• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Deleted member 8752

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,122
Really cool of Microsoft to do this. If I were in charge, I'm not sure I'd have the foresight or generosity to do the same.

I still don't fully understand where they are taking their gaming brands and how it's going to be sustainable for them.

These pieces of generosity are coming in piecemeal and it's hard for me to understand the full picture of their plan for say.... a decade from now.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
I'm still waiting for confirmation that MCC will be win32 and not encrypted on Steam (hello Stinkles ???), but yeah, I've sent Spencer a Tweet to thank him for bringing Halo to other storefronts as well. That's a great move, and it increased my hope that Microsoft will do pc gaming right sooner or later.

I can only repeat what Phil said, which is that our intent is to make the PC game available to PC players, where and how they're playing. That doesn't mean a stripped out Linux build, but tbh we're not being cagey for the sake of it. Even Steam itself means building components to play nice with the store and its infrastructure. The same thing would be true of any new landing spot for the project.

It's not just a port - it's really a quite serious challenge to not only get the various components up and running on PC architecture at fidelity - but also properly translate some elements that were built with consoles in mind - and in a couple of cases, 4:3 SD content at the very root level of some of its original design principles.

Obviously over the years the MCC project, the Anniversary releases and B/C have pushed the games closer to what the minimum expectations for PC are - but things that weren't there originally, like aspect ratio, FOV, key mapping have very serious design implications. At the HCS finals this weekend folks were asking why we announced it "so far from launch" - and the reality is that it's such a large challenge to do it right that it would have been reasonable to think of it as a normal game announcement - which can sometimes be years out (it will be here a lot faster than that - just pointing out the normal chronology of game announcements as an example).

We've already done a great deal and the team is really excited about the potential of not just putting the games on the new platform, but doing both the games and the PC gamers justice too so that people end up hopefully with the game they've imagined or hoped for this whole time and that it feels right as a Halo game and as a PC game.

That's why the answer to "will there be cross-play" is still not cut and dry - it's certainly possible technically - so the testing and tuning will have to include questions about matchmaking, controller vs M/KB, populations (and their respective tastes), security, etc etc. The easy answer would be "yes options rite?" but again we don't want to compromise the PC version to do that. Flighting will obviously help us shake out lots of technical issues, but it will also provide tons of user play style feedback - and the fuzzy subjective stuff that emerges from how PC players use it.

If you've played the H5 Forge MP component on PC you'll also notice that the console origin of that suite means that on average, some wasd players feel that there's about one control function too many for natural setups and player movement - not an issue on controller because of the ability to use all the main triggers, bumpers, buttons and clicks. This is specific to H5 because of the increased mobility - but the original HCE - despite staring as a Mac title, was really Xbox specific and the design was crafted in tandem with the development of the OG Xbox controller. It's not just buttons, necessarily but also designer intent - so that's one of the less clear cut challenges to get right - making these games feel like they were built for PC from the getgo.

A lot of the audience will be Halo console players and fans, but there'll be folks new to the series too and we want it to show up well for them too without changing the fundamental core of each original game.

It's not rocket science, but it also kind of is a bit...


Also now I have to build a PC gaming rig. Which I haven't done in a while except at work.
 

elzeus

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,887
so the testing and tuning will have to include questions about matchmaking, controller vs M/KB, populations (and their respective tastes)
Thanks for not closing the door completely on cross-play, though it seems like Epic solved most of these issues with their Fortnite cross-play solution. Opt-in cross-play with queues by input and if you add kbm to the console version down the line those people would get matched up with PC by default. I noticed in one of the Halo blog updates that there would be IP masking added to matches, I'm assuming that was for security reasons? How hard would it be to have that functionality added to the OS party system? It's hard to be part of the community in any game when accepting an invite from a new player exposes you do a potential ddos attack.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
Thanks for not closing the door completely on cross-play, though it seems like Epic solved most of these issues with their cross-play solution. Opt-in cross-play with queues by input and if you add kbm to the console version down the line those people would also get matched up with PC as well. I noticed in one of the Halo blog updates that there would be IP masking added to matches, I'm assuming that was for security reasons? How hard would it be to have that functionality added to the OS party system? It's hard to be part of the community in any game when accepting an invite from a new player exposes you do a potential ddos attack.


TBH I'm not going to get into specifics for reasons outlined above, but also for a special reason: As a PC gamer, I'm basically your dad. I'll be all, "whoa is that a 486 DX? Does it have a DVD-R drive!? Have you heard about the new Power VR!?"
 

