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Horror Fan Era: Eternally Overlooked
- Thread starter Hex
- Start date
Yikes. I usually really like Joe Bob's shows because I find them funny and entertaining, but yeah...
he was doing a bit of that during the halloween specials, but they were never overbearing or flat out offensive, unless he's gotten worse since then I'm not too worried. he just seems like an old grump and less a hard right political figure.
Hoo boy. That...that was bad...
Ooookay, so...first things first: I can't tell you how long it's been since I've been to a straight up horror film on opening weekend. I've forgotten how fun the audience reactions around you can be. Unfortunately this movie didn't give me a ton of that. The Grudge (2020) is basically a prequel/midquel to The Grudge (2004). As a result the story takes place in the mid 00's. It actually starts with a character who Yoko from the 2004 movie replaced as a caretaker nope-ing the fuck out of Kayako's house and moving back to the states. From there the main plot follows a detective as she follows the history of the house for no real reason other than morbid curiosity.
A sizeable amount of the movie is flashbacks that are told out of order. Basically the detective story is a framing device and as she's looking at pictures in the case file you get blue skidooed into the photo to live that event. That's pretty obviously a callback to the out of order storytelling of the original and the 2004 film. You'll find that there are a LOT of callbacks to those...some might say so many that this film feels less like a story happening parallel to the 2004 film and more like a 3rd reboot except even more of the Asian cast was replaced with white people.
But I think the greatest negative of this movie is that it's boring. I was bored to literal tears in this film. It felt like I was in the theater for hours and the movie's only an hour and a half long (I checked my phone at around the 1hr 5 mins mark). The curse and ghosts in this one are so watered down. They're trying so desperately hard to be scary through the same jumpscare that gets used so many times you'd swear that they only filmed it once and then the actress had to leave so they just copy pasted it all over the movie. Kayako in the old movies was freaky but it didn't have anything to do with rotting-decayed flesh. Her unnatural movements, death rattle, and constantly wide open eyes were more than enough to make you uneasy, and Toshio's super huge cat scream did the job as well. The ghosts in this look like the child of The Ring and Amityville Horror, but in a bad way. Also the ghosts in the old films were a lot more to the point. They'd scare you but there was no question that if they caught you they were going to kill your ass (sometimes only a few minutes/hours of you entering the house). Here, the ghosts drag out everything for so long that you start to wonder how some of these people have been alive in the fuckin' house for so long. And then the movie just...ends. People in my theater were looking around wondering what happened when the credits rolled. The whole thing just felt so uninspired. They could've done something amazing and they opted to remake The Grudge 1 inside of The Grudge 2 but not as good.
My only positive are the practical effects. It's Raimi-produced so you're gonna get what you're looking for in that regard.
Ooookay, so...first things first: I can't tell you how long it's been since I've been to a straight up horror film on opening weekend. I've forgotten how fun the audience reactions around you can be. Unfortunately this movie didn't give me a ton of that. The Grudge (2020) is basically a prequel/midquel to The Grudge (2004). As a result the story takes place in the mid 00's. It actually starts with a character who Yoko from the 2004 movie replaced as a caretaker nope-ing the fuck out of Kayako's house and moving back to the states. From there the main plot follows a detective as she follows the history of the house for no real reason other than morbid curiosity.
A sizeable amount of the movie is flashbacks that are told out of order. Basically the detective story is a framing device and as she's looking at pictures in the case file you get blue skidooed into the photo to live that event. That's pretty obviously a callback to the out of order storytelling of the original and the 2004 film. You'll find that there are a LOT of callbacks to those...some might say so many that this film feels less like a story happening parallel to the 2004 film and more like a 3rd reboot except even more of the Asian cast was replaced with white people.
