Halo |OT| She's Gone, Sir

[Trup1aya]

Yeah, one of the reasons I love Cortana's "evil" turn is she's basically trying to pull off exactly what ONI's been trying to do, she just has power they could only dream of. The idea that a military AI based on the mind of a young genius scientist who thinks she's saving humanity by creating covert hit squads of supersoldiers to stop rebellions decides that she knows best for humanity is not much of a stretch at all, and the Gravemind specifically identified and tried to exploit that.

I have issues with certain executional elements, but execution is ultimately the only really relevant benchmark I hold this stuff up to. If they wanted magical space unicorns to show up in Halo I'd be down with it as long as it's executed well.

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Yeah. I have 0 problems with her turning "evil". It actually makes perfect sense. I just hate the way they executed it.

As i said, the didact is mostly a cool concept executed poorly, but i think he could still be salvaged. Cortana's arc in halo 5 makes perfect sense if you've only followed the numbered halo games; in fact I don't think any supplemental media has anything else to add to it. said supplemental media is where you'd find out that they've only known each other a year, by the way; it doesn't really feel that way in the games.

Cortana's motivation is not her affection for chief, what i was saying is that she's always had kind of a god complex, but she's also always been limited in a way that tamped down on that. it makes sense that she would resent those limitations once they've been taken off, and it makes sense that she would rationalize what she's doing in the way she does.

The interplay between the two in the endgame of halo 5 feels really authentic to actual relationships, for me, where one person can be blind to the flaws of another until they do something so extreme that you can't ignore it anymore. As to why a deep personal drama would be at the center of galaxy-changing events? because that's good storytelling. And honestly who's to say it's all that unlikely; wars have been started over people's personal business many, many times.

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Where in the game's do you gather she has a God complex, and where does one get the impression that that complex would evolve into the mass murder of the innocent people she's been protecting her whole life?

You find out chief and Cortana have only known each other for a few weeks, just by playing the games. The dates are provided. The only reason it maybe "feels" longer than that is because the space between game releases. And then because H4 makes it seem like they are BFFs with benefits.

And how were her limitations removed? The domain? To someone who's only played the game's its just empty space jargon used to handwave a monumental shift in character. They definitely didn't do enough to explain how she was able to free herself from those shackles or why hey current behavior would differ so greatly from her past.

As far as the interplay between the two, I can't say it's good storytelling at all. If the Idea is that Cortana has amassed so much intellectual power that she can rationalize sacrificing the few (millions) for total galactic peace, then why would she allow emotion to jeopardize her plan? Logically, she should be more Ozymandias than Scooby-Doo villain, but that's not what we got. Master Chief (off-screen) had, up to this point, spent his entire life sending his life long friends to die for the mission. Now we are to believe he'd jeapardize it all due to blind love for an AI he's consciously known for a few months? Again, if it was effectively established, in game that this was the sort of relationship they had, then sure go for. But the entirety of their emotional connection has felt contrived ever since 343 decided to focus on it.

 

[Dokkaebi G0SU]

I watched as well. I'm just hoping they actually implement it, in the final game.

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I think they will. from the way he talked about it, it feels like this is what they want the experience to be with Infinite. Plus wasnt the guy on the stream like the director of experiences or something along those lines?

it would be a huge bait and switch if the energy they poured into introducing us to infinite was not in the final game. but i guess 5 was kind of like that huh...

 

[Karl2177]

I ain't reading a Halo book just to figure out why a main character is evil now.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

I ain't reading a Halo book just to figure out why a main character is evil now.

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I don't think you've ever needed to.

If all you did was play Halo 1–3, you weren't going to be confused by the Didact. Ancient Forerunner who doesn't like humans, gotcha'.

And if all you've played is the games, Cortana explains her plans to the Chief/player. You accept that motivation or you don't.

 

[Dokkaebi G0SU]

What is Cortana's final form though?

Tune into the next episode to find out ...

