• The GiftBot 2.0 Launch Giveaway Extravaganza has come to a close with an astounding 8073 games given away to the community by 696 members, a huge success thanks to you! The gifting now continues with more official prizes in the new Gaming Giveaways |OT|. Leftover Steam codes are also being given away to the PC Gaming Era community.

I always disliked Super Mario Bros Trilogy:too fast, no saves, less forgiving than gameboy counterparts

robjoh

Member
Oct 31, 2017
463
The funny part of reading this thread is that I have done two warpless runs and one warp run with SMB the last two days on original hardware. Didn't have time to finish my warpless run on "hard mode".

Now I find it completely fair that people does not share my love for this game. However I must say that the two complaints I find in OP, running and no saves, is what I think makes SMB a game I want to replay. You can beat SMB by going slow but you can beat SMB with full speed and doing so feels great. Saving would also not be a good idea, it would just make a short game where the fun comes from mastering a level feel even shorter.

The one and only complaint I would raise for SMB, knowing the limitations of the cartridges at that time, would be that I have to beat the game to get to hard mode.

I would say SMB2 is in similar situation, it is not a very long game.

SMB3 is actually a game where a save function would help but the levels are great. It is more of an adventure than SMB1 which I find to be a great arcade experience.
 

videodrome

Member
Oct 27, 2017
484
The warp whistles were a good solution to not being able to save in SMB3. Been playing this game for 30 years and it’s still the undisputed champ. Only BOTW comes close in my book.
 

Palazzo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
525
It's being bad at a video game. It's not a thing where mockery should even enter the equation.
You can insult someone's opinion for being poorly formed or badly presented without insulting the person themselves. "Mario is a cult game and is unreasonably designed" is absurd, but "I have trouble getting into Mario because of the controls" isn't really weird. The OP's phrasing is like playing Final Fantasy and thinking that the idea of being expected to look at your equipment menu is absurd.
 

ReyVGM

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,948
Complaining that a Mario platformer from the 80s, doesn't save is like complaining a horse carriage from the 1800s doesn't have air conditioning.

Mario 3 came out in 1988, literally no cartridge platformer from that era was expected to have a battery save.

And seriously, you're complaining that the game expects you to run? Surely you must be trolling.

And if you want Mario 3 with saves, there's the AllStars version, and the GBA version, and the virtual console version, and the NES Online version.
 
OP
OP

fireflame

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,714
Complaining that a Mario platformer from the 80s, doesn't save is like complaining a horse carriage from the 1800s doesn't have air conditioning.

Mario 3 came out in 1988, literally no cartridge platformer from that era was expected to have a battery save.

And seriously, you're complaining that the game expects you to run? Surely you must be trolling.

And if you want Mario 3 with saves, there's the AllStars version, and the GBA version, and the virtual console version, and the NES Online version.
I don't know, not all platformers make running mandatory. NSMB2, Mario 3D WOrld, many platformers in general feature run as an option but you are not forced to use it to win.
As for the lack of saves, I will say that, given its length and difficulty, it could at least have some password system.The amount of lives is so small.
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,627
I don't know, not all platformers make running mandatory. NSMB2, Mario 3D WOrld, many platformers in general feature run as an option but you are not forced to use it to win.
As for the lack of saves, I will say that, given its length and difficulty, it could at least have some password system.The amount of lives is so small.
Where are you forced to use running to win SMB3? There's one jump in SMB 1 that requires the run button but by that point you're already at the last world. You can dodge the hammer bros, they're hard to but its possible.
 
OP
OP

fireflame

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,714
Where are you forced to use running to win SMB3? There's one jump in SMB 1 that requires the run button but by that point you're already at the last world. You can dodge the hammer bros, they're hard to but its possible.
you are not forced but it seems all people I talk with say it makes everything better and apparently easier to them . The issue have with running is it makes falling or hitting enemies much more common in a way that feels nearly impossible to anticipate(I don't have that issue with games in 3d for example).

I am starting to believe it is a mental thing possibly, based on subjectivity...
 

D.Lo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,098
Sydney
Among old and cult games that I dislike, Super Mario Bros Trilogy is probably in the top tier.

There are several factors that make me dislike it, like the lack of saving system in the original series(though yes there are ways t skip levels) and the crazy expectation you are going to press the run button to skip obstacles, the game being already hard enough without running.

And when I think about that series, it's rival sister on the game boy comes to mind: the Super Mario Land trilogy. Though it appeared later, that series benefits from being slower, allowing you to avoid danger more easily, giving you easy ways to get bonus lives, giving you a save system in SML2 and Wario Land.

Even the first Super Mario Land feels less frustrating, shorter and easily doable in 45 minutes after a bit of training. Any game that comes after the Bros trilogy feels more accessible and less frustrating,any.

That's probably why I prefer Kirby over SMB(sure Kirby is more recent)and any Mario game after. Between the axes to dodge, the flying guy that sends thunder, the expectation you are going to run, the lack of a decent save system or megaman-like password system after every level beaten...
Ignoring the Game Boy 'rival trilogy' are three vastly different games, one of which does not even star Mario, all three were released well after all four of the Famicom/NES Super Mario games.
  • Super Mario Land 1 is an easy, short, weird take on a Super Mario Bros 1 style game, released a year after Super Mario Bros 3. It was super primitive for the time.
  • Super Mario Land 2 was fashioned after Mario World, and was released four years after Super Mario Bros 3. It has great presentation for the Game Boy, but bad Wonder Boy like physics.
  • Wario Land was five years after Super Mario Bros 3, and plays more like a heavyweight Kirby.
 