But I think the greatest negative of this movie is that it's boring. I was bored to literal tears in this film. It felt like I was in the theater for hours and the movie's only an hour and a half long (I checked my phone at around the 1hr 5 mins mark). The curse and ghosts in this one are so watered down. They're trying so desperately hard to be scary through the same jumpscare that gets used so many times you'd swear that they only filmed it once and then the actress had to leave so they just copy pasted it all over the movie. Kayako in the old movies was freaky but it didn't have anything to do with rotting-decayed flesh. Her unnatural movements, death rattle, and constantly wide open eyes were more than enough to make you uneasy, and Toshio's super huge cat scream did the job as well. The ghosts in this look like the child of The Ring and Amityville Horror, but in a bad way. Also the ghosts in the old films were a lot more to the point. They'd scare you but there was no question that if they caught you they were going to kill your ass (sometimes only a few minutes/hours of you entering the house). Here, the ghosts drag out everything for so long that you start to wonder how some of these people have been alive in the fuckin' house for so long. And then the movie just...ends. People in my theater were looking around wondering what happened when the credits rolled. The whole thing just felt so uninspired. They could've done something amazing and they opted to remake The Grudge 1 inside of The Grudge 2 but not as good.
My only positive are the practical effects. It's Raimi-produced so you're gonna get what you're looking for in that regard.
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Hey thanks for this! Because of the X-Men title, I had completely overlooked this movie as this kind of stuff usually don't interest me. But now I'm really intrigued. The trailer is great.
Really? How? I thought the studio had disowned the very existence of this movie. Which I think is a shame because the director, Craig Zobel, can really do interesting things.
Edit: Never mind, lol! I read too quickly. You're talking about Haunt, not Hunt. lol!! And yeah, I really liked Haunt as well. There's something about the Halloween haunted house theme that I always liked, and this one is very well done.
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I'm still rather bemused by the F cinemascore for The Grudge. It's run of the mill. There's nothing especially bad, or especially controversial, or divisive or whatever. Nothing that would put it on a list with Fear Dot Com, The Wicker Man (remake), mother! or Bug (the latter two which I love, but which I get why they went over so badly with average audiences).
It's not as bad as US movies The Grudge 2 or The Grudge 3. But that's a stupidly low bar. Ju-On: The Grudge 2 remains my favorite. I haven't seen any of the Japanese ones beyond that mind, but it sounds like other than fun Sadako vs Kayako monster mash ups that I haven't missed much.
I expected more from the director of The Eyes of my Mother, let's put it that way.
It's not as bad as US movies The Grudge 2 or The Grudge 3. But that's a stupidly low bar. Ju-On: The Grudge 2 remains my favorite. I haven't seen any of the Japanese ones beyond that mind, but it sounds like other than fun Sadako vs Kayako monster mash ups that I haven't missed much.
I expected more from the director of The Eyes of my Mother, let's put it that way.
Saw Grudge (2020) on Friday and unfortunately, I have to mostly agree with the reviews above. I don't think it's going to bring about the resurgence of the late 90's/early 2000's J-horror trend I was hoping for...
This film got the feel of the previous Grudge/Ju-On films mostly correct, but it really stumbled on the content. The movie relies on jump scares, yet few of them are actually scary. The ghosts get a fair amount of screen time, but their makeup isn't particularly effective and their appearances are predictable and flat (the ghost of the husband just looks like some dude with a beer gut and chocolate on his face or something). The expository dialog is dumbed-down and unintentionally funny at some points ("There's something wrong with that house... it's been GRUDGED!"). They also seem to have misread some key points from the original films. In the original Ju-On/Grudge, the croaking sound Kayako's ghost made was explained by the fact that her neck had been broken. In The Grudge (2020), all of the ghosts seem to make the same sound, and the only one who appeared to have a broken neck is the husband. The plot device of the curse escaping Japan and coming back to America was already functionally the plot of Grudge 2 and 3, where it was explained better.
All that being said, there were still things to like about this film. The look of the film is bleak and grimy throughout. I've previously described the original Ju-On/Grudge films as "apocalyptic"; hope is generally quickly dashed, and most of the films end with nobody making it out alive. Grudge (2020) nails that atmosphere perfectly. While the movie is never really scary, it's constantly unnerving and uncomfortable. The characters are all dealing with life issues weighing heavily on their psyche even before setting their foot inside the cursed house. The acting was quite well done across the board, with Lin Shaye and Andrea Riseborough standing out in particular. They also effectively used the "intersecting stories played out over a fragmented timeline" idea from the previous Grudge films which I appreciated. However, this probably didn't win them any points with the mass audience, who complained about the original Grudge films as being confusing and hard to follow. There are also some decent gore effects, and probably the gnarliest looking desiccated corpses I've seen in a film in years.
