But here is the thing. Scorsese saw a few, and even says they are well made and all that. he was using the phrase “cinema” in a very esoteric, scholarly and insular sense.
Infinity War both succeeds and fails entirely on the back of the 20 movies that came before it. Which is a major problem. They are using built up affection for these characters in lieu of any character development -- which is needed for the climax to hit the way they want it to. The whole thing is effectively the most purified version of slamming action figures together for 2 and a half hours. And it's really fun because of that. But also because of that it is impossible for it to stand on its own as any sort of effective film. I suppose it is extra memorable in a way because of that, but it also is going to prevent it from being easy to revisit or get anything out of for people who weren't there for it at the time.
A lot of fast food is garbage. The marvel films aren't high art but they aren't garbage.
Because people on ERA can't accept opinions, and when something they care about (see MCU) is criticized they need to start insulting and getting mad because someone dared to say that Marvel movies are not good or they are not cinema. The first page is embarassing.
You’ve hit the proverbial nail precisely on the head: In 90% of the cases, these films do not stand on their own two legs. There’s no true “cinematic classic” that can stand the test of time as a real achievement beyond being just another cog in a well-oiled money making mega franchise. Taken as a whole it’s an impressive feat; the most successful movie franchise in history. But like any franchise it offers nothing but empty calories. And that’s totally fine! That’s still an enjoyable, popcorn-munching time at the movies. But no, it’s not “cinema” in the purest sense of the art form, I’m sorry to say.
He said he has seen some but apparently wasn't impressed enough to watch any more.
Of course- standard fair for both of them. Good vs Evil, Perseverance, Courage/Heroism
Scorcese admitted he hasn't seen the movies.
I don't think when people are using that analogy they are talking about quality. They are talking about how it's the same frozen and reheated thing every time, and it makes you feel good/crave it, but is never as tasty or nice as a meal at a good sit down restaurant.
Yup. Exactly. And it's why so many people like Logan and call it one of the better superhero movies out there -- despite NOT being a 250 mil big spectacle superhero film. Even if they can't vocalize that's why.
Good Vs. Evil isn't really a theme though, that's just a standard conflict, if you took a writing class and said that was your theme you'd likely get an F from the teacher. You have to something to say about the idea of good vs. evil.
That's simply not true. He has stated he has seen several of them multiple times in the past. We just don't know which ones. But frankly it doesn't matter. We know Coppola has seen more than one also, with Black Panther definitely being one of them.
These apply to literally every one of the MCU films. Yes, ALL of them. They're also extremely surface level without deep things to say about any of them.
This gets it.
He said he tried to watch them. He didn't say he finished a single one. Given his takes, I'm highly skeptical.
Which is more likely reality Marvel books studio time to make movies or they do it just to cock block Coppola or Scorsese? One is reality the other is tinfoil hat land. Hell Scorsese just got 150 million for The Irishman? Damn dude can barely catch a break
There are a lot of people who enjoy fast food and don’t think it tastes like garbage. People get excited over the McRib returning is a perfect example.
Scorsese isn't the kind of guy to walk out of the theater. He has seen a MCU movie. You don't need to move your goal posts, you're just not right about this. He never said they're unwatchable.
I... don’t understand what you’re trying to say in this post. Nobody is saying that Marvel are gatekeeping, just that the notion that Marvel movies are being denied access is beyond ridiculous.
"Gatekeeping" is colloquially used to describe the act of an individual taking it upon themselves to decide who/what has access to a particular communitty/ identity/ classification.
Unless there are other quotes. The one below doesn't really suggest he's watched them. It's honestly an absurd take. All marvel movies have some emotional angle and definitely a narrative angle. His characterization of the movies to me implies he thinks they're something that they're not
this is bullshit tho
I don't know why you coming at me silly. A man shits on the good work of others and folks happy feelings about said work. People make have something to say about it. If you going to dismiss the conversation cause you don't folks have valid thoughts and opinions it, then that is on you bro.
You're thinking on too small a scale. It's not about Marvel personally fucking either of these guys. It's about how they fought for creator-control in Hollywood and now the MCU machine (and others) have transformed it back into a producer/studio-controlled world where it's incredibly difficult to get any big budget picture made that doesn't fit this mold.
Disney is the biggest blockbuster maker, makes the most money at the theatres, and is supposedly pressuring theatres in various way. To say Scorsese or Copolla are gatekeeping is incredibly hilarious. Yeah, they may gatekeep a word in an elitist way, but how harmful is that?
How is the definition of a word an opinion? Cinema has an objective definition.The reason they are "Gatekeeping" is because they are trying to dictate what classifies as cinema.
Money/ theater terms have nothing to do with whether or not Scorsese or Copolla are gatekeeping nor anything to do with the discussion at hand.
I still think that's a terrible analogy.
Why when I can read books *shrug*. Cinema still playing catchup to the actual enlightening content of books.
If you show me a quote where he says so, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. The quotes I found to me imply he hasn't.
You are being pediantic, "gatekeeping" has many meanings one being demeaning something by saying it isn't legitimate. And also
"I tried" = he saw at least one. I am not going to go digging right now, but I am positive he has mentioned seeing more than one in the past.
Their words have 0 effect on anything except people debating nonsense on the Internet. That is why it isn't gatekeeping.
People can have bad taste. Like people saying rogue 1 is a good movie.
How do you gatekeep when you cannot physical stop or pressure anyone from doing so? Do you think studios are going, "Well, time to not try and copy the MCU formula because these 2 directors don't like it?"
Gatekeeping does have many meanings, but that isn’t one of them.
I'm not coming silly on you at all, he gave his opinion on the MCU and that's fine, i mean, if he said the same thing about "Logan", "Joker" or another comic movie that i really like, who cares? He has his own idea of cinema and that's completely fine, his opinion won't stop me from enjoying movies and he is not erasing comic movies from theatres.
"Good vs evil" is a conflict (and a rather boring one to be honest), it's not a theme. A theme is having something to say about "good vs. evil".
LOL so you are arguing a positive without any support. FO.
And people are giving their opinions on his opinion, that how things should work
There words having little actual effect has NOTHING to do with whether they are gatekeeping are not.
You pissing on fast food and claiming anyone who likes it has bad taste is just the same shit you’re arguing against. To some people, Marvel movies are the equivalent in quality of fast food. Lots of people love Marvel movies just like lots of people like fast food. It’s amazing you can’t grasp how the analogy can be made when you’re doing it from the other end of it to dispel it.
Difference is their opinion carries a lot more weight seeing as how they've made some of the greatest modern films period versus ... "random dude on internet".
Giving your opinion is fine, saying that he is gatekeeping is not true.
Also this.