LewieP

Member
Oct 26, 2017
18,097
I can see why competitive crossplay is not a simple thing to implement, but how about campaign coop? That would be pretty fun, and would sidestep some of the issues that would be present in competitive multiplayer (since players with all control schemes would be fighting alongside each other, rather than against each other).

Not sure if this is something that you can talk about much yet, but split screen coop and perhaps even multi-monitor support for coop would be amazing on PC too.

Edit: and regarding Linux, whilst a native Linux version would be cool, even just doing testing with Proton to identify and perhaps resolve sources of incompatibility would be great for Linux users.
 

Braaier

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
13,237
Good work, Phil! I look forward to what else he has planned for the PC. Good things ahead I'm sure
 

Deleted member 28523

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 31, 2017
2,911
Gabe's been answering quite a few emails recently. The anticipation for GDC must be strong over at Valve HQ.
 

Zonal Hertz

Banned
Jun 13, 2018
1,079
Phil Spencer and the team are doing gods work.

He keeps saying and doing the right things. Honestly the swing in public perception of Xbox since he took over has been huge if you consider what a state things were in when he took over.
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
61,016
Would be cool to see Steam and MS to join forces. Steam sees competition from other stores more and more. Even from MS abit.
But if the competition results in that Steam is gonna work with MS more and MS sees a opportunity to work with Steam more. I am all for it.
 

Mifec

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,744
Would be cool to see Steam and MS to join forces. Steam sees competition from other stores more and more. Even from MS abit.
But if the competition results in that Steam is gonna work with MS more and MS sees a opportunity to work with Steam more. I am all for it.
I don't think Steam and Valve leadership are against MS publishing games on their platform but you have to remember the reason for them existing and some of their initiatives was because they disagreed with the way MS was doing things at the time.
 

Akelisrain

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,416
Bel Air MD
I am hoping this game gets a certified seal of approval for Proton. ;) My friends still keep trying to talk me into returning to Windows.
 

Ge0force

Self-requested ban.
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
5,265
Belgium
I can only repeat what Phil said, which is that our intent is to make the PC game available to PC players, where and how they're playing.

I'm glad to hear this! No doubt you're aware that PC gamers like to tweak, mod and improve games to their own liking, and I'm sure you'll figure something out to allow this without compromising the safety and online experience for other players.

You see, the community has done wonderful things with classics like S.T.A.L.K.E.R., Diablo and Doom, and no doubt the Halo games may inspire them to do so as well. I mean, how cool would it be if the community would be able to improve these games even further with upcoming features like procedural texture enhancements and ray tracing? I'm not sure how you're looking at community content and modifications from a developers point of view, but I'd image you'd love to see this happening as well. Only thing you need to do is not locking them out from doing so. :)

About the minimum expectations of pc gamers: Durante once wrote a great article about this. Gears 4 already did an excellent job with this (except for the uwp/encryption, but that wasn't their decision) so perhaps TC can assist you in fine-tuning this?

Cross-play with Xbox would be nice, but it should always be optional. I'm not a fan of controller vs mouse cross-play for a game like Halo. Even when playing with mouse + kb, the aim-assist of controller players feel a bit like cheating to me.

I can only image how hard it is to turn these old console-focused games into a decent PC game. I have loads of respect for you and your studio for making this work. Good luck with the development, I'm really looking forward to the result!
 
Last edited:

Cecil

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,447
This is how it should be done. Make it available on your Store, and other ones that people request, and let them chose.
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
61,016
I don't think Steam and Valve leadership are against MS publishing games on their platform but you have to remember the reason for them existing and some of their initiatives was because they disagreed with the way MS was doing things at the time.
I think they are maybe more open now to do things because of the competition. That they maybe see a joined forces with MS as a good step to do now wich maybe a couple of years ago they maybe didnt want to.
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
I think they are maybe more open now to do things because of the competition. That they maybe see a joined forces with MS as a good step to do now wich maybe a couple of years ago they maybe didnt want to.

Valve didn't join forces with MS lol. Valve has been always open, anyone can publish their games on Steam (or at least since 2017).
 

Ge0force

Self-requested ban.
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
5,265
Belgium
Would be cool to see Steam and MS to join forces. Steam sees competition from other stores more and more. Even from MS abit.
But if the competition results in that Steam is gonna work with MS more and MS sees a opportunity to work with Steam more. I am all for it.

