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Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
I guess it really isn't but...it'd be kind of funny if those stupid fucking mosquitoes were ultimately at fault for Blighttown tanking so hard. It'd be kind of poetic considering what utter dicks they are. I swear, there's no weapon that reliably hits them even with lock-on. I was maining a great club and spear last time I went through there...oh my god.

I wouldn't be surprised at all really. They're a horrible enemy lol. And they really can get aggro'd from way out.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
They're also infinite right? I've never stuck around long enough to truly find out but they sure seem like it?

No, but they seem that way. They are placed across the entirety of the swamp, but when you aggro enemies, for some reason all the mosquitos get alerted. There's like idk, 15? I just remember the number surprised me as apparently there aren't a lot.
 

Baloota

Member
May 12, 2018
913
Egypt
The thing with DeS remake is that it would need more than a graphical remake to stand today with the rest of the Souls games. If it is indeed in the making,I wonder to what extend are they capable and willing of modifying/adding/removing things from the old version to make it up to today's standards

So if the remake rumours are true,I'm really curious how they are gonna handle it
I'm okay with a straight up SotC quality remaster but i'm hoping for the broken archstone.
 

Res

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,601
What if a demons souls remaster is true, but it's not a remake by bluepoint? Also, blighttown(minus the bad framerate) and valley of defilement are my favorite swamp areas in the series. I find them very oppressive, and I can't tell you how I relieved I was when I finally found a bonfire in blighttown
 
Apr 3, 2020
2,636
Both are worth playing, really. The DS2 DLC is very good overall, which elevates SotFS. Demon's is, of course, also quite good. If you have to choose one, I guess it depends on whether the rumored Demon's remake makes you want to play the original more or less.
Yeahhhh...about the rumored remake by Bluepoint, I hope there will be an option to let us play the original game (remastered 1:1) after what they've done with SoTC remake I'm very pessimistic about the rumored remake, I didn't like their creative take on the remake especially on the art department making everything lifeful and realistic, and DeS is game full of fantasy.
if you jump into DS2 unbiased,you'll enjoy it way more than you think. If you jump in with the mood "lets see how bad DS2 is", then you aren't starting on a right track

I say go to Drangleic,DeS is great,but it's a bit rough since it was the first. You'll appreciate DS2 more imo

Actually this is the plan lol (being unbiased), I played DS2 when first came out on PS3, at the time I've felt From used really cheap methods for sake to be difficult, like after each death your health limit decreases, slower animations, attacks' animations can't be canceled by rolling (until like last few frames?)

After I beat it, I didn't never looked back, so other than fps upgrade and DLCs, what changes have been made? Also should I leave the DLCs after the end game?
 

Grudy

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,643
Phil Spencer's comments about the effects of the coronavirus specifically on games releasing early next year might be something to think about though. He mentions that delays due to inability to do mocap and voice acting, of which the latter is more vital in a From Software game development, I think. Not sure if From uses Mocap for animation or not a la what they did with the Witcher games.
 
Apr 3, 2020
2,636
And you know what's crazy? I can't remember who but there was someone who demonstrated that the poor performance was mostly due to the AI being really taxing. Like, all of it activates when you enter blighttown. There are a number of periods in the game where when you enter an area the framerate tanks as it loads all the AI in.

So the entire may have worked and performed fine, and then it was just too late to change when they were populating it with enemies. I don't know.

But whatever the case the game seems to not handle a lot of AI very well. Kind of wish they sectioned them off more cuz like those mosquitos are annoying.
Speaking of performance, we all know From isn't good in this aspect, so I've been thinking lately and came by theory is the reason From's games suffer from performance is because they prioritizes the "level design" by keeping it more engaging and consistent? while other developers prioritize performance filling the levels with climbing and crawling sections, and generally criticized for poor leves design
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
Speaking of performance, we all know From isn't good in this aspect, so I've been thinking lately and came by theory is the reason From's games suffer from performance is because they prioritizes the "level design" by keeping it more engaging and consistent? while other developers prioritize performance filling the levels with climbing and crawling sections, and generally criticized for poor leves design

That could be a big part of it.

