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Astral

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
28,115
I've been on the fence about jumping into this game with the Heavensward promotion running right now. My main interest is to Platinum the game on PS4, mostly playing solo at my own leisure. My question is... do I need Bloodstorm? Or is there enough content to keep my playing until I get to my goal with only the base game and the first expansion?

If so, what class do you recommend that I play? I'd want something good for solo play, with good survivability, but also good offense.


... if that's not too much to ask :P

I have hundreds of hours in the game. I think 300 or 800, I forget. My trophy percentage is still like less than 10 and I haven't gotten a trophy I'm forever. Maybe my game is broken. Assuming it's not, you'll be at the game for a very long time if you're trying to platinum it. As for starting class, pretty much anything will do. I guess it's easier to die as a DPS though since you can't heal yourself and aren't tanky.
 

Deleted member 18021

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,000
I've been on the fence about jumping into this game with the Heavensward promotion running right now. My main interest is to Platinum the game on PS4, mostly playing solo at my own leisure. My question is... do I need Bloodstorm? Or is there enough content to keep my playing until I get to my goal with only the base game and the first expansion?

If so, what class do you recommend that I play? I'd want something good for solo play, with good survivability, but also good offense.


... if that's not too much to ask :P

FYI, the FFXIV trophies are all for the base game. You don't need any of the expansions to get them.

The platinum is just time investment. You'll need to spend some time with the crafter and gatherer classes, do a bunch of FATEs and levequests, clear the 2.0 main story, and clear the first tier of ARR's raids. The most trouble that you'll run into is that levequests are time gated, which will delay the platinum on the order of months.

Honestly, don't slog through it just for the trophy. Give the game a try via the trial and see if it's something you'll actually enjoy first, and then do most of it over time.

As for class choice, it's largely going to be up to you. The game's based on the holy trinity of Tanks, Healers, and DPS, so pick the most interesting one and go. There's no commitment if you decide you don't like it later down the line.

Every job's going to be changed rather significantly in like a month, too, so keep that in mind.
 

Azem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,004
I took the liberty of highlighting all the elements I'd like to have shrunken a bit to help keep better track of my character during al

I realize there's an option to turn off or minimize special effects from other characters, but I'm a sucker for cinematic flair and doing this makes battles look lamer. I may also display my character name again to help keep track of my position. If there are other ways to help visually identify where I am during the craziness, I'd like to know about them, but in the meantime let me know if any of the highlighted text can be adjusted too.

The battle effects and numbers are called flying text. There's also pop-up text, but I don't know if that covers the other stuff you want to change because I don't know what it does.
HC1bKRV.jpg

Enemy names and HP bars can be changed under display name settings. You can change the names to only display when targeted. The HP bars are either on, only on at <100% health, or off completely (there's no "when targeted").

Ignore the rest of my HUD, it's firmly in "It works for me and I can't be bothered changing it" territory.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,781
I am really glad that the clunk from tanks are finally being removed. Being able to jump in and start doing damage immediately without having to throw out aggro combos should do well for flow (consuming/building resources/doing damage rotation).

I hope that the encounters also make use of whatever new tanking abilities that they're handing out too.

All the these changes should make them as smooth to play as DPS jobs now imo.

The days of having to deal with Paladin and to a lesser extent Dark Knight stances are over.
 

Pendas

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,654
I've been on the fence about jumping into this game with the Heavensward promotion running right now. My main interest is to Platinum the game on PS4, mostly playing solo at my own leisure. My question is... do I need Bloodstorm? Or is there enough content to keep my playing until I get to my goal with only the base game and the first expansion?

If so, what class do you recommend that I play? I'd want something good for solo play, with good survivability, but also good offense.


... if that's not too much to ask :P

The FF14 Achievements are all tied to old content, and 80% of them are Grinds (Craft 1000x as a specific crafter, multiply that by 8) Honestly if you're in it for achievements, you're going to spend a LOT of time just doing boring, repetitive things over and over and over (Fate's, crafting, gathering) instead of actually enjoying the things that make the game fun.
 

Deleted member 24149

Oct 29, 2017
2,150
Has anyone used or bought a story skip potion for anyone? I'm thinking of getting one for my brother who's interested in HW and on but is dying on the altar of ARR's shitty production value. Has anyone felt like they're missing anything by skipping ARR?

