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I hate Raimis Mary Jane so much
- Thread starter sawatsu
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No applause, but there's also nothing wrong with telegraphing a character the way they did, MJ's character had brevity on purpose to set up the reveal, and her character absolutely came through in the brief scenes we saw of her which were there to do exactly that.
And Liz was part of Peter's backstory/teenage world building as much as she needed to be, she's not a main character in PEter's story but part of his coming of age tale, and they did well with the screen time she had. She wasn't presented in a problematic way as a prize, imo, and there's only so much screen time you can give to a side character like that. They did well with the screen time she had.
she was maybe my least favorite part of Hoemcoming, not a fan of her character at all.
Bitch? Because she's a woman? I mean she's not one in the slightest.
Ursula was clearly the best anyways. She even went to go give Peter those cookies with nuts in em!
Yes, please along with some cookies and this month's rent.
His main love interest being a "side character" with absolutely no depth or drive outside of Peter Parker is the problem. She's a nothing character, she's there for Peter to gawk at and try to obtain. That's it. She has no independent agency in the film. People can hate Raimi MJ all they want but she was her own character with her own agency.
So? Why is that a problem?
Edit:
Never mind...
I love Spiderman 2, but every time I watch it i feel like it should have ended with Peter accepting that he and Mary Jane were not a good pair and moving on. I think it would have fit the rest of the movie better and like she only left her fiance because "the main character has to get the girl".
Also this ^
Also this ^
Haha same.
I'm surprised no one has posted the scene where Harry manipulates her into breaking it off with Peter in 3. Like, just tell him...he's Spider Man.
The movie where side characters don't have much purpose in regards to the themes and messages the movie wants to tell? How they exist to move the plot forward or even worse, just exist? MJ doesn't so anything but look cute and say a few lines. Wtf does Ned do for the overall package? Guy gets a lot of screen time but he is just a jokey side-kick who adds no substance.
She was mostly part of the world building, she's also not his main love interest but simply a side-character in his coming of age story. MJ is his main love interest. The film was telegraphing this all the way.
These kinds of characters are perfectly fine and indeed absolutely required for worlds to be fleshed out, and for a side-character she was fleshed out pretty well.
She also had her own agency, she was clearly presented as a capable person who had her own goals and abilities etc... she was absolutely not just there for Peter to gawk at.
Rewatched the movies recently and I agree. Outside of J.K Simmons, Willem Dafoe and Alfred Molina, the cast of the Raimi trilogy isn't all that great.
I gotta quote again but the video game avatar couldn't be more perfect.
Damn people take their comics waaaaaay to seriously forget that theres been cheese as far back as the 60's etc, which I assume is what Raimi grew up reading.
Also we just found out in another thread how Videogame Magazines treated female gamers in the early 2000's (which is LESS than 20yrs ago) like as if it was still pre 2000's.
Of course now we may finally get female characters treated right in Homecoming and everything going forward etc, but it took them long enough.
As a side note the Horror/Sci-Fi has been serving up some bad ass female characters for years, the rest need to catch up.
Also we just found out in another thread how Videogame Magazines treated female gamers in the early 2000's (which is LESS than 20yrs ago) like as if it was still pre 2000's.
Of course now we may finally get female characters treated right in Homecoming and everything going forward etc, but it took them long enough.
As a side note the Horror/Sci-Fi has been serving up some bad ass female characters for years, the rest need to catch up.
Spider-Man 3 MJ is the worst incarnation of the character by far. Let's get upset at Peter even though he has no reason to really expect anything for the most part!
How are women characters treated right in Homecoming? Liz is designed to be an object of Peter's affection who isn't anything but that. MJ has no character, she has a personality. Aunt May is treated as Hot Aunt May.
Unpopular opinion, but right.
Raimi's movies are mediocre, people are fond of them because they were decent on an era of pure shit.
She's so awful in 3 that she might as well be the 4th supervillain of the movie
This makes no sense. the idea that movies that were celebrated both critically and financially weren't that great is some weird 4th Dimension chess
nah just watched them last week, they're legit better than a lot of the superhero films we even get today
This isn't true at all.
As reasoned above:
MJ's character had brevity by design as she was being telegraphed. This is a perfectly fine technique, AND her character definitely came through in the brief scenes we saw of her.
Liz was a side-character as part of Peter's coming of age story. She was presented as someone with her own intelligence, agency, and abilities, and it was more like two peoples lives intersecting with our focus on one person than her being an object.
Better super villain than last minute venom. I enjoyed the movie for its delightful amount of camp, but Harry and sandman could've carried that movie without the need for a shoehorned venom.
I didn't dislike MJ in these movies but I certainly felt like I always wanted to like her more than I actually did. There wasn't much to her the characterization and I don't think Dunst ever managed to get more from the page in the same way Stone or even Laura Harrier did.
ASM Gwen is the only great love interest in any of these movies though, hopefully Zendaya steps up when she actually becomes one, she felt incredibly one note in Homecoming.
ASM Gwen is the only great love interest in any of these movies though, hopefully Zendaya steps up when she actually becomes one, she felt incredibly one note in Homecoming.
nah Peter was being obtuse, she just wanted him to listen not give her the 'everything will turn around, look im spiderman and everyone loves me!' talk
Kirsten Dunst is a good actor but MJ is written extremely shitty in those movies. So was Aunt May and Gwen Stacy.
The only likable females in those movies are Betty and that skinny neighbor girl.
The only likable females in those movies are Betty and that skinny neighbor girl.
It really is. Her kissing Harry made me so mad. Hell her actions in almost every movie were maddening. She was better in 3 but by then it was too late.
Emm Stone / Gwen Stacy is still the best spidey movie love interest.
Truth.
I rewatched X-men 2 recently and it held up a lot better than Spiderman 2.
If only Spiderman 1 and 2 could live up to our modern classics like Batman V Superman and Thor: The Dark World.
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