There's a shitload of other emotes in the game that are not Elaine or popcorn either that don't come from Black Creatives, actual dances, that are also refered by everyone as "Fortnite Dances"
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
"Fortnite Dances" is Cultural Erasure. Straight Up.
- Thread starter DigitalOp
- Start date
- Status
Oh I get being upset about it because it's your culture. I just don't understand how you could even go about arguing to get it changed/get credit due when that's your driving force behind your argument. It really has to be an everyone gets credit scenario, or no one gets credit scenario.
So something such as Fortnite propelling these dances and help giving them exposure is now cultural erasure? Isn't this what happens when "culture" becomes "pop culture"?
I completely agree that the appropriate artists/creators of these dances should be credited but culture isn't about creating something for larger financial gain.
I completely agree that the appropriate artists/creators of these dances should be credited but culture isn't about creating something for larger financial gain.
Fully in favor of Epic making an effort to credit sources in-game when possible, and am not opposed to working out some kind of a compensation deal.
But as someone brought up earlier, that still doesn't seem to solve the major problem many posters have with these dances being referred to as "Fortnite dances." Even if BlocBoy JB's name is on the screen in a menu somewhere and he's getting a cut, millions of kids are obviously going to innocently refer to the emotes as "Fortnite dances," because that's where they were exposed to them. I'm not really sure it's possible at all to get around that. Do we expect kids to carry around works cited pages for pop culture?
But as someone brought up earlier, that still doesn't seem to solve the major problem many posters have with these dances being referred to as "Fortnite dances." Even if BlocBoy JB's name is on the screen in a menu somewhere and he's getting a cut, millions of kids are obviously going to innocently refer to the emotes as "Fortnite dances," because that's where they were exposed to them. I'm not really sure it's possible at all to get around that. Do we expect kids to carry around works cited pages for pop culture?
Exactly the problem referenced in the very title of the thread.
From Epic's point of view? Yes if they are going to give credit to black artists they should do so for all artists. From OP's point of view? Like I said, they don't have to care about cultures that they don't belong to.
It's a discussion over culture, race is part of culture.
Yeah I don't know about copyrighting dance moves, honestly... like in general I think fewer things should be subject to copyright. It'd be cool if people gave credit, though maybe then they'd argue they deserve royalties based on using their name. I don't know.
You do not have to say you made this.
If someone posted someone's artwork on twitter, it doesnt matter if you didnt say you made it. The implication of posting it without giving someone credit is that you probably made thus, even though you didnt. Therefore, people will get angry if you dont give a source some credit. You do not have to make money for people to ask to cite your source of said image, nor do they have to or need to demand monetary compensation.
Capitalism is cultural erasure. I think the current young generation fell for capitalism because a few artists got paid well over the last 50 years, but essentially culture is created in isolation whereas capital's motives are the opposite, for everything to be universal.
I'm reminded of clothing chains stealing indie clothing makers' and artists' designs without their consent, without giving credit and without any fear of repercussions. While OP specifically makes an argument about stealing from an entire community, I think it is easy to see the negative impact something like this can have on the creative individual. Being completely removed and eventually disassociated from something you created is inexcusable.
It's no more a race thing than the term "Belgian chocolate" is a race thing for stealing cocoa away from my ancestors, who were the first to truly cultivate chocolate damnit!
For real though. This is just cultural osmosis.
OP makes it sound like Epic are paying when they copy white artists, but not when they copy black artists. That's the only way you could spin this into a race issue ("fuck the blacks" as he implies). I get that the majority of the moves might be made by black people, but surely not all?
The dances used in games are from all over the place, from shuffling, memes and kpop to the dances from anime opening songs. One example from Guild Wars 2 (LoL also has a separate instance of this) was the war like bull-people using the Haka, a war dance originating from my countries Māori culture, and afaik it presence is usually seen as a positive thing to have more representation of a culture that Pakeha had tried to erase in the past, but that could also become problematic depending on the depiction. They wanted to have a space-haka in James Camerons Avatar, and the reaction was mostly that it was cringe.
What I want to know is why Soulja Boy thinks his wack gimmick dance moves would be featured in 2018 with or without him copyrighting them.
Did the Rocksteady Crew pay the Shaw Bros for all the Kung-fu moves they used?
Nah it's definitely taking someone else's shit and not giving them credit for it. But it is also super common in entertainment. Still shitty though.
