Gran Turismo SPORT | OT | Putting it all on the line

CassiusClay99

Member
Oct 28, 2017
128
I feel like this is a waste of money. And I say "do I miss something?"

Even if I say: "this is a total failure!" How does this entitle GHG to disrespect me ?

I am talking about a business perspective. OF COURSE i see the point for the guys who participate... but what is the point in terms of strategy? Short term? Long term? Did they get Pro players coming from other sims?

I have the same doubts about GT Academy yes. Great for the few talented who had a chance and enjoyed it...but how did it help the franchise? Was it the best value for money in terms of marketing?

The views numbers GHG gave don't mean much to me. I don't really know where they come from... and how they were calculated. Are they really good considering we talk about the biggest car franchise and the biggest car institution in the world? I mean a total of 2 millions viewers (even if I guess MANY of those viewers watched both...).. does not sound that impressive to me... How much money spent to get there? To get so little coverage in the media? I might be totally wrong : maybe those numbers are huge...if someone has numbers for others e-sports competitions... would be interesting)

How can these be ridiculous questions?

How will this help GT sell more games?
 
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RounD

Member
Oct 29, 2017
260
I feel like this is a waste of money. And I say "do I miss something?" Even if I say: "this is a total failure!" How does this entitle GHG to disrespect me ?
Your last question before GHG replied was "I feel all this FIA thing is not worth it... don't you?" You're the one that asked the question.

GT Academy made real racers out of gamers and to me at least, that is incredible. More so than how many copies PD has sold.

But after PD/Sony hosts these awesome events in multiple countries giving gamers around the world an outlet for there motorsport fantasies.. you go "I feel like this is failure and a waste of money"
 
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Deleted member 11426

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,628
Greensboro NC
I feel like this is a waste of money. And I say "do I miss something?"

Even if I say: "this is a total failure!" How does this entitle GHG to disrespect me ?

I am talking about a business perspective. OF COURSE i see the point for the guys who participate... but what is the point in terms of strategy? Short term? Long term? Did they get Pro players coming from other sims?

I have the same doubts about GT Academy yes. Great for the few talented who had a chance and enjoyed it...but how did it help the franchise? Was it the best value for money in terms of marketing?

The views numbers GHG gave don't mean much to me. I don't really know where they come from... and how they were calculated. Are they really good considering we talk about the biggest car franchise and the biggest car institution in the world? I mean a total of 2 millions viewers (even if I guess MANY of those viewers watched both...).. does not sound that impressive to me... How much money spent to get there? To get so little coverage in the media? I might be totally wrong : maybe those numbers are huge...if someone has numbers for others e-sports competitions... would be interesting)

How can these be ridiculous questions?

How will this help GT sell more games?
Go look up why esports is exploding in many gaming genres in general. This is what Sony/PD chose to build GT Sport around. They got 3 million people watching the Finals in their first year. The production quality was excellent too, so they're putting money into this stuff for it to grow. Forza has been doing esports events. Even F1 does an official esports series with their games along with almost all of the real F1 teams participating, and got 4.4 million views through streaming and TV.

https://racer.com/2018/12/06/f1-esports-series-attracts-4-4-million-viewers/
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,978
I think the FIA involvement is great for people with aspirations to become pro racecar drivers via GT. I think it's a bit meaningless for people who just want to race online. Look at the way the tournaments have been structured --the focus is on the top 0.0001% of drivers and the tournaments are tailored to focus on them. There's no A or B or C DR tournament levels and awards. For esports maybe that's acceptable, but from a videogame perspective it's catering to a very small segment of the audience and leaving the rest out to dry. Even with esports games like Tekken there's still plenty of local tournaments for people of all skill levels to compete in with a chance to win. GT doesn't have that and PD should've built that into the tournament system.

I don't think FIA involvement is a waste for PD, because it's obviously been a branding opportunity for GT and makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports, but I think for the average player of GTS it has had no impact.
 

GHG

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,648
Come on man... why are you trying to make me look supid? Tells more about you than about me.

Worth it like it: "DOES IT SELL MORE GAMES ?" for instance.
Last time I checked, PD was a game developer... all the money, time, human ressources invested in this competition is supposed to bring something back. media coverage for example, more sales, positive buzz, etc...