 

[Deleted member 20284]

Random Halo Infinite day dream...

Chief discovers some advanced tech to flash clone himself, gives that clone his armour for an unavoidable suicide mission to trick/kill/fix Cortana and the mission after that you have to stealth retrieve a new set of armour. We get to see Chief die and keep Chief. Hell we could see Cortana kill Chief and then come to her senses...and still keep John.

 

[Chuck the Bean]

Great posts Gents. Very interesting to read.
Now go on...!

 

[Deleted member 20284]

From the minds over at Waypoint I present...

The chief could be female if you look at the legs on the trailer and what planet are they on?

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I don't normally like to make fun of what someone posts but this is pretty funny. Chief skips leg day confirmed.

 

[Banamy]

I think they will. from the way he talked about it, it feels like this is what they want the experience to be with Infinite. Plus wasnt the guy on the stream like the director of experiences or something along those lines?

it would be a huge bait and switch if the energy they poured into introducing us to infinite was not in the final game. but i guess 5 was kind of like that huh...

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He's the "Narrative Experience Director"

 

[mlappy]

He's the "Narrative Experience Director"

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My question is, how much of that trailer was "creative liberties" and how much of that was being "the vision" for Infinite?

Its hard to tell really. It could be just a trailer to make a cool trailer and really have nothing to do with Infinite.

 

[Banamy]

My question is, how much of that trailer was "creative liberties" and how much of that was being "the vision" for Infinite?

Its hard to tell really. It could be just a trailer to make a cool trailer and really have nothing to do with Infinite.

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hard to say, he was constantly updating the infinite head, so maybe it had to somewhat mirror the game

 

[Calvarok]

I ain't reading a Halo book just to figure out why a main character is evil now.

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again, there is literally nothing about her turn that was set up specifically in the books. it was all in the game and drawing on moments from previous games. (not even drawing anything from outside the main numbered ones, no less) That's part of why it was surprising and interesting. everything about halo 5 was mega self-contained, which is what people asked for, but i guess you can't please everyone.

responding to a little bit of a thing on the previous page, I think cortana has a god complex because compared to humans, in a lot of ways she is a god. if she weren't doomed to die in a short period of time it would be hard to argue that her kind wouldn't be a superior leadership force. and now, they aren't doomed to die. it makes a lot of sense from her perspective and that of a lot of AI. (this is another reason i love how Roland just straight-up doesn't take any of that shit and it's not even made a big deal of.)

if you just don't like it for whatever reason, fine. I doubt Infinite is going to be a straightforward "AI War" premise, and i think that fits with how they set up cortana. keep bein' unexpected, halo

 

[Deleted member 2226]

As much as I like the story that's probably one of the least essential components of Infinite being a success. One thing I do think the guy on the social stream had a good point about was that CE had a lot of "quiet" time where you could make your own story up, and especially if Infinite's going open-world that would be a good factor to bring back. For all the games have revealed about the Forerunners as a people, their machines are mostly inscrutable and weird, and that's a good thing.

 

[Rodeo Clown]

There's another H3 qualifier tonight. Should be streamed by some of the top players (Flamesword, Ace, Roy).

Of note, Roy and Lunchbox are competing this week as Instinct and are teaming with (surprise) Pistola and Snipedown.

 

[Trup1aya]

again, there is literally nothing about her turn that was set up specifically in the books. it was all in the game and drawing on moments from previous games. (not even drawing anything from outside the main numbered ones, no less) That's part of why it was surprising and interesting. everything about halo 5 was mega self-contained, which is what people asked for, but i guess you can't please everyone.

responding to a little bit of a thing on the previous page, I think cortana has a god complex because compared to humans, in a lot of ways she is a god. if she weren't doomed to die in a short period of time it would be hard to argue that her kind wouldn't be a superior leadership force. and now, they aren't doomed to die. it makes a lot of sense from her perspective and that of a lot of AI. (this is another reason i love how Roland just straight-up doesn't take any of that shit and it's not even made a big deal of.)

