How can there be a chunk of the Death Star on Endor despite the fact it exploded?

Oct 27, 2017
14,270
Perfect. I swear only Star Wars gets this nitpick treatment. Nobody questions all the bullshit in other movies because they’re ... movies. It’s like people think Star Wars is a documentary from along time ago in a galaxy far far away it something. It’s not a realistic sci-fi movie. It’s a fantasy. Imagine the kids in 1977 thinking like this. Jeez
LOL
I take it you've never been in a thread for a Nolan movie then
 

Burrman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,496
If there's a point where my suspension of disbelief is violated, it's that such a large piece of the Death Star made it intact all the way through the atmosphere, and that it didn't create a massive crater where it landed. Assuming this is new space age material that can resist atmospheric reentry and survive the impact, the size of it puts it on the same level as the meteor theorized to have wiped out the dinosaurs.

Do we see an extinction level impact on Endor? No.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_impactor
It sort of looks like it created that whole body of water or did major damage to the land though. But I don’t think of that stuff too much.
LOL
I take it you've never been in a thread for a Nolan movie then
Thats a little different though. If we’re talking interstellar. It’s pretty realistic overall, but eventually you have to turn the logic off in your brain at the end. Lol
I mean compare it to something like the MCU. Nobody nitpicks anything in those movies. Which is the way it should be. It’s a real life comic book.
 
Oct 29, 2017
1,892
Is it even Endor? I don't see any trees.

Anyway, it still makes more sense than exploding planets in a different solar system being visible from Takodana in Force Awakens.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
4,707
Arizona
The old explosion effect doesn’t make much sense to begin with and was limited by the technology of the day. Stop fucking overthinking shit like this, it’s outright embarrassing.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,638
Agreed.


For me it is not just that though. I hate watching older entries in a franchise with the knowledge of newer ones reusing certain bits and pieces and then instead of enjoying the old scenes, being concious of the fact that somewhere down the line in EpIX or Genisys or whatever they messed that bit up. So instead of enjoying the boom from DS2 and the victory, Han awkwardly kissing Leia and starting their relationship I'm now reminded of the inconsistency coming from Episode IX. Why were they not mortally afraid of the giant 50km piece hurling towards them at explosive speeds?
Ah well, not that anything can ever top Han and Leia's sweet start of their marriage now also foreshadowing asshole brat Vader fanboy's rule and murdering of his father..
Good, now that you’ve done all this important work, get cracking on how they fly faster than the speed of light and how their laser swords work.

The world needs your devotion to the serious topics brought up in these space documentaries from a long-dead civilization.
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,127
Toronto
I really can't fucking believe this thread. When did we all become so hyper-literal in the way we watch movies? Instead of seeing an explosion FX and realizing that it is representative of an explosion of colossal degree of destruction, we are taking that explosion FX and applying it so strictly that we are ruling out the possibility of anything that could not be rendered by blowing up a beach-ball sized model with firecrackers. That 1983 model blew up so finely that we must take it to mean that the Death Star was vaporized. Disintegrated into dust. Alderaan too, even though that's contradicted in the very same movie; there is an Alderaan debris field despite how finely that model exploded. So now we're looking at canon debris of the Death Star and instead of realizing that the representational explosion in RotJ, which was enough to sell the fact that the Death Star fucking blew up, implied the debris we are now seeing, we're instead treating this as some sort of retcon because it doesn't fit a hyper-literal view where the reality of Star Wars is only as good as the effects that render it. That's like actually making up in-universe reasons for why Jar Jar's skin became better defined between episode I and III and saying saying episode III recons how Jar Jar looks.
When Star Trek: Enterprise debuted it was met with an angry nerd brigade that was all up in arms with "If it takes place BEFORE TOS then why does it look MORE HIGH TECH?"

Because TOS was made in the '60s, with crude toggle switches and paper maché?
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,168
Just imagine that the fire and gases of the explosion expanded much faster than the gargantuan chunks could travel. They were engulfed by the explosion. Smaller pieces got launched faster. It's fine. Everything will be okay.

