethrowers are roughly at: 0:30, 3:40, 5:55, 8:15 and Atomic Rays are @0:12, 4:20, 7:20, 8:05. I say roughly since Level Checker duration varies with kill time which throws off the time between #1 and #2 of both but the time in between the others is pretty much constant within a GCD. This is probably getting really grating to keep hitting Reprisal but it's a free bit of mitigation. It's also one of the more coordination heavy ones so it's kind of expected to be underused until you sit down and go "I got this you got that" a lot.

RNG. This fight will wildly swing your average since a lot will be dictated by your dash numbers and the Sword / Shield order and which boss you have / how you handle the mechanic. I'll be honest, I'm not sure how to tackle this one without it being about how you handle all the mechanics? So for now, I'm going to wimp out and say I can look at this more after this post? I'm not too sure of too many super big things that aren't also "This is a good spot to greed one extra hit" or "Make sure to move your boss to a spot where you + your melee buddy is so you can both hit the boss while dodging." Maybe a bit of a copout. Sorry D:

Plus, we don't do the Tank LB for Meteor + Sagittarius Arrow (it's technically not a DPS gain!) so that kind of warps the cooldowns slightly. I will say, though, is there a reason at it being you Holmganging the two Bladedances vs Hallowed? I guess technically it doesn't matter with a Benediction in play, outside of the GCD clip it adds, but just curious. Also, obligatory Intervention on close Solar Ray is amazing as you'll take basically nothing!

I'm still reworking a lot of O12S as we're finishing up reprogging the fight (and, well, same for M-F but R N G and disasters means I haven't thought much about M-F besides crying) so there's a lot that will end up being potentially wrong for alignments. That said, most of the fight from your DPS perspective is pretty much straightforward. IR doesn't really line up poorly with anything and if you can be consistent on use then you'll be fine throughout the fight. You look to do non-uptime Unreal for HW so there's kind of some built-in limitations there for your DPS and really there's not a lot to really greed out.

That out of the way, there's a lot to be said about how much you can trivialize the tank busters through Cover? Notably, once really comfortable with it, you don't even really need to monitor threat on the first two Target Analysis as both can be safely Covered every time. This would end up being a massive overhaul to your cooldowns, however, so a lot of if you can make use of this will come down to how you currently do your planned cooldowns. I personally have my cooldowns metered out for the fight and if we can Cover / Hallowed / Holmgang a set, we go ahead with those. Just currently always with the back-up plan of making sure we can handle a kneejerk soak situation.

Reprisal wise, you're definitely going to want to make sure to get Reprisals up on all the Oversampled Wave Cannons: 0:40, 2:50, 4:10, 7:05, 8:25 roughly. Again, this is a great spot for Intervention to save your asses a bit and they're also spread out enough that you can make sure to Reprisal + Dismantle them all to really help making it manageable with fewer cooldowns.

I kind of over rambled at the beginning and this ran into my raid start so if needed I'll come back and touch up O12S as I assume those were the ones you wanted really looked at the most :( But, at the same time, M-F lends itself a lot to RNG making a mess of things and Final Omega you'll mainly look at tank synergy things to really keep the healing down for the healers.

______

tl;dr: You're really consistent with your IR use and your IR's mainly suffer from missing some raid buffs either from a group-side perspective to adjust OR some of them you can just hold yourself to line it up, especially fight-ending last use IRs. You do seem to underuse your meter a bit which lends itself to you losing out on ~1-2k or so potency per fight; this mostly stems from being too early on Storm's Eye refresh, at 2.37/2.38 GCD tier, you really only need about 8s left on Eye to go ahead and hit a Storm's Path and still get an Eye refresh back without dropping Eye and what would mostly appear to be sitting on Infuriates a little too long / maybe over-resetting them.

Defensively, you can get some better uses out of Shake It Off and definitely with better Reprisals but the biggest source of missing mitigation will end up being the Cover and Intervention use you can throw at mechanics. You have a few spots where you just outright lose uses of Rampart / Vengeance but they're not major ones, just "can cover a few autos without hurting my tankbuster coverage" situations so you might as well get them. Most the changed cooldowns I went through are will come down to healer preference (though I'd argue most save them a GCD or Aetherflow stacks at least! but I also come from an AST/SCH perspective primarily).

Honestly, you have a lot less room for general improvement than you're probably thinking? Maybe? Most of what will be left to milk for DPS are the nitpicky sides of Warrior and meter management + cooldown alignments.
 
OP
OP
Red XIII

Red XIII

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
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NY
scy dropping that knowledge!
what's the go to opener on WAR if we don't have a ninja?
last time i did the Onslaught for Umbral Smash i got the dot is this a timing thing?
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
47
0
As far as the opener goes, you'll just do the same thing anyway as far as just going damage. It's mostly planned out this way so you get two Fell Cleaves (one before, one after) outside IR, your IR, an Infuriate refresh and end on a ~0-1s Eye refresh. SSPD / Fey WInd / Arrow is technically required for the FC to fit inside pot without messing with Eye refresh if I recall so its kind of up to you how you do it. You can just do the second Onslaught to keep yourself from overcapping and you'll end the sequence with 100 meter. There are other openers you can do if threat is the major concern BUT I tend to just prefer using an IB over the first FC if you need the bonus threat and hope all your DPS are just using Diversion (or Refresh / Tactician for Bard/MCH to drop).

As for the Onslaught, I think it's a combination of things? The only way I've so far been able to reproduce getting the DoT has been starting too close to the Cyclone and going for an immediate dash? It may just be a server latency thing but I also seem to be pretty consistent at no DoT once I've slightly delayed the Onslaught to after Chaos has made it part way over the puddle instead of snapping it the moment he starts moving. I wish I had a better / more conclusive answer but so far that's just been the one thing I've been able to do to control getting / not getting the DoT.
 
