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How much are you saving for retirement?

Oct 27, 2017
2,495
I have savings, but until I pay off my student loans, and buy a house, irit difficult for me to think of any of that as earmarked for "retirement."

I spent most of my adult life below the poverty line, and real long term savings in excess of $5,000 or so is pretty new to me. I now save abput $10,000 a year and hopefully that'll be good enough.
 
Oct 27, 2017
352
United States
For some this seems like a stealth brag thread. I mean some of you are socking away a ton of money and the best you can say is "I should be okay"? 40% of your income going towards savings/401k? That is simply unrealistic for most people. Also how much money do you think you will need for retirement? Goddamn.


It's the opposite for me. I just looked, and my savings rate for this year is 44% of take home (and that's down from last year). Not bragging at all. After savings my take home pay is $26k. I'm not rolling in it. I'll be lucky if I retire with 500k (that's my goal).

What I am doing is taking responsibility for my future. I don't want to work forever. Seems like a lot of people do. That seems crazy to me.
 
Oct 27, 2017
9,508
Netherlands
Well for me its done automaticly.....
But imma save up anyway cuz retirement money here in the netherlands is like 700-900 euros a month.....

My grandparents worked hard all their live and only get that. Ofcourse theres a few 100s added for rental home payback and healthcare but still thats only around 1200 a month then for 1 person.
 
Oct 30, 2017
864
Wisconsin
It's the opposite for me. I just looked, and my savings rate for this year is 44% of take home (and that's down from last year). Not bragging at all. After savings my take home pay is $26k. I'm not rolling in it. I'll be lucky if I retire with 500k (that's my goal).

What I am doing is taking responsibility for my future. I don't want to work forever. Seems like a lot of people do. That seems crazy to me.

Are you investing that?

$500k seems very low. I mean even with my paltry 6% plus employer matching I am projected to have at least $800k (at one point this was even higher).

I have seen a personal rate of return so far this year of 40.46%. In 2017 it was 20.82%. In 2016 it was 15.49%. 2015 was 13.65%. 2014 was 22.06%. Since 2005 to now it has been about 13.6% (annualized) or 485.76% (cumulative).

Saving is fine but you have to make your money work for you too. If you are not seeing decent returns (hence me questioning $500k when you are saving 44% of your income) it is time to start moving those funds around.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
703
How much would you need saved to live without a job in retirement anyway? If I take my current expenses into account and assume I'll have had a house and car paid off by retirement, I think it would be maybe 25k a year in utility bills and food and gas/electric.

You need to factor in things like taxes and maintenance.... Even if you were gifted a free house; lets say its $300k. You would still need to come up with ~$6k/yr just in property taxes alone and that will only go up as the value of your house goes up.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,029
Not at all. I rather live large young and have a subpar life in retirement, then have a modest life young and a modest life old.

I made a thread on this already: https://www.resetera.com/threads/why-do-you-save-for-retirement-and-why-i-dont.35512/

*Please note everything I'm about to say below is from living a privileged status in a first world country with a decent pension and security net for those that hit retirement age - I know those in the US and countries with not the greatest social security nets may not have the same privilege and what I'm about to say may not apply as much. As well as is different for those with children looking to provide them with something upon death*

So I don't save for retirement - I may save for specific things (like a down payment on a house or investments to increase current income or for large ticket experience items such as living abroad for a year) but never retirement. I don't have any investments into RRSPs, 401k's, Mutual Funds, or whatever safe interest long yield retirement saving plans there are. Often I hear people in threads here or in my life mention about saving for retirement as a huge component of their budget.

So the question I ask all of you is, why do you save for retirement? What's the plan?

Here's my reason for not saving for retirement:


Out of the 5 greatest things people regret on their deathbed, "I wish I hadn't worked as hard" and "I wish I had let myself be happier" were two of the common ones. Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/5-things-people-regret-on-their-deathbed-2013-12

So here's my personal philosophy. Life is a collection of experiences, and the quality of those experiences can be higher when experienced in your life's prime then when older - or at least have more impact when spaced out over your entire life. Instead of putting 15% into a retirement fund, you can save that 15% towards taking a break from your career to live somewhere abroad for a year as example. You never know when your body will fail you, whether death or disability, to prevent you from doing what you wanted to do in life. I rather we were 65 years old in social housing with a long memory of great experiences then trying to travel at 65 with a bunch of health conditions that limit me wishing I had traveled more when younger. Maybe this may be the concept of "min-max"ing your life - front loading great experiences and living a minimal life at the end - but it's working out great for me so far.
 
Oct 27, 2017
352
United States
Are you investing that?

$500k seems very low. I mean even with my paltry 6% plus employer matching I am projected to have at least $800k (at one point this was even higher).

I have seen a personal rate of return so far this year of 40.46%. In 2017 it was 20.82%. In 2016 it was 15.49%. 2015 was 13.65%. 2014 was 22.06%. Since 2005 to now it has been about 13.6% (annualized) or 485.76% (cumulative).

Saving is fine but you have to make your money work for you too. If you are not seeing decent returns (hence me questioning $500k when you are saving 44% of your income) it is time to start moving those funds around.
Of course I'm investing it. I made about 22% last year. A 40% return this year is insane, I'm not saying I don't believe you, but I don't believe you. Unless you are buying individual stocks and got very, very lucky (and took a big risk).

The market as a whole is not even close to that. Dow YTD is around 5%, S&P is around the same. Care to share how you made 40% in that market without incredible luck?

Edit: also, I don't expect those kinds of returns over time, I'm estimating around 5-6% average over time. If it's better, great! But I always play conservative.