Agreed. No doubt this would benefit both Valve and MS, and us as gamers as well.
 

Gevin

Member
Nov 2, 2017
1,823
I can only repeat what Phil said, which is that our intent is to make the PC game available to PC players, where and how they're playing. That doesn't mean a stripped out Linux build, but tbh we're not being cagey for the sake of it. Even Steam itself means building components to play nice with the store and its infrastructure. The same thing would be true of any new landing spot for the project.

It's not just a port - it's really a quite serious challenge to not only get the various components up and running on PC architecture at fidelity - but also properly translate some elements that were built with consoles in mind - and in a couple of cases, 4:3 SD content at the very root level of some of its original design principles.

Obviously over the years the MCC project, the Anniversary releases and B/C have pushed the games closer to what the minimum expectations for PC are - but things that weren't there originally, like aspect ratio, FOV, key mapping have very serious design implications. At the HCS finals this weekend folks were asking why we announced it "so far from launch" - and the reality is that it's such a large challenge to do it right that it would have been reasonable to think of it as a normal game announcement - which can sometimes be years out (it will be here a lot faster than that - just pointing out the normal chronology of game announcements as an example).

We've already done a great deal and the team is really excited about the potential of not just putting the games on the new platform, but doing both the games and the PC gamers justice too so that people end up hopefully with the game they've imagined or hoped for this whole time and that it feels right as a Halo game and as a PC game.

That's why the answer to "will there be cross-play" is still not cut and dry - it's certainly possible technically - so the testing and tuning will have to include questions about matchmaking, controller vs M/KB, populations (and their respective tastes), security, etc etc. The easy answer would be "yes options rite?" but again we don't want to compromise the PC version to do that. Flighting will obviously help us shake out lots of technical issues, but it will also provide tons of user play style feedback - and the fuzzy subjective stuff that emerges from how PC players use it.

If you've played the H5 Forge MP component on PC you'll also notice that the console origin of that suite means that on average, some wasd players feel that there's about one control function too many for natural setups and player movement - not an issue on controller because of the ability to use all the main triggers, bumpers, buttons and clicks. This is specific to H5 because of the increased mobility - but the original HCE - despite staring as a Mac title, was really Xbox specific and the design was crafted in tandem with the development of the OG Xbox controller. It's not just buttons, necessarily but also designer intent - so that's one of the less clear cut challenges to get right - making these games feel like they were built for PC from the getgo.

A lot of the audience will be Halo console players and fans, but there'll be folks new to the series too and we want it to show up well for them too without changing the fundamental core of each original game.

It's not rocket science, but it also kind of is a bit...


Also now I have to build a PC gaming rig. Which I haven't done in a while except at work.

Thanks for this post, it's great to know you guys are really passionate about doing this and kept in mind a lot of details and nuances and how to do it properly

533059779090841650.gif
 
Oct 17, 2018
1,779
I'm guessing by default Controller and KB+M players won't play against each other in ranked playlists, but I'm hoping there's an option to play against/with players using different input if we want to.
 

Lashley

<<Tag Here>>
Member
Oct 25, 2017
59,985
I can only repeat what Phil said, which is that our intent is to make the PC game available to PC players, where and how they're playing. That doesn't mean a stripped out Linux build, but tbh we're not being cagey for the sake of it. Even Steam itself means building components to play nice with the store and its infrastructure. The same thing would be true of any new landing spot for the project.

It's not just a port - it's really a quite serious challenge to not only get the various components up and running on PC architecture at fidelity - but also properly translate some elements that were built with consoles in mind - and in a couple of cases, 4:3 SD content at the very root level of some of its original design principles.

Obviously over the years the MCC project, the Anniversary releases and B/C have pushed the games closer to what the minimum expectations for PC are - but things that weren't there originally, like aspect ratio, FOV, key mapping have very serious design implications. At the HCS finals this weekend folks were asking why we announced it "so far from launch" - and the reality is that it's such a large challenge to do it right that it would have been reasonable to think of it as a normal game announcement - which can sometimes be years out (it will be here a lot faster than that - just pointing out the normal chronology of game announcements as an example).

We've already done a great deal and the team is really excited about the potential of not just putting the games on the new platform, but doing both the games and the PC gamers justice too so that people end up hopefully with the game they've imagined or hoped for this whole time and that it feels right as a Halo game and as a PC game.