if you just don't like it for whatever reason, fine. I doubt Infinite is going to be a straightforward "AI War" premise, and i think that fits with how they set up cortana. keep bein' unexpected, halo

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I think there's a difference saying a character has a god complex, and saying a character is godlike. A god complex is a personality trait that inhibits a person from from acknowledging their flaws and regarding convention and the demands of society. A person with Cortana's intellect can develop a god complex... but so can an absolute moron. Likewise, a genius can live without feeling inherently superior to everyone else.

Yes, Halo 5 Cortana clearly has a God complex. But this personality trait appears only in Halo 5 - the wasn't built up in the any of the preceding mainline games.

It DOES make sense for Cortana to develop a god complex - in fact, the lore tells us it's a symptom of ramancy. But the key word here is develop. Cortana's character development in H5 was non-existent. She went from 0 to 100 real quick, with essentially no attention given to how she got there. The writers didn't even earn her revival, let alone her becoming the antagonist.

As much as I like the story that's probably one of the least essential components of Infinite being a success. One thing I do think the guy on the social stream had a good point about was that CE had a lot of "quiet" time where you could make your own story up, and especially if Infinite's going open-world that would be a good factor to bring back. For all the games have revealed about the Forerunners as a people, their machines are mostly inscrutable and weird, and that's a good thing.

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While I still I think having a compelling narrative is incredibly important, I also think it's important to leave space for players to carve out their own stories and their own truths. Halo CE as pretty light on character because it was heavy on world building- which makes sense because it was the first game in the series. Showing players this giant, alien, deserted, artificial world and having the characters learn about it as the player did was much more effective than exposition about it would have been.

I really hope they move back towards "showing" instead of "telling" when it comes to how they present both the narrative and characters.

 

[Prinz Eugn]

Fucking finally this thread shows up in by subscribed threads page, man that was annoying.

I always thought they moved way too fast story-wise in the past couple games. Like, we could've gotten two games of the Didact easily, and 3 with some tweaking. Then do whatever with the Rise of the Machines storyline (but preferably something less cliche).

Like, imagine Cortana dying partway through the Didact stuff, like in the climax of the first game. Then, the next game climaxes with Chief getting the Janus key (remember that McGuffin?) after racing the better-built-up Storm Covenant and defeating the Didact for good, only for Cortana to reveal that she's reborn, and events after her death were shaped by her to get the Janus key to Greater Good the galaxy.

Fan fiction aside, it really feels like the stories so far are not very well connected. Spartans Ops team disappears. Osiris basically comes out of nowhere.

 

[Green]

Do we know yet which Halo ring is in Infinite? I had a funny thought that it could be a Halo ring built by UNSC using upgraded Infinity tech - Installation ∞. Also strange that there is a Marathon Infinity and a Halo Infinite now.

 

[Cranster]

Do we know yet which Halo ring is in Infinite? I had a funny thought that it could be a Halo ring built by UNSC using upgraded Infinity tech - Installation ∞. Also strange that there is a Marathon Infinity and a Halo Infinite now.

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People like hiddenxperia keep saying it's Zeta Halo. I think there is a chance it could be the replacement Ring (installation 09) from Halo Wars 2 though.

 

[Deleted member 2507]

People like hiddenxperia keep saying it's Zeta Halo. I think there is a chance it could be the replacement Ring (installation 09) from Halo Wars 2 though.

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I believe the trailer itself indicated that the place is Zeta Halo (i07), hence people thinking that.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

I believe the trailer itself indicated that the place is Zeta Halo (i07), hence people thinking that.

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Yeah there's some additional details in the concept art from the stream that suggest it's Zeta Halo as well.

Fucking finally this thread shows up in by subscribed threads page, man that was annoying.

