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How do you feel about changing names in localizations?

Oct 25, 2017
5,179
Going off some of the posts here, it seems like people would have preferred if names like Tidus and Yuna from FFX were changed to Sol and Luna. Localizations don't need to go that far.

Also, seeing examples of Nintendo localizations makes me glad they're not localizing DQXI.
I mean...you're going to get endless amounts of puns either way with Dragon Quest. Don't think that's going away.

Yes! Like why


Like how they kept Tora Tora but chose to strangely change the name of the video game to Tiger Tiger?
I find it funny because I actually prefer the English translation over the Japanese original because it coneys the same message but on a global scale.

Really depends what they're going for, where the game is set and who it's aimed at.

Ace Attorney would lose a lot of its charm if it straight up used the original names, but I think The Great Ace Attorney would need to be tackled differently if they ever get around to localizing it, thanks to it pretty blatantly being set in Japan at a certain point in time (they can't just pretend it's part of California again.)

Xenoblade 2 is a bit more confusing - I doubt as many people would mind if the Japanese dub wasn't included but it was and using it makes the changes far more apparent. In cases like that I think there should have been an alternate sub track, but that woulda been time consuming to put together.

Then there's stuff primarily focused at kids, where sometimes it's necessary to change it for approach-ability and marketing, like Pokémon and Yo-Kai Watch names. It's still silly how the latter's UK release has £ symbols while everyone has an American accent and the town is blatantly Japanese, but even that is so absurd to the point of Ace Attorney charm for me.
The Great Ace Attorney only has the first case in each game take place in Japan. Every other case is either in England or on a boat TO England.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,763
The Great Ace Attorney only has the first case in each game take place in Japan. Every other case is either in England or on a boat TO England.
Oh awesome, guess they could still go all out with the puns then.

Where's my localization at, Capcom...
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,424
Milano - Italy
Tora likes maids. He likes moe shit (or blushy-crushy in English I suppose). Poppi’s first line in the ENTIRE GAME is “How may I be of service, Master?”. This is not a matter of opinion: it is literally canon that Tora included settings for Poppi to fulfill his maid fantasies. Not necessarily sexual fantasies, but fantasies nonetheless. I’ve misrepresented nothing.
Tora does not consider Hana a pet. As a matter of fact, the opposite is closer to the truth. Implying that Tora sees Hana as a pet is indeed a misrepresentation.

Here is a link detailing survey results for Japanese pet names. Note that Hana is one of the absolute most popular pet names for all three animals the link discusses. Hana is a name you will see on a person, but it also happens to be a popular name for pets.

Additionally, I just typed Poppi into my Facebook search bar and found a woman named Poppi, with that spelling. So your statement that you will never see a person with that name is incorrect. If you widen the net to include the spelling “Poppy”, you’ll see that it’s actually an extremely popular girl name.
A name being used for pets does not make it a pet name. Hana is primarily a person's name, and a very common one at that. The reason why it's relatively present among pets as well is simply that it's so common to begin with. A poll with an extremely small statistical pool does not change that. Poppi and Poppy are not the same thing, and using "Poppi" makes the name sound, even more a pet's one, with a sound that is as childish and ridiculous as possible, which is nowhere similar to the effect and feel provided by Hana. Hana is a quite dignified and almost poetic name in Japanese. Poppi is not, in any language.

The original developers thought it was important enough to name her after flower. I believe that this is an important enough detail to carry over to foreign audiences. That you have a different opinion on the matter does not make you any more right than I am (or more right than those who localized this particular game).
Hana is a common name. You're just assuming it was important for them to name her after flower, and not that, for instance, they didn't simply like "hana."

Xenoblade 2 is a role playing game, not a Japanese language lesson. I don’t blame the localizers for not wanting players to have to google what Hana means to figure out why she was named that.
It's not a Japanese language lesson, but apparently it's ok for it to be a lesson in all the even less common languages the localization team decided to distort the names into. But that's ok as long as it's not Japanese, right?

I understand that you are a localizer
Was. The Anime market shrunk and the company closed, even if that's beside the point.

and I respect that you have your own opinions on how the the craft should be performed. But there are other ways of handling the process that have a significant number of merits for a significant number of people.
Here's what has the most merit: presenting a product that is a fruit of a very specific development culture in a way that is faithful to that culture. Gamers only stand to gain by broadening their horizons and being provided a look into many different cultural backgrounds, instead of flattening everything to western standards, which is not only a misrepresentation, but also extremely boring.