From what i see, there isn't much media coverage about all this and noone of my friends -who play CG- ever heard about this. So the question is all but ridiculous. How does that investment pay?
We are on Resetera here, not on PD official forum...(that does not exist btw). We are allowed to question business and strategic decisions...even when they are PD's.

Now, if you can't spare me your condescending/defensive tone (do you work for PD ? if not, what the hell?) , don't even bother answering my question.
Sorry but if you feel like you're being made to look stupid is simply because of the way you've approached all of this.

It started out with this:
  • "I fail to see the point of the FIA deal: i can see no mention of GTS on the FIA website. Isn't it a bit weird? What is exactly the point of this championship if noone talks about it? Must cost a fortune to organize...but for what purpose?" - you get shown the winners on the biggest motorsports stage of all, one which many real world drivers would bite your arm off to get on. It should tell you everything you need to know about how seriously this is being taken by the FIA but no...
Then it became this:
  • "Nice... but I can see no mention of that in the FIA website." - The website again... you would rather they put something on the website than at the actual annual awards ceremony? Strange but whatever.
  • "I don't think this is enough to put GTS under the spotlights... do you? I feel all this FIA thing is not worth it... don't you?" - with all of the information available now you're just taking the piss, especially with the way these "questions" are being framed.
And now it's evolved further to "but sales". Look at how you are asking "honest questions" here, look at how it shifts. Stop wasting everyone's time and just say you're disappointed with the direction they took the game in and you would rather they spat out a more "traditional" GT experience instead of seeking confirmation bias validation in places you aren't going to find it. There's a lot wrong with the game but the esports/FIA event side isn't it, especially when you look at how other racing sims/games are doing in this area.

Ever heard of Mclaren Shadow? Ever heard of Super Racers? The iRacing Grand Prix World Championship? What do the winners of the Forza Racing Championship get? How much exposure do the drivers and events get? The only one that comes close is the official F1 esports championship (which is also endorsed by the FIA incidentally) but again, the general coverage and exposure that the drivers get isn't at the same level. They are all now looking at the production values GT Sports events have along with the relationship they have with the FIA and they are trying to emulate it. They want the likes on Brendon Leigh on the big stage.

As an example (if you still need another one) the Ferrari F1 team principal is taking the strides that GT is making in this area seriously:

"Our competitor today, in my opinion, it’s my personal opinion, they are the Playstations,” he said, referring to video games and eSports.

“If you look at Gran Turismo, most probably we need to switch our minds and focus our attention on our competitors.

“Today we have a broad offer of entertainment and we need to look at everything, not only certain sports and try to equalise everything.

“Is PlayStation a competitor? In my opinion yes. What do you have to do to beat the PlayStation? You have to do something that is more interesting, most probably.

“It’s not a detailed answer to the question but we need to direction our attention to the entertainment industry and today what they offer is bigger than many many years ago.
https://www.motorsportweek.com/news/id/20366

Anyway I've rambled on enough, please watch this video from my so called YouTube channel and don't forget to like and subscribe.

 
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CassiusClay99

Member
Oct 28, 2017
128
I don't see why you get that personal. Or how "I don't see the point" or "i think it's a failure" is "taking the piss". It's an opinion. Might be right or wrong but you should wonder why MY opinion on a business strategy hurts your feelings.

Tx for your anwers anyway. You made it more about me and the winners of the competition than about the game sales and the strategy for the brand...but I guess you don't really care about my question and more about defending your beautiful game.

Look at how Eyeball_kid and Fox Mulder disagree with me without getting condescending.


I think the FIA involvement is great for people with aspirations to become pro racecar drivers via GT. I think it's a bit meaningless for people who just want to race online. Look at the way the tournaments have been structured --the focus is on the top 0.0001% of drivers and the tournaments are tailored to focus on them. There's no A or B or C DR tournament levels and awards. For esports maybe that's acceptable, but from a videogame perspective it's catering to a very small segment of the audience and leaving the rest out to dry. Even with esports games like Tekken there's still plenty of local tournaments for people of all skill levels to compete in with a chance to win. GT doesn't have that and PD should've built that into the tournament system.

I don't think FIA involvement is a waste for PD, because it's obviously been a branding opportunity for GT and makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports, but I think for the average player of GTS it has had no impact.