BlueScorpion

Member
Aug 8, 2019
252
The NES Mario Bros have not aged well at all visually or gameplay wise. All stars versions are a lot better but still not great, just good at best.
 

FreddeGredde

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,014
This is insane. How can one play Super Mario without holding down the run button. Honestly, my mind is blown.
 

FreddeGredde

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,014
It's less how and more why. Running in Mario is so damn satisfying, especially in 3 when you build up p speed.
Well yeah, that's what I mean! Imagine if there had been no run button. The game would be really slow and boring.

But also much harder. The first I tell my non-gaming friends when they struggle is "you're not pressing down the run button".
 

BlueScorpion

Member
Aug 8, 2019
252
They are still some of the best games from that generation.

You can dog their looks but gameplay wise they perform perfectly.
SMB 1 you can't turn in mid air or scroll backwards to the screen you just were in, and SMB 3 controls feel a little slippery imo compared to later Mario games.

That's what I'm comparing them to though, later games. By NES standards they're probably some of the best.
 

NHarmonic.

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
5,958
I feel like I'm reading crazy talk. SMB1 and 3 are masterclasses in game design. Sorry, but I can't agree at all, OP. SMB3 in particular runs circles across the Land trilogy.

Do you really need saves with games these short? You can always use save states like the above poster said
SMB is terrible, clunky shit. It’s important but it’s unplayable nowadays.
 
OP
OP

fireflame

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,714
This is an excellent troll thread 😂
I don't know maybe you have old games you absolutely don't like/enjoy at all despite their aura and fame. Ghost and goblin or altered beats are things more people agree about I get it.If i don't use any save state nor shortcut I can't get past world 1 , or barely make it to world 2, in SMB...
 

NHarmonic.

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
5,958
You are entitled to your opinion but Pac Man will always be a great arcade game to me. My kids loved it the first time they played it and they are 8. I always thought it was timeless.
I mean, personally i dislike them. I guess i was never a fan of games that punished you that much + endless and kind of pointless. I’m younger, so my arcade era was more of snow bros, beat em alls and that shit.

They are important parts of gaming history, but it’s really not the stuff i enjoy from this hobby at all.
 

robjoh

Member
Oct 31, 2017
463
I don't know maybe you have old games you absolutely don't like/enjoy at all despite their aura and fame. Ghost and goblin or altered beats are things more people agree about I get it.If i don't use any save state nor shortcut I can't get past world 1 , or barely make it to world 2, in SMB...
Ok now I am confused. As someone that finds world 1 in SMB to be quite easy to beat. What part of world 1 is so difficult that you need a save state to master it?
 

Kivvi

Member
Jun 25, 2018
752
OP, I decided to try out old classic platformers to see if I'm gonna like them and the original Mario trilogy wasn't really my thing. It took me awhile to get the game (interesting enough Megaman and Sonic clicked instantly) but I do think SMB3 is good considering its age. If we ever get a Gameboy classic I'll try out the Land games too.

The games are like an hour or two long, why do you need saves?

I replay the classic SMB games more than any others, because they're so easy to just sit down and play through in a couple hours or less. Still fun as well.
You can beat Super Mario NES games in about 3 hours or less, why do you need saves? Anyway All Stars versions of SMB 1-3 have save function so play those versions I guess

And yeah you need to learn how to handle platforming while running because that's an essential skill for most games in the genre
I played the SMB games last year for the fist time and they are not only 2-3 hours long on your FIRST playthrough. You are comparing your lifelong Mario skills to somebody's who hasn't played them much or simply isn't that good at them. And it can get frustrating fast. Add limited time for gaming a week and saves become a much more logical addition.
I'm sorry you struggle with a game I beat when I was 6.
You forgot to mention that you only had a few games at that age and played them non stop for hundreds of hours. :)
 

Laser Ramon

Member
Oct 28, 2017
379
Tempe, AZ

robjoh

Member
Oct 31, 2017
463
I played the SMB games last year for the fist time and they are not only 2-3 hours long on your FIRST playthrough. You are comparing your lifelong Mario skills to somebody's who hasn't played them much or simply isn't that good at them. And it can get frustrating fast. Add limited time for gaming a week and saves become a much more logical addition.

You forgot to mention that you only had a few games at that age and played them non stop for hundreds of hours. :)
The easiest way to legally play the original NES games today is to either buy a 3DS, a Switch or the NES classic as far as I know all these has save states. I play on original hardware but please don't act like these games has not been released on systems where saves work.

I also find it a little bit odd that playing more games would make SMB1-3 harder. If anything you would be a better gamer and have easier to adapt to a new experience.
 

Kivvi

Member
Jun 25, 2018
752
The easiest way to legally play the original NES games today is to either buy a 3DS, a Switch or the NES classic as far as I know all these has save states. I play on original hardware but please don't act like these games has not been released on systems where saves work.

I also find it a little bit odd that playing more games would make SMB1-3 harder. If anything you would be a better gamer and have easier to adapt to a new experience.
The posts I quoted said the SMB games don't need saves which I disagree and I explained why.
The SMB games are try and error games, arcade style. In one level you have a sun chasing you, in the next you have to time your jumps perfectly to reach the goal. If you're playing them blind there's no way you gonna know what the gimmick of a level is without trying it first. The slippery controls don't help either. The run button was a hallelujah moment as well when it clicked with me. I haven't timed my SMB3 playtime but it sure wasn't 2-3 hours.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,320
SMB3 is a flawless gem and it’s a timeless masterpiece all because of the perfect design the game had.

It’s the greatest game in Nintendo history IMO.