I think I could maybe give him a quick summary of what he missed and maybe direct him to a couple of cutscenes -

2.0-2.3: Beast Tribe fuckery, some rando scion who dies immediately, we learn about how to kill Ascians by trapping them in a Crystal first
2.4: Lady Iceheart
2.5: Crystal Braves and the first "set time aside" cutscene

I really believe that with the NG+ system implemented and those questlines propery encapsulated, the next step will be allowing players to skip ARR.
God this is wrong and hurts me.

2.x quick notes.
2.1: Help F'lhaminn come to the Waking Sands. Fix her earring. Get side tracked by moogles. Relocate Scions to Reverant Tolls. Ascians taunt you beat them up.
2.2: Domans arrive. Help them relocate to Reverant Tolls. Get sidetracked by Leviathan.
2.3: Get sidetracked by Ramuh. Find out Sylphs are more annoying than ever. Alphinaud gets a great idea that definitely will not have repercussions for the rest of the god damned game. Also have fun finding NPCs in a virtual haystack.
2.4: There's a spy amongst us. Also stuff is happening in Ishgard take a look at this dungeon. Also there's seriously a spy go chase some domans. Also seriously there's a primal in ishgard now. Oh by the way here's the spy and its an annoying solo duty. Oh hi Moenbryda!
2.5: Deal with some Crystal Braves junk. By the way the dragons are singing quick to do this dungeon. Oh and go find these packages in Northern Thanalan beat some garleans. By the way there's an Ascian here and SURPRISE trial fight. Oh and bye Moenbryda. Say goodbye to her at a special spot in Mor Dhona.
2.55: Go back to that special spot in Mor Dhona again. By the the dragons are really mad talk to some people and then go fight some dragons. And then fight a really big dragon on a bridge (Don't worry he's already been beaten with the nerf bat several times). Go help Tataru not be useless (Don't worry she'll still be useful) and help the crystal braves one last time. Now go to some fancy party in Ul'dah and why is everything falling apart?
 

Qvoth

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,899
my creations, liking the hrothgar and veena viera most atm, probably gonna be a toss between those 2
might change if we got more customization options on release, i sure hope so, would like my hrothgar to have a horn but not the face that it currently is forced to have on the benchmark
ideally this beard face and a horn
fMrCdnB.jpg

wQyhikR.jpg

zpWnTUY.jpg

showing off my creations :P
 

Deleted member 24149

Oct 29, 2017
2,150
The FF14 Achievements are all tied to old content, and 80% of them are Grinds (Craft 1000x as a specific crafter, multiply that by 8) Honestly if you're in it for achievements, you're going to spend a LOT of time just doing boring, repetitive things over and over and over (Fate's, crafting, gathering) instead of actually enjoying the things that make the game fun.
The crafting ones are easy because quicksynth counts towards it. The FATE ones are the most annoying unless you've done 2.X (Leveling, Zodiac Relic Questline) or the Yokai Event. 5.0 will surpringly give a reason to grind away at FATEs.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,781
Actually one plus for me with the removal of Dark Arts is that there will be less instances of double weaving.

I used to be able to do it until they moved the servers to the west coast and now it only seems to work with a few things.

Dark Arts + Carve and Spit pretty much always clips for me now so I won't miss having to deal with that.
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
For what it's worth, you were never supposed to double weave DA + CaS.

Since I like being the dissenting opinion, I'm more nervous about 5.0 changes than anything re: tanks. The current expectation is a lot more homogenized than I was hoping we'd see after a tank stance pruning but time will tell how the tanks pan out. I'm not entirely happy about "They all do the same things but different glamours", even if it's probably better off to make sure they each have the same answers to avoid certain fringe cases.

...though, this still means it's basically "take the two best DPS tanks."
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
Under Blood Weapon? The animation timing is too finicky in that order, especially when we're looking at opener and trying to get it all under raid buffs. You can spare the single weave around a Hard Slash anyway. And you'd generally aim for doing CaS + DA over DA + CaS if you're double weaving, again for getting the most out of the buff windows.