Go look up why esports is exploding in many gaming genres in general. This is what Sony/PD chose to build GT Sport around. They got 3 million people watching the Finals in their first year. The production quality was excellent too, so they're putting money into this stuff for it to grow. Forza has been doing esports events. Even F1 does an official esports series with their games along with almost all of the real F1 teams participating, and got 4.4 million views through streaming and TV.

https://racer.com/2018/12/06/f1-esports-series-attracts-4-4-million-viewers/
Interesting read... tx. Looks like 2 or 3 millions views is a good number for GTS compared to other esports and considering it's the first year. Reading this article, I start to wonder if GT had the choice: could they leave the esports opportunity to the competitors?

I think the FIA involvement is great for people with aspirations to become pro racecar drivers via GT. I think it's a bit meaningless for people who just want to race online. Look at the way the tournaments have been structured --the focus is on the top 0.0001% of drivers and the tournaments are tailored to focus on them. There's no A or B or C DR tournament levels and awards. For esports maybe that's acceptable, but from a videogame perspective it's catering to a very small segment of the audience and leaving the rest out to dry. Even with esports games like Tekken there's still plenty of local tournaments for people of all skill levels to compete in with a chance to win. GT doesn't have that and PD should've built that into the tournament system.

I don't think FIA involvement is a waste for PD, because it's obviously been a branding opportunity for GT and makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports, but I think for the average player of GTS it has had no impact.
I get that it makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports... what I don't get is: why "getting more relevant to traditional motorpsorts" will sell more games?

Gt Academy was nice and all...did it have an impact on game sales?

Would be interesting to see if there has been a -even little- bump in GTS sales after the FIA finals...
 

GHG

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,648
I don't see why you get that personal. Or how "I don't see the point" or "i think it's a failure" is "taking the piss". It's an opinion. Might be right or wrong but you should wonder why MY opinion on a business strategy hurts your feelings.

Tx for your anwers anyway. You made it more about me and the winners of the competition than about the game sales and the strategy for the brand...but I guess you don't really care about my question and more about defending your beautiful game.
Here's the thing, you never once made it clear any of this was about sales or strategy, it all hinged on your thoughts or feelings:

I fail to see the point of the FIA deal: i can see no mention of GTS on the FIA website, and nothing on any major videogame website either.

Isn't it a bit weird? What is exactly the point of this championship if noone talks about it? Must cost a fortune to organize...but for what purpose?

I can't help seeing this as a failure and waste of money... am i missing something? Is there more to see that i don't see? Honest question.
Nice... but I can see no mention of that in the FIA website.

https://www.fia.com/news/fias-fanfare-champions-saint-petersburg

Or in any medias.

I don't think this is enough to put GTS under the spotlights... do you?

I feel all this FIA thing is not worth it... don't you?
If you wanted to make it clear you wanted to know how the FIA events have or haven't impacted sales and the brand then all you had to do was say "has any of this had an impact on the brand or on sales"?

I think you need to be more clear in what it is you want to discuss and find out... Don't you? I think you need to be more specific with your questions... Do you?

I'd actually appreciate it if you simply approached all of this from a more open and neutral point of view rather than fire a load of negatively framed leading questions in my direction. But yes, of course I'd rather defend the "beautiful game", that must be it.
 
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CassiusClay99

Member
Oct 28, 2017
128
Here's the thing, you never once made it clear any of this was about sales or strategy, it all hinged on your thoughts or feelings:





If you wanted to make it clear you wanted to know how the FIA events have or haven't impacted sales and the brand then all you had to do was say "has any of this had an impact on the brand or on sales"?

I think you need to be more clear in what it is you want to discuss and find out... Don't you? I think you need to be more specific with your questions... Do you?

I'd actually appreciate it if you simply approached all of this from a more open and neutral point of view rather than fire a load of negatively framed leading questions in my direction. But yes, of course I'd rather defend the "beautiful game", that must be it.

...ho the irony.

Anyway.I'll give you the last word because this a GT thread and not a "cassius vs GHG" one.

I will still phrase my posts the way I want to. Feel free to ignore them.
Peace.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,978
I get that it makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports... what I don't get is: why "getting more relevant to traditional motorpsorts" will sell more games?

Gt Academy was nice and all...did it have an impact on game sales?