I always thought they moved way too fast story-wise in the past couple games. Like, we could've gotten two games of the Didact easily, and 3 with some tweaking. Then do whatever with the Rise of the Machines storyline (but preferably something less cliche).

Like, imagine Cortana dying partway through the Didact stuff, like in the climax of the first game. Then, the next game climaxes with Chief getting the Janus key (remember that McGuffin?) after racing the better-built-up Storm Covenant and defeating the Didact for good, only for Cortana to reveal that she's reborn, and events after her death were shaped by her to get the Janus key to Greater Good the galaxy.

Fan fiction aside, it really feels like the stories so far are not very well connected. Spartans Ops team disappears. Osiris basically comes out of nowhere.

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I think the bigger issue from the outside looking in is that the stories aren't well connected because they've been second-guessing themselves based on feedback. I'm concerned they're going to do the same with Cortana's motivations, because they got flak for people complaining she "just turned evil" and even more flak for Frankie daring to suggest that she's not "evil", and now we've gotten a bunch of Loot Crate materials that are wishy-washy about it and "maybe it is the logic plague or Gravemind corruption or a rampant fragment of Cortana! Who knows!"

 

[Calvarok]

Fucking finally this thread shows up in by subscribed threads page, man that was annoying.

I always thought they moved way too fast story-wise in the past couple games. Like, we could've gotten two games of the Didact easily, and 3 with some tweaking. Then do whatever with the Rise of the Machines storyline (but preferably something less cliche).

Like, imagine Cortana dying partway through the Didact stuff, like in the climax of the first game. Then, the next game climaxes with Chief getting the Janus key (remember that McGuffin?) after racing the better-built-up Storm Covenant and defeating the Didact for good, only for Cortana to reveal that she's reborn, and events after her death were shaped by her to get the Janus key to Greater Good the galaxy.

Fan fiction aside, it really feels like the stories so far are not very well connected. Spartans Ops team disappears. Osiris basically comes out of nowhere.

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I will absolutely agree that 4 and 5 weren't very well connected storywise, but I think that was kind of a good thing since 4's story was just honestly not very interesting. I enjoyed 5 because it took a hard left turn into something that felt like something instead of feeling obligated to carry forward exactly what it felt like 4 was going for. The end of 5 feels like it gives a lot more room to breathe imo, and it would feel a lot less weird for infinite to introduce a universe that feels unrecognizably changed vs the predictable status quo 4 set up.

Basically I like how confident 5 is in being its own thing and bringing in new elements we never knew about, solely with the aim of telling a better story.

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Re: narrative minimalism in infinite, I agree that seems like the direction, and I think that's cool. It definitely seems like a more solitary experience is being set up, with nothing like the amount of exposure to human civilization we got in 5, and a contrast to 5's frantic, urgent nature as well.

I do really like how the forerunners have been fleshed out and shown as something other than benevolent and all-knowing, and I hope infinite continues to tell us more about them while still finding ways to make them and what they left behind mysterious.

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Btw has anyone yet dubbed voice clips of marines saying dumb things while riding warthogs into the end of the halo infinite trailer?

EDIT: fuchsdh wait what's this loot crate business? I guess i missed this

 

[Trup1aya]

Yeah there's some additional details in the concept art from the stream that suggest it's Zeta Halo as well.


I think the bigger issue from the outside looking in is that the stories aren't well connected because they've been second-guessing themselves based on feedback. I'm concerned they're going to do the same with Cortana's motivations, because they got flak for people complaining she "just turned evil" and even more flak for Frankie daring to suggest that she's not "evil", and now we've gotten a bunch of Loot Crate materials that are wishy-washy about it and "maybe it is the logic plague or Gravemind corruption or a rampant fragment of Cortana! Who knows!"

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I don't think it's fair to blame feedback for a lack of connective tissue. The main criticism on Halo 4's narrative was that in order appreciate the principle antagonist, you needed exposure to the Forerunner and Ancient Humanity millenia spanning backstory. They crammed an entire book trilogy into a 5 minute cutscene and shipped it. All of the character development happens off screen.

