GDC Rescinds Nolan Bushnell’s Pioneer Award. MOD EDIT: Read OP

MattWilsonCSS

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IMO It's pretty obvious that gamergate failed to achieve much of anything, since there are more women in the industry than ever before. Do you think the game industry is full of abusers that aren't being talked about? Who do you think might be the Weinstein of my industry if you had to guess. Which studio is turning a blind eye to harassment?
Gamergate still exists and it is still active. I think the game industry HAS abusers in it, not that it's FULL OF abusers. We already know of Brad Wardell who is still around and still an ass. We also know if the harassment at IGN, the harassment from Polygon's Nick Robinson. If you want to pretend that this doesn't exist in the industry just because people haven't been outed yet, that's your call.

As far as turning a blind eye, Nintendo did not stick up for Allison Rapp when she was targetted by Gamergate. They fired her and left her to the wolves. They may have had to make a move based on the moonlighting thing that was revealed from the doxxing, but the way they went about it was so wrong. They were silent during the harassment, let her go, then let out a whimpering burp of a response that wouldn't even name Gamergate.
 

Deleted member 18568

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Why did developers support Gamergate, then and now?

Also I don't know if you've seen what's going on at places like Quantic Dream, but the ultra defensiveness is kinda silly. Tech industries are extremely toxic. Combine that with horrible working conditions and I don't think it's a stretch at all.



One derives conclusions from evidence. When more or different evidence is presented, one changes said conclusions. That's logical. Fencesitting when presented with shittiness because you're a fan is not. It's called bias.

Why don't you do your own research if your only goal is to criticize someone? I'm not a fan of Wu but she isn't lying when she talks about gamergate.



We s

1. That’s my point, thanks. Others jumped to condemn without enough information.


2. On Brianna Wu who started this:

“I fought trolls now give me money” isn’t a political platform. What is hers?

I strongly agree with your note about doing my own research. We all should. Hence, I searched for more information on the internet.

What I found hasn’t exactly filled me with confidence concerning her motives for starting this particular mini-mob.

And let’s not try and conflate this very specific point with straw men about other situations or other people or other studies or other industries.
 
Oct 30, 2017
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I am disappointed that this was all instigated by false information. Brianna Wu starts with “some facts”, then proceeds to type a list of things that are not facts.

Social media is a mistake. Shit like this makes the high-school level of gossip at my workplace appear Shakespearean in comparison.
Brianna Wu has always been an agenda driven instigator who couldn't care less about "facts", especially ones that don't fit her narrative.
 

stufte

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Why did developers support Gamergate, then and now?
Which devs supported gamergate?

Also I don't know if you've seen what's going on at places like Quantic Dream, but the ultra defensiveness is kinda silly. Tech industries are extremely toxic. Combine that with horrible working conditions and I don't think it's a stretch at all.
The tech industry is no different than most industries when it comes to shitty behavior, it's not Hollywood, but what is.
 

OrdinaryPrime

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“I fought trolls now give me money” isn’t a political platform. What is hers?

I strongly agree with your note about doing my own research. We all should. Hence, I searched for more information on the internet.

What I found hasn’t exactly filled me with confidence concerning her motives for starting this particular mini-mob.

And let’s not try and conflate this very specific point with straw men about other situations or other people or other studies or other industries.
I responded to a person who was saying that this stuff doesn't happen in the gaming industry and at this very moment there are harassment complaints at a development studio. How is that not relevant?

I honestly don't care what you think of Briana Wu, just the sheer laziness of asking people what you can criticize her for was sort of galling.
 

MattWilsonCSS

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Which devs supported gamergate?
Tim Soret of The Last Night. Warhorse the developers of Kingdom Come: Deliverance, Dennis Dyack of Silicon Knights and Eternal Darkness fame. Doug TenNapel of Armikrog and The Neverhood. The devs of Hatred. Huniepop's developer. The lead on Vanishing of Ethan Carter. I believe there are people at Daeadlic that supported GG. The creator of Orion Prelude. The creator of Epic Battle Fantasy (a jRPG that literally has a Nazi in it by the way!).
 

