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Chromie

Member
Dec 4, 2017
5,237
Washington
Okay first off, season 13 is okay. I wasn't laughing as hard or as often but meh, I enjoyed it. I didn't watch it when it was on air so I just watched it with a friend on Hulu.

My best friend and I are roommates. He's gay, not religious but comes from a...traditional Dominican background. We're from New York City. While the idea of machismo isn't too prevalent in his family since he was raised by his mom and has 3 sisters, his dad is more "old school" or whatever else to call it. I still remembering him getting mad at the idea of me sleeping over because he taught I was gay, this was probably during Junior High School days too.

Well anyway, just wow. I loved everything about the season finale. My friend did as well. Anyone who knows him well thinks of him as similar to Mac. Gay but IASIP brings up an excellent point. Gay men on TV are shown as very into rough sex/dungeon lifestyle or into stuff like RuPaul's Drag Race. Yes we know people like that but he is not. He's some nerd, like me, we work, play games during the weekends and look forward to D&D on the weekends and date who we like. I'm straight myself but I was still very moved by the final part especially having a father who has walked out on my life not because of my sexuality but because of him not wanting a child. Of course I don't feel the same things my friends feel but man, I was actually crying by the end of the episode.

The woman dancing with mac representing his religious side, his relationship with women, his sexuality and how it all conflicts with each other, in his mind, was just so amazing to watch. He wants to be sexually attracted to women because that what his Catholic guilt is telling him is right. He's gay and when Mac tells Frank he dreamed of dancing with a sexy woman angel all Frank can say is "Those Catholics fucked you up" is just astute even though delivered in a joking way. Mac just wants to be loved by someone that he tries very hard and fails constantly to win his fathers approval, his friends accept that he's gay but never want to hear about it and Frank admits that he just doesn't get him and even less so with him being gay. Yet while his own dad walks out on him, Frank stays, tears up and says "I get it" and I'm just there watching and thinking "Wow, this is not what I expected but just wow."

I'm not even sure what my point is but this episode has really been stuck in my head. Maybe it's the fact I see this too often in my line of work. I work with homeless LGBT teens and just seeing all those sad faces, yes some are gay, some are bi but they're all abandoned children because of their sexuality. It just really struck me.

I felt like Frank at the end of the performance.

 

Pirateluigi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,866
I was not expecting to finish a season of Sunny with tears in my eyes, applauding it as a beautiful and touching piece of art, yet here we are.
 

Daysean

Member
Nov 15, 2017
7,383
Was suprised when Mac's Dad left and the show was like fuck it, we're still serious, this isn't a joke.
Lil upset that the season ended on that note but I get why, i was honestly expecting for there to be more scenes after the dance where Mac just tries to promote how his body looks as usual.
I expect the next season to not make his sexuality much of a joke
 

Joeku

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,475
giphy.gif
 

Einchy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
42,659
I remember seeing this when it first aired on Reddit, though I didn't see the full episode since I haven't seen Sunny in a while. Anyway, I loved that it was played completely straight and it was genuinely a beautiful scene.
 
OP
OP
Chromie

Chromie

Member
Dec 4, 2017
5,237
Washington
I've apparently missed out on something significant. What an incredible scene.
Yeah im like wtf right now. Ive seen my share of sunny episodes but they apparently are in the 'fuck it' mode now where the extra special stuff happens.

It really is a powerful scene and with a decades worth of material on Mac and his backstory makes it even stronger. We've known forever that Mac believes in God, has slept with women because he was in denial about his sexuality, his father doesn't love him, and his friends constantly tell him they don't like him. It was just so well done. His greek statue of a body hiding his inner turmoil. He tries very hard to change himself for some recognition only to be constantly shat on.

ufmpqjc2vdx11.jpg
 

Joeku

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,475
It really is a powerful scene and with a decades worth of material on Mac and his backstory makes it even stronger. We've known forever that Mac believes in God, has slept with women because he was in denial about his sexuality, his father doesn't love him, and his friends constantly tell him they don't like him. It was just so well done. His greek statue of a body hiding his inner turmoil. He tries very hard to change himself for some recognition only to be constantly shat on.

ufmpqjc2vdx11.jpg
Seriously, there was seasons and seasons of buildup to this. It was both out of left field emotionally for an Always Sunny episode, but still earned.
 

wenis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,105
Good ending to a good season. It's Always Sunny will never get the awards it deserves, but it's a show that's been on for what will be more than 14 years now and continues to age like fine wine.
 
