What the heck lol
So he's also a pandemic unbeliever?
He's full package of far right
This is a good watch, along with the rest of the "Why Are You So Angry" playlist by Innuendo StudiosI don't fully understand what gamergate was/is... from what I read on Wikipedia it was like a bunch of gamers and developers who were shaming female journalists for writing about misogyny or something?
But it's also some identification of a bunch of boomers who make "memes" and cyber bullying using homophobia, transphobia, misogyny, ableism and racism and attack feminists, LGBTQ and any progressive game? And also steps to support sexual assaulters, bigots and fascist politicians like Trump and Bolsonaro?
If someone that's familiar with it cares to explain, I'll really appreciate.
Either way, fuck them, there is no way to tolerate those kind of people having any spotlight.
Barrel of laughs...
It feels too soon to laugh at this and yet I did anyway
lmao
This is a good watch, along with the rest of the "Why Are You So Angry" playlist by Innuendo Studios
It was a movement started by 4chan raids to harass women basically. "Ethics in games journalism" was a shield to deflect criticism and pick up angry gamers, such as their "Angry Jack" example of how an average disillusioned and insecure person starts to build contempt for things that don't affect them because it makes them feel like they're "forced" to reflect on themselves. People like vegans, environmentalists, people who don't drink, etc, it gets them thinking, "if they think they're good, does that make me bad? Are they judging me?".
I also don't see the merit in banning discussion of games like this. Era is one of the only places you can openly talk about issues like this without a million gators jumping down your throat, and realistically it's reach is not big enough to move the needle for 'promotion' ie sales just by having a game be discussed a lot. The discussion out in the open outweighs it just being swept under the rug and invisible imo.
You can have discussions around Rowling and a notice in a sticky making people aware as to a decision made and why, alongside staff posts in subsequent locked threads that may pop up, without allowing for a stream of adoration and glee toward the IP and associated products. The notion that you must allow for complete discussion of something to educate people via is false. There are bookstores that have stopped stocking her books. They didn't have an onus to continue supporting her work in order to educate others, not sure why there would be one here.If it wasn't for discussion on here I wouldn't know about many of these issues. I don't really use Twitter and don't spend free time researching into things like these anyways. I don't typically know popular gamer YouTube people, etc.
I won't be supporting for reasons that everyone else has hammered home a million times (just like I won't buy Cyberpunk) but I do support discussion of games to be allowed even ones that have known issues like those two.
The problem with this game is that while the game itself doesn't really have the issues, literally anyone that buys the game is giving money to groups that straight up don't want anyone trans to exist. Even with Cyberpunk, there isn't an actual known TERF that is one of the heads of the game.If it wasn't for discussion on here I wouldn't know about many of these issues. I don't really use Twitter and don't spend free time researching into things like these anyways. I don't typically know popular gamer YouTube people, etc.
I won't be supporting for reasons that everyone else has hammered home a million times (just like I won't buy Cyberpunk) but I do support discussion of games to be allowed even ones that have known issues like those two.
You can have discussions around Rowling and a notice in a sticky making people aware as to a decision made and why, alongside staff posts in subsequent locked threads that may pop up, without allowing for a stream of adoration and glee toward the IP and associated products.
The problem with this game is that while the game itself doesn't really have the issues, literally anyone that buys the game is giving money to groups that straight up don't want anyone trans to exist. Even with Cyberpunk, there isn't an actual known TERF that is one of the heads of the game.
Not sure if you're being serious but I'm assuming you understand there's a line between banning topics around the game and raising awareness as to why the game was banned, and allowing the usual foray of threads around a game that you would usual see. This is in addition to Etcetera threads on Rowling and any ongoing moves she makes around trans lives. That's what I said in what you responded to, as there should be a notice of the decision made and an explanation with links to learn more on the issue.But if you ban discussion of everything around an item then this thread shouldn't exist nor should any topic about the game. And I'm going to guess a lot of people have made their decision not to support this game based on threads like these. I just don't see how instantly deleting or banning everything related to the game makes sense. It seems like ok no one talk about this game isn't going to be helpful to that end.
It comes from having been in most of those threads and an awareness of what they have been like, and what an anticipated OT for the game would be like on release.Also I'm not sure where the endless adoration and glee is coming from. I haven't followed every possible thread but lots of the ones I've been in have been filled with people saying they won't buy the game and why. In this thread you've got a very small amount of people saying they still plan to buy it and an overwhelmingly large amount saying they won't support it me included.
