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Fire Emblem Community | Anime Game Of Thrones

oni-link

oni-link

tag reference no one gets
Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,015
UK
oni-link said:
I'm at the dragon, old man is alive, as are 3/4 of my team, the old guy has elixers, Pent is alive and has a healing staff!

I'm going in!
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I did it!

Used the old man and had everyone else act as bait, just as he was down to the last elixir I had Hector rush him, 20hp down to 1hp. My heart sinks, the dragon attacks, Hector manages to survive with a mere 3hp

Eliwood strides up, promoted at level 10 and currently on level 8, he attacks, it connects, the dragon dies!

What an adventure. I love that it goes though the entire cast and tells you what happened to them or where they died, though I feel like the phrase "died at Light" came up for about 1/4 of the cast

In the end Sain, easily my playthoughs MVP, survived (though hilariously he slept though the final battle thanks to a pesky mage)

So yeah, overall I had a great time with my first Fire Emblem. It took me just over 24 hours in the end, and I want to thank everyone in this thread who helped me along the way. I came close to giving up after last night as I thought my file may be unwinnable and the dragon seemed like such an impossible obstacle, but after reading all your messages I decided I had to see it though to the bitter end

I managed to beat it with 3 under leveled lords and no healer until the final chapter, so I didn't exactly make things easy for myself

I think I'll play FE8 and post updates of my playthough of that in here as well, since I had a lot of fun doing that with FE7, and like I said you were all a great help. It's also interesting seeing how my impressions and views as a new player stack up to those of people who are familiar with the game/series. I will take a rest before starting FE8 though, as I don't want to get burnt out and I'd like to reflect on FE7 for a while first

It was nice seeing Roy at the end of the game, though I only know him from Smash. Is Hector's daughter also in FE6?
 

spiritfox

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,623
Sacred Stones will be much easier than Blazing Blade, and you can at least grind if you lost too many units.

Hector's daughter is in Binding Blade too.
 
Caz

Caz

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
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Oct 25, 2017
13,055
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Sacred Stones is where I was first introduced to the series, enjoy!
 

Normal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,296
Ohh good job on beating the game. And yeah Sain is truly the goat, dude gets no love in the community tho.
 

Normal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,296
Just from my experience from the communities(not really talking about this one) that I visited in the past other characters got a lot more love. Dude is hardly mentioned.

Edit: I did look up to see how he placed in the heroes vote. Wasn't in the top twenty, but at least he was in top 5 males for FE7. Surprised lol (must have been due to all my votes haha o:), always felt like characters like Canas, Raven, Hector, Jaffar, and Dart got a lot more love. And people like Batre and Drocas were more popular due to memes. And that's not even mentioning the female cast in 7. He placed 139 overall though.
 
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Disclaimer

Disclaimer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,466
Lord of Ostia said:
My Alan's always end up great while my Lance's always end up shit, unfortunately.
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I hear you, haha. Generally mine are similar (and they shine when mutually supported), but their growths are within +/-5% of each other, so the beauty is that if one is screwed you can simply drop them for the other. Kent, on the other hand, has a massive strength deficit compared to Sain, puzzlingly specializing in skill...

To date, I've never had good versions of various objectively decent units.
 
Firemind

Firemind

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,530
Disclaimer said:
Lance edges out Alen, being able to double sooner and having more skill in a game where that can matter.

(Really, though, they're practically identical and best used supporting one another.)
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FE6 throws Brigands and Pirates at you in the early game and Iron Swords have good accuracy, so Alen on average performs better than Lance.
 
PK Gaming

PK Gaming

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,331
Tangentially related; I like how FE6 doesn't throw horribly broken early-game cavalry units, at least on Hard Mode.

It was horrifying but satisfying when I realized I couldn't just lean on Allance to carry me.
 

Deleted member 11413

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PK Gaming said:
Tangentially related; I like how FE6 doesn't throw horribly broken early-game cavalry units, at least on Hard Mode.