Although things like bad frame pacing are something they just need to figure out.
 

Deleted member 2229

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,740
Omni if you had to compare Elden Ring to a progressive rock song what would it be? The people need answers.
Honestly I don't even really listen to enough progressive rock to have even a silly answer for this. I was never really able to, or at least never took the time to get into stuff like Rush or Dream Theater or anything adjacent as technical musical wankery for technical musical wankery's sake never really interested me. Pink Floyd and Opeth (Ghost Reveries, but otherwise Blackwater Park and everything that leads up to it) are more my speed but beyond that I'm pretty prog rock illiterate.

I think there's a bit of a fine line here. I understand some of the complaints that people might have with the long, multi-phase boss fights like Friede and the Sword Saint, but at the same time, I think those are also some of the most spectacular and rewarding fights that they've ever made.

It's also worth noting that the difficulty scaling might change a bit here with the open-world aspect, as I expect there'll be some freedom in terms of the order in which players tackle the content, as opposed to the more linear design of DS3 and Sekiro.
For sure

I personally wouldn't want the long, more mechanic heavy fights like Friede, Sword Saint to go away, but I can understand if someone wouldn't want them along the critical path. Though for myself I'd just be happy with healthpools being brought down a bit or at the very least not continuing to escalate when it comes to multi-phase, multi-health bar fights or especially in the cases of Demon of Hatred and Midir.

Though I can also agree with the fact that if a fight is going to have multiple phases/health bars, those phases should be mechanically different from one another rather than just having a second or third health bar just because.

I am curious to see how difficulty in Elden Ring plays out. One the one hand, you have From as a developer and their reputation for challenging games, and I'm sure they will continue that tradition. But on the other hand, if any part of the collaboration with GRRM is marketing and attempting to capture a larger audience, then I can see providing tools like co-op and summons and maybe clarify those to make the potential of getting through the game higher. It'll be interesting to see how they handle it.

I think this is an interesting point. I found the challenge of endgame bosses in Dark Souls 3 like Sister Friede/Nameless King/Midir to be annoying with some of the bloat and punishes, whereas, with the exception of Demon of Hatred, I didn't feel the same way about Sekiro. I found it hard as balls, but because it was testing me in different ways, I guess it didn't bother me as much. But with Dark Souls 3 needing to change things up and put a new spin on a system where there are 100 bosses preceding those bosses in roughly the same system, it is a challenge to meaningfully change the difficulty. I'm hoping then that Elden Ring provides enough tweaks to the Dark Souls formula so that it is less an escalation of Dark Souls difficulty, and more providing difficulty by finding new ways to challenge and test players.

I wouldn't really put much stock into the games difficulty or accessibility being adjusted because of GRRM being attached to the project tbh, not saying that's exactly what you're implying but it is something I've seen brought up a lot. Miyazaki had addressed this in an interview from last June.

But addressing your other point, I would agree in that I feel Sekiro is largely pretty fair, though if you miss upgrades some fights can end up being more punishing than they need to be. But I did personally enjoy the more focused nature of the fights that revolve around your ability to "become" the Shinobi of myth and face challenges based around that.

Though in the case of Dark Souls 3 and From ARPG's in general, I think it's also worth noting that these fights then also have to be able to be defeated by a much wider variety of builds (Which From keeps freeform, which increases the number of playstyles that need to be "viable") which also affect their ability to design and balance challenging fights. So just adding and tweaking combat mechanics isn't really the silver bullet solution (especially when these mechanics need to also work for most if not all builds) but of course it helps. It's a bit of a difficult issue to properly navigate for sure.

I think in the case of Bloodborne and Sekiro in particularly, the more focused build variety works in their favor in that regard as it allows them to focus in on a more narrow set of playstyles and design fights around those rather than the much greater variety of something that is more RPG heavy like Dark Souls.

