French rapper investigated for call to 'hang white people'

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

This is why hate speech laws are heavy handed authoritarian nonsense quite often.

If you ignore context of anything you can make it whatever you want. The only thing that's ever amusing on Era is how people apply the context argument depending on whether they like or agree with the source. That's not how that works. Objective honesty is what is important not opinions. This isn't a legit call to kill white people, it's an edgy rap.

Good thing I'm consistent. Unless the guy is posing an actual threat or a serious call to violence, wasting money, resources and so on, on this, is a media circus and a waste of time. Let YouTube kick it if they want and people call him a twat, but save the hyperbole and Government intervention please.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
So because of colonialism every african person gets a free pass from hate speech?Get real, man.

You keep saying things that no one said.

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

I love the hot take that colonial history should give you a free pass regarding hate speech.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
I love the hot take that colonial history should give you a free pass regarding hate speech.

It's only hate speech, if you ignore the contextual message.

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Audioboxer said:
This is why hate speech laws are heavy handed authoritarian nonsense quite often.

If you ignore context of anything you can make it whatever you want. The only thing that's ever amusing on Era is how people apply the context argument depending on whether they like or agree with the source. That's not how that works. Objective honesty is what is important not opinions. This isn't a legit call to kill white people, it's an edgy rap.

Good thing I'm consistent. Unless the guy is posing an actual threat or a serious call to violence wasting money, resources and so on, on this, is a media circus and a waste of time. Let YouTube kick it if they want and people call him a twat, but save the hyperbole and Government intervention please.

What is the context of the video? Especially a context which justifies the killing of babies?

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
It's only hate speech, if you ignore the contextual message.

Which you failed to provide. But but colonial history doesn't cut it.

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
You keep saying things that no one said.

I'm not the one downplaying this.You and the other guy are.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
Which you failed to provide. But but colonial history doesn't cut it.

If it's not clear to you and it's only hate speech in your eyes, then maybe you should go do some research on colonialism and it's brutal history.

Otherwise that's a problem for you to figure out, not me.

YuYu said:
I'm not the one downplaying this.You and the other guy are.

I'm certainly not downplaying anything, more like attributing the reality of the situation. Instead of the knee-jerk one.

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
What is the context of the video? Especially a context which justifies the killing of babies?

The context here is the guy not being literal/serious. Especially made obvious by using the medium of song/rap. It's one for the "courts of public opinion", not the Government. Youtube can kick it under TOS if they want, people can call him a twat, end of. At worst it's an attempt at being edgy or getting mainstream attention by saying offensive things, under the guise of art or spreading a reflective message.

Unlike others around here I have no issues defending stuff I might not personally like or enjoy from the hyperbole of "this is literally a threat! this violent man needs to be locked up!". This is not a case for wasting Government time and resources.

Cocolina · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
Which you failed to provide. But but colonial history doesn't cut it.

If you say so. I think in this context, with all the descriptions of whipping and lynching, colonial history is something you, like your apparently universal hate speech laws, are conveniently avoiding.

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
If it's not clear to you and it's only hate speech in your eyes, then maybe you should go do some research on colonialism and it's brutal history.

Otherwise that's a problem for you to figure out, not me.

More like it's not hate speech for you.In most EU countries this is considered to be hate speech.

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
If it's not clear to you and it's only hate speech in your eyes, then maybe you should go do some research on colonialism and it's brutal history.

Otherwise that's a problem for you to figure out, not me.

So you have nothing to say about this case and just want to post hot takes. I see.

At no point you provided any "context" why this case shouldn't fall under the French hate speech laws.

Bernd Lauert · Sep 29, 2018

I came here expecting people to downplay it any way they can. Was not disappointed.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
So you have nothing to say about this case and just want to post hot takes. I see.

At no point you provided any "context" why this case shouldn't fall under the French hate speech laws.

The french hate speech law, is just operating under the sense of blanket net criteria. These folks would have hated KRS-one.

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Jktpnymonorel said:
as an Asian it always blows my mind how that is not equivalent.

did we miss something?