OrdinaryPrime

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Which devs supported gamergate?
http://thisisvideogames.com/gamergatewiki/index.php/Support_List#Developers from their very own wiki. Let me guess, next you're going to dismiss this list for some arbitrary reason.

The tech industry is no different than most industries when it comes to shitty behavior, it's not Hollywood, but what is.
This shit happens EVERYWHERE. Stop acting like Hollywood is somehow this aberration or something.
 

Deleted member 18568

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I responded to a person who was saying that this stuff doesn't happen in the gaming industry and at this very moment there are harassment complaints at a development studio. How is that not relevant?

I honestly don't care what you think of Briana Wu, just the sheer laziness of asking people what you can criticize her for was sort of galling.
I agree it was lazy to ask others for more information in a discussion forum, rather than do my own research or, maybe better yet, make a knee jerk reaction without any context.

And that’s quite a leap to assume I’m asking people to tell me what “I can criticize her for” when I wrote no such thing. You know a side’s running out of things to say when they start making things up. Trump does it too, and so did Brianna Wu apparently.

Anyway, I did my research and it was worth the time. The source of this is very clear now.
 

stufte

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Gamergate still exists and it is still active. I think the game industry HAS abusers in it, not that it's FULL OF abusers. We already know of Brad Wardell who is still around and still an ass. We also know if the harassment at IGN, the harassment from Polygon's Nick Robinson. If you want to pretend that this doesn't exist in the industry just because people haven't been outed yet, that's your call.

As far as turning a blind eye, Nintendo did not stick up for Allison Rapp when she was targetted by Gamergate. They fired her and left her to the wolves. They may have had to make a move based on the moonlighting thing that was revealed from the doxxing, but the way they went about it was so wrong. They were silent during the harassment, let her go, then let out a whimpering burp of a response that wouldn't even name Gamergate.
What did Brad Wardell do?

RE: Ign, Polygon, game journalists are NOT "in the industry". They cover the industry.

Nintendo absolutely made the move to fire her based on her side job. It's pretty incredible to suggest anything else.
 

Fredrik

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There’s one side: people who were there, including plenty of women.

And then a second, revisionist side clearly sparked by a political activist and fueled by a disingenous association with a genuine social movement 40 years later.

Don’t fall for it.
I know but there is always the possiblity that there is a silent type present as well who may think things are inappropriate but never dare to speak up about it, especially in these types of scenarios. I think we've all experienced something similar some time in our lives, that situation where you're thinking "Should I say something? Or maybe it isn't worth making a fuss out of it?". But Wu's accusations seems to be highly exaggerated only to fuel her agenda, she's definitely not 100% trustworthy going by how she interpreted the situations she talked about. Personally I think Nolan should get the award, it's a real shame that GDC backed off that easily, if Nolan can't get this award then the industry can just stop giving out awards all together, I wasn't there at the Atari era but I know how incredibly important it was for the history of gaming, it's really unfortunate that the current heated political climate can take away all that in a whim just like that.
 

stufte

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http://thisisvideogames.com/gamergatewiki/index.php/Support_List#Developers from their very own wiki. Let me guess, next you're going to dismiss this list for some arbitrary reason.



This shit happens EVERYWHERE. Stop acting like Hollywood is somehow this aberration or something.
Sorry, when I say "devs" I mean studios. Of course I know there are individual game developers who support gamergate (for either their treatment of women, or "muh ethics"). The list of studios though, that's a pretty sad and (aside from running with scissors to a certain extent) aren't at all notable.

Hollywood IS an aberration.
 