Oct 25, 2017
723
0
The real way to optimize O10S add phase as the yellow tank is to go for the nail that is only tethered to the dragon and threaten to aim Frost Breath at your bard if he keeps putting fucking DoTs in it to pad.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,568
0
I wish expert roulette would include more than the same two dungeons. It would make families less boring. Then again, I started avoiding Alliance Raids because I got bored of those too, mostly because they’re long.
Alliance roulette would be fine if it wasn't Labyrinth of the Ancients 95% of the time
 
Oct 27, 2017
281
0
UK
Thanks a lot!. This detailed post is really helpful and i appreciate it. I saw the post last night, but wanted to wait till i was at a PC so i could reply properly

I'll try at a very generic / broad level so WALL OF TEXT INCOMING. For reference sake, my logs: https://www.fflogs.com/character/id/8569656, though this is my only tier as Warrior for this expansion (WHM for Delta/Sigma prog, PLD for Sigma speed and Ultima). We're now a fairly caster-centric group (DRG/BRD/SMN/BLM) after finishing prog so there's some Trick and Hypercharge timings I'm not as comfortable with in practice so much as theoretically so I may gloss over important alignment situations. I'm pretty bad at GCD-by-GCD-by-GCD type of analysis unless we really need to dig deep but it'll generally just be following normal "best practices" of always be riding your GCD, keep your meter as full as possible, minimize early Eye refreshes, and 5/5 FC + Onslaught + Upheaval your IRs. These are the sort of things you can kind of look at with XIV Analysis but that comes with the disclaimer of that's about all you'll really want to be looking at it for as it doesn't really track gauge use and other finer details. But first:
WALL of TEXTS are perfectly fine! That XIV Analysis looks useful


It is in fact better, but the margin is within about 1-1.5% total over the i400 Axe. It was close enough that I picked up the i400 Axe after prog was done so I'd end up getting the coffer later (and then got the coffer the same week help my tomes help). Our BiS still gets us to our sweetspot 2.37-2.38 GCD and I'm currently unaware of any fight having some weird SSPD tiering that's better.
The Axe makes my Skill Speed 1480 odd with a GCD of 2.34. It also drops my Crit to 2200. I need the Omega Arms and Head to drop fix my SS a bit. Literally never seen either. If one drops, I could buy the other.

I haven't tried a fight since to know how it feels though

Also, I'll mention it here since it looks like it covers every fight: The Onslaught before pot+IR is, technically speaking, costing you an Onslaught under pot. Which, yes, is a super minor thing but the generic opener rotation is this. I will admit since we're not really doing speed this tier I haven't looked into any swanky fight specific things.
That first Onslaught under Unchained is ingrained in me from PF for aggro. It's muscle memory now and I havemn't gotten around to fixing it.

It more-or-less works out but is there a reason the opener Trick Attack is so late? Your IR is actually delayed in the opener by about a full GCD's worth and the first FC flat out misses TA to begin with still so it's strange to see. It's not something to harp on a lot because being NIN is suffering enough but you only really get two IRs under TA which hurts a bit. I bring it up because the two missing ones you can in theory fix / match the drift if it's a consistent thing: delaying for the 3:30 TA doesn't mess with your 4th IR and if your fight time is consistent, you can make sure to delay your last IR for when the last TA goes up. That one is more a speedrun min-max thing but it's in general a good practice to get into, you can guarantee your last use of a major buff lines up with as many things as you possibly can. There's a lot to be said that the pattern specifically in here is worse for everyone's DPS (Blaze->Cyclone vs Tsunami->Earthquake) but that is also getting pretty finicky. Looking at it, you rode your IR anyway so you didn't run into the issue with IRing the Cyclone knockback.so it's not like the opening delay hurts your lineups specifically but it's still kind of a standout.
I never considered delaying the middle IR. Once we have a clean run with no deaths, I'd miss the last IR anyway, so may as well move it under buffs.

One major thing to note, and it will come down to having to practice it somewhat, you can Onslaught the Cyclone -> Umbral Smash jump and the Tsunami -> Umbral Smash jump without getting yourself killed. It'll help the two bits of downtime you get in the fight (and, realistically, you'll eventually stop seeing the 4th Element anyway so you can luck out of the Cyclone one a lot if RNG is with you) as each one is costing you 1-2 GCDs to cover. Basically, you wait for Chaos' jump away animation to start playing before hitting Onslaught. Here's a visual representation of it on Cyclone:

https://i.imgur.com/9onE4x1.gifv
I can do the Onslaught during the Tsunami jumo fine, the one during Cyclone is awkward though because even if i make it to other side, i still get wind debuff. might need to delay it ever so slightly. Incidentally, after that onslaught in Cyclone, how many GCD's do you get off before you position for knockback. I always get two, but haven't been brave enough to try a 3rd yet...

Also on Cyclone phase, after the first jump and knockback, how do you position boss? Personally I'd like to face boss towards the middle cyclone, but our PLD keeps him faced towards edge/corner.

Defensive wise, there's a few things to note. You outright lose a Vengeance use in this it looks like? You can throw everything at the first Chaotic Dispersion tankbuster and always have it up for when you need it next. It's worth note that many of the best practices here (and, really, for all the fights) is milking Holmgangs and/or Covers a lot when you can get away with it. Cyclone Orbs can safely be done with minimal DPS loss, if any, from a PLD taking both + Hallowed since nothing stops them from having both tethers. This frees up your cooldowns a lot for Cyclone to just throw a lot as generic auto-attack mitigation as you have a looooong time from Cyclone before you get tankbustered again. The Tsunami one is a bit harder to get Hallowed up for so this is more a "if your healers think it's worth it" situation but imo, there's a preference here to Holmgang your tankbuster hit and dump more cooldowns into the orb; you lose the boss anyway so going to 1 isn't a big deal on the tankbuster and it lets you mitigate the orbs down to practically nothing which makes the sequence a bit lower on total GCD healer strain. Again, healer preference trumps things when it comes down to Holmgang use here but it's an option.
To be honest when i was learning, I used Holmgang more often. But it's such a gentle Tank Buster, that with some shields i wasn't even dropping to 1HP when using it (nothing will be as gentle as O6 though..). I typically Rampart+Raw the TB's, and Vengeance for Orbs, but i guess I can Holmgang busters again and free Rampart and Raw for autos.

Shake It Off use is more-or-less fine, it's largely down to healer preference on the Cyclone / Earthquake ones. I'll note that you can Shake around 20s into the fight safely and it catches the opening Blaze / Tsunami cast (or hold slightly longer if you'd prefer to Shake the Umbral Smash after Tsunami, which is what we do since we position slightly closer for uptime) but that's really the only standout "missing" Shake I'd say.