Perhaps fear of replicating this dilemma is what lead them to unceremoniously kill off Jul M'dama and the Janus Key plotline - but that doesn't explain having Cortana's character development happen offscreen.

So now they've replicated H4's problem of having the principle antagonist's motivation largely being absent in the game. But this time we don't even get a 5 minute exposition cutscene or terminals to read. And to make matters worse, the antagonist is a character who the audience already knew well , so her new behavior is harder to accept.

If there's anything to take from feedback, it's that character development needs to happen in front of the player. That's how you maintain connective tissue - because the audience can fully appreciate how past events molded a character into his/her present state.

They didn't need to assassinate the Jul thread in mission 1. They just needed to show players who and why he is (an intelligent and charismatic yet phony religious leader who's racist views have been reinforced by ONI actions). There's a great story to be told here, 343i just chose not to bother.

Likewise, with Cortana, they needed to show who she is and why she's that way. All we can gather now is that, for some unknown reason, she's not acting like the person we grew up with. That's not the critcs' fault - its the writers'. The reason Frankie's comment drew backlash is because he's an externally describing a character differently from how she's depicted in the game. Showing how Cortana managed to reach her conclusion from a position of good will would have been more effective than simply telling us "she's not evil" after the fact.

 

[Miles X]

Can anybody help? Bought Halo Wars 2 today and was really excited to show the OH but the install is paaaaaaainfully slow. Does anybody remember at what point in the installation "ready to play" became available? I'm at 54.1%.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

Can anybody help? Bought Halo Wars 2 today and was really excited to show the OH but the install is paaaaaaainfully slow. Does anybody remember at what point in the installation "ready to play" became available? I'm at 54.1%.

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Pretty sure mine was way before that but it was also before all the DLC and updates so who knows now.

 

[Miles X]

Pretty sure mine was way before that but it was also before all the DLC and updates so who knows now.

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Ah thanks, yeah I was expecting it to be sooner. The file is 41GB and I think I read it was 26GB at launch.

Edit - Woop, literally just popped. 58.2% for anybody else querying.

 

[Akai]

If it really turns out to be Zeta Halo, which seems to be very likely, then I'm kinda hoping for the "Palace of Pain" to make an appearance. Zeta definitely has some potential and it also fits into the whole mystery thing that they have been talking about in the "Making of" stream.

 

[Tappin Brews]

Just won a match 50-3 against a playing, and at least competent, 4. Lol

 

[Trup1aya]

Had anyone toyed with the latest MCC insider build? I'm hearing you can apply H2As aiming system to every game - a major upgrade for Halo 3.

 

[Tappin Brews]

Speaking of mcc, did the flood infection get cleared? Anything new?

 

[m23]

If it really turns out to be Zeta Halo, which seems to be very likely, then I'm kinda hoping for the "Palace of Pain" to make an appearance. Zeta definitely has some potential and it also fits into the whole mystery thing that they have been talking about in the "Making of" stream.

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I would be extremely disappointed if the Palace of Pain does not make an appearance, if the game is indeed set on Zeta Halo.

 

[Akai]

I would be extremely disappointed if the Palace of Pain does not make an appearance, if the game is indeed set on Zeta Halo.

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I don't like setting my expectations too high, but it's hard to imagine the game taking place on Zeta Halo and then not have any references to the "Palace of Pain". I'm not misremembering that it was under the control of Mendicant Bias and the Primordial, right? Not sure what happened afterwards with it.

 

[m23]

I don't like setting my expectations too high, but it's hard to imagine the game taking place on Zeta Halo and then not have any references to the "Palace of Pain". I'm not misremembering that it was under the control of Mendicant Bias and the Primordial, right? Not sure what happened afterwards with it.