Would be interesting to see if there has been a -even little- bump in GTS sales after the FIA finals...
I think it's sort of a cross-pollination effect. From what I've heard, motorsports viewership is in decline. The FIA wants the partnership because they hope it will get GT players more interested in traditional motorsports. I imagine Polyphony thinks that having an official partnership with GT will elevate the status of the series and potentially bring new or lapsed GT players from the motorsports viewership to the fold. (for instance, racing commentators often still comment about GT when an ex-GT Academy driver is in a race) I think this is going to be a long-term partnership and the fruits of it won't necessarily be born out for either party right away.
 

CassiusClay99

Member
Oct 28, 2017
128
I think it's sort of a cross-pollination effect. From what I've heard, motorsports viewership is in decline. The FIA wants the partnership because they hope it will get GT players more interested in traditional motorsports. I imagine Polyphony thinks that having an official partnership with GT will elevate the status of the series and potentially bring new or lapsed GT players from the motorsports viewership to the fold. (for instance, racing commentators often still comment about GT when an ex-GT Academy driver is in a race) I think this is going to be a long-term partnership and the fruits of it won't necessarily be born out for either party right away.

Makes sense... But the costs of the GT- FIA championship must be enormous... and the manpower they spend on it instead of working on the game they will actually sell... I mean: PD is already not the fastest dev... :-(

I don't feel like GT Academy had much of an impact in terms of marketing... maybe things will be different with the FIA deal...

At this time, I am not convinced yet: to me, GT is a casual franchise... competition may even scare players away: putting GT in the "Hardcore sim" category... which has so much less players.

Just my 2 cents though...
 

NuMiQ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
277
Makes sense... But the costs of the GT- FIA championship must be enormous... and the manpower they spend on it instead of working on the game they will actually sell... I mean: PD is already not the fastest dev... :-(
I seriously doubt they have devs working on organizing events. I imagine everybody in the company has their own tasks and schedules to stick to. So far, we've seen a pretty steady stream of new tracks and cars, and I've seen no sign of those slowing down. Looks to me as PD is working their usual pace and this is something that is being handled by separate people who are trained for event management etc.

Meanwhile, I've been enjoying this game more than most of the previous releases due to the online racing being so much more enjoyable. Sure it's a tradeoff, but if you're still pining for that glorious return of the singleplayer career of yore, I really doubt that will ever come. I would not be against a great singleplayer campaign in the style of old GT games, but that would require some other REALLY big changes to the way the game operates. Mostly AI driving, which is no small feat to get right in a racing game. So for me, I'm very interested in this new direction the series is going in. I hope they manage to get a great tournament going and maybe, once they have a game with a load of content set up and running, they might even think about that singleplayer campaign so many people (including myself) look forward to.
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,993
Sometimes this game is such trash.

I was hit SEVEN times today in Sport mode, and every time I got penalty. People are driving like madmen, ghost car bouncing from wall to me and then solidifying when inside of me, even in Sportmanship a and S races.

I think I will stop playing.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,904
Quick question - I have the disc version but am tempted to convert to digital as it’s on sale now. Will my save transfer across? Also can I just buy the digital version or do I have to delete and then reinstall (all 79GB!)
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,993
On PS4, saves should be interchangeable between the same version of the game and the same region of the game [but I remember there was some noise about some games not supporting it].

Disc and PSN installs are not interchangeable, you will have to re-download the game.
 

FeD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,208
Race C is super fun to play around with the tire strategy. I prefer SS/MM/SS at the moment. But MS/SS with being a bit more aggressive with the front bias in the first stint is also pretty doable.
 

Riderz1337

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,616
Experienced gt sport in VR for the first time yesterday and it was awesome! I wish the AI in the 1v1 mode was more competitive though. They don't even full accelerate on the straights lol
 

DHC-Shannow

Member
Oct 29, 2017
945
Manchester, England
Experienced gt sport in VR for the first time yesterday and it was awesome! I wish the AI in the 1v1 mode was more competitive though. They don't even full accelerate on the straights lol
Yep there might as well be no opposition at all - at least there is time trial now so you can do more than 2 laps at a time! If only they'd expand the mode a bit more or even allow small online VR races...
 

Dave_6

Member
Oct 25, 2017
939
I tried this out last night with my new PSVR. No matter with me centering the screen each time, once I'm in the car I have to turn my head to the right unless I want to look out the drivers window. Is there a recenter option while driving like most racing sims have with Oculus?
 