Reprisals are probably the biggest thing to note, there's a lot of casts that go through unReprisal'd. Pretty much every major AoE set can be covered with a Reprisal so it goes a long way to work out a good Reprisal plan. 10% is 10%! Your only Reprisal here actually overlaps the PLD one so if they're consistent on theirs, you can safely move yours to Blaze #2 and more-or-less keep that same pattern of PLD Reprisal Elemental AoE #1, WAR Reprisal Elemental AoE #2.
Reprisal use could defo be a lot better. Unlike in O11 where I get the Flamethowers and he gets the Atomic rays, and in Final where i do Oversampled and him Ion Ifflux, we never really mapped it out for other fights.

Obligatory min-maxing O10S is highly highly highly RNG specific.
Can I say how much i dislike O10? At least we don't see 4 busters anymore..


This will take some serious looking into so I'll just state it as a generic point: There's safe spots to greed out the GCD for the cardinal/intercardinal mechanic so you don't have to sit on your GCD slightly. It's super small to worry about so don't do it without like ... your healer's knowing you'll probably make them hate you while you test saving yourself a 0.2-0.3s downtime. If you have a run going bad and you want to practice it, or if you feel like braving PF to practice the spacing/timing, it's something you can try to do but still.
I can do this for the corner ones, but haven't gotten that good at doing so for the cardinals. Need more practice.

ANYWAY. DPS lineups here suffer a bit as Midgardsormr kind of decides your fate for 'add' phase. Generally speaking, you either accept a loss when you're forced to take dragon OR you'll need to have a pre-planned route that hopefully people don't get in your way. There's really not a lot to note here for your cooldowns besides the same as above with adjusting when you IR if you know you can afford the slightly delay due to boss jumps if it helps sync yourself with TA / the end of the fight. I'll be honest, the trend so far is you're pretty consistent with your IRs and not really slipping up on overcapping much which is a large part of WAR. There may be some 7-9s refreshes you can mess with and some meter min-maxing you can work on as, just going over one of my logs, I have a bit more total meter use than you: 57 FC, 17 Onslaught, 14 Upheaval vs 58 FC, 7 Onslaught, 13 Upheaval in the same 8:59 timeframe; 14 vs 13 Infuriates and 29/15 vs 21/18 Path/Eye.
I definitely need to work on my Eye refreshes. It used to be much worse! And i need to better prep for IR. I have enough cases where i go into IR and I'm 60 or above meter, or need to infuriate during it, and end up holding it for a FC or 2 to prevent clipping since it's costs me an IR FC at times.

When do you use your 3rd IR? Just before Boss jumps, or on add phase? The former can be tricky at times. Only tried it recently and haven't fully figured out the rotation to that i can immediately use my 2nd and 3rd IR's instead of being mid combo.

Defensive wise, we're in for a lot of preference / healer vote. I'd make the argument for throwing cooldowns at the first tankbuster -> cover the second -> Holmgang / Hallowed the third. I assume your plan here is normally Vengeance the opener so it's up for Tail End #3 and just happened with this log to miss it? I just prefer the cooldowns up front in the event I end up as dragon tank as it guarantees I can cooldown everything no matter what RNG throws at me. Either way, this is probably mostly a wash and your kill time fixes the major tank cooldown crunch in the fight as you don't have to deal with 4x Tail End as a possibility at the end. I'll note you can also just roll cooldowns for the hell of it if you have the boss post-add phase anyway while Flame Breath stuff is going on. You have enough time to get everything back before you'll need it again (or, in the case of this log, you never need it again!).
We Holmgang> Cover > CD's (me)/Hallowed(him) busters in first phase. In 2nd it's Holmgang > CD's for me, and i'm not fully sure for him. So that early Vengeance and Rampart were just for Auto's knowing they'd be back up for 3rd buster if neccesary. I'm so glad we don't need to deal with 4 buster RNG anymore.

Also, again, healer mileage may vary here but imo, opener Akh Morn is less of a potential strain than the first Earth Shaker. It's another bonus for cooldowns on the first Tail End as there's the option of getting Vengeance+Raw Int Shake up for the Earth Shaker hit. That said, looking over the log I think they just Assize + Indom the Earth Shaker so this is probably not of any importance at all.

Reprisal - I'll be honest, I tend to Reprisal the tankbuster a lot. It's admittedly a lot harder to get good mileage out of Reprisal here so I'm not going to complain too much at it. Your current ones are basically fine, you can probably squeeze another one for some value in phase 1 and another during the Bulwark passes but it's really just for a 10% mitigation on ~2 autos so don't take this to heart as anything besides "might as well hit it because +1 cast per minute padding?" really.
I typically Reprisal and Shake the Akh Morns, and then Yolo any other Reprisal use. Since we Invuln/Cover 3 of the busters, and throw everthying and Feint/Palisade at the other 2, I'm not sure else to use them on. We both do it in the Dragon Add too. I guess i can hold a Shake for the Earth Shakers since with Veil and Dismantle, the first Akh Morns don't really hurt.



This is super nitpicky and I haven't actually crunched the numbers to be sure how much it gains but if you can delay the GCDs slightly, I do believe it's a gain to finish the Omega phase 1 hitting Maim @1:30-1:32 and then Storm's Eye as soon as the Level Checker appears. As it stands right now, you miss slashing on an extra hit under IR AND you'll lose Eye while doing tethers. You have 1 GCD of space here without messing with tethers so there's no harm in getting it if you can. I'd also have to check exactly the amount of meter you can spend in p1 but you should be able to make sure to go into Level Checker at 40 with an extra Onslaught or so. It's a fairly static 90s rotation so you can usually crunch it out precisely, especially when you're sitting at 2.37 / 2.38 GCD tiering.
I used to hold IR for after magnet phase under Trick in PF. But we kill Level Checker far too fast and IR is nowhere near ready again for when boss returns, so i started IR before magnets, but I'm still getting used to it. I try to Eye as boss leaves, but I never considered delaying a GCD. Maybe I can use more Onslaughts instead of a FC or 2 and might end on Main naturally? Guess I'll have to see.

Defensive wise, and this applies to all fights but I'm throwing it here specifically because Mustard Bomb makes for some real big gains from it and O12S will be a different focus, you really should be getting more Interventions? I know you're looking for advice for yourself but 0 Interventions in every fight is leaving a lot of mitigation on the table. Every ~30s, PLD generates a Sheltron or Intervention use and the little bit of mitigation goes a long way, especially in spots where they can double up cooldowning themselves and you with it (Mustard Bomb + HP- Atomic Ray, basically everything in O12S).
I brought up Interventions before, put PLD says timing of them is always near an AoE so he sheltrons for Shield Swipe procs.