Also, 6% of what? See, that matters. 6% of 200k, sure, thats something, 6% of what I make? You'd never retire.
 
Oct 30, 2017
864
Wisconsin
Of course I'm investing it. I made about 22% last year. A 40% return this year is insane, I'm not saying I don't believe you, but I don't believe you. Unless you are buying individual stocks and got very, very lucky (and took a big risk).

The market as a whole is not even close to that. Dow YTD is around 5%, S&P is around the same. Care to share how you made 40% in that market without incredible luck?

Edit: also, I don't expect those kinds of returns over time, I'm estimating around 5-6% average over time. If it's better, great! But I always play conservative.

Also, 6% of what? See, that matters. 6% of 200k, sure, thats something, 6% of what I make? You'd never retire.
I only make $61k per year. My employer matches my contribution up to 6%.

93% of my 401k portfolio value wise is company stock (I used to contribute only to the BNY Mellon Small Cap Stock Index Fund Instl then in 2011 I put 50 percent into company stock. In 2014 I put the remaining 50% into company stock). The other 7% is JPMCB Large Cap Growth Fund CF-A. I have just recently started putting money into that instead of the company stock because at my contribution rate the stock is no longer affordable. The YTD rate of return for just the stock alone would have been 42.55%. The JPMCB Large Cap Growth Fund CF-A has had horrible performance with a YTD rate of return of -0.82%. It's pretty gross.

I don't really give two shits what you believe.
 
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Oct 31, 2017
2,984
Wife and I just started our 457k but we have pensions. We each have a 500k life insurance plan that we will bump up to 1mil but that is for our children
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,315
Didn't get into saving until 30s. Upper 40s now and i'm only like ___k in 401k, but i'm putting 25% in. I do have some savings account also if that counts. I feel like I'm screwed for retirement, but we'll see. Oh, I also have a pension with Coke(been there for 16), but no idea how much it would amount to haha

Edited to remove saved amount...figured that wasn't worth posting
 
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Oct 27, 2017
1,315
And how do people get these crazy returns on investment. I think mine is like 90% stocks(index funds?) and 10% bonds. I got like 12ish% last year and this year was mostly negative
 
Oct 29, 2017
10,670
I max out 401k, max out IRA, and have a pension from my former employer and one from my current employer. I should be able to retire fairly early.
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,946
Not at all. I rather live large young and have a subpar life in retirement, then have a modest life young and a modest life old.

I made a thread on this already: https://www.resetera.com/threads/why-do-you-save-for-retirement-and-why-i-dont.35512/
It’s much harder to go from luxury to simplicity than the other way around. Furthermore, you’re missing the time value of money and actually shortchanging how large you could live overall.

There’s nothing wrong with enjoying the present, but you could live larger and larger as you go if you do it better. No reason to literally plan to have your finances blow up in your face like that.

Experiencing growth in wealth, not just through salary, but through smart investments, can be extremely rewarding.

And about “letting yourself be happier” and “not working as hard”... well, neither of those things should mean that you need to spend your cash to the point of financial insecurity.

You may not plan to have kids, but if you ever do have them, don’t you want to not be a burden in your old age, but instead, be a source of stability for them?

Really think about what you’re doing. You say you’re privileged. Don’t you want your kids and grandkids to feel the same?
 
Nov 9, 2017
491
30 to 40%. No plans for retirement though, just hope I can lower my work hours every few years till I eventually reach a satisfying work/life balance.
 
Oct 27, 2017
352
United States
I only make $61k per year. My employer matches my contribution up to 6%.

93% of my 401k portfolio value wise is company stock (I used to contribute only to the BNY Mellon Small Cap Stock Index Fund Instl then in 2011 I put 50 percent into company stock. In 2014 I put the remaining 50% into company stock). The other 7% is JPMCB Large Cap Growth Fund CF-A. I have just recently started putting money into that instead of the company stock because at my contribution rate the stock is no longer affordable. The YTD rate of return for just the stock alone would have been 42.55%. The JPMCB Large Cap Growth Fund CF-A has had horrible performance with a YTD rate of return of -0.82%. It's pretty gross.

I don't really give two shits what you believe.
A -0.82% is pretty reasonable this year. The market has been up and down. You have A LOT of one stock. You had a good year, which is great, and now is great time for you to diversify. I wouldn't expect to get that kind of return every year (you seem smart enough to know that).

I used to work for GE, a place where people did what you are doing, put a lot into company stock. It worked for years, until it didn't, and now a lot of retirees are in a bad place (source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenkam...c-retirees-take-another-beating/#349af565205c ).

Time in market will matter too. My goal is 500k, because I don't want to work until I'm 65, some people do. I live on less than 25k a year now, so that goal will put me in a comfortable range. You can hit 700k at 6%, but you'll need longer in the market then I feel like working. But do what works for you.

Sorry if you thought my tone was hostile, it wasn't my intent. I did want to point out that suggesting a normal investor could get a 44% YTD in 2018 was not something people should expect without huge risk.
 
Oct 30, 2017
864
Wisconsin
Sorry if you thought my tone was hostile, it wasn't my intent. I did want to point out that suggesting a normal investor could get a 44% YTD in 2018 was not something people should expect without huge risk.
Word. Accusations of dishonesty is a pet peeve of mine so my final sentence was a reflection of that.

Regarding the negative return being gross comment that is because the only time within the last 14 or so years I have seen a negative return (or hell even close to it) was during the 2008/2009 recession (and looking at historical graphs that was just a blip for me).