I don't know.Some people turn a blind eye if the victims are white.

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
I don't know.Some people turn a blind eye if the victims are white.

How many victims are there from a rap song?

You're doing the exact same thing you'd probably accuse others of doing if it was a song targeting non-white people. Overreacting to what is clearly not a genuine threat or call to violence.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
I don't know.Some people turn a blind eye if the victims are white.

No one's a literally victim is this case. Did someone die? or do you mean target? even that's flux in nature.

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Cocolina said:
If you say so. I think in this context, with all the descriptions of whipping and lynching, colonial history is something you, like your apparently universal hate speech laws, are conveniently avoiding.

So why should the French society accept calls of violence against people solely based on skin color?

Trying to frame it as a metaphor of colonialism is not just baseless, you failed to provide any arguments regarding that claim, nor would it justifies such hate speech.

Deleted member 4021 · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
I don't know.Some people turn a blind eye if the victims are white.

All those white victims of racism. There are dozens of us, dozens!

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Audioboxer said:
How many victims are there from a rap song?

You're doing the exact same thing you'd probably accuse others of doing if it was a song targeting non-white people. Overreacting to what is clearly not a genuine threat or call to violence.

Cabbagehead said:
No one's a literally victim is this case. Did someone die? or do you mean target? even that's flux in nature.

Victim isn't the right word, but hearing about how he wants to hang white babies then some of you people defend him is disgusting.

Cocolina · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
So why should the French society accept calls of violence against people solely based on skin color?

Trying to frame it as a metaphor of colonialism is not just baseless, you failed to provide any arguments regarding that claim, nor would it justify such hate speech.

I just explained why I think it's a message on colonialism because of the visual language he's using. Just another thing you choose to ignore. Conversely, you have not explained why this is a "call" when clearly it is written from a 1st person perspective and not a 2nd "you" or "we" perspective. So now your turn to justify why this is a call to action.

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Branduil said:
All those white victims of racism. There are dozens of us, dozens!

Of course you'd downplay it.

fanboi · Sep 29, 2018

Buzzman said:
I mean, Youtube, the home of many different strains of nazis and fascists with millions of subs who love to talk about how the blacks or the jews or the muslims should all be eradicated, that's A-okay. But one anti-white moron is news?
Hell this is the second thread on here in as many days.

Is there any french YT channels that hasn't been brought to action? Since we are talking about France and not the world (and, shock, each country has it own laws).

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
Of course you'd downplay it.

Are you using this word right?

TheFurizzlyBear · Sep 29, 2018

Topic makes me think of NOFX's "Kill All the White Man"

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

TheFurizzlyBear said:
Topic makes me think of NOFX's "Kill All the White Man"

That wouldn't fly at all in France or under Eupore law, shit i'm sure it didn't when it was released. There's a lot of songs in a similar vine, none of it is humorous or a call to arms.

Hans Gruber · Sep 29, 2018

A local (Norfolk, UK) BBC radio presenter with the same name has received death threats aimed at this French rapper. There are some real geniuses out there.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-45666261

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
Are you using this word right?

Yes, I am, Mr.It's ok to talk about killing babies as long as they're white.

BabyMurloc · Sep 29, 2018

The conservative politicians reacting are obviously super racist, but suspected hate speech being investigated is the law working like it should. I'm sure a judge will provide reasoning for whatever is decided.

Don Draper's Hat · Sep 29, 2018

Hans Gruber said:
A local (Norfolk, UK) BBC radio presenter with the same name has received death threats aimed at this French rapper. There are some real geniuses out there.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-45666261

Smell my cheese!

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
Yes, I am, Mr.It's ok to talk about killing babies as long as they're white.

It's like talking in a different language.

BabyMurloc said:
The conservative politicians reacting are obviously super racist, but suspected hate speech being investigated is the law working like it should. I'm sure a judge will provide reasoning for whatever is decided.

For sure, wonder how many of these get reported a day and what the punishment looks like.