Not sure if you're being serious but you must understand there's a line between banning topics around the game and raising awareness as to why the game was banned, in addition to Etcetera threads on Rowling and any ongoing moves she makes around trans lives. That's literally what I said in what you responded to, as there should be a notice of the decision made and an explanation with links to learn more on the issue.
It comes from having been in most threads and an awareness of what they have been like, and what an anticipated OT for the game would be like on release.
I'm just reiterating my last post at this point but again, you can raise awareness of issues and why general discussions around the game itself have been blocked.
But if you ban discussion of everything around an item then this thread shouldn't exist nor should any topic about the game.
I'm merely saying this is a discussion board and if one is trying to limit the amount of money made off a hateful IP I'm not sure saying no one is allowed to talk about it is the way to go. I think discussions of the issues with the game have lead to less support on here and not more.
Yeh I broke it down in an edit but was a little too late, and Messofanego covers it above.yes I was largely commenting on the people saying can we ban discussion of this game. I'm saying that the discussions of the game on here so far have probably diminished the sales of the game from Era users, not enhanced them. I could be wrong, just judging by the threads I've been in. Some people on Era are going to buy the game and it doesn't matter what discussion is or isn't allowed. Just like everyone not on Era. But some people also may not buy the game the more they learn of those issues through threads such as these.
So when I hear ban discussion of the game I just wonder if that's the right move to make. This is discussion of the game and from the way the thread has gone and the overwhelming majority of responses it doesn't seem as if it is enhancing sales or anything.
Maybe it's splitting hairs as to what people actually mean when they say ban discussion of it or what I'm taking from that comment. If someone is saying don't have a celebratory OP about all the kick ass things I would be on board with that thinking.
When most people are advocating for a ban on the game they mean they don't want to see general threads about it. Not that they would be opposed to a staff thread highlighting why a ban was put in place. One which would cover a lot of what Rowling has done up until now in damaging trans lives, and links to understand more.
But if you ban discussion of everything around an item then this thread shouldn't exist nor should any topic about the game. And I'm going to guess a lot of people have made their decision not to support this game based on threads like these. I just don't see how instantly deleting or banning everything related to the game makes sense. It seems like ok no one talk about this game isn't going to be helpful to that end.
Also I'm not sure where the endless adoration and glee is coming from. I haven't followed every possible thread but lots of the ones I've been in have been filled with people saying they won't buy the game and why. In this thread you've got a very small amount of people saying they still plan to buy it and an overwhelmingly large amount saying they won't support it me included.
I get that places ban her books and all that and I support that if it's what those owners want to do. I'm merely saying this is a discussion board and if one is trying to limit the amount of money made off a hateful IP I'm not sure saying no one is allowed to talk about it is the way to go. I think discussions of the issues with the game have lead to less support on here and not more.
The problem with this game is that while the game itself doesn't really have the issues, literally anyone that buys the game is giving money to groups that straight up don't want anyone trans to exist. Even with Cyberpunk, there isn't an actual known TERF that is one of the heads of the game.
You're not wrong at all and I was just being matter of fact, I meant the overt bullshit that Cyberpunk has, but Hogwarts could have sinister messages that are just more buried.How do you know the game itself doesn't really have issues?
Based on everything so far, I'm expecting the first quest to go something like this:
1. A kid is sorted into a particular house.
2. They discover that they don't really want to belong to that house and try to change to another house
3. They then learn that they can't change to another house and are wrong for thinking that was possible. So they happily accept that the house they were assigned to was correct and apologise to everybody else.
As for this guy, he sounds like such a shitbag that you have to wonder how much involvement he has. Like he once delivered a coffee (already cold with the wrong amount of sugar) to a conference room, took out a whiteboard marker and corrected the punctuation on a sentence hastily scribbled up.
linked in updated, LEAD DESIGNER
This is a good watch, along with the rest of the "Why Are You So Angry" playlist by Innuendo Studios
It was a movement started by 4chan raids to harass women basically. "Ethics in games journalism" was a shield to deflect criticism and pick up angry gamers, such as their "Angry Jack" example of how an average disillusioned and insecure person starts to build contempt for things that don't affect them because it makes them feel like they're "forced" to reflect on themselves. People like vegans, environmentalists, people who don't drink, etc, it gets them thinking, "if they think they're good, does that make me bad? Are they judging me?".