That's why the answer to "will there be cross-play" is still not cut and dry - it's certainly possible technically - so the testing and tuning will have to include questions about matchmaking, controller vs M/KB, populations (and their respective tastes), security, etc etc. The easy answer would be "yes options rite?" but again we don't want to compromise the PC version to do that. Flighting will obviously help us shake out lots of technical issues, but it will also provide tons of user play style feedback - and the fuzzy subjective stuff that emerges from how PC players use it.

If you've played the H5 Forge MP component on PC you'll also notice that the console origin of that suite means that on average, some wasd players feel that there's about one control function too many for natural setups and player movement - not an issue on controller because of the ability to use all the main triggers, bumpers, buttons and clicks. This is specific to H5 because of the increased mobility - but the original HCE - despite staring as a Mac title, was really Xbox specific and the design was crafted in tandem with the development of the OG Xbox controller. It's not just buttons, necessarily but also designer intent - so that's one of the less clear cut challenges to get right - making these games feel like they were built for PC from the getgo.

A lot of the audience will be Halo console players and fans, but there'll be folks new to the series too and we want it to show up well for them too without changing the fundamental core of each original game.

It's not rocket science, but it also kind of is a bit...


Also now I have to build a PC gaming rig. Which I haven't done in a while except at work.
This is a breath of fresh air. Thank You.
 

sprinkles

Member
Oct 25, 2017
517
I'm still waiting for confirmation that MCC will be win32 and not encrypted on Steam (hello Stinkles ???), but yeah, I've sent Spencer a Tweet to thank him for bringing Halo to other storefronts as well. That's a great move, and it increased my hope that Microsoft will do pc gaming right sooner or later.
When Halo is playable with Proton on Linux, I will be convinced that Microsoft finally takes PC seriously.
 

wwm0nkey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,575
We all know Halo MCC is going to sell stupid well on Steam, MS probably knows this to. Rather than giving us a "test" game they are giving us a for sure hit that will help justify more of their games hitting the Steam platform. However they will beef up their gamepass selection on PC so people have an option on how they want to consume MS games and where.
 

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
17,811
Also now I have to build a PC gaming rig. Which I haven't done in a while except at work.

I think you'll like it, modern PCs are a great platform to play games on. I also have a small request as a Steam Controller user: if you have the time, please consider making a native profile for it. Thanks for replying and good luck!
 

CalamityPixel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,810
Can I just say how odd it is we've entered a timeline where Halo and Gabe Newell share a thread title. It'll be even weirder when it eventually gets round to Ninty
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
I didnt say they joined forces?
You did say they're more open to work with MS now, while in reality they're as much open now as they were in the past*, any publisher/dev can release their games on steam.

*Probably less open now if you consider hentai games "controversies".
 

karnage10

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,503
Portugal
I can only repeat what Phil said, which is that our intent is to make the PC game available to PC players, where and how they're playing. That doesn't mean a stripped out Linux build, but tbh we're not being cagey for the sake of it. Even Steam itself means building components to play nice with the store and its infrastructure. The same thing would be true of any new landing spot for the project.

It's not just a port - it's really a quite serious challenge to not only get the various components up and running on PC architecture at fidelity - but also properly translate some elements that were built with consoles in mind - and in a couple of cases, 4:3 SD content at the very root level of some of its original design principles.

Obviously over the years the MCC project, the Anniversary releases and B/C have pushed the games closer to what the minimum expectations for PC are - but things that weren't there originally, like aspect ratio, FOV, key mapping have very serious design implications. At the HCS finals this weekend folks were asking why we announced it "so far from launch" - and the reality is that it's such a large challenge to do it right that it would have been reasonable to think of it as a normal game announcement - which can sometimes be years out (it will be here a lot faster than that - just pointing out the normal chronology of game announcements as an example).

We've already done a great deal and the team is really excited about the potential of not just putting the games on the new platform, but doing both the games and the PC gamers justice too so that people end up hopefully with the game they've imagined or hoped for this whole time and that it feels right as a Halo game and as a PC game.

That's why the answer to "will there be cross-play" is still not cut and dry - it's certainly possible technically - so the testing and tuning will have to include questions about matchmaking, controller vs M/KB, populations (and their respective tastes), security, etc etc. The easy answer would be "yes options rite?" but again we don't want to compromise the PC version to do that. Flighting will obviously help us shake out lots of technical issues, but it will also provide tons of user play style feedback - and the fuzzy subjective stuff that emerges from how PC players use it.