As for your own, I'd throw out you can get a Shake It Off out in the opener @20s or so to catch the first Flamethrower. It's essentially free and since you're doing Cover - Hallowed, you basically can just do whatever with your cooldowns and feed it Vengeance Thrill Raw Int for the Flamethrower. The other notable big spot to Shake is during the Big Fists -> Electric Slide (stack) marker; prep your Raw Int + Thrill (or save Thrill for IR Upheaval coming up :D) when you go to the marker and Onslaught + Shake to get back in. Besides that, Omega auto attacks. A lot. There's a lot of periods with extended auto windows like after Big Fists, and, really, the entire period between Panto 1 and Panto 2 is ~5 auto attacks between mechanics. It's not reliable but it's a good spot to just throw Anticipation, Conva, etc. at. I'll note you have a free Vengeance around the 6m mark, but it's fairly low value as it'd only really catch Panto 1 and maybe 2 auto attacks. Just a random mention as you can pop Vengeance a little earlier for the Mustard Bomb you take and it'll catch maybe an extra auto. NOT A HUGE DEAL but just something I caught that I'll probably look at doing myself lol.

Likewise with the above notes on Reprisal for other fights, you can Reprisal all of the Flamethrowers and Atomic Rays so working out some plan helps a lot. Flamethrowers are roughly at: 0:30, 3:40, 5:55, 8:15 and Atomic Rays are @0:12, 4:20, 7:20, 8:05. I say roughly since Level Checker duration varies with kill time which throws off the time between #1 and #2 of both but the time in between the others is pretty much constant within a GCD. This is probably getting really grating to keep hitting Reprisal but it's a free bit of mitigation. It's also one of the more coordination heavy ones so it's kind of expected to be underused until you sit down and go "I got this you got that" a lot.
It's probabaly missed since I do it pre pull, but I shake on opener in O11, and I tend to Reprisal + Shake every Flamethrower. I've not actually tested to see if Shake i available during Big Fists and Electric Slide, but if not i could move one.

Since I Holmgang the buster after red fists to save CD's for the Panto 2 laser cleave, I typically throw a everything at the buster before first Doom Tether since it's the only one I'll ever need CD's for. Vengeance, Thrill, Rampart and Reprisal. I try to have Raw+ Aware or Anticipation+Convo yp for autos whenever possible, and have found a good spot for Rampart. That seems like a good spot for Vengeance, so I guess i can use it early as soon as Star/Larboard resolves before that buster.


RNG. This fight will wildly swing your average since a lot will be dictated by your dash numbers and the Sword / Shield order and which boss you have / how you handle the mechanic. I'll be honest, I'm not sure how to tackle this one without it being about how you handle all the mechanics? So for now, I'm going to wimp out and say I can look at this more after this post? I'm not too sure of too many super big things that aren't also "This is a good spot to greed one extra hit" or "Make sure to move your boss to a spot where you + your melee buddy is so you can both hit the boss while dodging." Maybe a bit of a copout. Sorry D:
We use Fennek Strat if that makes any sense to you.

I know one way to boost my DPS on M/F, but it sabaotages the PLD. Since he has no Slashing and is bad at snap aggro, het gets the NIN for when we split into groups. And since SCH/BRD/DRG should stay togther, he gets MCH too. So while I get Voice, Litany and Chain, they don't do much for me, and he gets Trick and Hypercharge. I get a bit jealous...

Before the boss splits I have the rotation mapped to a T. I don't see how there's anything i can do to improve there. I end with an Upheaval and FC to finish on 10 meter.

The 2nd phase is RNG as you say with numbers. As for Mechs, i much prefer Shield 2nd. If Shield is 2nd, i can get a IR off just before i need to dodge the cross, but if Blade is 2nd, it doesn't quite work out that way and I miss and I'd miss an IR FC so I hold it. Unless I'm doing something wrong.


Plus, we don't do the Tank LB for Meteor + Sagittarius Arrow (it's technically not a DPS gain!) so that kind of warps the cooldowns slightly. I will say, though, is there a reason at it being you Holmganging the two Bladedances vs Hallowed? I guess technically it doesn't matter with a Benediction in play, outside of the GCD clip it adds, but just curious. Also, obligatory Intervention on close Solar Ray is amazing as you'll take basically nothing!
I'm not fussed either way, but we Tank LB since that's what the group learned in PF before and it's less hassle. I Holmgang so we can build LB for 2nd Tank LB.

I'm still reworking a lot of O12S as we're finishing up reprogging the fight (and, well, same for M-F but R N G and disasters means I haven't thought much about M-F besides crying) so there's a lot that will end up being potentially wrong for alignments. That said, most of the fight from your DPS perspective is pretty much straightforward. IR doesn't really line up poorly with anything and if you can be consistent on use then you'll be fine throughout the fight. You look to do non-uptime Unreal for HW so there's kind of some built-in limitations there for your DPS and really there's not a lot to really greed out.
yeah we generally played s safe strat. But now that everyone has an i400/405 weapon, we're gonna switch to a more uptime one from next week. Will take practice though

That out of the way, there's a lot to be said about how much you can trivialize the tank busters through Cover? Notably, once really comfortable with it, you don't even really need to monitor threat on the first two Target Analysis as both can be safely Covered every time. This would end up being a massive overhaul to your cooldowns, however, so a lot of if you can make use of this will come down to how you currently do your planned cooldowns. I personally have my cooldowns metered out for the fight and if we can Cover / Hallowed / Holmgang a set, we go ahead with those. Just currently always with the back-up plan of making sure we can handle a kneejerk soak situation.
Yeah we try to Holmgang, Cover and hallowed as much as we can, and save actual CD's for monitors and autos.

Reprisal wise, you're definitely going to want to make sure to get Reprisals up on all the Oversampled Wave Cannons: 0:40, 2:50, 4:10, 7:05, 8:25 roughly. Again, this is a great spot for Intervention to save your asses a bit and they're also spread out enough that you can make sure to Reprisal + Dismantle them all to really help making it manageable with fewer cooldowns.