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Yeah, it was controlled by those two.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

I don't like setting my expectations too high, but it's hard to imagine the game taking place on Zeta Halo and then not have any references to the "Palace of Pain". I'm not misremembering that it was under the control of Mendicant Bias and the Primordial, right? Not sure what happened afterwards with it.

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It may not exist anymore, given that Installation 07 lost a lot of its original surface area.

 

[Akai]

Yeah, it was controlled by those two.

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Thanks.

It may not exist anymore, given that Installation 07 lost a lot of its original surface area.

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I forgot that it has shrunken from a 30,000 km to a 10,000 km diameter ring. I've also just read that a Flood outbreak happened in 2558, which the Swords of Sanghelios contained? Same year as Halo 5 takes place, so we could actually still encounter some of these Flood testing facilities, if they weren't all glassed/destroyed.

 

[m23]

fuchsdh Since you seem to be one of the more knowledgeable posters here on Halo lore, did we ever find out what was on that crashed ship from the Halo CEA terminal? I wonder about that to this day.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

fuchsdh Since you seem to be one of the more knowledgeable posters here on Halo lore, did we ever find out what was on that crashed ship from the Halo CEA terminal? I wonder about that to this day.

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Nope. Still an open-ended mystery, and at this point given stuff like we got the Drinoi after 14 years it's probably one of the longest dangling plot threads. I'm not really sure they'll ever address it.

 

[SlightlyLive]

My kingdom for a Guilty Spark.

 

[Deleted member 2507]

fuchsdh Since you seem to be one of the more knowledgeable posters here on Halo lore, did we ever find out what was on that crashed ship from the Halo CEA terminal? I wonder about that to this day.

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Nope. Still an open-ended mystery, and at this point given stuff like we got the Drinoi after 14 years it's probably one of the longest dangling plot threads. I'm not really sure they'll ever address it.

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I'll point out that there are actually two (or more) cases of non-Covie aliens visiting the Alpha Halo.
The Halo CEA terminals have a ship that crashes on the ring and we never ever find out what kind of aliens were inside (Spark didn't investigate). And Conversations From The Universe implies there have been visitors who investigated things and then left, as such i'd interpret these as being separate events. But ultimately these aliens are just a background detail, i think, merely confirming there's more to the galaxy than just humans and Covies.
The Sharquoi/Drinol were most certainly intended to be more than they ended up being, i think, unlike the visitors.

Incidentally, are there any other things that are hinted at but never followed in anyway?
The Impossible Life and the Possible Death of Preston J. Cole implies Cole is/was alive after his last battle but i suppose it won't be followed as the character is effectively written out.
There's also the time travel mess from First Strike that has never been... well, clarified. I mean, there's a hint that the Covies copied Cortana (at least Halopedia interpreted things that way, didn't recall that detail myself), plus the whole time travel shenanigans in general. Was the crystal part of a Forerunner slipspace drive or something?
And then there's that how several characters in The Fall of Reach and First Strike note that Forerunner symbols feel very familiar plus that the blind jump to the Alpha Halo was not exactly blind, but i suppose that's due to the Librarian's geas on humankind?

 

[SlightlyLive]

Remember the Data Pads from Reach? Neither does 343! :P

 

[Deleted member 2507]

Remember the Data Pads from Reach? Neither does 343! :P

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Riight.. those.
I don't want to remember them. Frankly utterly stupid... unless they're someone's in-universe conspiracy theory.

 

[Cranster]

Remember the Data Pads from Reach? Neither does 343! :P

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Those were dumb, just like the rest of Bungies retcons in Reach.

 

[SlightlyLive]

Those were dumb, just like the rest of Bungies retcons in Reach.

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Yeah, a coalition of rogue AI that control the galaxy. Such a silly idea!