All in all, I liked it enough that I hope Ghost House pushes for a sequel (which I believe could be much better). The foundation was there, the film just drops the ball in terms of plotting and payoffs. All in all, I liked it more than Grudge 3, less than Grudge 1 + 2, and much less than the Juon films.
And man... I hate to wave the Japanese language flag, but there are 2 kanji in Juon. One of them means "curse" and the other means "grudge". The implication is that it is a curse caused by a grudge, not the other way around. In fact, back when the original fansubs of the direct-to-video installments were made in the early 2000's, they were titled "Grudge Curse". Anyway, the point of going into all this shit is the original house was "cursed", not "grudged". The former sounds like a line spoken in countless haunted house movies, the latter sounds like a funny way of shoehorning the title of the film into an explanation of the phenomenon.
This film got the feel of the previous Grudge/Ju-On films mostly correct, but it really stumbled on the content. The movie relies on jump scares, yet few of them are actually scary. The ghosts get a fair amount of screen time, but their makeup isn't particularly effective and their appearances are predictable and flat (the ghost of the husband just looks like some dude with a beer gut and chocolate on his face or something). The expository dialog is dumbed-down and unintentionally funny at some points ("There's something wrong with that house... it's been GRUDGED!"). They also seem to have misread some key points from the original films. In the original Ju-On/Grudge, the croaking sound Kayako's ghost made was explained by the fact that her neck had been broken. In The Grudge (2020), all of the ghosts seem to make the same sound, and the only one who appeared to have a broken neck is the husband. The plot device of the curse escaping Japan and coming back to America was already functionally the plot of Grudge 2 and 3, where it was explained better.
All that being said, there were still things to like about this film. The look of the film is bleak and grimy throughout. I've previously described the original Ju-On/Grudge films as "apocalyptic"; hope is generally quickly dashed, and most of the films end with nobody making it out alive. Grudge (2020) nails that atmosphere perfectly. While the movie is never really scary, it's constantly unnerving and uncomfortable. The characters are all dealing with life issues weighing heavily on their psyche even before setting their foot inside the cursed house. The acting was quite well done across the board, with Lin Shaye and Andrea Riseborough standing out in particular. They also effectively used the "intersecting stories played out over a fragmented timeline" idea from the previous Grudge films which I appreciated. However, this probably didn't win them any points with the mass audience, who complained about the original Grudge films as being confusing and hard to follow. There are also some decent gore effects, and probably the gnarliest looking desiccated corpses I've seen in a film in years.
All in all, I liked it enough that I hope Ghost House pushes for a sequel (which I believe could be much better). The foundation was there, the film just drops the ball in terms of plotting and payoffs. All in all, I liked it more than Grudge 3, less than Grudge 1 + 2, and much less than the Juon films.
And man... I hate to wave the Japanese language flag, but there are 2 kanji in Juon. One of them means "curse" and the other means "grudge". The implication is that it is a curse caused by a grudge, not the other way around. In fact, back when the original fansubs of the direct-to-video installments were made in the early 2000's, they were titled "Grudge Curse". Anyway, the point of going into all this shit is the original house was "cursed", not "grudged". The former sounds like a line spoken in countless haunted house movies, the latter sounds like a funny way of shoehorning the title of the film into an explanation of the phenomenon.
That's a name I haven't heard in conversation in a long time...it was one of those 00s movies I rented from the video store because the cover looked scary, like Boogeyman
For me it's because it was boring. Very, very boring. The parts that had nothing to do with the ghosts were the most interesting things, which ironically is what would save it from getting a solid F for me (I'd go with a D).
The initial setup is actually EXTREMELY similar to The Grudge 2. American woman goes to Japan, gets cursed, brings it with her, her home becomes the new curse and dooms everyone else living there.
The title drop almost got a chuckle out of me because there's no way to get that in without sounding silly.
I also realized that the old films were PG-13 and still managed to pull better scares than this one, though this one does make use of its R rating
Lin Shaye exploding when she hit the floor was pretty brutal, though I question why she was allowed to roam the hospital unattended. The assisted suicide woman packing her suitcase after the husband gives that heartfelt speech was fuckin' hilarious though, and even the "He tried to kill me!" line from Lin Shaye got a bit of a chuckle from me because hey, she's not wrong.
