BAD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,569
USA
https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomas...d-phones-with-a-3d-printed-head/#2a1270161330
I cover crime, privacy and security in digital and physical forms.

Facial recognition is cropping up everywhere. From shopping malls to the workplace, it's likely something is scanning your face every day. But rather than invade your privacy, facial recognition on smartphones is supposed to protect your digital life from snoops.

If you're an Android customer, though, look away from your screen now. We tested four of the hottest handsets running Google's operating systems and Apple's iPhone to see how easy it'd be to break into them. We did it with a 3D-printed head. All of the Androids opened with the fake. Apple's phone, however, was impenetrable.

Two heads are better...
The head was printed at Backface in Birmingham, U.K., where I was ushered into a dome-like studio containing 50 cameras. Together, they combine to take a single shot that makes up a full 3D image. That image is then loaded up in editing software, where any errors can be ironed out. I, for instance, had a missing piece of nose.

Backface then constructs the model with a 3D printer that builds up layers of a British gypsum powder. Some final touch-ups and colourings are added, and the life size head is ready within a few days, all for just over £300. You're then the proud owner of an uncanny, almost-spectral version of your own visage.

For our tests, we used my own real-life head to register for facial recognition across five phones. An iPhone X and four Android devices: an LG G7 ThinQ, a Samsung S9, a Samsung Note 8 and a OnePlus 6. I then held up my fake head to the devices to see if the device would unlock. For all four Android phones, the spoof face was able to open the phone, though with differing degrees of ease. The iPhone X was the only one to never be fooled.
 

Tregard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,221
Sounds like in order for this to work you'd need the victim of the break-in to pose for a full facial capture, though?
 

Gandie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,651
Seems appropriate that you cannot use face recognition for banking stuff on Android.
 

bionic77

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30,922
Sometimes you just have to give it up to the criminal scumbag.

If someone can capture my face without me knowing it and then perfectly replicate a 3D printing of my entire head and then somehow use it to gain access to my phone then they kind of earned a look inside my WhatsApp messages.
 

Robochimp

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,681
Sometimes you just have to give it up to the criminal scumbag.

If someone can capture my face without me knowing it and then perfectly replicate a 3D printing of my entire head and then somehow use it to gain access to my phone then they kind of earned a look inside my WhatsApp messages.

A government certainly has the means to do this.
 

Vagabond

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,415
United States
Is this by the same writer who made an article about police using face ID to unlock phones using their deceased owners head?

If you 3D print a head just to unlock my phone... you deserve to go through my phone lol
 

Deleted member 11626

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,199
I doubt you'd ever have to worry about this. Maybe if Android phones were vulnerable to holding up a picture or something.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,643
Sometimes you just have to give it up to the criminal scumbag.

If someone can capture my face without me knowing it and then perfectly replicate a 3D printing of my entire head and then somehow use it to gain access to my phone then they kind of earned a look inside my WhatsApp messages.
Yeah, I mean they are more than welcome to enjoy all my cat pictures.
 

YuYu

Banned
Jun 18, 2018
1,309
LMAO

Face ID isn't that great either, but it's mile better than what Samsung has.

wow not a good look for apple
Joke post?
I then held up my fake head to the devices to see if the device would unlock. For all four Android phones, the spoof face was able to open the phone, though with differing degrees of ease. The iPhone X was the only one to never be fooled.
 

Deleted member 4367

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,226
Sometimes you just have to give it up to the criminal scumbag.

If someone can capture my face without me knowing it and then perfectly replicate a 3D printing of my entire head and then somehow use it to gain access to my phone then they kind of earned a look inside my WhatsApp messages.

Feels like an argument against any good encryption. "If somebody wants to spend effort in accessing my data then good for them I have nothing worth hiding."
 

Cat Party

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,596
I don't have any interest in ever using facial recognition.

I want my phone to open based on my musk.
 

TheDoctor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,272
None of these Android phones come with same 3D facial recognition hardware as the iPhone X.

The OPPO Find X, Mi 8 Explorer Edition and Huawei Mate 20 Pro are the only Android phones with actual 3D Face Unlock. Those were not tested.
 

borghe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,112
LMAO

Face ID isn't that great either, but it's mile better than what Samsung has.
I mean... Face ID is pretty great. I get there are always going to be those "I WANT MAH FNGER PRINTZ!", but... Face ID is pretty great. In most practical applications faster than Touch ID. In some (few) applications less convenient. Overall positive comparably though.
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,508
Toronto
IIRC, Apple's facial recognition doesn't just take your face's shape and features into account, it measures certain IR information to determine whether the face it's looking at is real.
 