It was horrifying but satisfying when I realized I couldn't just lean on Allance to carry me.
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True, but the game gives you so much cavalry to use. There are a potential 7 Paladins in the game iirc, which is just insane.
 
Rutger

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,245
Lord of Ostia said:
True, but the game gives you so much cavalry to use. There are a potential 7 Paladins in the game iirc, which is just insane.
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The game gives you a lot of every class.
Still, those early cavalry aren't as powerful as ones you'll find in other games, but they're still nice to have for rescue strategies. It's a nice balance before you get to go crazy with Melady and Perceval.
 
Bonen no Max'd

Bonen no Max'd

Member
Oct 25, 2017
523
tbh I've found Allance pretty worthless after like, chapter 9 except for rescue utility. They're better than a lot of other combat units early but by the time Rutger can become a one man army and you have both Marcus and Zealot, and then once you start to get other good combat units like Milady and Shin even a promoted Lance is still shittier than any of your main combat units.
 
Rutger

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,245
Caz said:
It will feature an avatar character and probably have Kusakihara in a directorial position.
I'm being an optimist.
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I still don't get the hate for the avatar characters. They're no more than a lord we can alter their appearance as far as the story is concerned.

Kusakihara though...
Elfforkusu said:
Thank you

(I am still hyped for the inevitable FE4 remake though)
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The real hype starts with the inevitable FE6 remake.
 
Caz

Caz

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
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13,055
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Rutger said:
I still don't get the hate for the avatar characters. They're no more than a lord we can alter their appearance as far as the story is concerned.

Kusakihara though...

The real hype starts with the inevitable FE6 remake.
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To paraphase a recent video of mine, in Awakening, Robin may have been an homage to Rekka no Ken from a meta perspective, but from a narrative perspective, Robin's increasing importance to the villain's main plot lead to Chrom becoming a secondary character in his own story, to the point where the final decision was left in Robin's hands instead of theirs. It was, in a word, distracting. The sad part is that it's the second-best handling of this concept since New Mystery crammed one into a narrative which they were blatantly not a part of and the less said about the borderline fan-fiction approach of Fates with Corrin, the better.
 
Rutger

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,245
Caz said:
To paraphase a recent video of mine, in Awakening, Robin may have been an homage to Rekka no Ken from a meta perspective, but from a narrative perspective, Robin's increasing importance to the villain's main plot lead to Chrom becoming a secondary character in his own story, to the point where the final decision was left in Robin's hands instead of theirs. It was, in a word, distracting. The sad part is that it's the second-best handling of this concept since New Mystery crammed one into a narrative which they were blatantly not a part of and the less said about the borderline fan-fiction approach of Fates with Corrin, the better.
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Awakening felt like Robin's story from the start to me, not Chrom's. Chrom may have had the title or lord, but I would say he was never the protagonist.

There's plenty that can be said about the poor writing of this series, honestly I don't think any FE game has an amazing story. However, the point is that there is nothing inherently wrong with have these avatar characters, they are effectively their own characters in the narrative and the issues they have as characters are caused by the writing of the game they are in not because the player can alter their appearance.

It would not hard to have both a good story and the avatar character imo.
 
Caz

Caz

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Rutger said:
Awakening felt like Robin's story from the start to me, not Chrom's. Chrom may have had the title or lord, but I would say he was never the protagonist.

There's plenty that can be said about the poor writing of this series, honestly I don't think any FE game has an amazing story. However, the point is that there is nothing inherently wrong with have these avatar characters, they are effectively their own characters in the narrative and the issues they have as characters are caused by the writing of the game they are in not because the player can alter their appearance.

It would not hard to have both a good story and the avatar character imo.
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The story was all about Chrom's journey...at first. The only reason it "feels" like his story is due to his increasingly important role in the latter half; all Robin does for the beginning is act as a tactician and give advice to Chrom and co. It was his country he had to lead into battle and his role as leader that he had to fulfill once his sister died. There are hints about the bigger picture but for the first nine-ish chapters, the story is largely focused on Chrom and his struggle against Plegia, later Walhart. It's only when Validar re-emerges that Robin's role in the story begins to increase and never stops from there.
 