And the creative writing bit? Please. Localizing a story means taking that story and telling it in a completely different language. To do this and not have it sound like you used Google translate would by nature require at least some amount of creative writing. Just because you’re not making the whole thing up doesn’t mean you’re not using your creativity to tell a story.
Working in localization means telling someone else's story, not yours. The more you change, the more you're telling your story, and not the original author's. The use of creativity should be kept to the absolute minimum, taking a backseat to research on the original's author's intentions and the original's cultural background.

Mind you, this requires a lot more effort than simply using creativity, which is why many take the easy road and just replace the author's creativity with theirs.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
9,671
I also hate title changes, that happens all the time here with movies.

John Wick here is called "De Volta ao Jogo", while John Wick: Chapter 2 is called "John Wick".

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Ok, then.

I still can't get over how beautiful Team ICO's titles are and how generic the western titles become. I don't care who makes that decision, even if it's Ueda himself, he's wrong.

"Trico, the Great Man-Eating Eagle" sounds like the title of a great anime film, it's awesome. The Last Guardian sounds so uninspired, and people can barely agree on who the hell this Guardian is supposed to be in the game. I have my own theory, but at the end of the day it's meaningless, because this isn't the original title anyway. I'm not even asking for them to keep the title in japanese in this case, it's ok to translate, but at least try to convey a similar message, they're not even trying with The Last Guardian.
No one would've taken the game seriously if it was titled "Trico, the Great Man-Eating Eagle" in English. Japanese titles have a tendency to be way longer and more literal than titles usually are in English, changing the title to something more evocative and mysterious to convey the tone of the game is good localization. Not to mention the fact that a literal translation sounds extremely awkward in English, due to differences in the language.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,179
Working in localization means telling someone else's story, not yours. The more you change, the more you're telling your story, and not the original author's. The use of creativity should be kept to the absolute minimum, taking a backseat to research on the original's author's intentions and the original's cultural background.

Mind you, this requires a lot more effort than simply using creativity, which is why many take the easy road and just replace the author's creativity with theirs.
The problem with this is that you are assuming that the directors are not fluent enough in English to recognize if something has truly lost its meaning. Which might be the case for a lot of Japanese games, but for XBC2 and Ace Attorney in particular this clearly isn't the case. The director of the Ace Attorney game Spirit of Justice blatantly talked to the English localization team in numerous interviews, even praising the team for localization changes over Case 4 (which was about a specific type of Japanese stand up comedy) with the being able to keep the essence while making it fit with the Japanifornia setting. XBC2's director throws every European philosopher in his games and to imply that this same person somehow doesn't know English seems...weird.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,174
It's really annoying in Xenoblade Chronicles 2. They changed so many names in the English localization. Played with japanese dub and English subs. There were many times that I was confused.
Most of the localization makes sense. Homura means fire in Japanese. It's the English equivalent of just naming her Fire. Most westerners don't know Japanese and it would be wrong for western audience to not get a similar experience to the Japanese audience. Most westerners understand Greek and Latin roots so localizing Homura as Pyra makes sense. Not to mention that the Japanese version already has Greek names for some blades and tons of Greek mythology, so it already fits.

With the decidedly European English localization they went for an overabundance of Japanese names wouldn't really fit and it makes sense to change them to equivalents that would serve the same purpose for a Western audience that they serve for the Japanese audience.

Some are bad, though. Like in the Japanese version the names of the Titans are the latin names of the 7 deadly sinces and 7 heavenly virtues. For the localization they changed these names to more obscure references to the sins. Probably censorship.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,424
Milano - Italy
The problem with this is that you are assuming that the directors are not fluent enough in English to recognize if something has truly lost its meaning. Which might be the case for a lot of Japanese games, but for XBC2 and Ace Attorney in particular this clearly isn't the case. The director of the Ace Attorney game Spirit of Justice blatantly talked to the English localization team in numerous interviews, even praising the team for localization changes over Case 4 (which was about a specific type of Japanese stand up comedy) with the being able to keep the essence while making it fit with the Japanifornia setting. XBC2's director throws every European philosopher in his games and to imply that this same person somehow doesn't know English seems...weird.
Fluency in English is *very* rare among Japanese game developers, even at high levels. Throwing around European philosophers does not mean having read their work in English. Not sure where you'd get that idea. Japan has plenty of books about foreign philosophy, in Japanese.