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,445
I find it more curious as to why the fake didn't work on the iPhone. If its an EXACT replica, eye spacing, ears blah blah blah I would expect the copy to work across the board.

Also there was reports of the iPhone unlocking both for a Mom and Son https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/51825...phonex-face-recognition-cant-tell-them-apart/
It's because the 3D topography alone is not enough to fool the system used in iphone X. It takes into account colors of the skin, and most importantly, the particular infrared reflectivity of the eyeballs. That's why to fool it, you'd need to pait the 3d model realistically, and to create eyeballs of the simillr gelly material that real eyeballs are made from (and warm it up to a body temperature). It's possible to do, some Israeli team did it, but it's a far more involved process than just printing the head.
 

YuYu

Banned
Jun 18, 2018
1,309
I mean... Face ID is pretty great. I get there are always going to be those "I WANT MAH FNGER PRINTZ!", but... Face ID is pretty great. In most practical applications faster than Touch ID. In some (few) applications less convenient. Overall positive comparably though.
I know, I own an 6s Plus and a 7 Plus but my brother has the XS Max.The thing is he's my twin and I can unlock his phone with my face.
 

Cookie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,258
Was this not already known? Samsung and co usually have all these "security" features which don't work properly or are not actually secure.

They care more about the bullet points than doing them right.
 

Manu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,191
Buenos Aires, Argentina
giphy.gif
 

AzerPhire

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,207
Also noted in the article that they were unable to fool Microsoft's Hello facial recognition either.
 

borghe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,112
I find it more curious as to why the fake didn't work on the iPhone. If its an EXACT replica, eye spacing, ears blah blah blah I would expect the copy to work across the board.

Also there was reports of the iPhone unlocking both for a Mom and Son https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/51825...phonex-face-recognition-cant-tell-them-apart/
someone covered the first part.. there is more at play than just facial recognition. it's 3D scanning, skin reflection, eyeball reflection, etc. and as apple releases future gens I have to believe iris scanning will be included by default on top of the rest. a perfectly proportioned model isn't enough. You also need nearly real eyes, nearly real skin, etc.

as for the second.. apple has already said results will be less accurate with younger individuals.. due to the way our bodies grow and change. sort of like how all babies look 60% of the way identical (not a real number). So if you have two genetic matches (i.e. immediate family) and one of them is young and one older.. it could goof. Both Apple's and Google's image recognition ML match pics of my daughter at a young age (5-10) with pictures of her cousins at the same age range.. until I input enough pictures (hundred plus?) to train the AI.
 

Mulciber

Member
Aug 22, 2018
5,217
Personally, I just don't use biometric type stuff to unlock anything. It's a combination of factors (including simple ones, like the fact that my fingerprint safe doesn't work in the winter if my skin peels, which it sometimes does on my fingertips), but it's never seemed secure to me.
 

faceless

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,198
Most bank apps just use Google's API for fingerprint sensing I believe. So I don't think facial recognition would even be possible without that changing.
indeed.

Samsung Pay can be authorized with Iris scaning (not face unlock) and all the other banking apps are Password or Fingerprint only.

still not a good look for the non-financial information that people want to secure on their device.
 

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,445
Yeah, but I mean by choice
What do you mean? You don't have an alternative option with those phones. At least if you want to use the phone for paying for stuff and keeping your passwords - and don't want to type pincode hundred times a day. And honestly, beside some use cases, like phone laying flat on the desk, faceid is pretty great. Especially now in the winter that I can use phone normally even if I'm wearing gloves.
 
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args

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,897
face ID sucked at launch. since then, it has become probably as convenient as the fingerprint scanner.
 

borghe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,112
My brother uses face id for his online banking app on his iPhone XS.
this is the same as what he said. iOS at the API level has a "use biometrics to unlock" call. This is what everyone taps into to use Touch ID to unlock banking, security fobs, etc.

All Apple did was on Face ID devices, use the exact same call to instead hook into Face ID. Thus ANY call that previously prompted for Touch ID, will now prompt for Face ID.
 

faceless

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,198
None of these Android phones come with same 3D facial recognition hardware as the iPhone X.

The OPPO Find X, Mi 8 Explorer Edition and Huawei Mate 20 Pro are the only Android phones with actual 3D Face Unlock. Those were not tested.
how many people own those phones? they didn't test the Google Pixel or HTC whatchamacallit either.
 

greepoman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,982
Feels like an argument against any good encryption. "If somebody wants to spend effort in accessing my data then good for them I have nothing worth hiding."

I think the point is there's quite a difference between someone discretely breaking your encryption from a distance and using 50 cameras while you stand perfectly in position and then stealing your phone as well.