sunshine had some problems in particular with the camera. it is a damn fine game though.
however if you compare it to the likes of 64, galaxy 1,2, 3D world and odyssey it does pale.
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I have noticed a correlation between a Nintendo Console's success and its flagship 3D Mario title.
- Thread starter perfectchaos007
- Start date
however if you compare it to the likes of 64, galaxy 1,2, 3D world and odyssey it does pale.
Smash was on the 3DS first which killed the Wii U version's system selling potential. MK8 is only one game and it was too little too late.
You guys need to stop blaming everything on the hardware. I am a huge Nintendo fan and I never even considered a Wii U. Nintendo's software output was way, way, WAY below par that generation. I don't care how much fun you had with 3D World. It's not exciting. It's not "wow". It doesn't make me want to buy a console. These are things that Mario NEEDS to be as Nintendo's flagship franchise. In this sense, 3D World is a miserable failure and Odyssey is a roaring success.
The only reason people call 3D World forgettable is because not many played it. Nintendo really showed some of its best level design ever in this game.
"I didn't own a Wii U, I didn't play the game in question, I don't care how much fun you all had with it"
That's a reasonable critical position? I get that you're trying to say it was somehow less marketable - and in the sense that people thought it was a 3DS port - that's probably true, but it wasn't a port, it was one of the very best single and multiplayer games of not only Nintendo's last generation, but their entire history.
The Wii's success had literally nothing to do with Super Mario Galaxy 1 & 2.
As for 3D World apologists ITT: it was the second consecutive Mario platformer for the Wii U that was made within the framework of a game originally created for a handheld with a small fraction of its power. The same thing happening twice with Wii U Mario games was incredibly disheartening for enough people to make these games not all that successful.
As for 3D World apologists ITT: it was the second consecutive Mario platformer for the Wii U that was made within the framework of a game originally created for a handheld with a small fraction of its power. The same thing happening twice with Wii U Mario games was incredibly disheartening for enough people to make these games not all that successful.
Yeah, 3D World and NSMBU, both have great level design and are very underrated.
I played and beat it this year and thought to myself "yeah, I'm glad I didn't buy that Wii U".
Yes. Games sell hardware. But if nobody wants the hardware, then it's an impedance to growth.
Games like 3D World helped boost Wii U sales, but it can only do so much. Being an appealing hardware helps a ton to further push sales.
It basically is just your own opinion though. Nobody can deny 3D World's critical reception, no matter how much spin you put through it.
MatildaMuggins's Reality: The Wii U had no good games.
Actual Reality: People are begging for Switch ports of Wii U games. A Wii U game won GotY. Many games are considered the best of their respective series.
But you know, when the OP starts a thread with a troll, you can't really expect the thread to not continue that course.
Actual Reality: People are begging for Switch ports of Wii U games. A Wii U game won GotY. Many games are considered the best of their respective series.
But you know, when the OP starts a thread with a troll, you can't really expect the thread to not continue that course.
You lost me here buddy.
Mario 3D World was an incredible game. It got a lot of hate (mainly before release), maybe because of 3D land and because Wii U was getting a lot of hate already. But the game is simply amazing and if you play through it in coop it is even more incredible.
The game should not receive the hate it received just because Wii U was not a hit.
Edit: forgot to mention that 3D world is probably my favourite Mario of all time. Maybe because I played through with my gf and she is not really into gaming and had a blast playing it. I still did not have the chance to play Odyssey, still waiting for my copy to arrive, but it will be really hard to top 3D world for me.
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A vocal minority on message boards being babies about 3D World doesn't mean it wasn't below average or forgettable.
Flawed premise, flawed argumentation, flawed conclusion.
Flawed premise, flawed argumentation, flawed conclusion.
I swear some of y'all haven't even played 3D World lol.
...What drama? Just a lot of people pointing out that a correlation is pretty damn weak when you have to remove 50% of the data points (SM64, SMG2, SM3DW) and ignore another one entirely (SM3DL).
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And I bought it and played it when it came out and was glad I bought the Wii U. I get it. You didn't like the game. But you've zoomed far passed "I hate the game" to "everyone who liked the game is somehow less intellectual than me because reasons" And the game still sold 5.7 million copies. I get the people love throwing around than Knack joke but it's just that. A joke. A joke that doesn't even make sense past one extremely specific point for one week only in one specific country. 3D World to me was the absolute culmination of what I was looking for in a 3D Mario game, a 2D Mario game in a 3D scale. If that wasn't what you want in a 3D Mario, that's fine. I completely understand because Mario games are so varied in every game that one style isn't for everyone. I take offense to when someone starts sneering that his style is somehow inherently superior to others.