Proficient levels of English are more widespread among the business side of Japanese game development and publishing, but definitely not among developers. Some can speak and understand English, but not nearly with the level of nuance required to extensively discuss localization. This is because in Japan standard English education in school includes basically no conversation, and is extremely ineffective.

If one wants to learn English decently in Japan, he has to do it on his own, or pay for specific lessons or private schools, which people who aim for a game development career simply normally don't do.

More importantly, they mostly don't have *time* to discuss localization in deep detail. They may be rarely consulted for very specific choices, but you can pretty much forget the idea that many Japanese developers go out of their way to read the entire script of an English localization, or even sizable parts of it. It's not part of their job description.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,174
Did you read my post? I said Hana is acceptable to the English audience, a name change was unnecessary.

But whatever, they could've easily remedied this problem by showing the original Japanese names in the subtitles when you choose Japanese as the voices.
Hana is an acceptable English name, but it loses meaning for the English audience. They changed it to a different acceptable English name that preserves the meaning for the English audience.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,179
Fluency in English is *very* rare among Japanese game developers, even at high levels. Throwing around European philosophers does not mean having read their work in English. Not sure where you'd get that idea. Japan has plenty of books about foreign philosophy, in Japanese.

Proficient levels of English are more widespread among the business side of Japanese game development and publishing, but definitely not among developers. Some can speak and understand English, but not nearly with the level of nuance required to extensively discuss localization. This is because in Japan standard English education in school includes basically no conversation, and is extremely ineffective.

If one wants to learn English decently in Japan, he has to do it on his own, or pay for specific lessons or private schools, which people who aim for a game development career simply normally don't do.

More importantly, they mostly don't have *time* to discuss localization in deep detail. They may be rarely consulted for very specific choices, but you can pretty much forget the idea that many Japanese developers go out of their way to read the entire script of an English localization, or even sizable parts of it. It's not part of their job description.
I mean...for Ace Attorney they did. And while it's for Xenoblade Chronicles X, Takahashi mentioned in interviews about localization that he got plenty of feedback from the localization team and there was a lot of back and forth. So for those two examples, which you are using as proof that "English Localization only cares about its own vision", they are actually far more deep within the director's wishes than you seem to want to accept.

https://kotaku.com/xenoblade-chronicles-xs-director-on-localization-change-1796157409
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,038
I generally don't get too bothered about it, when name changes are to "fix" names that sound bad in the target language, or communicate puns and jokes that are present in the original names.
I'm sure Enter Poundbag sound exotic and exciting in Japanese, but it does not to English speakers.
Same with a lot of Pokemon name changes, or the changes with Splatoon character names.

Ar Tonelico II is an example of name changes that are ultimately pointless but inoffensive, so I wasn't too mussed about it.
Luca Truelywaath to Luca Trulyworth, for example. A fairly small difference that can be explained by romanization of Japanese characters not being a perfect science but requiring some interpretation.
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,981
Jesus Christ, even worse then.

I guess I'm lucky this doesn't seem to happen in my region, at least with the games I play.

I can't imagine how ridiculous it would be to boot up Uncharted 4 and read about the adventures of Luis Silva in the subtitles. Something tells me this would never happen, though, no matter how uncommon a certain western name would be in another country, only japanese games seem to suffer from this.
You seem to be brazilian. You play lots of localized games already, just not localized for us in specific. And you don't even realize that because the localization is done well.

Series like Ace Attorney lose all the charm without the fun localization. A straight up translation/original names would never work because they're so intrinsically japanese that none but japanese can actually have any enjoyment from it. This is not "being allergic to other cultures", it's being sensible. But justt as a tidbit, when Escrava Isaura got to japan, they did plenty of localizations on stuff considered "too different" for their culture as well
 
Don’t really have a problem with it for the most part. Some names need to be changed in localization. Pokemon is a good example of changing names for the better. Some may not like character name changes but it’s not like their bad and it’s easy for kids to understand and say with gym leaders often being puns on their gym type and what not. Not to mention Pokemon names HAVE to be changed because a lot of them suck in japan and don’t actually describe the Pokemon in question.