Also just because it may be interesting to some, the relevant piece is a little different than that image. Though we can't say how much exists under the surface of the water. It is roughly this portion of the DS2:
 

Burrman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,496
There were lots of posts complaining about one single line that Rhodey said in some recent footage released LOL

Alternatively, make a Civil War thread right now.
I’ve seen them all for the MCU.
- Thanos infinite resources
- Caps shield always comes back
- ironmans nanomachines
- wakanda charging head on
+ dozens more.

The nitpicking still isn’t even close to ST. And you’ll see a lot of the same posters complaining about SW while defending the MCU. It’s weird. They should be judged as the same type of movie and not taking them too serious. Do people feel SW is supposed to be somewhat sci-fi or something?

And what recent footage? Lol
 

Replicant

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,300
MN
Abrams has always gone for a pretty picture rather than logic when conveying planetary behaviour and spacial positioning.
What’s with the Abrams hate all of a sudden in particular with Star Wars? The Force Awakens was a fantastic return for the series and at least gave a glimpse of the prior trilogy and some world building and now we are seeing it again with remains from the OT. Seeing stuff like parts of the Death Star and broken ships is exactly what we should have been seeing in the last Jedi too, but no, we saw literally nothing but the inside of ships and a casino.
 

Almighty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,383
This thread is just one example of why I can't take the fan communities of many sci-fi movies/shows seriously. I really hate the idea that what we see on the screen is treated as some kind of documentary film and not perhaps a limitation of budget and technology of the time the movie was made. Maybe they didn't show debris because they felt that doing debris during that scene wasn't worth it or something. Instead it gets treated as proof that there couldn't possibly be any debris of such and such size.

Perfect. I swear only Star Wars gets this nitpick treatment. Nobody questions all the bullshit in other movies because they’re ... movies. It’s like people think Star Wars is a documentary from along time ago in a galaxy far far away it something. It’s not a realistic sci-fi movie. It’s a fantasy. Imagine the kids in 1977 thinking like this. Jeez
I agree the the idea behind this, but go venture into a Star Trek thread from time to time. Star Wars is hardly alone and if we include TV series then oh boy.
 

Burrman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,496
This thread is just one example of why I can't take the fan communities of many sci-fi movies/shows seriously. I really hate the idea that what we see on the screen is treated as some kind of documentary film and not perhaps a limitation of budget and technology of the time the movie was made. Maybe they didn't show debris because they felt that doing debris during that scene wasn't worth it or something. Instead it gets treated as proof that there couldn't possibly be any debris of such and such size.



I agree the the idea behind this, but go venture into a Star Trek thread from time to time. Star Wars is hardly alone and if we include TV series then oh boy.
It’s like those nerds from galaxy quest.
 

El Bombastico

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,008
OP, you're bringing logic into a film directed by JJ Abrams and written by the man who gave us Batman v Superman.

...Don't.
 

jontin

User Requested Ban
Banned
Dec 29, 2017
854
I'm still trying to figure out how I can hear the Death Star explode in space. Hopefully you all have made some headway on the debris issue by the time I'm done...
 

Almighty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,383
It’s like those nerds from galaxy quest.
Pretty much. One of my favorite scenes from the movie is when they are going though that gauntlet o death and they ask "why would you design this" and the answer is because it was in the show and no more thought was given to it by the aliens.
 

Burrman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,496
Pretty much. Once of my favorite scenes from the movie is when they are going though that gauntlet o death and they ask "why would you design this" and the answer is because it was in the show and no more thought was given to it by the aliens.
It’s a pretty great movie. Need to watch it again.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,839
Laser guns and space wizards... yet this is what you're questioning?
Contrary to popular belief, "But space wizards" is not an end all excuse for everything dumb that happens in Star Wars. Fantasy can still be consistent within its own framework. The most recognizable part of the Death Star conveniently landing on whats possibly a familar moon isnt the most questionable thing in the series, but its still pretty stupid.

ie. The scene in TPM with Anakin finding a tiny helmet and accidentally fucking shit up in the Naboo ship is excessively stupid and makes the stakes feel completely empty (especially with how serious the movie tries to go at the end). No amount of "but space wizards" makes that shit any better.
 