I kind of over rambled at the beginning and this ran into my raid start so if needed I'll come back and touch up O12S as I assume those were the ones you wanted really looked at the most :( But, at the same time, M-F lends itself a lot to RNG making a mess of things and Final Omega you'll mainly look at tank synergy things to really keep the healing down for the healers.
How we do it is I reprisal every Oversampled Wave Cannon, and he and the MCV reprisal and Dismantle all the Ion Ifflux. Bar the first Ion, I'll Shake the rest of them and he Veils the first, skips 2nd, and Veils the rest. Ouw WHM is gonna go AST soon, so once we can CU the Ion's, i can ask the MCH to Dismantle the MOnitor busters instead.
______

tl;dr: You're really consistent with your IR use and your IR's mainly suffer from missing some raid buffs either from a group-side perspective to adjust OR some of them you can just hold yourself to line it up, especially fight-ending last use IRs. You do seem to underuse your meter a bit which lends itself to you losing out on ~1-2k or so potency per fight; this mostly stems from being too early on Storm's Eye refresh, at 2.37/2.38 GCD tier, you really only need about 8s left on Eye to go ahead and hit a Storm's Path and still get an Eye refresh back without dropping Eye and what would mostly appear to be sitting on Infuriates a little too long / maybe over-resetting them.

Defensively, you can get some better uses out of Shake It Off and definitely with better Reprisals but the biggest source of missing mitigation will end up being the Cover and Intervention use you can throw at mechanics. You have a few spots where you just outright lose uses of Rampart / Vengeance but they're not major ones, just "can cover a few autos without hurting my tankbuster coverage" situations so you might as well get them. Most the changed cooldowns I went through are will come down to healer preference (though I'd argue most save them a GCD or Aetherflow stacks at least! but I also come from an AST/SCH perspective primarily).

Honestly, you have a lot less room for general improvement than you're probably thinking? Maybe? Most of what will be left to milk for DPS are the nitpicky sides of Warrior and meter management + cooldown alignments.
Oh thanks for all the help! It's just this is the first time I've ever been part of a static in FFXIV and I've never done optimisation as a group, offensively or defensively before. So I figured there's a lot I can improve on.

The Eye refreshes are a big point, as is sitting on Infuritate during IR because I'm scared to clip and waste an IR FC. Our DPS are really good with Feints/Palisades and stuff, but Intervention is rarely seen. I've been holding/sitting on Thrill a few times for Tank busters beyond the opener, but with better CD usage I cold prbably free that up a bit for Upheaval.

I still don't understand how SE expects Tanks to play though, or people who aren't that good and expect tanks to sit in tank stance all day. As it generally is, tanks between them have more CD's than they know what to do with, and that's without Tank stance. When learning CD timing on Final, whenever i messed timings up it was so easy to just do a quick Unchained+Inner Beast and carry on as normal.

Thanks again!

Also on a side note, how much of a difference does an Astro make compared to WHM DPS wise?

The real way to optimize O10S add phase as the yellow tank is to go for the nail that is only tethered to the dragon and threaten to aim Frost Breath at your bard if he keeps putting fucking DoTs in it to pad.
I try and keep to the North side, and target a small nail that has a big nail attached to it. That way i can move onto that one when i kill the first.
 
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scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
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The real way to optimize O10S add phase as the yellow tank is to go for the nail that is only tethered to the dragon and threaten to aim Frost Breath at your bard if he keeps putting fucking DoTs in it to pad.
But then you still need another nail since it dies too fast even without someone else! That's the real problem. Getting a solo nail only goes so far, it's the securing a second one without cleaving people / leaving your Earthly Star playpen / no seriously, how does someone always manage to get cleaved when I move him :(

Alliance roulette would be fine if it wasn't Labyrinth of the Ancients 95% of the time
But that's the only reason you want to do it so you get out in like <20 minutes!

...honestly, most of the shitty feeling is every job feels pretty bad at 50. Even 60 for a lot of jobs for the HW Alliance Raids.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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But then you still need another nail since it dies too fast even without someone else! That's the real problem. Getting a solo nail only goes so far, it's the securing a second one without cleaving people / leaving your Earthly Star playpen / no seriously, how does someone always manage to get cleaved when I move him :(
It's like they added that point in the yellow dragon's rotation where he does two frost breaths in a row instead of alternating Breath / raidwide as a greedy tank check.
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
47
0
Thankfully the clip has been forever lost through the annals of Twitch purges but we shall never forget:

"Moving dragon, cleaving soon"
cleaves NIN
"BETRAYAL"

The Axe makes my Skill Speed 1480 odd with a GCD of 2.34. It also drops my Crit to 2200. I need the Omega Arms and Head to drop fix my SS a bit. Literally never seen either. If one drops, I could buy the other.
YUP. Loot drops are just frustrating since we need 3 drops you'll end up buying with O10S pages. In 10 weeks, we've seen two gloves. That's it for our BiS. And those were on week 7 and 9. F u n F u n F u n. At least I got the O12S glamour I wanted before paging it out was going to happen :|

That said, our BiS is still around 2200-ish Crit for the 2.38 GCD tier set so you're basically sitting around the Crit you'll have when fully geared.

I can do the Onslaught during the Tsunami jumo fine, the one during Cyclone is awkward though because even if i make it to other side, i still get wind debuff. might need to delay it ever so slightly. Incidentally, after that onslaught in Cyclone, how many GCD's do you get off before you position for knockback. I always get two, but haven't been brave enough to try a 3rd yet...

Also on Cyclone phase, after the first jump and knockback, how do you position boss? Personally I'd like to face boss towards the middle cyclone, but our PLD keeps him faced towards edge/corner.
With the Onslaught over, 3, maybe 4 GCDs. Without, 2 GCDs. That said, you can max melee range and the knockback still doesn't get you punted off so it's usually not too risky / GCD loss. And we also face him out, I haven't thought too much about facing him inside. I know there's an uptime variant with him basically on the edge of the Cyclone but it looks a little meme-y when the true answer is just get Longitude/Latitude start and never see Cyclone again :D

To be honest when i was learning, I used Holmgang more often. But it's such a gentle Tank Buster, that with some shields i wasn't even dropping to 1HP when using it (nothing will be as gentle as O6 though..). I typically Rampart+Raw the TB's, and Vengeance for Orbs, but i guess I can Holmgang busters again and free Rampart and Raw for autos.