Other times it’s just a disservice to the original design like with Fire Emblem or other mature titles. Fire Emblem has a translation issue in general but there are definitely a ton of examples of needlessly changing names.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,381
You seem to be brazilian. You play lots of localized games already, just not localized for us in specific. And you don't even realize that because the localization is done well.

Series like Ace Attorney lose all the charm without the fun localization. A straight up translation/original names would never work because they're so intrinsically japanese that none but japanese can actually have any enjoyment from it. This is not "being allergic to other cultures", it's being sensible. But justt as a tidbit, when Escrava Isaura got to japan, they did plenty of localizations on stuff considered "too different" for their culture as well
Except this is a thread about name changes, not "are you against localization?"
 
Dec 4, 2017
1,562
I've done some translation jobs in my life.
There isn't a single one that I don't think I could make better.
And for each and every one of them, there's several instances where I know I could do better because I was way too faithful to the original text for the translation's good.

Translation/localization, just like writing original content, is a work that's never completed, only abandoned.
You can always do better, and no two people would do it the very same way.


Even if it was true, the original name is not a pet name. Translating with a pet name would be an addition of the "I think my creativity can improve the product, and so I should" variety. That's the telltale sign of bad localization.

Localization is not and should not be a creative writing job. If one wants to do creative writing, maybe he should consider actual scriptwriting, instead of distorting actual authors' work.
This attitude is pure poison for a translator. It's the attitude I had as a teenage weeb who discovered manga for the first time, and who found out how much anime is changed when it is localized for my country. After doing a few translation works myself, I've changed my stance entirely, and I completely disagree with you on this point.

In my experience, this is an attitude very common among:
1) inexperienced translators
2) people who translate from Japanese

And it's led to spectacular disasters (like the most recent Italian localizations of Studio Ghibli films, which I wouldn't take in my house if you gave me money).


Xenoblade Chronicles 2, which is a very, very shoddy localization work in many ways.

Not as bad as the whole Ace Attorney series, but still bad.
Good Lord. This here is pure heresy. The first Ace Attorney is one of the finest localization jobs ever made. It works so well, thunderous applause is the only legitimate reaction it should get.


Nintendo are the only ones left who just change names in localizations. Everyone else has moved to faithful and accurate localization when possible. So this is more or less a Nintendo problem at this point and they need to be made to catch up with the millennium.
Aaaaaannnd this here is so blatantly false and biased I'm having trouble telling if it's trolling or not.

Nintendo's localizations can go too far and they often do, that much is true - especially if you happen to speak an European language that's not English, then you'll have The Wind Waker's Tetra named Dazel for no justifiable reason in the world. But this freedom of localization also gave us the Italian version of Paper Mario Color Splash, which is simply stellar.


Also, if you're playing Xenoblade with the Japanese dub, you're playing it wrong. XC 1 and 2 are some of the very rare dubbed Japanese games where I can't see how any amount of effort could make a convincing argument that the Japanese dub is better than the English one. They're so much better in English, I can barely stand to watch Japanese videos of them.

Oh, and yes, Duff McWhalen and the whole Maverick cast for the English version of Megaman X5 is the greatest sin ever committed in localization. My contempt for it will burn through the ages, long after video games will cease being a thing.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,698
Switzerland
i don't mind most of the time, like when it's a joke like in splatoon...

but then there's games like Xenoblade Chronicle 2... when there's a blade that's obvioulsy japanese in every way, the way it talk, the design, the weapon, everything from it screams japan, and they change its name to perceval, it's just dumb

it's not a big deal, i'm not offended by it, but it's still dumb as fuck
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,552
Ok I think we probably need to take the stance all the way back because I do think that localisation is by necessity a creative writing job because translation is a creative endeavour, so I'm just by default going to clash with half the purist thread
 
Oct 27, 2017
712
Ephemera --> Ephemer in Kingdom Hearts is one that I still don't understand. There was a 1.5 year gap between the character's introduction and the game being localized, and this series has like no history of name changes either.