 

[Trup1aya]

I'll point out that there are actually two (or more) cases of non-Covie aliens visiting the Alpha Halo.
The Halo CEA terminals have a ship that crashes on the ring and we never ever find out what kind of aliens were inside (Spark didn't investigate). And Conversations From The Universe implies there have been visitors who investigated things and then left, as such i'd interpret these as being separate events. But ultimately these aliens are just a background detail, i think, merely confirming there's more to the galaxy than just humans and Covies.
The Sharquoi/Drinol were most certainly intended to be more than they ended up being, i think, unlike the visitors.

Incidentally, are there any other things that are hinted at but never followed in anyway?
The Impossible Life and the Possible Death of Preston J. Cole implies Cole is/was alive after his last battle but i suppose it won't be followed as the character is effectively written out.
There's also the time travel mess from First Strike that has never been... well, clarified. I mean, there's a hint that the Covies copied Cortana (at least Halopedia interpreted things that way, didn't recall that detail myself), plus the whole time travel shenanigans in general. Was the crystal part of a Forerunner slipspace drive or something?
And then there's that how several characters in The Fall of Reach and First Strike note that Forerunner symbols feel very familiar plus that the blind jump to the Alpha Halo was not exactly blind, but i suppose that's due to the Librarian's geas on humankind?

Click to shrink...

What's the time travel mess? The way I interpreted it is that the crystal allowed for much faster slipspace than UNSC equipment could properly measure.

 

[Deleted member 2226]

Yeah, a coalition of rogue AI that control the galaxy. Such a silly idea!

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Out in the open is a lot more preferable to "actually we've been secretly orchestrating everything behind the scenes".

My headcanon is it really just was bad fanfic left behind in the chaos of the planet coming under attack.

I'll point out that there are actually two (or more) cases of non-Covie aliens visiting the Alpha Halo.
The Halo CEA terminals have a ship that crashes on the ring and we never ever find out what kind of aliens were inside (Spark didn't investigate). And Conversations From The Universe implies there have been visitors who investigated things and then left, as such i'd interpret these as being separate events. But ultimately these aliens are just a background detail, i think, merely confirming there's more to the galaxy than just humans and Covies.
The Sharquoi/Drinol were most certainly intended to be more than they ended up being, i think, unlike the visitors.

Incidentally, are there any other things that are hinted at but never followed in anyway?
The Impossible Life and the Possible Death of Preston J. Cole implies Cole is/was alive after his last battle but i suppose it won't be followed as the character is effectively written out.
There's also the time travel mess from First Strike that has never been... well, clarified. I mean, there's a hint that the Covies copied Cortana (at least Halopedia interpreted things that way, didn't recall that detail myself), plus the whole time travel shenanigans in general. Was the crystal part of a Forerunner slipspace drive or something?
And then there's that how several characters in The Fall of Reach and First Strike note that Forerunner symbols feel very familiar plus that the blind jump to the Alpha Halo was not exactly blind, but i suppose that's due to the Librarian's geas on humankind?

Click to shrink...

Cole's fate is left open, although frankly I think there's enough there to give him closure (if he never shows up again it's because he well and truly had enough of war, and you can't blame him.)

To this day I'm not sure what the point of the time travel shenanigans were in First Strike (i'd love to ask Nylund about that.) I don't think the point of the crystal was anything beyond Inscrutable Forerunner Maguffin though.

The stuff with the symbols being familiar is basically taking the implication Humans were descended from Forerunners and making it the genesong, yeah. Cortana's "blind jump" not actually being blind was already explained before the game even came out in The Fall of Reach as derived from an artifact at Sigma Octanus, and then Bungie decided that wasn't good enough and implied that the information came from the Forerunner ship on Reach (and to reconcile it I guess you can say that Cortana used both.)

As SlightlyLive intimated above, though, I think after the CEA mystery ship the next biggest plot thread left is where 343GS/Chakas got off to after the events of Primordium. Then there's some other minor longstanding ones, such as the fate of Chol Von and her idea of a Jackal-led Covenant, and given the timeframe of the books exactly what happened to splinter factions like the Keepers up to and after Cortana's Big Announcement.