I've been lurking these parts for a long while now, mostly for the infamous Omniposts 🙂 Love you and everything you're doing for this community, in those times of silence I'm at a loss for words and unable to emphasize how much ANY kind of insight into this game means to me, and most certainly, every other FROM fan... On the current topic of difficulty though, I felt I should break the lurker status and throw out this one question... Will SL1 runs still be possible in Elden Ring? Or something equivalent? I'm this guy who got that taste of adrenaline out of those games and once DS3 came out, I went in blind and straight up SL1 for the very first playthrough - I can only say that it was the most memorable and the most intense gaming experience of my life. And repeating this ordeal is something I'm desperately waiting to experience once more!
Much appreciated! I'm genuinely glad that what I do means something to you guys and its always nice to hear it.

As for SL1 runs, not sure if you mean technically possible or humanly possible. They know people like to do stuff like that and I don't see any reason for them to remove ones ability to engage in personally set challenging content like that. I haven't really "checked" for myself, but if something works, is unobtrusive and isn't detrimental to the game then they'll generally just keep it and in the case of stuff like SL1 runs in particular, or things similar they generally prefer to let players engage in their own personally defined challenges rather than making rigid restrictions which is why you generally see a lack of challenge modes across these games.

Whether or not it's humanly possible for one to do, I don't know, it's definitely beyond my own ability. A few years ago I probably would've said it's not possible to beat these games with a dance pad or guitar hero controller, but I've been proven wrong numerous times on that.

Hope that helps!

please say Atom Heart Mother please say Atom Heart Mother please say Atom Heart Mother please say Atom Heart Mother please say Atom Heart Mother
Admittedly, I've always been more of an Animals guy myself.

Obviously not being the same beast, but do you see the world and art direction in Elden Ring to be something that will change the way people approach fantasy games moving forward?
I can only answer this with my own personal thoughts and opinions but my honest answer is probably not, at least not to the degree it would make much of a difference.

I think that especially as of late with so many niche games finding much wider successes that I don't really see devs and studios across the board taking the lesson that less risks and copying what's already been successful is the way to go, but instead maybe making more of an effort to carve out their own path and identity as that's been rewarded time and time again. At least that's how I see it.

Like Skyrim is one of if not the biggest fantasy game of the past decade with over 30 million copies sold to date and as much as devs have said their game was inspired by Skyrim, pretty much none of those games were ever really anything like Skyrim, you could maybe say it helped popularize RPG's in general to a more mainstream audience and maybe say it helped or influenced other games to move in a Norse inspired direction (though there are a number of other potential reasons for this as well, such as the popularity of Vikings).

But beyond that I don't really think it's convincingly changed the way the gaming landscape has approached fantasy games beyond just popularizing Open World games and RPGs in particular.

it's not been long enough to say definitively but I imagine the same will be true for Witcher 3 and BOTW and all of the above have sold a lot more than From games generally do.

There will always be smaller teams and lower budget copycats but historically, trying to copy the success of X thing has rarely ever panned out and studios usually find much better successes doing their own, unique thing. If there was anything I would really say would change meaningfully is that it's going to be a lot harder for studios that follow closely in From's footsteps to even really attempt to replicate something like ER.

I need to be careful with my wording here as I'm sure some website will pick it up as a headline, but I don't really think that Elden Ring will be some revolutionary work of gaming or fantasy that's completely unheard of. Like I don't think this realistically is going to be gaming's "Star Wars 77" or anything like that where it bursts onto the scene and completely changes the landscape because it feels so new and radically different. Especially in a landscape where fantasy games as a whole have been around, relatively popular and releasing consistently for like 40+ years now. I think it's going to be an incredible game, and one created by people who are well versed and masters at their craft, from two incredible minds. But I don't think it'll be earth shattering.
 

crespo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,509
In my mid-30's I've taken a liking to PF's 80's stuff.

I don't have a permanent favorite PF track, but On the Turning Away had the throne for the longest period of time, I think. Straight powerful lyrics.

Animals is heavenly.
 

finalflame

Product Management
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,538
Started my DkS Remastered run last night in honor of how much I need Elden Ring news in my life :P
 

What-ok

Member
Dec 13, 2017
3,038
PDX OR
I can only answer this with my own personal thoughts and opinions but my honest answer is probably not, at least not to the degree it would make much of a difference.