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kvetcha

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,985
The explosion in RotJ suffers from limitations in the f/x work of the time. Realistically, stuff doesn’t just vaporize when it explodes.
 

Drewton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,170
It's time for the ROTJ new special edition with a post-credits scene of Ewoks being wiped out by Death Star wreckage falling from the sky.
 
Jan 3, 2018
616
I hate watching older entries in a franchise with the knowledge of newer ones reusing certain bits and pieces and then instead of enjoying the old scenes, being concious of the fact that somewhere down the line in EpIX or Genisys or whatever they messed that bit up. So instead of enjoying the boom from DS2 and the victory, Han awkwardly kissing Leia and starting their relationship I'm now reminded of the inconsistency coming from Episode IX. Why were they not mortally afraid of the giant 50km piece hurling towards them at explosive speeds?
A lot of new stuff introduced in the series has contradicted other movies, some more annoying than others.

I was just rewatching ESB, and Vader never uses powers that we see him use in the prequels/Rogue One (like force-push/force-throw-dude-into ceiling) even when it would be extremely useful for him to do so. So instead of trying to manipulate Luke into the carbonite chamber, Vader could have just force-lifted him off the ground and placed him there. Or when Luke threw himself off the bridge, Vader could have force-levitated him to capture him.

And conversely, stuff introduced in the OT could mess with future films, like the whole "size matters not" philosophy. It was fine with Luke because he never became really good at using the force. But size should not be an issue with any capable Jedi we meet in the future.
 
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Burrman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,496
A lot of new stuff introduced in the series has contradicted other movies, some more annoying than others.

I was just rewatching ESB, and Vader never uses powers that we see him use in the prequels/Rogue One (like force-push/force-throw-dude-into ceiling) even when it would be extremely useful for him to do so. So instead of trying to manipulate Luke into the carbonite chamber, Vader could have just force-lifted him off the ground and placed him there. Or when Luke threw himself off the bridge, Vader could have force-levitated him to capture him.

I think it goes the other way too. Stuff introduced in the OT could affect future films, like the whole "size matters not" philosophy. It was fine with Luke because he never became really good at using the force. But size should not be an issue with any capable Jedi we meet in the future.
I don’t think Vader was really trying both those times.
 
Oct 25, 2017
16,127
So, I'm waiting for Netflix to cancel Mystery Science Theater 3000. I love that show more than anything, but I know it's coming. Fans had to literally pay to bring it back. It'll likely be the last time I ever get new MST3K. Two shots (three if you count Sci-Fi picking it up in the original run) That's it. Do I like every episode? Is the return as good as the original? No. But I knew it never would be. Because I grew up loving it as a kid. Now as an adult with a crushed spirit, so few new experiences bring me joy like the return of a fictional show that meant so much to me growing up and hoping that starry-eyed kids today would love it just as much as I did.

Then you have Star Wars. A franchise with entries out the ass and more on the way for all eternity. Movies. Spinoffs. Shows. Books. Merchandise. Theme parks. It's all there for you. Everything you could ever want.

And here we are complaining about the fucking size of Death Star debris.

Fans as joyless as this deserve absolutely nothing.
 
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Slayven

I don’t know what you’re talking about
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
37,934
So, I'm waiting for Netflix to cancel Mystery Science Theater 3000. I love that show more than anything, but I know it's coming. Fans had to literally pay to bring it back. It'll likely be the last time I ever get new MST3K. Two shots (three if you count Sci-Fi picking it up in the original run) That's it. Do I like every episode? Is the return as good as the original? No. But I knew it never would be. Because I grew up loving it as a kid. Now as an adult with a crushed spirit, so few new experiences bring me joy like the return of a fictional show that meant so much to me growing up and hoping that starry-eyed kids today would love it just as much as I did.