If you can double weave, cool. But since you can force it under a single weave anyway, and you generally want to aim for more single weave windows than double weaves anyway to reduce the risk of any clipping, there's not a lot of reason to force it into a double weave unless you're forced to (e.g., DA + CaS around non-Hard Slash).
 

Mikebison

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,036
I am really glad that the clunk from tanks are finally being removed. Being able to jump in and start doing damage immediately without having to throw out aggro combos should do well for flow (consuming/building resources/doing damage rotation).

I hope that the encounters also make use of whatever new tanking abilities that they're handing out too.

All the these changes should make them as smooth to play as DPS jobs now imo.

The days of having to deal with Paladin and to a lesser extent Dark Knight stances are over.
As someone who levelled dark knight for like 4 levels 4 years ago and is back doing it now because of the job trailer, removing that constant MP drain from darkside helped big time, but the things they spoke about in the live letter sound like they're going to be even better.
 

cdyhybrid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,422

Since 90% of all people I talked to assume that the one line in the live letter literally means that healers gonna be casting healing spells 24/7 in ShB I thought I repeat and stress what some people say about the translation:

The translation from Japanese is pretty vague.

In Japanese it said that the pure healing SPELLS will be enhanced and focused on, shielding spells will be less impactful.

After all, the dps'ing for Healers will still be there and - if executed well - healers will still be casting more dps spells than healing spells.
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
I feel like most people got that it's not all healing all the time. It's still kind of unfortunate in the same vein of the tanking situation of everything sounding very same-y. Until we get full tooltips though, it's mostly just an unsettling feeling about the whole thing.
 

Megawarrior

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,355
Just had intense anxiety trying out a healing job for the first time. I did what I needed to do but....I'm never doing that again.
 

Deleted member 24149

Oct 29, 2017
2,150
Since I like being the dissenting opinion, I'm more nervous about 5.0 changes than anything re: tanks. The current expectation is a lot more homogenized than I was hoping we'd see after a tank stance pruning but time will tell how the tanks pan out. I'm not entirely happy about "They all do the same things but different glamours", even if it's probably better off to make sure they each have the same answers to avoid certain fringe cases.

...though, this still means it's basically "take the two best DPS tanks."
Honestly I think the homogenization of tank utilities (Specifically things like standardizing recast timer on their invulns and giving them each MT and OT cooldowns to utilize) is a good thing to prevent one tank from becoming the red headed step child of the four. Holmgang's recast was honestly too good and it let WARs cheese a lot of bullshit in a fight and Hallowed Ground was over and above the best when compared to Living Dead.

Granted if they don't do serious changes around the invulns on tanks in regard to timers and how much damage they take PLDs are still going to come out of the match up looking extremely good while DRK, GNB, and WAR are going to be looking about the same.
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
Making all their cooldowns the same (20% 90s, 30% 120s, Party Shield, meter'd CD, etc.) is more my major concern since it rides the line dangerously close to them being effectively palette swaps of each other. There's still some things that exist with invuln effectiveness and timers and then one-offs like Cover so it's not that bad yet but eh. Just my gut feeling after going through GNB skillset and how formulaic it felt..

Also, tbh, I'm not thinking too highly of PLD for this expansion but we'll see with tooltips. Blocking gives them a theoretical edge but that's less effective in reality outside of Sheltron'd busters due to reliability concerns (aka, healers ain't planning for blocked autos). This is where we look at me funny for this considering the first sentence up there but Sentinel being as 'bad' as it is always kind of makes PLD a weird tank to plan around. Having actual alternatives in the OT slot for Intervention (and, on paper, GNB's is a standout best so far) is making PLD the bar to clear for a spot rather than the one holding the top spot. Just my opinion on it, anyway. Without tooltips it's very feelycraft-y so only so much to really say.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,781
Under Blood Weapon? The animation timing is too finicky in that order, especially when we're looking at opener and trying to get it all under raid buffs. You can spare the single weave around a Hard Slash anyway. And you'd generally aim for doing CaS + DA over DA + CaS if you're double weaving, again for getting the most out of the buff windows.