I think that especially as of late with so many niche games finding much wider successes that I don't really see devs and studios across the board taking the lesson that less risks and copying what's already been successful is the way to go, but instead maybe making more of an effort to carve out their own path and identity as that's been rewarded time and time again. At least that's how I see it.

Like Skyrim is one of if not the biggest fantasy game of the past decade with over 30 million copies sold to date and as much as devs have said their game was inspired by Skyrim, pretty much none of those games were ever really anything like Skyrim, you could maybe say it helped popularize RPG's in general to a more mainstream audience and maybe say it helped or influenced other games to move in a Norse inspired direction (though there are a number of other potential reasons for this as well, such as the popularity of Vikings).

But beyond that I don't really think it's convincingly changed the way the gaming landscape has approached fantasy games beyond just popularizing Open World games and RPGs in particular.

it's not been long enough to say definitively but I imagine the same will be true for Witcher 3 and BOTW and all of the above have sold a lot more than From games generally do.

There will always be smaller teams and lower budget copycats but historically, trying to copy the success of X thing has rarely ever panned out and studios usually find much better successes doing their own, unique thing. If there was anything I would really say would change meaningfully is that it's going to be a lot harder for studios that follow closely in From's footsteps to even really attempt to replicate something like ER.

I need to be careful with my wording here as I'm sure some website will pick it up as a headline, but I don't really think that Elden Ring will be some revolutionary work of gaming or fantasy that's completely unheard of. Like I don't think this realistically is going to be gaming's "Star Wars 77" or anything like that where it bursts onto the scene and completely changes the landscape because it feels so new and radically different. Especially in a landscape where fantasy games as a whole have been around, relatively popular and releasing consistently for like 40+ years now. I think it's going to be an incredible game, and one created by people who are well versed and masters at their craft, from two incredible minds. But I don't think it'll be earth shattering.
Thanks for taking the time to share your insight. I really appreciate it. (=
 

Baloota

Member
May 12, 2018
913
Egypt
There are dogs in Elden Ring
wolves in particular
"Wolves hunt in PACKS"
I need to be careful with my wording here as I'm sure some website will pick it up as a headline, but I don't really think that Elden Ring will be some revolutionary work of gaming or fantasy that's completely unheard of. Like I don't think this realistically is going to be gaming's "Star Wars 77" or anything like that where it bursts onto the scene and completely changes the landscape because it feels so new and radically different. Especially in a landscape where fantasy games as a whole have been around, relatively popular and releasing consistently for like 40+ years now. I think it's going to be an incredible game, and one created by people who are well versed and masters at their craft, from two incredible minds. But I don't think it'll be earth shattering.
Fair enough, none of the recent From games has been earth shattering to be honest. Unlike Dark Souls and Demon's Souls which were pretty unique back in the days.
 
Last edited:

finalflame

Product Management
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,538
I am going to do the same. I love a fresh start. It's always such a treat.
It is, even after playing it probably dozens of times beginning to end, it's still goddamn amazing :D
Did this recently and did my first ever mage run. I never realized how easy magic makes the game when you know what you are doing haha
I went pyro this time, I think it was muscle memory from mix-maxing builds in the past. I actually build it as a mage, I think it's the one build I've never really done in earnest.
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,294
There are dogs in Elden Ring
wolves in particular
oh SHIT

We got our first enemy confirmation

Lol, but also nice.
1etN6yy.png
 

AAFCC

Member
Dec 2, 2019
549
Honestly I don't even really listen to enough progressive rock to have even a silly answer for this. I was never really able to, or at least never took the time to get into stuff like Rush or Dream Theater or anything adjacent as technical musical wankery for technical musical wankery's sake never really interested me. Pink Floyd and Opeth (Ghost Reveries, but otherwise Blackwater Park and everything that leads up to it) are more my speed but beyond that I'm pretty prog rock illiterate.


For sure

I personally wouldn't want the long, more mechanic heavy fights like Friede, Sword Saint to go away, but I can understand if someone wouldn't want them along the critical path. Though for myself I'd just be happy with healthpools being brought down a bit or at the very least not continuing to escalate when it comes to multi-phase, multi-health bar fights or especially in the cases of Demon of Hatred and Midir.