Then you have Star Wars. A franchise with entries out the ass with more on the way for all eternity. Movies. Spinoffs. Shows. Books. Merchandise. Theme parks. It's all there for you. Everything you could ever want.

And here we are complaining about the fucking size of Death Star debris.

Fans as joyless as this deserve absolutely nothing.
Now you know how i feel when people bring up One More Day.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,620
So, I'm waiting for Netflix to cancel Mystery Science Theater 3000. I love that show more than anything, but I know it's coming. Fans had to literally pay to bring it back. It'll likely be the last time I ever get new MST3K. Two shots (three if you count Sci-Fi picking it up in the original run) That's it. Do I like every episode? Is the return as good as the original? No. But I knew it never would be. Because I grew up loving it as a kid. Now as an adult with a crushed spirit, so few new experiences bring me joy like the return of a fictional show that meant so much to me growing up and hoping that starry-eyed kids today would love it just as much as I did.

Then you have Star Wars. A franchise with entries out the ass with more on the way for all eternity. Movies. Spinoffs. Shows. Books. Merchandise. Theme parks. It's all there for you. Everything you could ever want.

And here we are complaining about the fucking size of Death Star debris.

Fans as joyless as this deserve absolutely nothing.
Here here
 

samoyed

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,974
I enjoy nitpicking star wars more than I do star wars, this is what the franchise means to me.
 

Seeya

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,639
Did the TFA novelizations or whatever explain how Starkiller base was supposed to work after it drained its star in four shots? Was is supposed to be able to travel in hyperspace or something somehow and drain more stars?
I always kind of assumed that it was built that way out of necessity (to avoid attention somehow) and that it was so incredibly destructive that they weren’t going to need more shots.
 

Flutter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,590
because it looks cool.

We joked about it in the Rise of Skywalker trailer thread. Personally, I think it's ok since, it looks cool :p

Also I want Palpatine to meld with Endor.

That's right, Palpatine is now a planet.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,168
I always kind of assumed that it was built that way out of necessity (to avoid attention somehow) and that it was so incredibly destructive that they weren’t going to need more shots.
That's actually a pretty good point.
But in addition it actually has been confirmed that it can travel. Though I'm not aware of any further elaboration that has been provided on its mobile capabilities.

because it looks cool.

We joked about it in the Rise of Skywalker trailer thread. Personally, I think it's ok since, it looks cool :p

Also I want Palpatine to meld with Endor.

That's right, Palpatine is now a planet.
Exclusive sneak peek of the next death star
 

Mihai_

Banned
Sep 25, 2018
216
To be honest, everyone saying 'hur dur jj abrams' and assuming that the entire death star would completely vaporise due to it exploding (in the vacuum of space) is an idiot.
 

nekkid

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,592
What’s with the Abrams hate all of a sudden in particular with Star Wars? The Force Awakens was a fantastic return for the series and at least gave a glimpse of the prior trilogy and some world building and now we are seeing it again with remains from the OT. Seeing stuff like parts of the Death Star and broken ships is exactly what we should have been seeing in the last Jedi too, but no, we saw literally nothing but the inside of ships and a casino.
I never said I hate him. I like him as a director.

But you only have to look at the destruction of Vulcan or the Hosnian system to see that he’s perfectly happy to ignore the logic of physics when it’s inconvenient for a beautiful scene.
 

samoyed

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,974
it was obviously made of DURASTEEL and blessed with SITH ALCHEMY
The metal is obviously very strong, as a structure of that size has to deal with:

1) It's own gravitational pull as a consequence of its mass (something the films never touch on)

2) If it is ever propelled anywhere, it must be able to resist the stresses on its joints during acceleration and deceleration and I'm not an engineer so I can't tell you how bad it'd be but it's probably big

The better question is, if they have this amazing material, why do they not use it in construction of TIE fighters? And if they do, how strong are rival aerial weaponry that they can punch through this armor, though they clearly don't even make a dent on the Death Star?
 

Mariachi507

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,583
Because it looks good, that is all.

I guess people will complain though. We'll have to have a ROTJ special special special edition where we see that piece of the death star intact.