There's also the character ブレイン who everyone was calling "Blaine" but was localized as "Brain" and nothing will convince me that that's not a mistranslation.
 
Nov 24, 2017
544
It can work in series that aren't all that serious to begin with and are not generally all that reflective of Japanese culture, such as the Mario franchise. A good example is how they translated the name of the bird enemies that can extend their beaks, located in Bowser's Japanese-inspired castle, ironically enough. "Tsukkun" is the name thrown around in the original Japanese text, but in English they are referred to individually as "pokio," which is a clever pun because it perfectly and succinctly describes their beak-extending ability/attack.

Although, the Mario games do have an example of a needless translation replacement with Rosalina, who could have easily gone by the fitting and good-sounding name of Rosetta as she does in Japan.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,007
It can work in series that aren't all that serious to begin with and are not generally all that reflective of Japanese culture, such as the Mario franchise. A good example is how they translated the name of the bird enemies that can extend their beaks, located in Bowser's Japanese-inspired castle, ironically enough. "Tsukkun" is the name thrown around in the original Japanese text, but in English they are referred to individually as "pokio," which is a clever pun because it perfectly and succinctly describes their beak-extending ability/attack.

Although, the Mario games do have an example of a needless translation replacement with Rosalina, who could have easily gone by the fitting and good-sounding name of Rosetta as she does in Japan.
It was mentioned earlier in the thread that apparently Rosetta is copyrighted and couldn't be used outside Japan. (I'm assuming by Rosetta Stone.)
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,567
It's ok when there's lots of wordplay involving the characters (ideally non-human), such as in Pokemon or Splatoon.
It's stupid inf Fire Emblem.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,534
Ok I think we probably need to take the stance all the way back because I do think that localisation is by necessity a creative writing job because translation is a creative endeavour, so I'm just by default going to clash with half the purist thread
Yeah this is where I’m at.

Ephemera --> Ephemer in Kingdom Hearts is one that I still don't understand. There was a 1.5 year gap between the character's introduction and the game being localized, and this series has like no history of name changes either.

There's also the character ブレイン who everyone was calling "Blaine" but was localized as "Brain" and nothing will convince me that that's not a mistranslation.
I’ll never forget the moment when I discovered he was going to be named Brain. First time that game made me laugh out loud, and it’ll probably be the last.
 
Nov 24, 2017
544
It was mentioned earlier in the thread that apparently Rosetta is copyrighted and couldn't be used outside Japan. (I'm assuming by Rosetta Stone.)
Ah, did not know that. Then Rosalina is as good as it gets. Not that I ever minded the change all that much in the first place.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,995
Brazil
I think that it really depends on the game for me. In Persona and Danganronpa, I would hate if they changed the names of the characters. In Xenoblade 2 I understand some changes but I didn't liked some others or why some were the same. In Ace Attorney it never bothered me. So yeah, I don't have a set of rules and like I said, it depends from game to game.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,385
Florida
I'm fine with it and always use my region (USA)'s names for anything.

The only time I think it's a bit silly is Blue (JP Green the character) in Pokemon because he wears a green shirt that they didnt change. I'm okay with him being Green and Blue being the female player who didn't make it into the games, from the RGB promo art and manga.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,995
Brazil
I've done some translation jobs in my life.
There isn't a single one that I don't think I could make better.
And for each and every one of them, there's several instances where I know I could do better because I was way too faithful to the original text for the translation's good.

Translation/localization, just like writing original content, is a work that's never completed, only abandoned.
You can always do better, and no two people would do it the very same way.



This attitude is pure poison for a translator. It's the attitude I had as a teenage weeb who discovered manga for the first time, and who found out how much anime is changed when it is localized for my country. After doing a few translation works myself, I've changed my stance entirely, and I completely disagree with you on this point.

In my experience, this is an attitude very common among:
1) inexperienced translators
2) people who translate from Japanese

And it's led to spectacular disasters (like the most recent Italian localizations of Studio Ghibli films, which I wouldn't take in my house if you gave me money).



Good Lord. This here is pure heresy. The first Ace Attorney is one of the finest localization jobs ever made. It works so well, thunderous applause is the only legitimate reaction it should get.



Aaaaaannnd this here is so blatantly false and biased I'm having trouble telling if it's trolling or not.