Though I can also agree with the fact that if a fight is going to have multiple phases/health bars, those phases should be mechanically different from one another rather than just having a second or third health bar just because.



I wouldn't really put much stock into the games difficulty or accessibility being adjusted because of GRRM being attached to the project tbh, not saying that's exactly what you're implying but it is something I've seen brought up a lot. Miyazaki had addressed this in an interview from last June.

But addressing your other point, I would agree in that I feel Sekiro is largely pretty fair, though if you miss upgrades some fights can end up being more punishing than they need to be. But I did personally enjoy the more focused nature of the fights that revolve around your ability to "become" the Shinobi of myth and face challenges based around that.

Though in the case of Dark Souls 3 and From ARPG's in general, I think it's also worth noting that these fights then also have to be able to be defeated by a much wider variety of builds (Which From keeps freeform, which increases the number of playstyles that need to be "viable") which also affect their ability to design and balance challenging fights. So just adding and tweaking combat mechanics isn't really the silver bullet solution (especially when these mechanics need to also work for most if not all builds) but of course it helps. It's a bit of a difficult issue to properly navigate for sure.

I think in the case of Bloodborne and Sekiro in particularly, the more focused build variety works in their favor in that regard as it allows them to focus in on a more narrow set of playstyles and design fights around those rather than the much greater variety of something that is more RPG heavy like Dark Souls.


Much appreciated! I'm genuinely glad that what I do means something to you guys and its always nice to hear it.

As for SL1 runs, not sure if you mean technically possible or humanly possible. They know people like to do stuff like that and I don't see any reason for them to remove ones ability to engage in personally set challenging content like that. I haven't really "checked" for myself, but if something works, is unobtrusive and isn't detrimental to the game then they'll generally just keep it and in the case of stuff like SL1 runs in particular, or things similar they generally prefer to let players engage in their own personally defined challenges rather than making rigid restrictions which is why you generally see a lack of challenge modes across these games.

Whether or not it's humanly possible for one to do, I don't know, it's definitely beyond my own ability. A few years ago I probably would've said it's not possible to beat these games with a dance pad or guitar hero controller, but I've been proven wrong numerous times on that.

Hope that helps!


Admittedly, I've always been more of an Animals guy myself.


I can only answer this with my own personal thoughts and opinions but my honest answer is probably not, at least not to the degree it would make much of a difference.

I think that especially as of late with so many niche games finding much wider successes that I don't really see devs and studios across the board taking the lesson that less risks and copying what's already been successful is the way to go, but instead maybe making more of an effort to carve out their own path and identity as that's been rewarded time and time again. At least that's how I see it.

Like Skyrim is one of if not the biggest fantasy game of the past decade with over 30 million copies sold to date and as much as devs have said their game was inspired by Skyrim, pretty much none of those games were ever really anything like Skyrim, you could maybe say it helped popularize RPG's in general to a more mainstream audience and maybe say it helped or influenced other games to move in a Norse inspired direction (though there are a number of other potential reasons for this as well, such as the popularity of Vikings).

But beyond that I don't really think it's convincingly changed the way the gaming landscape has approached fantasy games beyond just popularizing Open World games and RPGs in particular.

it's not been long enough to say definitively but I imagine the same will be true for Witcher 3 and BOTW and all of the above have sold a lot more than From games generally do.

There will always be smaller teams and lower budget copycats but historically, trying to copy the success of X thing has rarely ever panned out and studios usually find much better successes doing their own, unique thing. If there was anything I would really say would change meaningfully is that it's going to be a lot harder for studios that follow closely in From's footsteps to even really attempt to replicate something like ER.