But yeah, it's just not a good horror film. It's not scary. Not even really that suspenseful either. It's also kind of ironic that we see so little of the originator of the curse in that house. All the other victims get their backstories and lives and personal tragedies fleshed out, but you get maybe 2 minutes with the original owners of that house, if even that much
Totally agreed. I think I liked it a little more than you did, but the horror scenes were flat. Everything surrounding them was effectively unnerving (the Lin Shaye story being the best by far), but the actual scares themselves didn't really work.
Yup, except in the Grudge 2 everything made more sense and was presented better.
Kayako herself actually escaped and followed Allison to America after cursing whatever the hell Amber Tamblyn's character's name was to take her place in the house. In this one Kayako just follows another random home care worker to America, curses her with her rage, then jets back? I mean, I get that in this one it's implied that Kayako's rage possessed the home care worker and caused her to kill her family, creating a new curse with the home care worker and her family as the new ghosts... but from what was established in the other movies, that seems like it should be secondary? Like Kayako was still the main threat in Grudge 2 even though the US family was driven to kill each other. And I agree, if they wanted to establish the first family created a new curse, they needed to spend more time with them. Like had they shown how things degenerated to the point where the wife killed the husband, I might have been able to buy a new curse being created. Only spending about 2 minutes total with the central family before they were ghosts really hurt the story.
Yeah, it was just a bad line. There were definitely audible chuckles in my theatre for that one (including mine). Poor William Sadler.
Yeah, I enjoyed pretty much everything involving the Lin Shaye substory. I thought that story was pretty well done and contained the only semi-effective scares of the whole film. That's what makes me hope this one does well enough for Ghosthouse to consider a sequel. They got the tone more or less right, they just dropped the ball on actually bringing everything together and making it scary.
One thing that bugged me was the twist at the end of Andrea Riseborough's story, where she uses the "what do we do when we're scared?" line to reveal that the ghost was pretending to be her son. I mean, given the situation, you'd think the first time her son failed to immediately say "close our eyes and count to 5", it would have been enough. Did she really need to repeat the question 2 more times? That whole scene was just such a poor climax.
I just watched the 2019 remake of Jacob's Ladder. And wow... How could they take that great source material and spew this utterly boring movie?
It's like they made the whole thing following a checklist. Weird visions in the subway? Check! People moving weirdly fast? Check! Everything was just soulless, monotonous, and devoid of any fun. They did twist the original story a bit, but it didn't really add anything to the original idea, and it was just so uninteresting.
As far as I'm concerned this remake doesn't exist, and the only Jacob's Ladder is the brilliant 1990 movie.
It's like they made the whole thing following a checklist. Weird visions in the subway? Check! People moving weirdly fast? Check! Everything was just soulless, monotonous, and devoid of any fun. They did twist the original story a bit, but it didn't really add anything to the original idea, and it was just so uninteresting.
As far as I'm concerned this remake doesn't exist, and the only Jacob's Ladder is the brilliant 1990 movie.
In The Grudge 2 she curses Allison's neighbors with rage (and insanity? Whatever causes you to drink milk straight from the jug then vomit it back in) so I knew she could do it but she's still a presence beyond doing just that. In this movie, it's implied that that's exclusively how she deals with people; curses them with rage, has them kill family and then themselves, then lets them take it from there as a ghost. Maybe she didn't have a sitter for Toshio, I dunno. I also don't understand why the originator of the States curse felt the need to show the cop what happened instead of dealing with her right then and there. When they tried burning down the house in the first film, during both attempts Kayako and Toshio actively attempted to stop them. In this one the girl tries the fake out but never much beyond that.
Also was the shot at the end a reveal that her house was actually John Cho's house the whole time? Or that she moved into John Cho's house? She didn't know that with all the snooping she did?
Also was the shot at the end a reveal that her house was actually John Cho's house the whole time? Or that she moved into John Cho's house? She didn't know that with all the snooping she did?
I was hoping so much for the twist to be
that it was totally her son and he was just in shock. I know it's been done before in other films but I figured it would've been a payoff to the point of the curse as well as the incredibly stupid decision to bring her son to the ghost house instead of leaving him with her partner for a few hours
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Yeah, but Alison's neighbors didn't come back as ghosts to haunt the apartment building. All the Juon/Grudge movies implied Kayako's influence could hit people associated with the people that were cursed, but new ghosts didn't seem to be created (besides Amber Tamblyn who Grudge 2 implied was forced to stand in for Kayako while she went on a US tour). I'm not calling this out as a mistake by the new film or anything, they can expand the lore all they want. I'm just of the same opinion as you, if they were going to go that route the movie needed to spend more time with the original family to give the fact that a new curse had been established a little more weight.