Oct 25, 2017
579
Wow. What an absolutely beautiful scene. I haven't watched Always Sunny in years. I'm gonna make the time to watch it now.
 

FreezePeach

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,811
Good ending to a good season. It's Always Sunny will never get the awards it deserves, but it's a show that's been on for what will be more than 14 years now and continues to age like fine wine.
I remember actually way back when, when it first debuted. They paired it with some other show in the hour slot. The other show was fucking awful and i cant remember its name. At the time i remember this one at least being mildly amusing, and it was before they brought Devito in.
 
Oct 26, 2017
19,737
I've heard about this scene, but I still haven't watched because I'm afraid it'll hurt my enjoyment to watch it by itself. I should probably just wait to watch the season and see this naturally in the episode, right?
 
OP
OP
Chromie

Chromie

Member
Dec 4, 2017
5,237
Washington
I've heard about this scene, but I still haven't watched because I'm afraid it'll hurt my enjoyment to watch it by itself. I should probably just wait to watch the season and see this naturally in the episode, right?

Honestly, if you've seen season 1-12 then go and watch it. Mac's whole history of the show is what makes the scene so powerful to me. We know exactly the kind of life he had and that's why it's hard to see Luther leave and so great to see Frank. But it's also only 10 episodes so there's that.
 

Rob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,079
SATX
I stopped watching around season 8 or 9 because the Gang just felt like just complete unlikeable assholes. I might have to give the thirteenth season a watch in this case.
 

wenis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,105
I remember actually way back when, when it first debuted. They paired it with some other show in the hour slot. The other show was fucking awful and i cant remember its name. At the time i remember this one at least being mildly amusing, and it was before they brought Devito in.
Yea I've recently watched the first season again (over the 4th holiday) and the first season is still strong and gives a good indication of the potential the show has. I think it's met and exceeded it ten fold from where it came from. It's long past due for award recognition and is easily one of my favorite shows of all time.

You're thinking of
9i8uxnSSLN5bR9cTXQ9ZFOzA6LF.jpg


Sterling K. Brown was the only survivor
 
Oct 25, 2017
579
Years? There's a lot tied to the more recent seasons that Mac has gone through that is touched on in the finale. Well worth a watch especially cause it's Always Sunny.
Yeah. Unfortunately life got busy and I lost touch around season five. Loved my time with it and every now and then think about carving out the time to watch it (there's so many shows I need to watch/catch up on). Seeing this put it at the top of my list. I want to fully understand what I just watched. And like you said it is Always Sunny.
 

Vonocourt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,620
It really is a powerful scene and with a decades worth of material on Mac and his backstory makes it even stronger. We've known forever that Mac believes in God, has slept with women because he was in denial about his sexuality, his father doesn't love him, and his friends constantly tell him they don't like him. It was just so well done. His greek statue of a body hiding his inner turmoil. He tries very hard to change himself for some recognition only to be constantly shat on.

ufmpqjc2vdx11.jpg
Don't forget that his mom also was never very caring towards him despite him trying to connect with her, and his only real "open" relationship besides Charlie was with Poppins, a dog that would regularly disappear for months at a time.
 
Oct 26, 2017
19,737
Honestly, if you've seen season 1-12 then go and watch it. Mac's whole history of the show is what makes the scene so powerful to me. We know exactly the kind of life he had and that's why it's hard to see Luther leave and so great to see Frank. But it's also only 10 episodes so there's that.
I did go ahead and watch, and wow. That really was amazing.
 

Guzim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,496
Yeah. Unfortunately life got busy and I lost touch around season five. Loved my time with it and every now and then think about carving out the time to watch it (there's so many shows I need to watch/catch up on). Seeing this put it at the top of my list. I want to fully understand what I just watched. And like you said it is Always Sunny.
I'm so jealous you get to experience so many great episodes for the first time.
 

Senator Toadstool

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,651
Good ending to a good season. It's Always Sunny will never get the awards it deserves, but it's a show that's been on for what will be more than 14 years now and continues to age like fine wine.
It's probably gonna be the longest live action sitcom ever

the show started in 2005!
 