Reprisal use could defo be a lot better. Unlike in O11 where I get the Flamethowers and he gets the Atomic rays, and in Final where i do Oversampled and him Ion Ifflux, we never really mapped it out for other fights.
This is where it felt kind of bad in general on nitpicking cooldowns? Clearly they work and I didn't look too hard at the healer responses in all of them. I just know what our healers tend towards, both me and my co-tank have greedy healer experience, and some speedrun experience so I wanted to chime in. Basically, the thought process is forced tank swaps are a good spot for "mitigation" Holmgangs (as opposed to O12S and cheesing mechanics Holmgangs) since you can just be ignored and left to regen off the damage. The same for the Reprisals. It's hard to have them mapped out for O9S/O10S since there was most likely very little prog there so not a lot of mapping Reprisals or anything. Just smash buttons and go. it's specifically Earthquake we mapped around aiming for near-0 GCD Earthquake healing so getting Reprisals, Veil, Shake, etc. planned out here mattered and the rest of the fight kind of followed suit.

I can do this for the corner ones, but haven't gotten that good at doing so for the cardinals. Need more practice.

I definitely need to work on my Eye refreshes. It used to be much worse! And i need to better prep for IR. I have enough cases where i go into IR and I'm 60 or above meter, or need to infuriate during it, and end up holding it for a FC or 2 to prevent clipping since it's costs me an IR FC at times.

When do you use your 3rd IR? Just before Boss jumps, or on add phase? The former can be tricky at times. Only tried it recently and haven't fully figured out the rotation to that i can immediately use my 2nd and 3rd IR's instead of being mid combo.
Don't get me wrong on these. I've gotten a lot of yelling at taking the cardinal greed and failing it :D But once you get used to it it's not so bad to pull off. I want to say I get off the Storm's Path post-IR and then take a step back just-to-be-safe and it times out fine. And, also don't get me wrong, I let my IR drift 1-3 GCDs pretty often. Granted, I have no raid buffs left to sync with but still. It's probably one of the reasons my Onslaught use is where it is; find the spots where I'm off on meter and try to correct it down to <50 for IR or see if I can figure out a way to >40s on Infuriate so it doesn't matter if I'm >50 meter. It's a touchy thing since we're both at a bad GCD tier still due to gearing options which can end up generating a little extra meter here and there which skews timings.

And I IR the nails. I've done the boss one for awhile but losing raid buffs kind of makes both whatevers to me so I just IR nails and tell myself I can delete a nail in 5 GCDs so maybe it speeds up the phase a few seconds...! Optimism! That said, you will end up wanting to burn it on the boss for speed purposes / minmax damage purposes since it should line up with Trick (partially). I went to go double check something here since regular IR timing shouldn't work due to phase timing and it actually is a spot that benefits from a slightly tweaked opener. Staying in Defiance with Unchained + Thrill + Upheaval into a 1 GCD early IR lets all 3 safely fit in the first phase. So basically HS (Thrill) -> Maim (pot) -> Eye (IR) -> IB (Upheaval + Deliverance). You have to hard ride the cooldown from here on out since Midgardsormr jumps at ~3:18 and this would be IR at 0:09, 1:39, and 3:09 so ... you know.

I used to hold IR for after magnet phase under Trick in PF. But we kill Level Checker far too fast and IR is nowhere near ready again for when boss returns, so i started IR before magnets, but I'm still getting used to it. I try to Eye as boss leaves, but I never considered delaying a GCD. Maybe I can use more Onslaughts instead of a FC or 2 and might end on Main naturally? Guess I'll have to see.
You may have to hold your last GCD a second or so to get it to hit right before Omega flies off but it shouldn't cost you a GCD. That's honestly why I said I'm not 100% sure if it's better or not if only for the whole potentially flat out lost GCD given the SSPD tier. It's definitely something worth messing with to see if it works out? Ideally the goal is exiting the phase at 40 or less meter since you'll be doing an Eye on the Level Checker. Missing Trick sucks but, as you say, Level Checker dies too fast these days to get the IR refresh if you wait so you kind of have to do it this way.

I brought up Interventions before, put PLD says timing of them is always near an AoE so he sheltrons for Shield Swipe procs.
womp. That said, because this is the kind of person I am, 13 Sheltrons in the clear you linked which is 650 meter spent of 1195 generated. That's an intervention for every tankbuster and still having leftover! Just saying! If you'd rather not rock the boat too much since O11S will mostly be 10% Interventions, that's fine. I'd still make the point, though, for O12S where it can be 20-30% ones fairly consistently.

It's probabaly missed since I do it pre pull, but I shake on opener in O11, and I tend to Reprisal + Shake every Flamethrower. I've not actually tested to see if Shake i available during Big Fists and Electric Slide, but if not i could move one.
Yeah, you're right, I did miss it's a pre-pull use. That probably works fine too? Since it means basically no damage taken from pre-pull shields on the first Atomic. That said, it'll be something to maybe look at whenever you get AST instead if only since Star will be popping shortly after the Atomic Ray in most AST openers. So another thing to add to the healer opinion pile, really.

We use Fennek Strat if that makes any sense to you.

I know one way to boost my DPS on M/F, but it sabaotages the PLD. Since he has no Slashing and is bad at snap aggro, het gets the NIN for when we split into groups. And since SCH/BRD/DRG should stay togther, he gets MCH too. So while I get Voice, Litany and Chain, they don't do much for me, and he gets Trick and Hypercharge. I get a bit jealous...

Before the boss splits I have the rotation mapped to a T. I don't see how there's anything i can do to improve there. I end with an Upheaval and FC to finish on 10 meter.

The 2nd phase is RNG as you say with numbers. As for Mechs, i much prefer Shield 2nd. If Shield is 2nd, i can get a IR off just before i need to dodge the cross, but if Blade is 2nd, it doesn't quite work out that way and I miss and I'd miss an IR FC so I hold it. Unless I'm doing something wrong.
Yeah, no, I totally understand that. All my whining of raid buffs is pretty meaningless since WAR/SCH/DRG/BRD is a locked setup for M-F so it's not really like my M-F situation has ever changed. Though now both us tanks whine about it since our PLD has no Slashing and just Devotion + Contagion. And yeah, the pre-split routine is basically nailed down to the GCD if you're ending there. FC+Upheaval as they split, Infuriate should be up somewhere during the puddles so you can Onslaught the knockback (or just for threat). I don't really think there's an improvement here that wouldn't be super precise in a way I'm not sure about yet.