MattWilsonCSS

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What did Brad Wardell do?
He created a very toxic working environment in many ways, including sexual harassment, bringing BEES into the workplace despite employees' bee allergies, and being a general sexist asshole in general:

E-mail messages included in the records go back as far as March, 2008, and include a link to a sexually explicit YouTube video, a comment that Miseta was chosen to go to a conference "not just because you're 'hot'," and a 100-question 'purity test' that he asked her to take and then send him her score from. The purity test includes questions like, "Have you engaged in group sex?," 'Have you engaged in intercourse with an unconscious person, while conscious?," and, "Have you had anal intercourse?"

Witness depositions included in the case documents refer to multiple comments from Wardell to female employees about their breast and bra sizes, and one incident where he asked Miseta to attend a media tour because "[her] nipples look better on TV."
In an email he wrote "I am an inappropriate, sexist, vulgar, and embarrassing person and I'm not inclined to change my behavior. If this is a problem, you will need to find another job." in response to complaints. And also said that sexist jokes were okay because he likes Family Guy and Robot Chicken.

This is the CEO of an AA studio, makers of the Galactic Civilization series, Ashes of the Singularity, Offworld Trading Company. Not just some indie person but a significant studio.
 

Garf02

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Gamergate still exists and it is still active. I think the game industry HAS abusers in it, not that it's FULL OF abusers. We already know of Brad Wardell who is still around and still an ass. We also know if the harassment at IGN, the harassment from Polygon's Nick Robinson. If you want to pretend that this doesn't exist in the industry just because people haven't been outed yet, that's your call.

As far as turning a blind eye, Nintendo did not stick up for Allison Rapp when she was targetted by Gamergate. They fired her and left her to the wolves. They may have had to make a move based on the moonlighting thing that was revealed from the doxxing, but the way they went about it was so wrong. They were silent during the harassment, let her go, then let out a whimpering burp of a response that wouldn't even name Gamergate.
But she was fired cause of the sode job, people can argue it only came to light cause of GG and but ultimately Nintendo had a valid argument for ger termination.

What was the other option?
"It has come to our attention you are doing This side stuff and that goes against your contract, so normally we wouldt terminate your contract, but cuase the people that brought it to light are literall human scum, then we will turn a blind eye to it"??
 

OrdinaryPrime

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Sorry, when I say "devs" I mean studios. Of course I know there are individual game developers who support gamergate (for either their treatment of women, or "muh ethics"). The list of studios though, that's a pretty sad and (aside from running with scissors to a certain extent) aren't at all notable.

Hollywood IS an aberration.
Ah right. Because they're not notable it doesn't matter. How predictable!

No it fuckin isn't. Misogyny and abuse is rife everywhere. Everywhere. In my industry. In yours. All over the world. Stop taking it personally, no one is calling you an abuser or a misogynist.
 

MattWilsonCSS

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But she was fired cause of the sode job, people can argue it only came to light cause of GG and but ultimately Nintendo had a valid argument for ger termination.

What was the other option?
"It has come to our attention you are doing This side stuff and that goes against your contract, so normally we wouldt terminate your contract, but cuase the people that brought it to light are literall human scum, then we will turn a blind eye to it"??
I'll go into this a little more. The doxxing that revealed the moonlighting did not happen right away. The harassment came first, because of a delusion that Rapp was personally behind all of the censorship at the Nintendo Treehouse (GG's evidence for this conclusion was: she's a woman). Nintendo did and said nothing during this harassment. They didn't shield Rapp, they didn't speak out against it. They were silent and did nothing. And then when the moonlighting was revealed from the doxxing, they unceremoniously dumped her. It's not just about the firing but about the fact that they just didn't go to bat, they weren't even in the dugout, when the initial harassment started. I was pretty fucking pissed about the whole ordeal.

We're really getting off track from the initial story though. The point I'm trying to make is that GG is still a problem, the industry is still trying to pretend harassment isn't happening, and there ARE harassers in the industry, that continue to work in the industry. I'm familiar with Atari's history, and their party culture, and the flower-power era. I have no doubt that harassment went unchecked because just about everything went unchecked. No one at Atari seems to deny that Bushnell would call people over that were just doing their job and try to coerce them into the hot tub. And that even by itself is an abuse and exploitation of the position of power.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
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Wardell can simultaneously be a cock and a guy that knows what he's talking about over a wannabe politician obsessed with moon rocks. Wu being an unfortunate victim does not on its own make her a voice worth listening to.
 