Untzillatx · Sep 29, 2018

It seems pretty clear to me that is hate speech. I cannot see the relation between it being in a song and "not being serious". Evidently he is not really planning to hang white people or murder white babies, but the implication is there.

If the groups were reversed the reaction would be similar. Hate speech laws in France -as well as in most of western Europe- are the same for everybody and usually applied as such.

Hans Gruber · Sep 29, 2018

Don Draper's Hat said:
Smell my cheese!

If only it was him! :D

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Cocolina said:
I just explained why I think it's a message on colonialism because of the visual language he's using. Just another thing you choose to ignore. Conversely, you have not explained why this is a "call" when clearly it is written from a 1st person perspective and not a 2nd "you" or "we" perspective. So now your turn to justify why this is a call to action.

Ignoring the fact hat for a call of violence it isn't relevant if he sings in the 1st or any other perspective.

Your interpretation isn't even relevant what should be hate speech in a country, especially you didn't provide any arguments why it shouldn't covered by hate speech laws.

YuYu · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
It's like talking in a different language.

You're the one defending the hate speech, not me.You're the one who doesn't seem to understand that.

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
You're the one defending the hate speech, not me.You're the one who doesn't seem to understand that.

I'm typing to a brick wall.

Don Draper's Hat · Sep 29, 2018

Hans Gruber said:
If only it was him! :D

That's not racist. French people chomp onions and go "hoh-hee- hoh-hee-hoh", that's a fact.

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

YuYu said:
Victim isn't the right word, but hearing about how he wants to hang white babies then some of you people defend him is disgusting.

Yeah, that's it, I'm actually endorsing and advocating for the defence of literally hanging white babies.

This is the kind of bullshit I can't stand no matter where it comes from. Remember what I said earlier? Objective honesty is what matters here. You can be as offended as you want, in this case though, you're not a victim. It's a rap song. It's not literal. Stop feigning that as an adult you can't handle just seeing such lyrics, rolling your eyes and moving on with your life. Nothing is happening to you because of an edgy artist.

I said it earlier but I'll defend against this bullshit no matter where it comes from. Governments/police forces ignoring context/objective honesty is an erosion of human rights and/or just complete nonsense. Unless it is true the person involved has a history of legitimate threats, or this is a legitimate threat, it's not a case for a Government. Nor the police. Nor the justice system. It's for the public to disown/criticise or workplaces/jobs/private services to handle.

That's my stance and it always will be. Because if you inverse this topic, you get this - https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/woman-who-posted-rap-lyrics-14543694 Dumb white girl says the N word on instagram quoting song lyrics, gets arrested, fined and an ankle bracelet. Are you going to argue this was right?

How about society stops being so fucking dishonest all the time just to score political points, pretend to be a victim or support overreach on the behalf of a Government because "in this case, it targets someone I don't like".

BabyMurloc · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
For sure, wonder how many of these get reported a day and what the punishment looks like.

I've no idea about France, here in Finland it's usually a few hundred in fines.

Cocolina · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
Ignoring the fact hat for a call of violence it isn't relevant if he sings in the 1st or any other perspective.

Your interpretation isn't even relevant what should be hate speech in a country, especially you didn't provide any arguments why it shouldn't covered by hate speech laws.

Nah, you're not slipping out if this. I explained why I think it had artistic merit and why I think it's perspective adds to the artistic merit and also makes it not a call to action. Now extend me the same courtesy on your side. If you think a call to violence is what counts as hate speech I want you to explain why you think this is a call to action.

Sal · Sep 29, 2018

Some people on this board really don't like white people huh?

Buzzman · Sep 29, 2018

fanboi said:
Is there any french YT channels that hasn't been brought to action? Since we are talking about France and not the world (and, shock, each country has it own laws).

I'm not exactly equipped to search youtube for any specifically french racists. Are you claiming that there isn't a single one?
But it's not just the french reaction really. Why did Youtube remove it? Why did dozens of newspapers all around the world report on it? Why did this need two threads on here?
When is Youtube going to take action against any of this?