Roy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,287
I think the FIA involvement is great for people with aspirations to become pro racecar drivers via GT. I think it's a bit meaningless for people who just want to race online. Look at the way the tournaments have been structured --the focus is on the top 0.0001% of drivers and the tournaments are tailored to focus on them. There's no A or B or C DR tournament levels and awards. For esports maybe that's acceptable, but from a videogame perspective it's catering to a very small segment of the audience and leaving the rest out to dry. Even with esports games like Tekken there's still plenty of local tournaments for people of all skill levels to compete in with a chance to win. GT doesn't have that and PD should've built that into the tournament system.

I don't think FIA involvement is a waste for PD, because it's obviously been a branding opportunity for GT and makes them more relevant to traditional motorsports, but I think for the average player of GTS it has had no impact.
I'm not the top 0.0001%, I don't have any aspirations in becoming a race car driver and I think that FIA mode is brilliant.
The game has issues with punters and penalties but the FIA stuff is so enjoyable that I will risk it and put in an ungodly number of km in. I've spent hours levelling up secondary accounts just to be able to race multiple times in different regions.
 

Riderz1337

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,616
I tried this out last night with my new PSVR. No matter with me centering the screen each time, once I'm in the car I have to turn my head to the right unless I want to look out the drivers window. Is there a recenter option while driving like most racing sims have with Oculus?
You can center the screen even whilst in game/in the car. Have you tried that?
 

Deleted member 2321

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,555
It didn't used to, it's a new bug introduced after the last update. I used to run custom races as a trial for our endurance league but can't do it now as the refueling just takes for ever (and the whole point of running a custom race was to test which strategy was best).
Thanks. That means it’ll get fixed eventually.
 

ty_hot

Banned
Dec 14, 2017
2,778
I heard they inserted some kind of geo fencing in the game? Just saw part of a video complaining about that. I always only matched with people of my PSN account despite living across the Ocean from there. What changed?
 
Oct 25, 2017
110
I am so glad that the BMW Z8, Ferrari 246 Dino and TVR Tuscan Speed Six are returnng, but also nice to see some unexpected additions like the Porsche 356!
 

FriskyCanuck

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,886
Toronto, Canada
I got GT Sport over the holidays and I am really enjoying the Sport mode, especially those FIA races. The matchmaking in Sport mode is really good, I already got myself into the A Driver Rating split. The Safety Rating seems too easy to improve I think, I got to S in less than a day and stayed there ever since.

Is there a like a tier list of all the manufacturers' cars in Gr. 3 and Gr. 4? I'm wondering how well done the BoP is in this game.

Also, I absolutely love the livery creation system in this game. I can't make anything much more than a basic McLaren style one on the 650S GT3, but it's really getting my creative juices flowing.
 
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DHC-Shannow

Member
Oct 29, 2017
945
Manchester, England
I got GT Sport over the holidays and I am really enjoying the Sport mode, especially those FIA races. The matchmaking in Sport mode is really good, I already got myself into the A Driver Rating split. The Safety Rating seems too easy to improve I think, I got to S in less than a day and stayed there ever since.

Is there a like a tier list of all the manufacturers' cars in Gr. 3 and Gr. 4? I'm wondering how well done the BoP is in this game.

Also, I absolutely love the livery creation system in this game. I can't make anything much more than a basic McLaren style one on the 650S GT3, but it's really getting my creative juices flowing.
There have been many tweaks to the BoP over the games lifetime, these aren't universally agreed on (especially if it nerfs your favourite car!) and aren't track specific so you do find certain tracks suit a particular car (if you check out the top ten times list before entering the race you'll often see 1 car dominate the times but sometimes you do get quite a variety). Overall they are well done and have been honed over time - the N class BoP ratings are a bit more random as we found recently when we ran several N class races.
 

JamboGT

Vehicle Handling Designer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
533
Probably the most disappointed I have been with a track announcement. Oh well, at least the cars are good.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,978
The track is useless, unless you're into drag racing or speed tests. It has a nice vibe in the night TOD though.

They improved the physics though, and the MR cars seem a bit more stable now and controllable with the back loose. Even the sport tires on the road cars I tried seemed more stable and controllable.