Garf02

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I'll go into this a little more. The doxxing that revealed the moonlighting did not happen right away. The harassment came first, because of a delusion that Rapp was personally behind all of the censorship at the Nintendo Treehouse (GG's evidence for this conclusion was: she's a woman). Nintendo did and said nothing during this harassment. They didn't shield Rapp, they didn't speak out against it. They were silent and did nothing. And then when the moonlighting was revealed from the doxxing, they unceremoniously dumped her. It's not just about the firing but about the fact that they just didn't go to bat, they weren't even in the dugout, when the initial harassment started. I was pretty fucking pissed about the whole ordeal.
Not justifying what happend to her and maybe my mind is blurry on the details but didnt she lashed out back to people that complained about the localization Fire Emblem from, like saying she was happy so many people was mad about the removal of the head pat mini game for bonding??
 

stufte

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Ah right. Because they're not notable it doesn't matter. How predictable!

No it fuckin isn't. Misogyny and abuse is rife everywhere. Everywhere. In my industry. In yours. All over the world. Stop taking it personally, no one is calling you an abuser or a misogynist.
I suppose when this Bushnell thing is your metric for abuse in the industry, it can seem like shit is pretty fucking dire. But I digress, my original point was that gamergate has nothing to do with this and doesn't at all speak to what kind of industry this is.
 

Deleted member 18568

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Can you just imagine being a absolute pioneer in industry: taking the personal risks, working your ass off for years, not to mention hiring twice the number of women than we even see at studios today, and having those women speak highly of you for decades.

Only to have an attention seeker on Twitter 40 years later lead a campaign to see you publicly ostracized from the industry you created. And the GDC is sanctimoniously going along with it.

As a community posting on a video game forum, we should take a step back to reflect on that.
 

eddy

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What did Brad Wardell do?
I read the original sexual harassment suit at the time, and he came across as quite the little dictator. Was very surprised with how that ended. My conclusion at the time was that the employee was simply crushed under the legal firepower Wardell was able to bring to bear, especially as she may have done something quite unfortunate as a result of the situation (i.e what's in the counter-suit) described.

Unfortunately being in the right doesn't mean you'll win, or vice-versa. Got some experience in that domain.

Anyway, feeling mistreated by the press, which of course reported on the allegations, Wardell apparenty turned into a "GGer" fan-favourite when he criticized the press for doing their job.

People should actually read the complaint from Miseta, I think it helps to have seen how an actual sexual harassement complaint looks like at least once.



To tie this back to the topic at hand, it might be useful for the people who hang their hat on the "Nolan apologized, therefore admitted guilt" to consider this case, and the apology Miseta had to write.
 
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Deleted member 11413

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I'll go into this a little more. The doxxing that revealed the moonlighting did not happen right away. The harassment came first, because of a delusion that Rapp was personally behind all of the censorship at the Nintendo Treehouse (GG's evidence for this conclusion was: she's a woman). Nintendo did and said nothing during this harassment. They didn't shield Rapp, they didn't speak out against it. They were silent and did nothing. And then when the moonlighting was revealed from the doxxing, they unceremoniously dumped her. It's not just about the firing but about the fact that they just didn't go to bat, they weren't even in the dugout, when the initial harassment started. I was pretty fucking pissed about the whole ordeal.
The way Nintendo handles that situation was awful, they never should've treated Allison Rapp that way, they should've defended her. That said, that is kind of a topic for another thread as it has nothing to do with Atari or Nolan Bushnell.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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I'll go into this a little more. The doxxing that revealed the moonlighting did not happen right away. The harassment came first, because of a delusion that Rapp was personally behind all of the censorship at the Nintendo Treehouse (GG's evidence for this conclusion was: she's a woman). Nintendo did and said nothing during this harassment. They didn't shield Rapp, they didn't speak out against it. They were silent and did nothing. And then when the moonlighting was revealed from the doxxing, they unceremoniously dumped her. It's not just about the firing but about the fact that they just didn't go to bat, they weren't even in the dugout. I was pretty fucking pissed about the whole ordeal.
The Rapp situation is a mess all around and I can't fathom how anyone can see it as a black and white issue. First of all, it was a nonsensical role-reversal on both sides with her being more ideologically aligned with the people that were attacking her on things like censorship and fictional depictions. Were she to not be a victim, I'm all but certain the people that defended her would similarly be attacking her for her views.