If you can double weave, cool. But since you can force it under a single weave anyway, and you generally want to aim for more single weave windows than double weaves anyway to reduce the risk of any clipping, there's not a lot of reason to force it into a double weave unless you're forced to (e.g., DA + CaS around non-Hard Slash).

Under Blood Weapon it does seem to clip every time. Without it it seems to clip only some of the time due to inappropriate timing I assume. That's with my current ping.

It's probably too late for me to muck around with this stuff again since it's all going to change in a month. I kind of wish they made it easier to use an oGCD after another but even if they relaxed the timing I imagine some people still wouldn't be able to do it due to ping still having a strong effect.
 

jfkgoblue

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,650
I feel like most people got that it's not all healing all the time. It's still kind of unfortunate in the same vein of the tanking situation of everything sounding very same-y. Until we get full tooltips though, it's mostly just an unsettling feeling about the whole thing.
Yeah their "we gotta fix healers before we can add another" solution was just "make all the healers the same with a different gimmick"
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
Healers will be fine.

The main change at a glace is 1 nuke 1 dot as their baseline now like ast.

At a glance it looks like

Sch gets more op fairy so they can dps nonstop more safely + the loss of energy drain means aether management is moved to a ogcd healing focus only more than ever also fairy gauge management will be a thing now

Whm build up a huge direct nuke and spend lillies for instant cast

Ast lost damage from lord but give 3 single target buffs now and have a do everything at once mode now
 
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Haubergeon

Member
Jan 22, 2019
2,271
In the end I don't expect healers to be in a much different position than they are today, just with SCH being heavily nerfed. Unless they really did go totally insane and cripple our DPS capacity, not much is going to change fundamentally, for better or worse. People will adjust.

Tanks I agree are much more concerning from a design stand-point, which literally do feel like they're approaching an Eos/Selene situation after ShB - which is basically "they all do the same thing so just pick which one looks prettier!"
 

Lirion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,774
Changes to tanks are very welcome. I won't change my main from Sam but I might play tank more now.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
Even if healer dps totals are nerfed fights going forward will be made with the healer dps change in mind.
 

Pyros Eien

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,974
Everything will hit 20% harder ;)
But not really since tanks have 20% mitigation trait. I mean they might increase autoattack damage to force healers to hardcast tank heals more often but not sure how much they can do that without fucking people over with "instant kills" when the boss decides to tank buster > auto in 4-5frames.
 

Naru

Member
May 11, 2019
2,373
I play all three healers since they are the only classes I have at max level and I don't really understand all the worrying about healers. SCH needed some trimming, AST card system needed a rework (this was never going to work with just adjusting the cards) and WHM lilies were pretty much useless. Now we will get (most likely) lilies that really have a purpose, cards that are all worth using all the time and a more powerful fairy. All three will keep their specific unique abilities (cards, fairy and pure healer).
Even though AST was my main from Stormblood on I never thought the card system was well designed. I can't wait to see all the changes, especially for Scholar. I really believe the changes will get in the right direction.

Also found this chart on Reddit:
6csqv9e5ki031.png

All credit to Lady_Vis: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/bt5gcw/race_height_comparison_female/
 
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Deleted member 18021

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,000
If the healing changes mean that I'm doing more actual healing in dungeons, then I'm for it. Throwing out regens and then mostly ignoring the tank for 20 seconds in favor of Sick Deeps is all well and good, but it kinda gets old.

I'm not too worried about the new content, since it'll be made with this stuff in mind. Re-balancing the old stuff is always where it gets a bit murky.
 

scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
Not really sure how the proposed ShB card system (match card with role) is necessarily better than current (fish for AoE). It's a very stripped down version which makes it a pretty binary / choice-less system.

In the end I don't expect healers to be in a much different position than they are today, just with SCH being heavily nerfed. Unless they really did go totally insane and cripple our DPS capacity, not much is going to change fundamentally, for better or worse. People will adjust.