Thank you both very much. Amazing video and article.Marcelo Guimaraes It was also a proto alt right movement, almost like a rehearsal for the eventual campaign and movement that led to Trump becoming President.
Steve Bannon was the chairman of Breitbart News and eventual WH strategist/campaign strategist to Trump.
What Gamergate should have taught us about the 'alt-right'
The 2014 online hate-storm presaged the tactics of the Trump-loving far right movement. Prominent critics of the president elect should take notewww.theguardian.com
Don't forget the Hogwarts poll where the vast majority of users here said JKR's transphobic statements didn't affect their decision about the game, so there would likely be a lot of bigots trolling the topics and trying to silence critics in OTs.
yes I was largely commenting on the people saying can we ban discussion of this game. I'm saying that the discussions of the game on here so far have probably diminished the sales of the game from Era users, not enhanced them. I could be wrong, just judging by the threads I've been in. Some people on Era are going to buy the game and it doesn't matter what discussion is or isn't allowed. Just like everyone not on Era. But some people also may not buy the game the more they learn of those issues through threads such as these.
So when I hear ban discussion of the game I just wonder if that's the right move to make. This is discussion of the game and from the way the thread has gone and the overwhelming majority of responses it doesn't seem as if it is enhancing sales or anything.
Maybe it's splitting hairs as to what people actually mean when they say ban discussion of it or what I'm taking from that comment. If someone is saying don't have a celebratory OP about all the kick ass things I would be on board with that thinking.
It's also not as linear or analytical as 'make game sell less'. This is something that has a tangible impact on the lives of trans people and the arguments of not wanting to see the IP supported and given exposure here stand aside from any belief that we can somehow make a dent in the sales of the game. There's merit to it without judging it against that because it should come as no surprise that issues affecting a minority are often cared about by a minority of people.
A ban of a game OT or sales threads doesn't mean these kind of critical threads get banned. People are not asking for banning of all the kinds of Hogwarts threads, including the critical ones. Just wanted to let you know that.
Don't forget the Hogwarts poll where the vast majority of users here said JKR's transphobic statements didn't affect their decision about the game, so there would likely be a lot of bigots trolling the topics and trying to silence critics in OTs.
Mods can pin a non-replyable thread titled "Discussion of Hogwart's Legacy is banned due to extreme bigotry on part of its creators" and a laundry list of the shit Rowling and Leavitt have done in its body. Boom, problem solved, awareness achieved without the need for discussion.
It's signal boosting that the guy is a complete chud but not much else.At the same time if you're not going to have discussion about the game isn't this type of OP just signal boosting awful stuff? 2
This game is cursed, at this point I don't know if they can turn it around to certain crowds.
It's gonna be a hell of a marketing budget to bury this shit to the general public.
The "hypocrite/no ethical consumption" kind of attitudes, perpetuate the idea of always doing nothing, and is trite, toxic, cynical, defeatist garbage, an active obstacle for betterment.
No one can ethically oppose everything perfectly, so trying to chastise people for not doing that is daft, shitty nonsense.
I have little respect for people who try to shit on people who attempt to help others in some capacity.
And there is always value to doing something. Certainly more than doing nothing.
If doing an ethical consumerism makes you a hypocrite then you should be a proud one.
We didn't really had a big release/product from the franchise since JK reveal as a TERF. It's too soon to guess it's effects. WB is going to keep making the movies because money, if it's gonna be worth it...time will tell.The general public is a bunch of people who will go "Cool Wizard Game", think that it'll allow them to revive the wonder of childhood, and gladly pay money for this. Those who do know about these individuals being involved with it will also, by and large, do the same. That's how the mediocre Fantastic Beasts movies keep getting made, after all.
I thank you for sharing, and also second the calls for this post to be threadmarked.This is disappointing. I've worked with Troy in the past. I wasn't aware of his politics. I know it says he's the lead designer but from my understanding he was always more of a producer/project manager. I don't know if that makes it any better. I'm not 100% sure what the team structure is over at Avalanche these days, but my understanding was that Alan Tew was the lead designer on the Hogwart's game. His linkedin lists him as a lead designer at WB in SLC. Same as Troy. I don't know if they have multiple lead designers on the project or they have other projects in development other than Hogwart's or what. For some projects you'll have a bunch of lead designers with each over a particular feature of the game and then maybe a creative director over the whole game. I'm not sure if that's how they're arranged there or what.