Nintendo's localizations can go too far and they often do, that much is true - especially if you happen to speak an European language that's not English, then you'll have The Wind Waker's Tetra named Dazel for no justifiable reason in the world. But this freedom of localization also gave us the Italian version of Paper Mario Color Splash, which is simply stellar.


Also, if you're playing Xenoblade with the Japanese dub, you're playing it wrong. XC 1 and 2 are some of the very rare dubbed Japanese games where I can't see how any amount of effort could make a convincing argument that the Japanese dub is better than the English one. They're so much better in English, I can barely stand to watch Japanese videos of them.

Oh, and yes, Duff McWhalen and the whole Maverick cast for the English version of Megaman X5 is the greatest sin ever committed in localization. My contempt for it will burn through the ages, long after video games will cease being a thing.
Lmao what the fuck is that? You're wrong to play in a language that you wants to play? And what if the person likes more the japanese language than the english one or don't care at all about it? What if you don't speak the language and wants another that sounds better? This is a completely joke.

And yes, the original is completely better than the english one but that's not the problem here with your post.
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,552
I'm trying to imagine a hypothetical overly localised names danganronpa (I actually think the localisation is already really well done, especially with the meme spewing monokuma)
 
Oct 28, 2017
196
It can work in series that aren't all that serious to begin with and are not generally all that reflective of Japanese culture, such as the Mario franchise. A good example is how they translated the name of the bird enemies that can extend their beaks, located in Bowser's Japanese-inspired castle, ironically enough. "Tsukkun" is the name thrown around in the original Japanese text, but in English they are referred to individually as "pokio," which is a clever pun because it perfectly and succinctly describes their beak-extending ability/attack.

Although, the Mario games do have an example of a needless translation replacement with Rosalina, who could have easily gone by the fitting and good-sounding name of Rosetta as she does in Japan.
One Mario localization I'm not too fond of is Catherine-->Birdo. I get that they had to whitewash the whole drag-queen aspect of the character, but still, where the hell did Birdo come from?
 
Oct 25, 2017
417
Titty Typhoon
Fire Emblem has some examples I don't really understand. Changing Leon to Leo in particular just seems inscrutably pointless.

Otherwise I'm either indifferent or consider it necessary.
 
Oct 29, 2017
2,945
It's a literary tradition to try to translate puns when novels are localized, I think it should be the norm if possible if a play with words is present. And it is totally a creative endeavour, you HAVE to change the explicit appearance to preserve the implicit one. The job of the translator is to keep the meaning of the work, not its external appearance.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,251
Good Lord. This here is pure heresy. The first Ace Attorney is one of the finest localization jobs ever made. It works so well, thunderous applause is the only legitimate reaction it should get.
One of the problems with Ace Attorney is that it takes it's a translation built on the foundation of "Take Japanese thing and turn it into American thing". It feels like something made by Americans for Americans. Most people are not American. Most people aren't Japanese either, but the intention, which is that "This American version will be more familiar and therefore relatable" doesn't work if you aren't American. In one of the Ace Attorney games there was an entire case that hinged on left/right hand drive. Americans use left hand drive, so the game was rewritten to make that fit -- rather clumsily. And it was completely counterproductive because we have right hand drive cars here. The misguided attempt to make the game's setting familiar to (American) audiences backfires when the audience isn't American.
 

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Oct 25, 2017
1,365
Completely indifferent to it broadly, and it can actually be beneficial to the game and/or characters.

Unless your story or world is hinging on its setting, a good localisation that plays to the audience’s knowledge is broadly better than a straight no frills translation.
This is it right here.

Fortunately the good localizers get this and can factor in the need to be faithful while appealing to the mass-market instead of the minority of weebs who need everything to be 1000% Japanese context be damned
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,866
Another thing that recently happened that made me make this topic was the localization involving my favorite Persona character.

In Japan her name is Aegis, but in every single Persona game to feature her up to this point it was changed to Aigis.

Except when she was announced as DLC for Blazblue Cross Tag Battle this happend.