I think a nice way to have done it would have been to play a clip of the artists music for each dance.
I'm English, it's just my observation. I'm not attacking anyone for taking an identity and I'm sorry if I caused any offence. I genuinely don't distinguish American cultural output based on ethnic descent. It'd be pretty difficult as it's a country with such a diverse population, which makes it all the more weird that there are so many race problems.
That's not true, otherwise every time someone posted a gif or image here or on imgur there would be an expectation of giving credit, there isn't.
Except artwork most of the time can be proven ownership by the original version. Dance isn't that simple unless you're just going to name the dance itself.
people need to put more effort into learning the culture if they want to have an informed opinion.
i flipped through the thread a bit and saw a lot of dismissive comments.
popular black dances are a lot like popular memes for the black/hip hop community.
most dances have an extremely popular song tied to it these days.
if you're going to have an opinion, do your home work.
i flipped through the thread a bit and saw a lot of dismissive comments.
popular black dances are a lot like popular memes for the black/hip hop community.
most dances have an extremely popular song tied to it these days.
if you're going to have an opinion, do your home work.
You dropped facts, been that way since forever go back to rock and other things too
No, OP is just talking about their own culture, which is black culture. They doesn't have to care about other cultures being appropriated. Maybe they do, maybe they don't, why don't you ask them? Maybe they don't feel like they can say whether or not another culture that they don't belong to is being appropriated.
I see what you did but it doesn't negate my point.
Unless these dances are protected by law, this is legally a non-issue
Battle Royale genre is the most interesting thing in competitive games right now and far from creatively bankrupt. The 3 games you mentioned play completely different. As for the dances, give them credit. Why rename a dance?
something can be legally a non-issue and still be morally debatable.
i also think that too many people are seeing this as an isolated incident and not another point in a trend of non-black people getting praise for doing things that black people created and have been doing for years/decades/centuries
What does the law have to do with cultural erasure and giving credit where credit is due? The creator highlighted in the video even said he doesn't care about the money, he just wants respect. We just want respect.
It really is fucked up. All of these dance moves just become "the Fortnite dance with the _____" the moment they're put up there.
Epic needs to retroactively start crediting creators and paying them what they're owed. At the bare minimum they need to credit people properly.
Epic needs to retroactively start crediting creators and paying them what they're owed. At the bare minimum they need to credit people properly.
That's fine, but a lot of people in this thread and previous threads making claims about epic being taken to court over this are wrong.
I'm shaking my head at this whole thread. DigitalOp is trying really hard to make a good case here but a lot of you are trying to either derail it or make it about something it's not. Don't even get me started on the influx of random junior accounts trolling this thread too. Bring up culture or women issues in video games and these dudes come out of the woodwork like bees to honey thinking they are slick or funny.
Pretty much this. I don't really blame them for that, but the dance names could have been clever references.
Well when white people take ownership and profit off the work of black artists it's pretty relevant. That's the story of this country, we never let minorities have anything. We encroach on their spaces, lift from their culture, and then on top of all that we treat them like shit, and then on top of that people have the audacity to say we don't.
DigitalOp always makes great threads and posts
Calling it 'cultural erasure' is hypobolic to the extent that this topic was never going to taking seriously.
Whenever this topic comes up I just state my opinion on it.
This is cultural appropriation, no ifs ands or butts. Is it really possible to pay these people? Maybe maybe not. But they can absolutely give credit to where they lifted the dances from.
This is cultural appropriation, no ifs ands or butts. Is it really possible to pay these people? Maybe maybe not. But they can absolutely give credit to where they lifted the dances from.
Of course white people CAN dance...some well enough to make a living from it, unbelievable, I know.... , same as black people CAN swim and dogs CAN look up (sorry, Big Al).
Some of the generalisation and ignorant vitriol that gets posted around here is bordering on the rediculous sometimes.
Epic should credit the stuff they are "paying homage to" but I am not sure where this all stands, legally. Wouldn't the dances by covered by the fair use/parody laws?
Saying that's kids calling these dances "Fortnite dances" is cultural erasure? Yeah, that's a little far.
Saying that Epic not acknowledging the source or who popularized the dance is cultural erasure? I think there is a pretty good case to call cultural erasure there.
Paladins comes out but y'all are quick to call it an overwatch clone and get up in arms about it but as soon as a business takes a dance from a black man without crediting or referencing him, it's okay. Gotcha.
- Status