Nintendo were between a rock and a hard place as I've posted at length in the old country, and based on some people I've spoken to, it was going to happen with or without the Moonlighting thing.
 

Garf02

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Can you just imagine being a absolute pioneer in industry: taking the personal risks, working your ass off for years, not to mention hiring twice the number of women than we even see at studios today, and having those women speak highly of you for decades.

Only to have an attention seeker on Twitter 40 years later lead a campaign to see you publicly ostracized from the industry you created. And the GDC is sanctimoniously going along with it.

As a community posting on a video game forum, we should take a step back to reflect on that.
Is not that wu rallied and mob againt the guy, is how easily and baseless GDC took those accusations as face value.

Is true that manu times voices are silence and not heard but when those that are able to be heard start to scream Wolf they are doing even more damage that good
 

Trojita

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Reading that article in the mod edit, GDC fucked up.

Brianna needs to stop spreading lies.
 

MattWilsonCSS

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Not justifying what happend to her and maybe my mind is blurry on the details but didnt she lashed out back to people that complained about the localization Fire Emblem from, like saying she was happy so many people was mad about the removal of the head pat mini game for bonding??
Last post I'll make on this, because it's pretty off topic now, but it was because she was an outspoken woman on social media, and Gamergate needed a target for their ire in the wake of both Tokyo Mirage Sessions' mild censorship and Fates' editing. Rapp had nothing to do with the censorship, she was in marketing. The harassment had gone on for months before the doxxing found her moonlighting and her VERY dubious thesis and accompanying tweets. She would post compilations of the kind of harassment she was getting, and Nintendo would continue to do and say nothing.

Like I'm not a fan of her whole viewpoints on child exploitation in media, it's a bit distressing. They could get her out because of her old tweets and moonlighting. What really bothered me most is that a woman employee at Nintendo was being harassed for months and Nintendo did nothing. Honestly, I think it will happen again. Something will get editted in the next Fire Emblem game for Switch, and there will be a new scapegoat, and they'll be harassed, and based on what happened to Rapp, they'll probably get no support from their company.
 

Trojita

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They should give the award to Nolan and Carol Shaw. I loved the tribute The Game Awards did for her this past year.
 

Garf02

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They should give the award to Nolan and Carol Shaw. I loved the tribute The Game Awards did for her this past year.
Im sure removing the award from the "unheard voices" and back to Nolan this year will only result in another backslash, but GDC should at least, same as they were public to shame him and kicking him of the award, apologize to him
 

PogChamp

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This was a terrible move.

Accusations were bright against him without merit and without evidence. No woman employee of Atari has ever made an accusation of impropriety against him, and every single woman who has spoken up about him has done so in defense and said that they were like family. Nolan Bushnell employed more women than just about any tech company out there way before diversity was a standard corporate goal. All of the women he employs who have spoken up have said he was a great boss and they never felt uncomfortable around him.

The 80s were a different environment and the culture of drugs and openness wouldn't fly today, but in order for sexual harassment to have occurred there has to have actually been an aggreived party. There is none. Atari employees were close friends, they married each other and had babies. It was an unorthodox company and run in an unorthodox way but there is no shred of evidence that any employee was made to feel unsafe or coerced into anything.

What the people going after Bushnell are doing is in fact infantilising these women pioneers in tech and taking away their own agency, reducing then to victims of crimes they say never happened.