I need to be careful with my wording here as I'm sure some website will pick it up as a headline, but I don't really think that Elden Ring will be some revolutionary work of gaming or fantasy that's completely unheard of. Like I don't think this realistically is going to be gaming's "Star Wars 77" or anything like that where it bursts onto the scene and completely changes the landscape because it feels so new and radically different. Especially in a landscape where fantasy games as a whole have been around, relatively popular and releasing consistently for like 40+ years now. I think it's going to be an incredible game, and one created by people who are well versed and masters at their craft, from two incredible minds. But I don't think it'll be earth shattering.
Well I believe souls saga had already revolutioned the fantasy genre since a lot of people now when they see some artists designing towering dark knights or nightmare beasts compare them to Dark Souls . So , if Elden Ring monsters design is similar to Dark Souls there is nothing revolutionary because they already made the revolution.
I wonder if it wont be' revolutionary because this time they are focusing on more traditional fantasy creatures like trolls , werewolves, griffins, goblins etc.. As much as I love their usual dark design I would really like to see their take on some more traditional fantasy creatures this time.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
Third. First were giants and second were dragons!

Oh crap you're right.

Okay well these are our first confirmed grunt/common enemies! Got em.

Wait, unless the giants are?

Okay so is this bad but that actually would be a spoiler to me? Kinda? We don't know how this universe treats giants.
 

Deleted member 2229

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,740
Well I believe souls saga had already revolutioned the fantasy genre since a lot of people now when they see some artists designing towering dark knights or nightmare beasts compare them to Dark Souls . So , if Elden Ring monsters design is similar to Dark Souls there is nothing revolutionary because they already made the revolution.
I wonder if it wont be' revolutionary because this time they are focusing on more traditional fantasy creatures like trolls , werewolves, griffins, goblins etc.. As much as I love their usual dark design I would really like to see their take on some more traditional fantasy creatures this time.
I'm sure this is going to be blasphemy to some of you, but I'm going to be completely honest, I wouldn't really call those games revolutionary either. It's not like it's stuff that had never been done before, it was a marrying of a number of elements, both unique to From and not that made those games special, especially in comparison to the wider landscape. But a lot of the elements were there within From's games and the industry well prior to Dark Souls or Demon's Souls. Which I would say is the same situation here.

It's hard to truly innovate within a genre when it's gone on for so long, because after a certain point, just about everything has been done to some extent or another. Fantasy is one of the oldest genres of, really anything created by humans and fantasy games have been around for about as long as video games have existed. There have been hundreds upon hundreds of fantasy games both similar to eachother and radically different, long before Demon's Souls even rolled around and the same goes 100 fold for fantasy art or stories with the roots of what we call consider to be fantasy now dating back over a thousand years.

So it's hard to really call anything truly revolutionary, even in terms of effects and influence, the realistic scope of Dark Souls' influence on game design has been fairly limited beyond people likening "hard thing = dark souls". There are a handful of indie and AA copycats and a couple AA games will cite it as an influence, but beyond that it's influence has been more cultural than tangible.

So when speaking in terms of aspects of world design, art and game design, especially in a genre as well trodden as fantasy is across all mediums of art, it's near impossible to say that anything now is truly "revolutionary", (ex: involving or causing a complete or dramatic change.). Because again, it's more that the sum of its parts come together to create a greater whole, especially when viewed in the context of the landscape at that time, which had largely given into chasing western AAA gaming trends, even in Japan, more so than the fact that anything it did was truly groundbreaking. Which sort of then goes back into its cultural influence vs tangible influence, because I think it had far more influence as a symbol of "rebellion" against chasing AAA trends than it really did as a game in and of itself.

But it's not really like Dark/Demon's Souls truly created a genre like Id software did with FPS's and Wolfenstien/Doom where they were doing something that was never done before. From just continued to iterate what they had already been doing with stuff like Kings Field while adding in new elements. For me I kind of see the souls games as a union of Zelda, metroidvanias and western fantasy RPGs mixed with From's own proclivities, but they did it well and it resonated with people. It was something familiar but also unique enough to stand up on its own and I'd say they exist as sort of a spiritual cousin to the aforementioned rather than being a radical paradigm shift.

So in the case of Elden Ring I would argue that it's the next step in that sort of lineage, maybe not as big of a jump from Kings Field to Demon's Souls but as a whole, a bigger jump than Demon's Souls to Dark Souls. But I wouldn't say that any of them have really revolutionized the gaming landscape or changed the way people approached fantasy games as a whole as like I said, in this day and age that's incredibly difficult if not near impossible to do.
 