I'm not really concerned that much on the DPS side of it, it's always kind of fundamentally just been "you have filler buttons." It's more a worry at "everything now toolkits healing the same way." Fairy vs Lilies vs Cards is pretty much just different dressings of approaching healing the same way in the same way that tanks come down to how you want your animations to look. Hyperbole but maybe that makes my point more apparent? I'm generally not one who cares much for the 'fluff' of the jobs so much as their gameplay loops and my biggest fear is for the game to get close to tanks/healers are all same-y since need the same answers, DPS is where all the variety is.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
" Fairy vs Lilies vs Cards is pretty much just different dressings of approaching healing the same way in the same way that tanks come down to how you want your animations to look.
Cards are not a healing mechanic. Fairy guage management + aether flow management is different than passively waiting for lillies to spawn for a big nuke and burst heals.

Scholars healing tool kit is still there and different enough still. Auto crit adlo spreads , excog, fairy tether, mega fairy, and still having chain strategem should be signs enough as it is.

The goal is to make the healers that feel different but are able to do all the content together with no setbacks, this isn't a bad thing.

Healers as a healer wont be that much different from each other as they are now, they are already very similar in the sense they have answers for almost every situation they just wanted to make them all flow better and have proper answers to things regardless of who you bring. How you go about doing things will be different. Calling this fluff, then saying the melee classes are totally different is straight up a jaded view on things and wrong.
 
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scy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
I'm aware that cards aren't a healer mechanic but replies are bringing up Fairies / Lilies / Cards ergo my response is worded the same. That said, cards are a big part of the AST identity and I'm on the side of the changes being an unfortunate stripping down of that system. Even if I avoided playing AST to avoid dealing with fishing for AoE Balance decision points.

You can lay out all those things all you want but, again, the worry is towards what their toolkits all aim to do. The goal of the whole "pure healer" message is that the healers get to approach situations the same way. The method of it may differ but it's still a heavier focus on making it so they all have their given response to filling missing HP primarily. And yes, making sure the healers are all adequately equipped is a good thing. My problem stems from the utilizing their toolkits side of healing. And, yes, I'd say that currently known Super Fairy functionality isn't insanely different in this context. And then I'm not really sure what Chain Strat has to do with the healing toolkit process either?

I don't expect ShB to change the healer meta all that much. We'll probably still see AST/SCH as optimal. They'll still spend >70% of the time not healing. It's more just the worry at all sides of the healer role being dumbed down in the sake of giving them all the answers as opposed to reinforcing the jobs and filling their gaps in other ways. And right now it all heavily sounds like the former, not the latter. Again, tooltips can change a lot of this but I'm more worried about it than not as we wait for that info.

End of the day, feelycraft is feelycraft.

Edit:

Calling this fluff, then saying the melee classes are totally different is straight up a jaded view on things and wrong.

Well. Okay. I'm not entirely sure how one can consider the current healers as having massively different gameplay loops similar to the DPS--which, of note, is not just the melee DPS--but I suppose at this point there's not a whole lot of point trying to continue this conversation.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
The way melee dps go about doing their rotations and managing their job gauges is their version of fluff that you label the healing stuff as. At the end of the day they are still just doing the same things just in their own way. Healers are the same and tanks are the same.
 

Ghostfacedon

Member
Apr 17, 2019
1,025
I wanted to get all battle classes to 70 prior to ShB, but BLM, WAR and AST are kinda boring to me. I can kinda see the appeal for others but it's a drag atm.
 

Haubergeon

Member
Jan 22, 2019
2,271
At the end of the day, I've been forced to accept long-ago that Yoshi either doesn't have the interest, or the aptitude, to balance jobs that feel noticeably different to play outside of a handful of DPS (like Dancer or Ninja as examples of jobs that feels notably different) because with every year they seem to bemoan job differences in the Healer and Tank roles, which has basically culminated in that slide from the Live Letter presentation that may as well have said "We want to destroy any possible meta formations by streamlining these two roles to be more alike, and even easier to play, and also reducing instances of job synergy dramatically."

I fought this fight for years and at this point I have to just face the reality that my expectations (having played various MMOs for my entire life since I started playing games) of having differences and inherent imbalances between playstyles are not the same expectations that mainstream audiences have today. I've been conditioned to treat this game as a single-player game because anytime I think of it as an MMO I'm reminded of how shallow this game is mechanically, how limited the end-game content is, how the gear progression and encounter design is so conservative - but most people love it and their sub numbers have seemed to increase in the last few months, so I'm just the odd man out anymore. I've made my peace with my role as a healer in the game being increasingly simplified and I'll play for the story and the really great moment-to-moment gameplay, and maybe someday they'll decide to go in a different creative direction more to my tastes.