Now it’s currenty unknown if this is just for Blazblue:TAG or if it’ll be in all future appearances, but changing it back after all this time is just jarring.
oh no

I was hoping this was just for the trailer and they would change it for the eng release
 
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Oct 25, 2017
1,038
I know I'm in the minority, but insane names like that are what I live for. Never mind it coming out of Japan, I want English-native creators to do it, too.
Depends on the type of show, game, etc. I could see it fitting better for a crazy world/characters, less so for something that wants to be taken seriously.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,424
Milano - Italy
Good Lord. This here is pure heresy. The first Ace Attorney is one of the finest localization jobs ever made. It works so well, thunderous applause is the only legitimate reaction it should get.
I won't respond to the rest because it's obvious that our stances radically clash, but this...

I don't think I can think of a less appropriate and more downright insulting thing to do in localization (or in any field really) than removing all the references to a country and culture, and arbitrarily replacing them with another. Like it was somehow bad for a game to be set in a different country than America.

It's simply mindboggling that anyone considers this even acceptable, let alone "finest."
 
Oct 25, 2017
61
Ace Attorney is one of my favourite series of all time and I can guarantee you that I never would have gone past the first game if it wasn't for the localisation. Capcom 100% made the correct decision with the changes they made.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,534
Ace Attorney is an incredibly complicated situation. Even in Japanese, the character names are riddled with puns that would make absolutely zero sense in any other language. For a series that is 100%, every bit a comedy as it is a drama, leaving those puns unlocalized would not just hinder the experience, but irrevocably destroy it. This left the loc team with an unfortunate dilemma: have a game set in Japan despite featuring a cast of characters with westernized names, or change the setting to match the names. It’s not a stretch to see why they did what they did. Leaving the names untranslated, of course, was never an option.
 
Oct 26, 2017
634
Germany
One of the problems with Ace Attorney is that it takes it's a translation built on the foundation of "Take Japanese thing and turn it into American thing". It feels like something made by Americans for Americans. Most people are not American. Most people aren't Japanese either, but the intention, which is that "This American version will be more familiar and therefore relatable" doesn't work if you aren't American. In one of the Ace Attorney games there was an entire case that hinged on left/right hand drive. Americans use left hand drive, so the game was rewritten to make that fit -- rather clumsily. And it was completely counterproductive because we have right hand drive cars here. The misguided attempt to make the game's setting familiar to (American) audiences backfires when the audience isn't American.
Ace Attorney Investigaions had a case where one of the plot points was "Guns are illegal and hard to come by in this country.". I thought this was supposed to be America!
 
Oct 26, 2017
916
Panama
regarding the Ace attorney series, i guess it's just an unfortunate case of localization not being made with the sequels in mind that far ahead and they just wanted the first one to be a standalone game with those changes. like, if they changed that much and AA2 and 3 already existed in japan, they must have never thought it would take off enough to localize any of the sequels past the original (though AA2 and 3 don't really cause much problems here. shits hits the fan past those).

Can't trade mark or copyright Rosetta in the US, it's taken.

In fact, beyond a lot of the making it simple more palatable for other reasons, a lot of times names are changed are strictly for Business Reasons. Sure Nintendo could have used Rosetta in the west or other areas, but then they would have potential legal issues when making merchandise or using her name on things.
but then what about names like Mario and Peach or Luigi and Daisy? (especially "Daisy" since there's an air gun manufacturer using the same name as their brand name in the US, which would put it directly in the same situation as "Rosetta" with Rosetta Stone)

can they copyright those and not Rosetta? wouldn't "Peach" be considered a common word that can't be copyrighted?

also, this doesn't address why Rosalina's name is different in every language. i get why Rosetta can't be used but then why can't they use Rosalina for every other non-JP and non-English language?
 
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Nov 1, 2017
303
It depends. Sometimes it's neccessary because of the nature of the work, sometimes it's just plain old dumbing down and other times it's just a wanker of a translator that wants to be a writer and some times it's just pure incompetence.

Generally speaking I dislike it.

The first Ace Attorney is one of the finest localization jobs ever made
Ace Attorney Investigations has a Canadian Zaibatsu. I mean, they painted themselves into a corner with this series because of the localization so I'm not sure I can agree it's the finest job ever made.
 
Oct 27, 2017
8,100
Netherlands
Marina's nickname in japanese
DJ E-DA
Cool!