Edit: Oops. I skipped a thing on Blade / Shield, though it won't be very helpful. We do a very non-standard strat of all the ranged basically fan out for Fire 3 during the Sweep the Leg / Superliminal Motion. Basically this gives us a shot at those of us staying on Omega-F not having to move at all for no uptime loss while Omega-M group is the same uptime loss if we did the stack both near the middle and do clock positions. I'm not sure it's a gain or makes sense or anything, it's just what we've been doing and it's nice to 50% of the time get Blades and be on the 100% uptime side lol

Oh thanks for all the help! It's just this is the first time I've ever been part of a static in FFXIV and I've never done optimisation as a group, offensively or defensively before. So I figured there's a lot I can improve on. The Eye refreshes are a big point, as is sitting on Infuritate during IR because I'm scared to clip and waste an IR FC. Our DPS are really good with Feints/Palisades and stuff, but Intervention is rarely seen. I've been holding/sitting on Thrill a few times for Tank busters beyond the opener, but with better CD usage I cold prbably free that up a bit for Upheaval.
And, really, I went on at length but by no means was any of that saying you're doing bad. You're doing really good, especially if this is your first real attempt at a static / raiding. Like I said, a looooooooot of it is super nitpicky and either nuanced things or full group buy-in on the optimization. Pretty much all of the WAR basics are down really well and it's just the more finicky parts with the 40-60 meter range and IR, typically, that you're running into. The last little bits are going to be rough as it's either reworking muscle memory or adopting new timings or doing group-wide adjustments but, hey, if people are into doing the optimization thing then it's a really fun thing to go through.

I still don't understand how SE expects Tanks to play though, or people who aren't that good and expect tanks to sit in tank stance all day. As it generally is, tanks between them have more CD's than they know what to do with, and that's without Tank stance. When learning CD timing on Final, whenever i messed timings up it was so easy to just do a quick Unchained+Inner Beast and carry on as normal.
Yeah, I've long since given up figuring out how SE thinks tanks operate. Tank stance is mostly superfluous or an aggro situation. As much fun as I do get out of the tankdeeps situation, at this point I think they should just accept they messed it all up and figure out a way that Max Mitigation = Max DPS for tank optimization instead of this. The single happiest moment I had of tanking the entire expansion was that brief period of time they had tBN = DPS gain and I thought they finally figured out combining mitigation and DPS. But no, fun ruined, finicky DPS loss/gain status of tBN depending on final GCD of the fight (aka, don't bother min/max seriously) and now we're still stuck with DRK not competitive because Veil saves healer GCDs better / LB cheese.

Also on a side note, how much of a difference does an Astro make compared to WHM DPS wise?
An AST adds up to infinity DPS depending on who you ask D: But, seriously, we can do a rough estimation. Here's the raid DPS analysis from our O9S last night (because I finally didn't potato the run ad it was the only thing I didn't brainfart on last night): XIVRDPS Calculator. Which the initial reaction is getting to go "1000 rDPS!" If we go through the Details tab at the bottom and all of the cards I get, it's actually 'only' around 111.75 for myself which is really only around a 2.2% gain on me. Which is pretty good for 'only' around 30% Balance and the one Arrow and Spear.
 
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Jun 11, 2018
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Just bought the Encyclopaedia Eorzea from SE's official store. I love this stuff, but... seriously, Square? $49,99 for the book; OK. but... another eleven dollars for 5-to-10-day domestic shipping?

Media mail just doesn't cost that much, you gougers.

I'm still really looking forward to it, but... come on. I bought the Japanese original for the equivalent of $39.00, tax included, with free domestic-in-Japan shipping, and that was through Amazon (which must surely be taking a cut)!
 
Oct 31, 2017
147
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Just bought the Encyclopaedia Eorzea from SE's official store. I love this stuff, but... seriously, Square? $49,99 for the book; OK. but... another eleven dollars for 5-to-10-day domestic shipping?

Media mail just doesn't cost that much, you gougers.

I'm still really looking forward to it, but... come on. I bought the Japanese original for the equivalent of $39.00, tax included, with free domestic-in-Japan shipping, and that was through Amazon (which must surely be taking a cut)!
It's an additional $52.99 shipping for us Canadians.

Are there better ways to get this damn book without paying double? I got the first one by chance when I was on a business trip to Japan and saw they were selling the English version at the SquareEnix Cafe. Was really looking forward to getting the second volume ;-(
 
Oct 27, 2017
281
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UK
Thankfully the clip has been forever lost through the annals of Twitch purges but we shall never forget:

"Moving dragon, cleaving soon"
cleaves NIN
"BETRAYAL"



YUP. Loot drops are just frustrating since we need 3 drops you'll end up buying with O10S pages. In 10 weeks, we've seen two gloves. That's it for our BiS. And those were on week 7 and 9. F u n F u n F u n. At least I got the O12S glamour I wanted before paging it out was going to happen :|

That said, our BiS is still around 2200-ish Crit for the 2.38 GCD tier set so you're basically sitting around the Crit you'll have when fully geared.



With the Onslaught over, 3, maybe 4 GCDs. Without, 2 GCDs. That said, you can max melee range and the knockback still doesn't get you punted off so it's usually not too risky / GCD loss. And we also face him out, I haven't thought too much about facing him inside. I know there's an uptime variant with him basically on the edge of the Cyclone but it looks a little meme-y when the true answer is just get Longitude/Latitude start and never see Cyclone again :D



This is where it felt kind of bad in general on nitpicking cooldowns? Clearly they work and I didn't look too hard at the healer responses in all of them. I just know what our healers tend towards, both me and my co-tank have greedy healer experience, and some speedrun experience so I wanted to chime in. Basically, the thought process is forced tank swaps are a good spot for "mitigation" Holmgangs (as opposed to O12S and cheesing mechanics Holmgangs) since you can just be ignored and left to regen off the damage. The same for the Reprisals. It's hard to have them mapped out for O9S/O10S since there was most likely very little prog there so not a lot of mapping Reprisals or anything. Just smash buttons and go. it's specifically Earthquake we mapped around aiming for near-0 GCD Earthquake healing so getting Reprisals, Veil, Shake, etc. planned out here mattered and the rest of the fight kind of followed suit.