My glass-half-full look of the situation is that their conservative encounter design philosophy effectively making everyone in this game a DPS to some extent ensures that, without radically changing something, healers will always be able, and to some extent have to, DPS while in groups. Like a lot of things with healers the dev team kind of backed themselves into a corner where they don't like where healers are, but also have no ability to change it without ruining the role by making it incredibly boring, or fundamentally altering how combat encounters work. As expected it doesn't seem like they did either. But who knows. This whole conversation could be turned upside down once embargoes end.
 

Call me YHWH

Member
Oct 26, 2017
724
I'm not sure how they could fix the corner they've backed themselves into regarding healers specifically without completely 1) redesigning the role and likely overhauling combat encounters at least on an endgame level or 2)adding a level of homogenization so that all healers can combat the various issues. Like Haubergeon said above me, Yoshida is always going to be on the conservative side and try and include more people rather than exclude. And from what he has said, he sees the meta as being exclusionary and is willing to sacrifice synergy and niche roles in the name of balance.

From what I've heard of high-end tanks, most of the changes to that role so far have been regarded as overall improvements. Healers are less convinced this is the direction to take, and I'm definitely on that side of the fence myself.

Part of the reason I left WoW when I did (at the end of Cata, beginning of Mists) was that they were stripping the fun flavor from every class and rendering them all the same. It took them until the most recent two expansions to realize that people play what they play for the flavor. For the niche and the weird and the over or undertuned aspects.

I hope that XIV doesn't continue to move in this direction but I don't really know how they can avoid it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,944
I think what's killing me from a healer perspective is that the actual healer kits were already fine. They were effective. You by and large weren't seeing people have a hard time finding groups because their job's healing wasn't regarded as effective, but because their Other Stuff didn't hold up. Which isn't to say there wasn't QoL stuff that could be done--WHM needed either a ruin 2 or the malefic cast time on stone to fix some clipping problems-or that small tweaks wouldn't have been nice--WHM getting an oh-shit party wide mit button--but the biggest problem with healers was always that all of them were too good for what they were being asked to do. WHM being a super strong healer hammer didn't matter because nothing needed it. dAST having no match for cure 3 super did not matter because cure 3 was overkill anyway.

The problem was always in the non-healing pieces, and homogenizing the healing component won't fix it. Giving WHM shields doesn't address why they fell out of favor, etc. It's why removing a lot of the skill component from cards makes sense--the fewer choices you have to make to do well, the fewer cases they have to balance whatever WHM's answer to cards is--even if it's risking making cards sort of boring. But then to add a bullet point for homogenization on top does not spark joy.

I dunno, I'm hoping the tooltips give me something to look forward to, but healers lately had been flexible enough that you could just sort of whatever at the healing buttons, pull 2k DPS, and still get through fights without any massive drawbacks... or you could lean into the spaces jobs differed, maximize the lesser-used tools, coordinate with your cohaler, and pull double that in some fights (pre-echo, at least. I assume post echo we're now talking starting from 3k.)

And since it's role-wide homogenization, it's not like I can just change to a new healing job if they make AST boring. So instead I'm setting up role-swap suicide pacts with tanks, so if they make our roles boring we can at least float by the first tier on the novelty of switching.

I haaaaate the way they release combat changes for this reason, largely--you got the tooltips. You know the non-final forms are getting released in a few days anyway. Just give us some real info to go on on top of the hype reels and questionably worded slides. There's no actual gain from this grey zone of non-info.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
I don't see how if you liked ast gameplay before how you could find having to do more inputs to do the new card system more boring.
 

Haubergeon

Member
Jan 22, 2019
2,271
I haaaaate the way they release combat changes for this reason, largely--you got the tooltips. You know the non-final forms are getting released in a few days anyway. Just give us some real info to go on on top of the hype reels and questionably worded slides. There's no actual gain from this grey zone of non-info.