Bushnell is a pioneer, he did more for women in tech than most, all the women who worked for him loved him like family and trusted him, you will not find a single negative word against him from any.

The accusations against him are baseless and spurious, based on out of context passages from decades old books, not bothering to find a single aggreived party, because apparently these women's opinions and experiences don't matter, they are props in a culture war to take down somebody, anybody to feel better about yourself in Twitter and further your political career.

Yes, I'm mad that people are trying to tear down Bushnell's good name but I'm actually more angry at the treatment of Atari's women employees whose words and experiences are completely ignored because they do not fit the narrative.
qft.

Very classy response from Bushnell, he would have been well within his rights to call bullshit.
 

Sir Blaming

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The GDC should just stop giving out the award in question to anyone else if this is what it takes to make them back out from it. Their award means nothing if they can't do their own investigation and just follow some probably real but unverified claims.

What a mess this is.
 

Deleted member 18568

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Is not that wu rallied and mob againt the guy, is how easily and baseless GDC took those accusations as face value.

Is true that manu times voices are silence and not heard but when those that are able to be heard start to scream Wolf they are doing even more damage that good
The GDC has culpability for throwing the founder of their industry under the bus, absolutely. Especially in such a knee jerk manner (literally overnight) with clearly zero critical thought. It was a cowardly move and they’ve lost my respect.

But the series of others who enabled this should also be called out. Otherwise we just don’t get better at this.

Megan Farokhmanesh and The Verge should be called out for presenting a reactionary clickbait article summarizing a bunch of tweets, with zero actual - you know - reporting. Something they do far too often to jump on a viral bandwagon before it’s over.

www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2018/1/30/16952294/nolan-bushnell-gdc-pioneer-award-2018

The dozen or so “game developer activists” who blindly went along with Brianna Wu’s charge via Twitter and tried to self-righteously shut down women at Atari — who were there no less — should be called out for their utter hypocracy. They claim to stand for women’s voices in gaming?

Truth be told I couldn’t care about a failed political wannabe, or random people on twitter, or the Verge. But I do care about people’s lack of indendent thought and judgement.

It’s a personal bug bear of mine because it’s also precisely the root of why Trump was elected. People need to think much more carefully about their echo chambers and I’ll continue to call it out on this forum and elsewhere as long as they’re mature enough to have me.
 

Fredrik

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Dumb question maybe, but even if there were some truths to it, why wouldn’t he still deserve the award? It’s not a personality and popularity award to my knowledge. I don’t understand why GDC lets the current heated political climate take away all the great things this man has done for this industry.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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Dumb question maybe, but even if there were some truths to it, why wouldn’t he still deserve the award? It’s not a personality and popularity award to my knowledge. I don’t understand why GDC lets the current heated political climate take away all the great things this man has done for this industry.
It's a Poisoned Challice now for whomever they decide to give it to, GDC might have inadvertently consigned its own award to irrelevancy.

And looking at the other recipients of awards, one of them has to bear responsibility for the shit-canning of Mass Effect: Andromeda, and the other has faced his own allegations of making inflammatory comments at a previous GDC conference.

So, yeah, no-one's perfect.
 
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Durante

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I just read the Medium article and I'm happy that someone actually appears to be applying journalistic practices to this issue.
 

okayfrog

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Dumb question maybe, but even if there were some truths to it, why wouldn’t he still deserve the award? It’s not a personality and popularity award to my knowledge. I don’t understand why GDC lets the current heated political climate take away all the great things this man has done for this industry.
There are a lot of debates over whether or not people's personal lives should taken into account when it comes to their artistic work. You can draw your own conclusions, but I don't think it's too hard to understand why GDC wouldn't want to be associated with someone who created a poor work environment for women. It basically says to women, "Yes, we know it's men like this that make it harder for you to get into the business, but we're still going to give him an award because he produced some cool stuff even if he was an asshole while doing it."
 