If you've played the H5 Forge MP component on PC you'll also notice that the console origin of that suite means that on average, some wasd players feel that there's about one control function too many for natural setups and player movement - not an issue on controller because of the ability to use all the main triggers, bumpers, buttons and clicks. This is specific to H5 because of the increased mobility - but the original HCE - despite staring as a Mac title, was really Xbox specific and the design was crafted in tandem with the development of the OG Xbox controller. It's not just buttons, necessarily but also designer intent - so that's one of the less clear cut challenges to get right - making these games feel like they were built for PC from the getgo.

A lot of the audience will be Halo console players and fans, but there'll be folks new to the series too and we want it to show up well for them too without changing the fundamental core of each original game.

It's not rocket science, but it also kind of is a bit...


Also now I have to build a PC gaming rig. Which I haven't done in a while except at work.
i Have halos for xbox 360 but i have "abandoned" the console space because of both being inferior to PC and the high costs.
I just want to say a really really big thank you for bringing halo to PC now i can replay some of my favorites campaigns!

A bit of an abusive question since you are from "microsoft" do you know the price ballpark for halo MCC? will it be 60-70€/game? (ignore this question if you can't answer)
 

Phrost

Member
Dec 8, 2018
181
I just wanted to chime in about something else. I'm a PC gamer, haven't owned a console in years. I'm excited for MCC, especially since it's coming to Steam. I know you guys sell Halo 5 for the Xbox but afaik, it won't be included in MCC on Steam. Any chance that changes in the future?
 

wwm0nkey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,575
I just wanted to chime in about something else. I'm a PC gamer, haven't owned a console in years. I'm excited for MCC, especially since it's coming to Steam. I know you guys sell Halo 5 for the Xbox but afaik, it won't be included in MCC on Steam. Any chance that changes in the future?
It's possible they add it in later or just do a separate release.
 

Deleted member 10737

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
49,774
phil seems like a very nice guy and a super positive force in the industry, very happy a guy like him is in a position to do some positive things
 
Oct 26, 2017
19,758
Microsoft next system better rock my socks off. I've purchased and then sold off my Xbox One this generation TWICE now because of their game seleciton (lack of). However, everything about what Microsoft is doing for gaming lately, and what Sony isn't -coughcrossplaycough- has me itching to throw money at Microsoft's face. Just get me a console with games, for the love of Thor. I want to support you so much.
 

Smash Kirby

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 7, 2017
4,069
TBH I'm not going to get into specifics for reasons outlined above, but also for a special reason: As a PC gamer, I'm basically your dad. I'll be all, "whoa is that a 486 DX? Does it have a DVD-R drive!? Have you heard about the new Power VR!?"
I hope to see you start making Halo related dad jokes now. Is there a way to get Fable 3 relisted on Steam with the games for windows removed?
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
61,016
You did say they're more open to work with MS now, while in reality they're as much open now as they were in the past*, any publisher/dev can release their games on steam.

*Probably less open now if you consider hentai games "controversies".
Yes i said they are more open to have a closer relationship with MS and the otherway arround. Not they already joined forces.
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
Yes i said they are more open to have a closer relationship with MS and the otherway arround. Not they already joined forces.

I'm not seeing this closer relationship, at least not in this thread. Valve doesn't stop anyone from publishing on Steam.
 

Deleted member 15440

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,191
Really cool of Microsoft to do this. If I were in charge, I'm not sure I'd have the foresight or generosity to do the same.

I still don't fully understand where they are taking their gaming brands and how it's going to be sustainable for them.

These pieces of generosity are coming in piecemeal and it's hard for me to understand the full picture of their plan for say.... a decade from now.
how is it "generous" of them to sell a product (presumably for $60) on the biggest PC game store?

it's also a vector to get more people to sign up for xbox live accounts
 

StereoVSN

Member
Nov 1, 2017
13,620
Eastern US
Great job by MS here. I remember not that long ago how Tim Sweeney was complaining about MS, UWP and Windows Store lockout.

Oh how things have changed (Store and UWP still suck but optics have changed completely).
 

s3ltz3r

Banned
Nov 12, 2017
1,149
Well, Phil Spencer & Co have to fall in line and follow Satya Nadella's vision for Microsoft. This falls into that vision.

Nadella has and is really turning things around for MS and Xbox.