I know Alan Tew is a really good guy though. Very quiet, thoughtful and humble. A really good lead designer. I always had a lot of respect for him. I'm not sure of his politics, but I'm doubtful he's a right wing/gamer gate guy. He never seemed like the type. He was always very considerate of everyone on the team. So not everyone there as a lead on the team is a douche. There are some good people there.
HOWEVER... there have been a lot of comments about how a studio could employ someone like Troy who seems very publicly out about some obviously controversial (and by our standards ugly) viewpoints. The sad truth about Avalanche is while there are no doubt probably some people working there on the team with more progressive viewpoints, from my understanding a lot of the rot goes straight to the top. From what I've been told about the studio is that there's a lot of cronyism there and it's very top heavy with a lot of guys who are part of the "boy's club." I did hear a particularly ugly story about John Blackburn who's the studio head. I wasn't there so this is hearsay, but I trust where the story came from. Basically, Blackburn had some of the team management out for lunch one day and for some reason he decided it would be a good idea to go around the table and have everyone throw names out of people at the studio they thought were secretly gay and in the closet. What he didn't know was there was someone actually there at the table who wasn't out and was completely embarrassed and mortified by the whole thing. Totally unprofessional. That was back when Disney owned the studio and my understanding was that Disney HR ended up having to get involved.
So I wouldn't describe the studio management there as being very LGBTQ+ friendly. So given all of that I'm not too terribly surprised about this news.
Yes. Just because you can't deal with every injustice in the world doesn't mean you shouldn't try to deal with any injustice in the world.The "hypocrite/no ethical consumption" kind of attitudes, perpetuate the idea of always doing nothing, and is trite, toxic, cynical, defeatist garbage, an active obstacle for betterment.
No one can ethically oppose everything perfectly, so trying to chastise people for not doing that is daft, shitty nonsense.
I have little respect for people who try to shit on people who attempt to help others in some capacity.
And there is always value to doing something. Certainly more than doing nothing.
If doing an ethical consumerism makes you a hypocrite then you should be a proud one.
Just boosting this so more people can see it.I don't know how much this will count for, and apologies in advance for, uh, backseat moderation or whatever this is considered as, but my two cents here is that talking about one single videogame should not ever trump the confort and wellbeing of our transgender members. There's hundreds of sites that people wanting to discuss the game can go; I'm sure it will have its own subreddit, discord, etc. This game should not have a place in Era, especially after the CP2077 thread debacle.
I understand it's a tougher choice for the mod team than it is to me to condemnt it, with potential future ramifications for the board, but every choice is a sacrifice and I think we as a community should start putting our actions where our mouths are.
See above.When most people are advocating for a ban on the game they mean they don't want to see general threads about it. Not that they would be opposed to a staff thread highlighting why a ban was put in place. One which would cover a lot of what Rowling has done up until now in damaging trans lives, and links to understand more.
"But we have to support the developers and not the hateful creators!"
Thank youHey all,
The staff is going to be talking over how to handle this game. For now, please try to keep discussion civil. We'll let everyone know once we've had a chance to have that talk.
Maybe this should be threadmarked, if Belmont is alright with that.
Like this.Why because one of them is an absolute dipshit? When more than 50% of a team is like that it is for me valid to not support a game. Not when one out of hundreds is
I'm not opposed to that if people find the information helpful. I also updated my post as it looks like Troy has changed his job title to senior producer so I spoke to that as well.
I was, for one, shocked at these poll results
A ban of a game OT or sales threads doesn't mean these kind of critical threads get banned. People are not asking for banning of all the kinds of Hogwarts threads, including the critical ones. Just wanted to let you know that.
Don't forget the Hogwarts poll where the vast majority of users here said JKR's transphobic statements didn't affect their decision about the game, so there would likely be a lot of bigots trolling the topics and trying to silence critics in OTs.
So the guy who makes videos talking about how women are ruining the game industry is a senior producer at a game studio managing women on his project.
What an amazing place Avalanche must be to work as a woman.
This will be a good test to see how many people will continue to bust a gut to defend this game.
Like this.
50% is the number before you can boycott this guilt-free, everyone.
Why because one of them is an absolute dipshit? When more than 50% of a team is like that it is for me valid to not support a game. Not when one out of hundreds is
Implying the woman has any sort of morals lolAnti-feminist? I wonder if you could get JK Rowling to fight to get him off the project.