FF Seraphim

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So just catching up on this. Wow the GDC seriously messed up on this if the article is taken at face value and probably should of looked into the matter a little more than they did. If everything in the article is true, Brianna Wu seriously has hurt whatever movement she is trying to push by falsely accusing people and spreading misinformation. Who would believe her word now?
 
Oct 28, 2017
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I just read the Medium article and I'm happy that someone actually appears to be applying journalistic practices to this issue.
And yet, in this thread alone, certain people are trying to dismiss it because the author is a "gamergater" even though the statements are from the "victims" themselves, clearly defending Nolan from politically opportunistic snakes like Brianna Wu.

This tribal BS has to stop. It's making people stupid.
 

entremet

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And yet, in this thread alone, certain people are trying to dismiss it because the author is a "gamergater" even though the statements are from the "victims" themselves, clearly defending Nolan from politically opportunistic snakes like Brianna Wu.

This tribal BS has to stop. It's making people stupid.
When you're losing an argument, you just keep moving the goal posts. That's what happening.

He allegedly sexually harassed people. Debunked so far

Then he was accused in creating a hostile work environment. Debunked by women who worked there. Not only that Atari work values are even clearly ahead of most modern workplaces in progressiveness.

Then the guy that wrote the piece interviewing said employees, is now considered a gator so we should not take his work at face value, yet his reporting was based on 1st hand witnesses of the so called hostile work environment.

This is why inquiry and due process is so important.

Again my issue isn't in investigating any allegations. That should have happened after Wu made them.

My issue is that the GDC did a terrible job vetting the information and fell for the social media attack. They have an egg on their face. The court of Twitter is a horrible court.
 
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wesman

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And yet, in this thread alone, certain people are trying to dismiss it because the author is a "gamergater" even though the statements are from the "victims" themselves, clearly defending Nolan from politically opportunistic snakes like Brianna Wu.

This tribal BS has to stop. It's making people stupid.
I agree with your tribal remark entirely. Bracketing ourselves off into slivers and groups only divides us, and ultimately alienates one another. That's not unity, that's division. Thriving on differences, rather than uniting via similarities, will only create more resentment and distance.

We're all in this together.....
 

Fredrik

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Oct 27, 2017
9,003
There are a lot of debates over whether or not people's personal lives should taken into account when it comes to their artistic work. You can draw your own conclusions, but I don't think it's too hard to understand why GDC wouldn't want to be associated with someone who created a poor work environment for women. It basically says to women, "Yes, we know it's men like this that make it harder for you to get into the business, but we're still going to give him an award because he produced some cool stuff even if he was an asshole while doing it."
Yes but this is not just some guy producing some cool stuff, GDC wouldn’t even exist without him and Atari and we wouldn’t be here talking either. Nolan’s life achievements are too big for most of us to even understand, most of it happened before us. I started gaming in the early 80s when the crash had already happened, I learned about how big Atari was probably 10 years later and didn’t even believe it at first. Atari pioneered and ruled the industry and pretty much set the foundation to what still stands here today, without them we might’ve still just played cards. :P
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,767
Biggest takeaway in the article...

All former Atari employees are telling stories that are consistent with one another.
Consistency is key with things like this. All their stories are consistent some 40 years later. There is really no case here, at all, other than some slimy opportunists in the political arena trying to fabricate one.

They are literally making it about themselves, and dismissing the people who were directly involved with Atari and said 'claims'. Shame on them.
 
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Krejlooc

Self-requested temp ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,081
Yes but this is not just some guy producing some cool stuff, GDC wouldn’t even exist without him and Atari and we wouldn’t be here talking either. Nolan’s life achievements are too big for most of us to even understand, most of it happened before us. I started gaming in the early 80s when the crash had already happened, I learned about how big Atari was probably 10 years later and didn’t even believe it at first. Atari pioneered and ruled the industry and pretty much set the foundation to what still stands here today, without them we might’ve still just played cards. :P
Not to take away from Atari's significance, but there were arcades before Atari. Atari didn't invent arcade games. Electro-mechanical arcades had existed for 20 years before Atari existed. Pinball had existed for decades prior, too. Sega was formed in 1945. Midway was formed in 1958. Bally was formed in 1932. Even while working on the Atari 2600, Jay Miner was already designing its successor and had plans to leave and form his own company (which he did - Amiga Inc.). companies like Sears and magnavox produced pong consoles before partnering with Atari.