Rhodan

Member
Feb 8, 2020
167
Cheeky little reveal there, Omni. I recall interviews with From where they stated the Wolf AI (actually circling you, gathering in packs before attacking) was something new they created for Ariandel and things moving forward.
 

Solnatt

Member
Feb 16, 2020
68
Omni are you personally a fan of the music from dark souls 3 and or sekiro? Though the genre of the games cannot be changed a substantial amount, I believe that the evolution of the music in these games has come a long way from 1 to 3 and then to sekiro and that the potential for change is quite large.
 

Deleted member 2229

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,740
Omni are you personally a fan of the music from dark souls 3 and or sekiro? Though the genre of the games cannot be changed a substantial amount, I believe that the evolution of the music in these games has come a long way from 1 to 3 and then to sekiro and that the potential for change is quite large.
This will also be blasphemous to some of you but
when playing games in general I'm not usually paying attention to the music so I don't really have anything interesting or insightful to say opinions wise regarding it
I don't really know what it is but unless it's like a standout main theme or something that's really present, then I don't really pay too much attention. Though in the last few months I did grab myself a nice headset and I've been using that when playing games and it's made a huge difference for how much I actually pay attention to and appreciate the music in games. But when it's coming through the TV it's usually just in one ear and out the other. I've occasionally listened to a small handful of it on my own time, but overall it's one of those things that I've never really gotten around to paying much mind to, not for any particular reason but just because it's not really been a priority of mine. But perhaps sometimes soon I'll sit down with all the OST's and just listen to them on their own and see if i form any opinions.
 

Vivaladragon

Member
May 5, 2020
196
I starting doing a run of DSr with a faith build but it just became another Zweihander run...

damn it Miyazaki why did you make It so fun to flatten enemies with a big hunk of iron?
 

Deleted member 2229

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,740
I starting doing a run of DSr with a faith build but it just became another Zweihander run...

damn it Miyazaki why did you make It so fun to flatten enemies with a big hunk of iron?
DS1 Zweihander is so broken and I love it. The fact that it completely breaks major boss fights like super smough and Nito is pretty hilarious, on top of the fact that it does also literally flatten enemies. Started my love for ridiculously large weapons in these games.
 

Grudy

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,643
So it's hard to really call anything truly revolutionary, even in terms of effects and influence, the realistic scope of Dark Souls' influence on game design has been fairly limited beyond people likening "hard thing = dark souls". There are a handful of indie and AA copycats and a couple AA games will cite it as an influence, but beyond that it's influence has been more cultural than tangible.
I only gotta disagree with this part. You're right to say that Dark Souls was most associated with its difficulty, particularly in the mainstream sphere, but I do think devs in particular saw more to it than that. Personally speaking, the game came out at a time when most games were still veering in the direction of cinematic experiences and the huge influence of call of duty's rocketing success was still in motion, even if to a lesser degree. Every major game felt like it had to include auto-recovery, linear cinematic design, and an awful lot of hand-holding and spoon feeding. I only started to feel this trend decline towards the end of the 7th generation, and I would say Dark Souls played its part in this larger shift. It's reliance on subtlety and interactions of its systems together into a larger package has a universal appeal in every medium, and its success was a clear signal to devs and publishers that it is desirable, when at the time of Demon's Souls release it was unthinkable to approach this sort of design in AAA games.

I think saying it revolutionized the fantasy genre at large is a bit ridiculous considering the amount of history you have there. It's just the current poster-boy for it in gaming.
 

Deleted member 2229

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I only gotta disagree with this part. You're right to say that Dark Souls was most associated with its difficulty, particularly in the mainstream sphere, but I do think devs in particular saw more to it than that. Personally speaking, the game came out at a time when most games were still veering in the direction of cinematic experiences and the huge influence of call of duty's rocketing success was still in motion, even if to a lesser degree. Every major game felt like it had to include auto-recovery, linear cinematic design, and an awful lot of hand-holding and spoon feeding. I only started to feel this trend decline towards the end of the 7th generation, and I would say Dark Souls played its part in this larger shift. It's reliance on subtlety and interactions of its systems together into a larger package has a universal appeal in every medium, and its success was a clear signal to devs and publishers that it is desirable, when at the time of Demon's Souls release it was unthinkable to approach this sort of design in AAA games.