As for the ending, I thought that was just Andrea Riseborough's house. I thought John Cho's house was more of a split level and Andrea's was more like a bungalow/trailer? I absolutely could have missed something though, the movie jumped around a lot. Maybe it did imply she moved in to John Cho's house? Though that would be kind of odd and wouldn't add much to the story. I did actually like that last shot though. With the scream and then just lingering on the house while the credits started to roll.
As for the ending, I thought that was just Andrea Riseborough's house. I thought John Cho's house was more of a split level and Andrea's was more like a bungalow/trailer? I absolutely could have missed something though, the movie jumped around a lot. Maybe it did imply she moved in to John Cho's house? Though that would be kind of odd and wouldn't add much to the story. I did actually like that last shot though. With the scream and then just lingering on the house while the credits started to roll.
That would have been much better than what we got.
[Edit for tag screwup]
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I'm glad I'm not the only person who laughs at the delivery of I'LL KEEL YEEWWW
I always laugh at his line delivery when he's in the cabin on morphine.
Wow, the movie Open Graves has one of the dumbest horror protagonists I've ever seen
So the premise of the movie is that it's Jumanji, but you can draw a card that'll kill you Final Destination-style and if you manage to win you get a wish. So the main guy manages to win and the witch of the board game shows up to grant his wish. He wishes that it was a week ago and that they had never played the game. The witch points out that this is a stupid-ass idea (her exact words were "You'll be right back where you started, no better") but he goes "nah that's what I want" so she grants his wish and he gets stuck in an infinite time loop because he didn't take his memories back with him.
How fuckin' stupid do you have to be for the main antagonist to TELL you not to do it and you do it anyway? Be like if Pinhead showed up before you solved the lament configuration and said "hey so I know you're into S&M but this isn't gonna go well if you do that" and they do it anyway. She didn't even trick him. She TOLD him what would happen.
How fuckin' stupid do you have to be for the main antagonist to TELL you not to do it and you do it anyway? Be like if Pinhead showed up before you solved the lament configuration and said "hey so I know you're into S&M but this isn't gonna go well if you do that" and they do it anyway. She didn't even trick him. She TOLD him what would happen.
Damn, midsummer scream was giving away weekend passes for $20 if you took a CPR course. I got the email at 8PM last night and didn't see it, and woke up at 8:30 this morning to check my email and they're already sold out.
Watched a review. Comparisons to The Devil Inside got tossed around which makes me curious because that's by far one of the worst horror films I've ever seen purely for how it ended, and apparently the Turning is similar, just with no URL to visit
One of the mini-reviews I read said The Grudge is no longer the worst horror movie to come out this January by a long shot.
And ouch, The Devil Inside? Man... it's got to be better than that. Even just for the cast alone. That ending was definitely one of the most hilariously antagonizing things I've ever seen in a horror movie.
The Grudge's greatest crime was being boring.
I never had much faith in The Turning being good. We were in the theater watching something else and the trailer came up and my best friend turned to me and said "That looks scary" and I told her "yeah but it's coming out in January so it's probably gonna be shit"
I DO have some degree of faith in Gretel and Hansel, though, and A Color out of Space looks good. That 2nd one actually came out today but finding a theater showing has been weird.
Did y'all know there's a pro-life horror film called The Life Zone?
It's about this crazy dude and a crazy doctor who kidnap three pregnant women in middle of having an abortion and hold them captive and force them to watch and read questionable material on abortions until it's time for them to give birth. Bare in mind that this is a PRO-LIFE film where the pro-life characters have kidnapped three pregnant women.
Anyway
It's about this crazy dude and a crazy doctor who kidnap three pregnant women in middle of having an abortion and hold them captive and force them to watch and read questionable material on abortions until it's time for them to give birth. Bare in mind that this is a PRO-LIFE film where the pro-life characters have kidnapped three pregnant women.