I played it. I remember champion's road and that's about it. The praise this game gets here and at the other place always baffled me, I feel that both Galaxys have better level design and also don't feel boxy and narrow. Everything about the game's design, from the camera angles to the box-by-box layout of a lot of levels feels like a significant step down from the sweeping vistas of Galaxy. I'm not knocking any one who really loves that game, I'm just saying the kind of praise it get baffles me.
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3D Land was a fresh new take on the 3D Mario formula that was also on the 3DS where the expectations are much different. 3D World for a first mainline HD Mario console game was severely disappointing. All the variety the game did have was taken from other much better Mario games and having a run button for a 3D Mario game on a console that had two analog sticks was a disgrace. The multiplayer also did nothing for the game. I agree with the OP it was decent but a forgettable Mario experience.
Yeah, 3D World was amazing, Nintendo really brought their A-game with that one. It was an absolute joy to play, just like Galaxy 1 & 2. Hell, I might even prefer it.
So many lump Galaxy with 64 as being more of a big, open, exploration-style Mario game, but hub world aside, the levels in Mario Galaxy are rather linear, and I realized this as I played it. Sure, there were some big levels, or planets. But so many were just tiny planet-->launch star-->tiny planet-->launch star-->tiny planet-->launch star-->end. The linear 3D World levels have more interesting traversal than the on-rails launch stars.
So many lump Galaxy with 64 as being more of a big, open, exploration-style Mario game, but hub world aside, the levels in Mario Galaxy are rather linear, and I realized this as I played it. Sure, there were some big levels, or planets. But so many were just tiny planet-->launch star-->tiny planet-->launch star-->tiny planet-->launch star-->end. The linear 3D World levels have more interesting traversal than the on-rails launch stars.
It's funny how the original topic of correlating quality is now just a back and forth on whether or not 3D World was actually great.
It's great.
Yeah no, I still disagree with everyone who says this. It's a 3D game built with both the experience of the 2D Mario games and the Galaxy games in game design. And I prefer having a run button than having to long jump + roll + dive to get anywhere.
But that was the original intent of the OP. Despite all the paragraphs, they just wanted to start another "3D World is bad" thread.
I don't know where this came from. I remember people thinking it was the second coming. I loved the game, myself, and I wouldn't say it's forgettable. However, I do think people over praise it (to each their own, of course). We had seen this all before in 3D Land.
It's funny to see people talk about 3D World as if it wasn't basically tied with NSMBU for second-best selling game of the WiiU and didn't manage to sell half the copies Galaxy 1 did on a platform with a seventh of the userbase.
All things considered it did exceptionally well.
All things considered it did exceptionally well.
None of what you said is grounded in reality. Smash on the 3DS and Wii U had some different content and served very different purposes, one being a portable game. Yes, MK8 is only 1 game. So is this hypothetical revolutionary Mario game you wanted 3D World to be. What's the difference? And how is MK8 too late when it came out only 6 months after 3D World, not even 2 years into the Wii U's life?
I've owned a Wii U for years and I love the system and its games, but it didn't sell not because the games were bad but because it was a terrible proposition. Nobody wanted the Gamepad, which was flimsy and had terrible battery life, and very few games even made use of it well. The Wii U was simply not what people wanted.
The games on the other hand were spectacular, possibly broadly Nintendo's best output since the N64. 3D World was fantastic; 2D platformers were well-covered with Tropical Freeze, Yoshi's Woolly World and NSMB U/Luigi U, some of the best of all time; you had little spin-offs that were great in their own right like Captain Toad and Tokyo Mirage Sessions; you had Platinum Games killing it with Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta 2; instalments in anchor series like Smash and Mario Kart were the best they've ever been; and you had left field stuff coming out of nowhere to surprise like Super Mario Maker. Pikmin 3, Colour Splash, Zelda HD remakes; Kirby; Hyrule Warriors; Pokken, Xenoblade Chronicles X - if you think Nintendo's software output was below par on the Wii U, you're delusional.
3D World wasn't enough for you to buy a Wii U. There's nothing wrong with that. But get out of here with that 'I don't care how much fun you had with 3D World, it was a miserable failure' shit. To ascribe the Wii U's failure to 3D World is absolutely bizarre reasoning.