Firemind

Firemind

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Oct 25, 2017
15,530
There's a difference between an avatar character you create and a character with his or her own name and persona. You can play as many lords in the series and each one has a distinct personality and reasoning behind their actions. That's up to the writer. In Awakening, Robin also does things according to what the writer wants, but there's no real choice in matters beyond how you look and who you support. So what's the difference? The avatar is too limited in scope. You can choose who to support but the dialogue is fixed. You can choose how you look but you can't change the outcome of the game; it's still very linear. If you want to do Robin in Awakening, go all out and offer different routes. You can go evil like he does in the game (and become the antagonist while another character takes over the protagonist role) or you can choose the hero path and likely redemption. Let people decide their fate if the game has avatar creation!
 
Lynx_7

Lynx_7

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Oct 25, 2017
1,331
Honestly my biggest problem with the avatar is that I doubt we'll have another fully voiced game like Echoes if they need to take into account the different voices you can choose. Even just having a single voice for male/female options is already double the work it would take for a fixed protagonist.
 

Deleted member 11413

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The Avatar also has access to every class in Awakening. That's a significant difference between an Avatar and a Lord character that people may find appealing. That and the ability to match the Lord to the player's gender identity are important aspects of the Avatar, imo.
 
Disclaimer

Disclaimer

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Oct 25, 2017
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Avatar characters have weakened each of their respective games' storylines in ways that are intrinsic to their identity as self-inserts, so I disagree with the notion that they're "effectively their own characters in the narrative." They present unique challenges for IS's ability to write, because they have to be blandly personable, cause everyone to be playersexual, and siphon the Lord's role in the story—or replace them altogether with an inferior product that's less recognizably marketable due to customization.

Kris, while really bad, was actually the least offensive to me because their storyline was cordoned off to gaiden chapters, while their role in the main narrative was minimal—though they still robbed characterization and competence from Marth, Jagen, and probably others.

Robin, as Caz has covered, just co-opted the entire narrative focus, becoming equal to or greater than Chrom's role as MC.

Corrin was a dumpster fire I'd rather not talk about, emblematic of every avatar criticism.

IMO, the only player character that was serviceable—owing to their scarce existence—was Mark, because Mark served as a coy way for the writers/protagonists to reference the player without breaking the fourth wall. If they must exist, I'd really prefer if player avatars were silent or minimally voiced strategists, with absolutely zero narrative focus, because otherwise we'll continue equivocating between ones who are gormless or genius, yet worshipped by all.

Competent player insertion involves giving the player narrative control and tangible decision-making, whereby one can actually roleplay a personality. IS hasn't shown much desire to tread that route.
 
Drax

Drax

Oregon tag
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Oct 25, 2017
5,078
The main Lords were generally self inserts. There was a reason why they were usually milquetoast teenagers.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

One Winged Slayer
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Oct 28, 2017
9,372
The games have played around with a customizable personality for the avatar, it just has never made it out of Japan. Robin's was very limited, just changing his pronouns, but there was also the silent option that got eliminated too. Corrin's was more developed, with sentences sometimes rewritten to fit the different personality types, but yet again that got completely cut from the game (and almost insultingly they kept the menu there claiming personality differences in the voice options even though the actual script doesn't change at all). The problem here is if they haven't been willing to localize even the limited options we've gotten it doesn't make me optimistic that they'd localize a more expanded system.

Drax said:
The main Lords were generally self inserts. There was a reason why they were usually milquetoast teenagers.
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Yeah, just compare how they first modernized Alm in Awakening's DLC when he was just a one off character and how they handled him when they wanted to write him as the protagonist again. The first highlighted his conflict with Celica and aggressiveness, while in the second one he's made approachable and friendly, his conflict with Celica coming entirely from Celica's own character.