Anyway
Two decide to go through with giving birth and the third tries to force a miscarriage, and THEN it turns out that this is actually Hell, the other two women weren't real, the dude who kidnapped them is the devil and the woman overseeing their re-education is also in Hell for committing suicide, and the one who tried to force a miscarriage is ALSO in Hell because she died during her abortion and is doomed to get pregnant and give birth forever.
Did y'all know there's a pro-life horror film called The Life Zone?
It's about this crazy dude and a crazy doctor who kidnap three pregnant women in middle of having an abortion and hold them captive and force them to watch and read questionable material on abortions until it's time for them to give birth. Bare in mind that this is a PRO-LIFE film where the pro-life characters have kidnapped three pregnant women.
Anyway
Two decide to go through with giving birth and the third tries to force a miscarriage, and THEN it turns out that this is actually Hell, the other two women weren't real, the dude who kidnapped them is the devil and the woman overseeing their re-education is also in Hell for committing suicide, and the one who tried to force a miscarriage is ALSO in Hell because she died during her abortion and is doomed to get pregnant and give birth forever.
That almost sounds like a parody of a pro-life film. I might have to seek this one out. Was it actually watchable?
A majority of the film is like the part of The Human Centipede where they're strapped to the hospital beds except instead of explaining the surgery they're explaining weird abortion stuff
Well, I didn't think The Turning was as bad as some people are making it out to be. The ending was nowhere near the level of The Devil Inside. I think the trouble is it was a nod to the ambiguous ending of the novel, and I doubt many of the teenagers making out in my screening had read or gave two shits about ever reading the novel.
Honestly, I'd say The Grudge vs. The Turning is pretty much a push. Neither of them are great, nor really terrible, they're both just aggressively mediocre.
Basically, the thing Kate feared most was going batshit crazy like her Mom was. With the ending I think they were trying to imply that as her Mom turned around, she saw herself. Though I'll be the first to admit that a lot of factors surrounding that ending are clear as mud. It definitely felt like some narrative damage had been done on the editing table trying to cut it down to the requisite 90 min (which is par for the course with the multiplex Hollywood horror experience). The ending itself was fine though, IMO.
Honestly, I'd say The Grudge vs. The Turning is pretty much a push. Neither of them are great, nor really terrible, they're both just aggressively mediocre.
It's not great. Weird for a pro life movie to make the pro life characters the villains
I've yet to see it, but Color Out of Space seems very interesting.
I really liked this review:
Yeah, I'd like to see it as well, problem is it's only playing at the art-house cinema here and I'm not sure any of the dates this month are going to work for me.
To be honest I'm actually dragging my heels on that one a bit. As much as I like Richard Stanley and Lovecraft, I really hate the shit out of Nicholas Cage.
If you've seen Oz Perkins other movies he is a very slow burn director. I loved Blackcoats Daughter but really didn't like I Am The Pretty Thing that Lives in the House. Looking forward to this one, though. Love the fairy taleness of it all. Probably catching it Saturday.
I'd definitely like to, but it doesn't look like it's even playing in my city. Will check again tomorrow, sometimes the theater chains announce small releases really late here.
Yeah, an hour and a half slow burn makes me worry it's going to be another one of those hacked to shit studio releases. Like I think there might have been a decent movie hiding in The Turning, but I'm pretty sure most of it is sitting on the cutting room floor.
If they can't do it practically I don't think they should bother
It's a guilty pleasure of mine, mostly for the scene where the guy tries to save his friend and accidentally tears his skin off. That's some fucked up shit and is the most horrifying thing in the movie next to that girl getting the top of her finger cut off.
Then again I also don't like Stay Alive but I won't say no to watching Stay Alive when asked
Its the most nonchalant semi-dismemberment ive ever seen in a movie. I love it
Remember that scene in one of the Saw movies where they had to put as much flesh as they could into the scale and the dude was cutting off his own fat so to beat him the girl lopped off her own arm with a butcher knife? And it wasn't even in one clean sweep. She hit it the first time and it clearly hurt then she just started powering through the pain and hit it like 5 times in a row. That was probably one of the most brutal dismemberment scenes I've ever seen. I was staring at it like "DAMN"
Haha i do remember that scene! Saw has some great dismemberment scenes. Hostel, too. Especially the one during the climax of Hostel 2 :O
Just watched in the mouth of madness for the first time. What a dope movie. Felt like it should been a Stephen king novel or something, really loved the practical effects too. Wish there were more horror movies like this one.