Cabbagehead · Sep 29, 2018

Audioboxer said:
- https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/woman-who-posted-rap-lyrics-14543694 Dumb white girl says the N word on instagram quoting song lyrics, gets arrested, fined and an ankle bracelet. Are you going to argue this was right?

That's seems kind of overkill, though i'd have to watch the video.

Sal said:
Some people on this board really don't like white people huh?

Of course this is totally about that....

Qikz · Sep 29, 2018

Branduil said:
Surprise, white fragility isn't just an American problem.

Hate speech of any kind is banned in most of Europe, it doesn't matter what race you are you should use your speech to try and incite violence against another person even as a joke. Some people take things like that seriously.

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

Cabbagehead said:
That's seems kind of overkill, though i'd have to watch the video.

There wasn't a video, it was an instagram post.

Russell was found guilty of sending a grossly offensive message by a public communication.

She was given an eight-week community order, placed on an eight-week curfew and told to pay costs of £500 and an £85 victim surcharge.

BBC Source - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-43816921

Quoting this song

Wouldn't surprise me if this French rapper got something similar including a "victim surcharge".

Deleted member 3335 · Sep 29, 2018

Cocolina said:
Nah, you're not slipping out if this. I explained why I think it had artistic merit and why I think it's perspective adds to the artistic merit and also makes it not a call to action. Now extend me the same courtesy on your side. If you think a call to violence is what counts as hate speech I want you to explain why you think this is a call to action.

Rapping that you gonna kill babies is a call for violence.

This is pretty simple. You are the one who tries to justify this violence with freedom of arts.

R0b1n · Sep 29, 2018

Audioboxer said:
Yeah, that's it, I'm actually endorsing and advocating for the defence of literally hanging white babies.

This is the kind of bullshit I can't stand no matter where it comes from. Remember what I said earlier? Objective honesty is what matters here. You can be as offended as you want, in this case though, you're not a victim. It's a rap song. It's not literal. Stop feigning that as an adult you can't handle just seeing such lyrics, rolling your eyes and moving on with your life. Nothing is happening to you because of an edgy artist.

I said it earlier but I'll defend against this bullshit no matter where it comes from. Governments/police forces ignoring context/objective honesty is an erosion of human rights and/or just complete nonsense. Unless it is true the person involved has a history of legitimate threats, or this is a legitimate threat, it's not a case for a Government. Nor the police. Nor the justice system. It's for the public to disown/criticise or workplaces/jobs/private services to handle.

That's my stance and it always will be. Because if you inverse this topic, you get this - https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/woman-who-posted-rap-lyrics-14543694 Dumb white girl says the N word on instagram quoting song lyrics, gets arrested, fined and an ankle bracelet. Are you going to argue this was right?

How about society stops being so fucking dishonest all the time just to score political points, pretend to be a victim or support overreach on the behalf of a Government because "in this case, it targets someone I don't like".

I agree with this, but funny thing is you see more support for the girl getting arrested on Era than now

Oh, and the pug saluting case too. Tons of support for the owner getting arrested

Edit: Actually, maybe I'm mistaken. But that's what I remember

Deleted member 4021 · Sep 29, 2018

Absolutely disgusted by this recent book I read, I sincerely hope the authorities will arrest this man for his public calls to eat babies.

Deleted member 888 · Sep 29, 2018

Pmichael said:
Rapping that you gonna kill babies is a call for violence.

This is pretty simple. You are the one who tries to justify this violence with freedom of arts.

And creating a film with cannibalism and sexual violence is a direct endorsement of the artist's personal beliefs? Right?

Not every artist is as smart, educated, skilful, popular or as capable as every other, but even those that are "rejects" or "terrible at their trade" can do things that aren't literal. Stop feigning that this is a serious call to violence. Stop being intellectually dishonest.

The lyrics reach the realm of absurdity when talking about hanging white babies. You can say you're as offended as you want, but it's not a legit call to get people hanging babies.

KelticNight · Sep 29, 2018

Don Draper's Hat said:
That's not racist. French people chomp onions and go "hoh-hee- hoh-hee-hoh", that's a fact.

French rapper investigated for call to 'hang white people'

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