Pearls
M.C. Princess

English
DJ_Hyperfresh
Uhm what... Nope not canon to me.
And i even have a tattoo of her no way i wil refer to that hey look at my dj hyperfresh tattoo!

M.C. Princess

The squid sister namings are cute tho but imo Callie & Marie is the best names for em Calimari heh.....

So fine with me when done right but that dj hyperfresh.... Man i was like cringing when i saw that official tumblr post.
 
Dec 4, 2017
1,562
Lmao what the fuck is that? You're wrong to play in a language that you wants to play? And what if the person likes more the japanese language than the english one or don't care at all about it? What if you don't speak the language and wants another that sounds better? This is a completely joke.

And yes, the original is completely better than the english one but that's not the problem here with your post.
Taking the "you're doing it wrong" comment seriously is the complete(ly) joke here, I'm afraid.

Anyway, regarding Xenoblade, I find the Japanese dub barely tolerable for most main characters. For Xenoblade 2, Nia alone is so much better characterized in English, playing with the Japanese dub would completely change my considerations about her as a character.
I've had my experiences in Japanese vs English dubs. I can tell which one I prefer, which one suits characters better. There's plenty of JRPGs that I'd rather play with Japanese voices, and in many cases, where the original dub was available, I did. Not for Xenoblade, though.
Is it wrong? Of course not! Play what you like. But stop acting like there's rules here, and like the original dub is always unquestionably better, because there's exceptions.


About Ace Attorney... the series is so blatantly Japanese in tone, themes, visuals, names, everything, while still retaining an overall western look, that the only way to make it viable outside of Japan was to do what was done. What you see in the Ace Attorney games is pure West, except of course when you visit places like Kurain Village. This is the main difference from The Great Ace Attorney, and one of the key reasons why that spinoff is so much more difficult to bring to the West (Sherlock Holmes rights notwithstanding).
The game would not have worked in English in any other way. Just saying it loud and clear that the game is set in Japan would have made its critical and commercial reception much less than it is, and we probably wouldn't be here whining that Capcom won't give us physical versions of the new games, because Capcom would likely have stopped the localizations altogether before or immediately after Apollo Justice.

The thing is, Ace Attorney in English works. And it works like a charm. The conflict between its undeniable Japanese origins and the translated version pretending to be set in America is part of what makes it so goofy and charming - which is precisely what the game strives to be in Japan.
The translators painted themselves into a corner - yet so far, they've always managed to find a way out. 6-4 is the only case that's so brazenly Japanese, no amount of pretending can make you think it isn't.
What matters here, is that the English Ace Attorney games retain their original feel. I highly doubt a more literal, more faithful translations would have achieved the same goal. Do you like the English AA games? Did they make you laugh? Did they surprise you? Are they well written? Did they achieve critical success and satisfying sales? Is AA a series you care for? Do you want more of it? If your answer is yes, then the localization accomplished its mission, and bitching about it is futile.
 
Oct 25, 2017
969
I never get why she was "Aigis" to begin with.

And I highly doubt ASW has a say in if it's Aigis in future Atlus games or not. It's probably just them talking about future ASW games.
I don't think anyone will understand.
Aegis is an English word to begin with...WTF is Aigis?
Did the translator ever come out to explain why they changed an English word to gibberish?
It's probably because the English word "aegis" is pronounced like /ˈiːdʒɪs/ while her name is supposed to be pronounced like /ˈɑɪ:gɪs/. Also, some characters call her「アイ ちゃん」 ("Ai-chan") and transliterating that to "Ae" is just awkward.

Besides, "aigis" is a perfectly acceptable alternate romanization of αἰγίς - the name of Athena's shield - and closer in pronunciation, too. I don't think the game ever meant for it to be an English noun.
 
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Oct 26, 2017
1,993
Japan
The XB2 changes seem like a lot of thought went into them, but something rubs me the wrong way about the notion that Japanese mythological references are inappropriate, so changes to western mythology are necessary. We should be able to live in a world that's bigger than Europe.
 

Luchashaq

Banned
Member
Nov 4, 2017
4,329
Fire Emblem has some examples I don't really understand. Changing Leon to Leo in particular just seems inscrutably pointless.

Otherwise I'm either indifferent or consider it necessary.
Almost nothing about Fire Emblem's recent localisations make any fucking sense.