Lynx_7 said:
Honestly my biggest problem with the avatar is that I doubt we'll have another fully voiced game like Echoes if they need to take into account the different voices you can choose. Even just having a single voice for male/female options is already double the work it would take for a fixed protagonist.
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I think that just plays into the amount of support dialogue in general. I could see a situation where the story is voiced but supports aren't, if we get a large group of universal supports again like in Awakening and Fates, aside from maybe whatever is the highest ranking.

I guess if they dump the 2nd generation though, the number of conversations with all the extra character could get way too high. It makes me wonder how they'd handle that. Maybe characters from paralogues would get their own support group separate from the main story ones?
 
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Elfforkusu

Elfforkusu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,098
I like Robin a lot more than Corrin, because while they're both (too) central to the story, at least Robin is a character of his/her own.

But I think the avatar character being central to the story is inherently limiting to the story -- that is, it makes the writers' jobs a lot more difficult. And it is painfully obvious that they are not up to the task.

For the sake of the story of these games, they should make the avatar character an anonymous unit. or better yet, a non-playable tactician just along for the ride.
Disclaimer said:
Avatar characters have weakened each of their respective games' storylines in ways that are intrinsic to their identity as self-inserts, so I disagree with the notion that they're "effectively their own characters in the narrative." They present unique challenges for IS's ability to write, because they have to be blandly personable, cause everyone to be playersexual, and siphon the Lord's role in the story—or replace them altogether with an inferior product that's less recognizably marketable due to customization.


Kris, while really bad, was actually the least offensive to me because their storyline was cordoned off to gaiden chapters, while their role in the main narrative was minimal—though they still robbed characterization and competence from Marth, Jagen, and probably others.


Robin, as Caz has covered, just co-opted the entire narrative focus, becoming equal to or greater than Chrom's role as MC.


Corrin was a dumpster fire I'd rather not talk about, emblematic of every avatar criticism.


IMO, the only player character that was serviceable—owing to their scarce existence—was Mark, because Mark served as a coy way for the writers/protagonists to reference the player without breaking the fourth wall. If they must exist, I'd really prefer if player avatars were silent or minimally voiced strategists, with absolutely zero narrative focus, because otherwise we'll continue equivocating between ones who are gormless or genius, yet worshipped by all.


Competent player insertion involves giving the player narrative control and tangible decision-making, whereby one can actually roleplay a personality. IS hasn't shown much desire to tread that route.
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I ended up restating a lot of this post -- which is to say that I agree with most of it. I will say that the player character having a key role is not inherently limiting on its own, per se, but it's an added layer of difficulty that requires nuance and care that no one at intsys has demonstrated.
 
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Drax

Drax

Oregon tag
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,078
Elfforkusu said:
I like Robin a lot more than Corrin, because while they're both (too) central to the story, at least Robin is a character of his/her own.

But I think the avatar character being central to the story is inherently limiting to the story -- that is, it makes the writers' jobs a lot more difficult. And it is painfully obvious that they are not up to the task.

For the sake of the story of these games, they should make the avatar character an anonymous unit. or better yet, a non-playable tactician just along for the ride.

I ended up restating a lot of this post -- which is to say that I agree with most of it. I will say that the player character having a key role is not inherently limiting on its own, per se, but it's an added layer of difficulty that requires nuance and care that no one at intsys has demonstrated.
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eh, Robin and corrin have defined characters you really have zero control of them like firemind said. The problem with Corrin as a character is independent of being an avatar.

I do think that they have tone down the worship of the main character but lets be real main character worship just didn't start with nmoe.

For me the avatar right now basically lets you choose the gender of the mc and thats it, and its an important thing when the fanbase for fire emblem has expanded.
 

Deleted member 11413

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Drax said:
eh, Robin and corrin have defined characters you really have zero control of them like firemind said. The problem with Corrin as a character is independent of being an avatar.

I do think that they have tone down the worship of the main character but lets be real main character worship just didn't start with nmoe.

For me the avatar right now basically lets you choose the gender of the mc and thats it, and its an important thing when the fanbase for fire emblem has expanded.
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I would agree with this.
 
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