I agree with this personally but cynically it makes perfect sense why they would go with their approach - just releasing a slick, hype Job Actions slideshow filled with fancy graphics and animations with absolutely no context attached to whatever the new stuff in it is, it gets people excited, it makes people fill their brain with optimistic expectations for "Holy shit what is that!?" and there's no downside to it. It's easy positive press.

Releasing the tooltips and the raw info/changelist right away has the potential to blow up with negative reactions right from the get-go. At least if you go with this approach, you hook a decent swath of people back into the game, and the blow of potentially controversial changes gets softened. People who've already re-subscribed off the initial hype aren't going anywhere yet, and the small amount of people upset about their specific changes get drowned out by people talking about how cool ___ looks or how excited they are to be a sexy bunny dancer.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,944
I don't see how if you liked ast gameplay before how you could find having to do more inputs to do the new card system more boring.

The one leaked thing I've read about new cards is supposedly one that's an 8% damage buff on melee, but only 4% on ranged. If that's what role-based cards means, it's boring.

I don't want to just push buttons, I want to actually engage with thinking about them. Killing RR removes a bunch of decision points. Flat out dictating who cards should go to removes needing to know when my DPS are spiking in a fight to know who is the best ST person for a card at a given time.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
The one leaked thing I've read about new cards is supposedly one that's an 8% damage buff on melee, but only 4% on ranged. If that's what role-based cards means, it's boring.

I don't want to just push buttons, I want to actually engage with thinking about them. Killing RR removes a bunch of decision points. Flat out dictating who cards should go to removes needing to know when my DPS are spiking in a fight to know who is the best ST person for a card at a given time.
If that's true that's a bit wack, still it looks like you will be giving 3 out at a time, needing to know which of the two melee to give to at a time and who of the ranged to give to is it's own thing. Not a fan of the changed values based on who you put it on though if that plays out.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,944
Releasing the tooltips and the raw info/changelist right away has the potential to blow up with negative reactions right from the get-go. At least if you go with this approach, you hook a decent swath of people back into the game, and the blow of potentially controversial changes gets softened. People who've already re-subscribed off the initial hype aren't going anywhere yet, and the small amount of people upset about their specific changes get drowned out by people talking about how cool ___ looks or how excited they are to be a sexy bunny dancer.

See where they messed up was not teasing Ultimate in Shadowbringers so those of us who care about numbers had something of our own to be hyped by. All this worrying about balance would have been washed away in a flood of Pepsi man ultimate hype.

If that's true that's a bit wack, still it looks like you will be giving 3 out at a time, needing to know which of the two melee to give to at a time and who of the ranged to give to is it's own thing. Not a fan of the changed values based on who you put it on though if that plays out.

I think the general belief at this point is the three cards in rapid fire was going to be new Sleeve Draw. There does seem potential to move Draw itself to a charge mechanic and have Sleeve Draw just give you two or three bonus stacks, but in general I'd be surprised if we were doing 3 cards every 30 seconds. I also legit have no idea how they'd balance the other healers to counteract that sheer volume in buffs.
 

jfkgoblue

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,650
The one leaked thing I've read about new cards is supposedly one that's an 8% damage buff on melee, but only 4% on ranged. If that's what role-based cards means, it's boring.

I don't want to just push buttons, I want to actually engage with thinking about them. Killing RR removes a bunch of decision points. Flat out dictating who cards should go to removes needing to know when my DPS are spiking in a fight to know who is the best ST person for a card at a given time.
Yeah if they make cards braindead, you may as well play WHM
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,781
Thinking about the enmity stance, it's possible it might make tanking easier or harder depending on how much of an enmity boost it gives you.

If it boosts your enmity so much that you can press anything and keep aggro against DPS who are doing their best then tanking is going to be easier than it is now (do anything, don't even need to do correct combos to hold aggro).

If it boosts your enmity but only to the point that you still need to do a proper damage rotation in order to hold aggro against good DPS then it will be more difficult than it is now since there will be no aggro combo to fall back on for easy enmity.

I wouldn't mind the latter case. Since it would reward knowing how to use your damage abilities effectively and it would be fun to fight DPS for hate. But I can see how that might turn some people off since they would have to know what they're doing beyond spamming a nonexistent aggro combo in order to hold aggro and that wouldn't be friendly to new players who no longer have that fall back option.
 
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