Don't get me wrong on these. I've gotten a lot of yelling at taking the cardinal greed and failing it :D But once you get used to it it's not so bad to pull off. I want to say I get off the Storm's Path post-IR and then take a step back just-to-be-safe and it times out fine. And, also don't get me wrong, I let my IR drift 1-3 GCDs pretty often. Granted, I have no raid buffs left to sync with but still. It's probably one of the reasons my Onslaught use is where it is; find the spots where I'm off on meter and try to correct it down to <50 for IR or see if I can figure out a way to >40s on Infuriate so it doesn't matter if I'm >50 meter. It's a touchy thing since we're both at a bad GCD tier still due to gearing options which can end up generating a little extra meter here and there which skews timings.

And I IR the nails. I've done the boss one for awhile but losing raid buffs kind of makes both whatevers to me so I just IR nails and tell myself I can delete a nail in 5 GCDs so maybe it speeds up the phase a few seconds...! Optimism! That said, you will end up wanting to burn it on the boss for speed purposes / minmax damage purposes since it should line up with Trick (partially). I went to go double check something here since regular IR timing shouldn't work due to phase timing and it actually is a spot that benefits from a slightly tweaked opener. Staying in Defiance with Unchained + Thrill + Upheaval into a 1 GCD early IR lets all 3 safely fit in the first phase. So basically HS (Thrill) -> Maim (pot) -> Eye (IR) -> IB (Upheaval + Deliverance). You have to hard ride the cooldown from here on out since Midgardsormr jumps at ~3:18 and this would be IR at 0:09, 1:39, and 3:09 so ... you know.



You may have to hold your last GCD a second or so to get it to hit right before Omega flies off but it shouldn't cost you a GCD. That's honestly why I said I'm not 100% sure if it's better or not if only for the whole potentially flat out lost GCD given the SSPD tier. It's definitely something worth messing with to see if it works out? Ideally the goal is exiting the phase at 40 or less meter since you'll be doing an Eye on the Level Checker. Missing Trick sucks but, as you say, Level Checker dies too fast these days to get the IR refresh if you wait so you kind of have to do it this way.



womp. That said, because this is the kind of person I am, 13 Sheltrons in the clear you linked which is 650 meter spent of 1195 generated. That's an intervention for every tankbuster and still having leftover! Just saying! If you'd rather not rock the boat too much since O11S will mostly be 10% Interventions, that's fine. I'd still make the point, though, for O12S where it can be 20-30% ones fairly consistently.



Yeah, you're right, I did miss it's a pre-pull use. That probably works fine too? Since it means basically no damage taken from pre-pull shields on the first Atomic. That said, it'll be something to maybe look at whenever you get AST instead if only since Star will be popping shortly after the Atomic Ray in most AST openers. So another thing to add to the healer opinion pile, really.



Yeah, no, I totally understand that. All my whining of raid buffs is pretty meaningless since WAR/SCH/DRG/BRD is a locked setup for M-F so it's not really like my M-F situation has ever changed. Though now both us tanks whine about it since our PLD has no Slashing and just Devotion + Contagion. And yeah, the pre-split routine is basically nailed down to the GCD if you're ending there. FC+Upheaval as they split, Infuriate should be up somewhere during the puddles so you can Onslaught the knockback (or just for threat). I don't really think there's an improvement here that wouldn't be super precise in a way I'm not sure about yet.

Edit: Oops. I skipped a thing on Blade / Shield, though it won't be very helpful. We do a very non-standard strat of all the ranged basically fan out for Fire 3 during the Sweep the Leg / Superliminal Motion. Basically this gives us a shot at those of us staying on Omega-F not having to move at all for no uptime loss while Omega-M group is the same uptime loss if we did the stack both near the middle and do clock positions. I'm not sure it's a gain or makes sense or anything, it's just what we've been doing and it's nice to 50% of the time get Blades and be on the 100% uptime side lol



And, really, I went on at length but by no means was any of that saying you're doing bad. You're doing really good, especially if this is your first real attempt at a static / raiding. Like I said, a looooooooot of it is super nitpicky and either nuanced things or full group buy-in on the optimization. Pretty much all of the WAR basics are down really well and it's just the more finicky parts with the 40-60 meter range and IR, typically, that you're running into. The last little bits are going to be rough as it's either reworking muscle memory or adopting new timings or doing group-wide adjustments but, hey, if people are into doing the optimization thing then it's a really fun thing to go through.



Yeah, I've long since given up figuring out how SE thinks tanks operate. Tank stance is mostly superfluous or an aggro situation. As much fun as I do get out of the tankdeeps situation, at this point I think they should just accept they messed it all up and figure out a way that Max Mitigation = Max DPS for tank optimization instead of this. The single happiest moment I had of tanking the entire expansion was that brief period of time they had tBN = DPS gain and I thought they finally figured out combining mitigation and DPS. But no, fun ruined, finicky DPS loss/gain status of tBN depending on final GCD of the fight (aka, don't bother min/max seriously) and now we're still stuck with DRK not competitive because Veil saves healer GCDs better / LB cheese.



An AST adds up to infinity DPS depending on who you ask D: But, seriously, we can do a rough estimation. Here's the raid DPS analysis from our O9S last night (because I finally didn't potato the run ad it was the only thing I didn't brainfart on last night): XIVRDPS Calculator. Which the initial reaction is getting to go "1000 rDPS!" If we go through the Details tab at the bottom and all of the cards I get, it's actually 'only' around 111.75 for myself which is really only around a 2.2% gain on me. Which is pretty good for 'only' around 30% Balance and the one Arrow and Spear.
Well thanks for the advive. Guess I'll talk with my tank partner and healers how we can do things better. It's not so much about the numbers or parses. But just discovering how you are using your abilities to their most effective use to benefit the group as a whole
 
Oct 25, 2017
62
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It's an additional $52.99 shipping for us Canadians.

Are there better ways to get this damn book without paying double? I got the first one by chance when I was on a business trip to Japan and saw they were selling the English version at the SquareEnix Cafe. Was really looking forward to getting the second volume ;-(
Best way for Canadians to get it was via Fan Fest. Got multiple copies of the lore books for my friends that asked me to buy for them.
 
Oct 28, 2017
244
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It's an additional $52.99 shipping for us Canadians.

Are there better ways to get this damn book without paying double? I got the first one by chance when I was on a business trip to Japan and saw they were selling the English version at the SquareEnix Cafe. Was really looking forward to getting the second volume ;-(
You'd need to keep an eye for some Asian websites like Amazon JP, CD Japan and Play-Asia.

For example, CD Japan has some additional stock (English Language) coming soon

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEODAI-15838

And from what I know, they ship much less than Square Enix.