I think saying it revolutionized the fantasy genre at large is a bit ridiculous considering the amount of history you have there. It's just the current poster-boy for it in gaming.
But, you're not really disagreeing with me, that's the same point I made. The thing is, none of those design elements are really unique to Dark Souls or From, It's just stuff that used to be common place in an older class of games that has since been abandoned as things like Uncharted became popular. Dark Souls was more influential as a symbol that people still want and appreciate that older style of game design. But few games have actually adopted or emulated any real design elements of Dark Souls meaningfully.

You have Fallen Order and, to a minor extent Darksiders 3, but the rest have just been a handful small AA or indie studios following in From's footsteps.
 

culchulach

Member
Apr 2, 2020
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So in the case of Elden Ring I would argue that it's the next step in that sort of lineage, maybe not as big of a jump from Kings Field to Demon's Souls but as a whole, a bigger jump than Demon's Souls to Dark Souls. But I wouldn't say that any of them have really revolutionized the gaming landscape or changed the way people approached fantasy games as a whole as like I said, in this day and age that's incredibly difficult if not near impossible to do.

this little thing right here that you said means everything .... and well it really has been a theme from your very first Elden Ring post that has been hyping me along .... because ... Dark Souls was huge for me as a gaming experience. Maybe not a revolutionary game but for me it was a revolutionary experience. So big so that the coming of Dark Souls 2 was probably the most hyped I've ever been for ... anything. Clearly a recipe for disappointment I know. But I've loved every FROM game and played them a ton including Dark Souls 2 which was probably the FROM game I've put most hours into in fact. But, ... I can't help but feel that Elden Ring could be that game that finally does it ... by it I mean fulfilling that crazy hype I had for Dark Souls 2 ... ok maybe not but I think it WILL be more than Dark 2 and 3 which were great sequels and added nice tweaks and updates to Dark Souls and demons .... AND WILL be more than bloodborne and Sekiro which were amazing experience of very familiar formula .... Elden Ring will instead be that evolution I've been waiting for .... So yes indeed that little thing you said means everything .... can you tell I hang on every word? Maybe a little too much .... I love FROM games a lot.... I believe this is the evolution I've been pining for ...

Thanks Omni. I love all your posts ... please keep them coming ....
 

dieselgraves

Member
Apr 24, 2020
19
this little thing right here that you said means everything .... and well it really has been a theme from your very first Elden Ring post that has been hyping me along .... because ... Dark Souls was huge for me as a gaming experience. Maybe not a revolutionary game but for me it was a revolutionary experience. So big so that the coming of Dark Souls 2 was probably the most hyped I've ever been for ... anything. Clearly a recipe for disappointment I know. But I've loved every FROM game and played them a ton including Dark Souls 2 which was probably the FROM game I've put most hours into in fact. But, ... I can't help but feel that Elden Ring could be that game that finally does it ... by it I mean fulfilling that crazy hype I had for Dark Souls 2 ... ok maybe not but I think it WILL be more than Dark 2 and 3 which were great sequels and added nice tweaks and updates to Dark Souls and demons .... AND WILL be more than bloodborne and Sekiro which were amazing experience of very familiar formula .... Elden Ring will instead be that evolution I've been waiting for .... So yes indeed that little thing you said means everything .... can you tell I hang on every word? Maybe a little too much .... I love FROM games a lot.... I believe this is the evolution I've been pining for ...

Thanks Omni. I love all your posts ... please keep them coming ....
I would have to agree somewhat. But my hype comes from wanting to see how FROM is able to take their level design expertise open-world. I feel like this is the jump that Omni is referring to! Now perhaps we are just reading too much into it, but hearing something like that makes me very excited to think about all the possibilities that ER could bring to the table!!

ALSO, thanks Omni :) seeing you around and your enthusiasm about these games is keeping me from going hollow!