The industry still would have existed had Atari not come along, even if they were the primary grower in the late 70's to early 80's.
 
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Oct 30, 2017
887
People here are now criticizing the GDC and how they "fucked up", but how is most of this forum any different? The knee-jerk responses to this story here did nothing but applaud them and shit on Bushnell, giving him zero benefit of the doubt. Same with all of these kinds of stories. Just a few examples from the 1st page:

Good.
Having firsthand witnessed institutional harassment of women, fuck him.
After all the repercussion, yep, that was the right thing to do.
I actually didn't know Bushnell had a history of being a sexual harasser. Fuck him.
I'm seeing the same old alt-right gamer crowd on Twitter get incredulous over this news as if Bushnell's history of being a workplace sleazeball never happened. Like he didn't admit to it in the countless interviews he's done over the decades.
It was though I hate when they say IF my behavior or actions offended people. It was probably written by his lawyers but that language is so sleazy in all these apologies. You of all people should know they were offended!
I think that GDC probably made the right choice here, and Bushnell's response is a good one.
Good to see them take action, and that's a pretty good response too.
People really, really need to stop using this as an excuse. Normalizing harassment is not acceptable.
 

Kiunch

Member
Oct 26, 2017
239
What a rushed and unprofessional decision, if GDC really cared about its award and credibility, GDC could spend some time interviewing Nolan's past colleague to vouch for him.

A lot of them are still with the industry, without any allegation, he is basically a baby boomer scapegoat.
 

Nateo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,917
Hope he ends up getting the award. The more I read up on him the more I think he deserves it.
 

Buzzman

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,549
People here are now criticizing the GDC and how they "fucked up", but how is most of this forum any different? The knee-jerk responses to this story here did nothing but applaud them and shit on Bushnell, giving him zero benefit of the doubt. Same with all of these kinds of stories. Just a few examples from the 1st page:
I can understand kneejerk responses by posters on a forum. I expect more scrutiny from a large organization like the GDC.
 

Zomba13

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,950
Just read that medium article and wow. Even if the guy is an alt-right maniac, even if he's a misogynistic gamergator, it doesn't matter if what he wrote is true. If he did interview women and men who worked for him at the time and found no evidence of anything wrong, and all their stories are consistent, and no one has come out to say "that guy is lying, he never spoke to me and I never said that" then it seems clear there was no issue here. Just because the author is shitty doesn't mean what they say or write can't be the truth. Broken clock right twice a day and all that.

But also, the reply from Wu in the article is just disappointing, same with the tweet, how they are just ignoring facts to push their own narrative and how the experiences of actual women who actually worked for the man at the time the actual "harassment" took place don't matter is sad. I'm sure many women in tech at that time were harassed and abused, possibly at Atari too and that is sad and these women's positive experiences don't take away from those that were hurt. But from everything I can see no women at Atari felt hurt in anyway and were infact happy with the environment and how they were valued like the men were.
 

unknownspectator

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
1,791
I can understand kneejerk responses by posters on a forum. I expect more scrutiny from a large organization like the GDC.

I like to say something regarding the first part here. True, Forums of any type do have knee jerk reactions from time to time but I would like to implore all members here to be careful in not invoking witch hunts before getting all the facts. As this thread proves, it helps hearing all sides of the story before judgement. Also, be careful in who you listen to and believe because sometimes, like in this case, they just want to cause controversy for political gain and I advise everyone to be wary of said people. It's clear to me that Brianna Wu is just that type of person and I won't trust her anymore.
 
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