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree then. I am not looking for a Mario 3D game that plays like a 2D Mario game and the limited movement and ambition will always make 3D World fall below any other 3D Mario game for me. No matter how polished the game ultimately is.The game is so forgettable that I am struggling to remember a single thing about it but everything is just a blur. None of the other 3D Mario games have this problem.
Booooo
3DW was way better than anyone gives it credit for, it's just the look of it that scares people away so they never get to try it.
...You may be onto something.
3DW was way better than anyone gives it credit for, it's just the look of it that scares people away so they never get to try it.
...You may be onto something.
This is nuts. 3DW is nothing but memorable moments. Odyssey actually tried to rip a bunch of them off but not nearly as successfully.
I beat it with all characters, got all the stars and flag poles, including champion's road. It's a good game it's just not what I was expecting, which was an ambitious Mario game to raise the bar after Galaxy.
The entire game revolved around a carnival aesthetic. I'm really struggling to see how you'd forget that. From the Switch Houses to the bosses (especially Hissocrat) to the music, that entire game revolved around a carnival identity. Want to know a game I struggle to remember? Super Mario 64. Asides from the title, I don't remember a single thing about it from a wow standpoint. Maybe it's because I only started playing seriously in the Gamecube era, but going back to the game did not endear me to that game at all. None of the places feels unique in a Mario game. Sunshine has a tropical aesthetic, Galaxy has a space aesthetic, 3D World has a carnival aesthetic, 64 is a bunch of disconnected worlds with no central theme, which is fine, but it also completely blows this "this game is so forgettable I'm struggling to remember" crap. I don't remember the worlds of 64 but I DO remember the gameplay of it. I remember the gameplay of 3D World far better than I do its worlds and I like how tight it plays. If that's not what you're looking for, that's fine.
Correct, but that really only shows after the first couple of worlds. I was liking but not loving 3D World early on, but iirc from the third or fourth world onward things started to really ramp up in terms of creativity and ingenuity. I remember thinking after each world that it wouldn't get any crazier, but it did. 3D World really has some of the best 3D Mario design ever, the further you get into the game. I've just started Odyssey and I hope I get a similar experience here.
So I don't really agree with OP, also as shown again here 3D world is not thought of as 'forgettable' by many who played it. Also from M64 onwards I have never played a weak mainline Mario game. Loved them all, even Sunshine.
Not surprising when you drop a bombshell like that in your OP.
The N64 was a massive fall from grace for Nintendo, leading to a mass exodus of 3rd parties that has set the stage for all future struggles they've encountered. That system launched with the most revolutionary relative to era Mario game of all time. So where's the correlation?
Also, SMG came out a year after the Wii released. The Wii was still selling out at that point. It was a success before Mario ever showed up. The Wii U was the opposite. 3D World came at a time when the trajectory of the console was already heading in the wrong direction due to a variety of reasons unrelated to a single Mario game.
Also, SMG came out a year after the Wii released. The Wii was still selling out at that point. It was a success before Mario ever showed up. The Wii U was the opposite. 3D World came at a time when the trajectory of the console was already heading in the wrong direction due to a variety of reasons unrelated to a single Mario game.
4-player co-op is not some minor feature like a new powerup. It gives experienced players a new way to enjoy the game, with accidental jump interference injecting a nice random element into replays. It also makes the game accessible to a wide range of people who prefer to play socially. People play with family members or non-gaming friends.
I understand that SM64 and (especially) Mario Galaxy have primed people to expect 3D Mario games to have a romantic tone (established through the music, story, and camera angle), but that tone should not be confused with ambition (although it seems reasonable to concede that 3D World specifically has narrower ambitions than SMG1 did).
I'm beaten already but the N64 was a failure compared to the SNES and 3D World was amazing.
Barely correlated and no system is successful or a failure based on one title.
For example: Wii was already a smash well before Galaxy. Wii U was dead well before 3D World.
Barely correlated and no system is successful or a failure based on one title.
For example: Wii was already a smash well before Galaxy. Wii U was dead well before 3D World.
I think it sold so well because it's a legitimately awesome game. Tons of tightly designed content, plus the 3D effect is beautifully implemented.
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I think this analysis is half true. Mario 64 surely made the N64 a bigger success than it would've been without it. So maybe the GC and Wii U could've performed better if the flagship Mario had been better received. I doubt it was the difference between success and failure though.