What's then time travel mess? The way I interpreted it is that the Chrystal allowed for much faster slipspace than UNSC equipment could properly measure.

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The events of most of First Strike start before the events of Halo: Combat Evolved. It's time travel that's just kind of there, and doesn't really impact anything else in the story (the weird slipspace stuff and destroying the strike fleet would happen exactly the same way.)

 

[Deleted member 2507]

What's then time travel mess? The way I interpreted it is that the Chrystal allowed for much faster slipspace than UNSC equipment could properly measure.

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Do check the timeline:
https://www.halopedia.org/2552#cite_ref-29
The events from latter half of First Strike happen before events of Halo CE...

and then Bungie decided that wasn't good enough and implied that the information came from the Forerunner ship on Reach (and to reconcile it I guess you can say that Cortana used both.)

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Man, i completely forgot that part of Reach.

 

[SlightlyLive]

Whatever happen to ONI's bioterror plans involving the Sangheili crops?

 

[m23]

As SlightlyLive intimated above, though, I think after the CEA mystery ship the next biggest plot thread left is where 343GS/Chakas got off to after the events of Primordium.

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Oh yeah, I forgot about that, he was supposed to go find the Librarian.

 

[Trup1aya]

Do check the timeline:
https://www.halopedia.org/2552#cite_ref-29
The events from latter half of First Strike happen before events of Halo CE...


Man, i completely forgot that part of Reach.

Click to shrink...

That timeline confused me lol. THANKS! I guess I need to read it again.

 

[Deleted member 2507]

Now, i tend to call anything with time travel a mess (because of all the paradoxes) but its even worse when it is never referred to again. I mean, Forerunner crystals enable time travel, evidently, though it is plausible it was not the intended effect. The Forerunners must have been familiar with temporal manipulation though, during their prime their massive use of slipspace caused problems due to "causal reconciliation" or something like that, and they did have stasis fields that would allow accelerated aging for example. And why didn't anyone in the UNSC ever note that the Chief's and Cortana's logs and timeline of events don't add up to without time travel? The obvious answer to "why not again" is the lack of suitable crystal for that, but no one asking questions is weird all the same.

Amusingly, Halo CE kind of left open a possibility for Bungie to incorporate time travel to Halo (wouldn't be their first time, Marathon series comes to mind). "Why do you hesitate to do what you've already done?" Spark asks the Chief...
Of course, that statement can be explained in many ways, such as rampancy or Spark just not really bothering to tell meatbags apart. But the door most certainly was there.

 

[Trup1aya]

Now, i tend to call anything with time travel a mess (because of all the paradoxes) but its even worse when it is never referred to again. I mean, Forerunner crystals enable time travel, evidently, though it is plausible it was not the intended effect. The Forerunners must have been familiar with temporal manipulation though, during their prime their massive use of slipspace caused problems due to "causal reconciliation" or something like that, and they did have stasis fields that would allow accelerated aging for example. And why didn't anyone in the UNSC ever note that the Chief's and Cortana's logs and timeline of events don't add up to without time travel? The obvious answer to "why not again" is the lack of suitable crystal for that, but no one asking questions is weird all the same.

Amusingly, Halo CE kind of left open a possibility for Bungie to incorporate time travel to Halo (wouldn't be their first time, Marathon series comes to mind). "Why do you hesitate to do what you've already done?" Spark asks the Chief...
Of course, that statement can be explained in many ways, such as rampancy or Spark just not really bothering to tell meatbags apart. But the door most certainly was there.

Click to shrink...

oh I gotcha. I've got a soft spot for time travel after experiencing quantum break (still can't find a plot hole in that one). But it seems like Halo was probably wise to decline to dig deeper - I don't know if they could handle how complex the writing would need to be to get it right.

I'm I rememberimg correctly that there are other forerunner time manipulation devices. Like they could create areas where time moves slower than real-time.