Master Of Illusion

Alt Account
Banned
Mar 18, 2019
856
If it were a different show I'd see the praise, however that (as well as moments in that entire season really) suffer a complete tonal imbalance to the extreme version of "nobody hugs, nobody learns anything" that It's Always Sunny is at its core; and it's stuff like that that is too on the nose for this type of show as well as perhaps being telling that maybe 13/14 seasons for a sitcom is too much.
 

wenis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,105
If it were a different show I'd see the praise, however that (as well as moments in that entire season really) suffer a complete tonal imbalance to the extreme version of "nobody hugs, nobody learns anything" that It's Always Sunny is at its core; and it's stuff like that that is too on the nose for this type of show as well as perhaps being telling that maybe 13/14 seasons for a sitcom is too much.
source.gif
 

CrocM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,587
If it were a different show I'd see the praise, however that (as well as moments in that entire season really) suffer a complete tonal imbalance to the extreme version of "nobody hugs, nobody learns anything" that It's Always Sunny is at its core; and it's stuff like that that is too on the nose for this type of show as well as perhaps being telling that maybe 13/14 seasons for a sitcom is too much.
It's longevity owes to it being a sketch comedy show that incorporates sitcom continuity elements.
 

Fat4all

Woke up, got a money tag, swears a lot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
92,600
here
honestly i liked season 13 a lot more then i though i would going by impressions
 

Senator Toadstool

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,651
If it were a different show I'd see the praise, however that (as well as moments in that entire season really) suffer a complete tonal imbalance to the extreme version of "nobody hugs, nobody learns anything" that It's Always Sunny is at its core; and it's stuff like that that is too on the nose for this type of show as well as perhaps being telling that maybe 13/14 seasons for a sitcom is too much.
This is Seinfeld not Always Sunny. Always sunny is always sociopathic. But it's had growth and characters learning and changing for most of its existence
 

Joeku

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,475
This is Seinfeld not Always Sunny. Always sunny is always sociopathic. But it's had growth and characters learning and changing for most of its existence
Yep. For what its worth though the characters are always assholes and in the wrong, they think they're in the right and the show itself has grown in its many seasons. For instance, season 13 has an episode about the entire bathroom issue around trans people (in light of bills passed in some states) that is many steps above the first couple seasons making cracks about "the tranny" character (and the episode could actually serve as a good primer about the entire thing for people wholly ignorant to it)...even though at the end the characters are on the verge of learning a lesson to just treat people as they want to be treated, respectfully, and instead they double down on misogyny.

The messages always come across despite how atrocious the characters are as people. Though I guess not being loudly hateful towards Mac for being gay is actually a step above many shitty people these days, so reality kinda warped in such a way that the baseline was lowered and these characters kinda rise above it in some ways.
 

spam musubi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,380
It's worth noting that Rob McElhenney (Mac)'s mom and brother are gay, and they come from a conservative background, so it's coming from a real place.
 

Deleted member 2840

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,400
I've devoured all episodes of the show just over a month ago, and that episode was fucking amazing. I keep beating myself up that I hadn't started watching it earlier.
 

theBmZ

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
2,125
Yeah I finished the season a couple weeks ago. I was in a state of shock and awe at what they pulled off. I was waiting for the punchline, but it just cut to black. Played completely straight. I gotta give them props for that. After so much time on the air, we really know these characters, and it affords them the opportunity to take creative risks, and actually play with the format of the show. And it's well written enough that you would think just from this scene that the show was a character drama. Really beautiful stuff, and perhaps the best episode of Sunny purely based on impact.
 

Yams

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,841
If it were a different show I'd see the praise, however that (as well as moments in that entire season really) suffer a complete tonal imbalance to the extreme version of "nobody hugs, nobody learns anything" that It's Always Sunny is at its core; and it's stuff like that that is too on the nose for this type of show as well as perhaps being telling that maybe 13/14 seasons for a sitcom is too much.

These character are always evolving and changing. Yes, they're horrible people. The writers know this and they use these characters as a way to show how people can still be the same on the surface while also changing on a deeper more cognitive level
 

thewienke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,934
It's worth noting that Rob McElhenney (Mac)'s mom and brother are gay, and they come from a conservative background, so it's coming from a real place.

That's what really made it all the more powerful in retrospect.

That said, even as a massive, massive fan, I would never, ever encourage people to watch the show on the basis of that episode alone. It can't be stated enough that the tone of that scene is just so, so far off the rails from their usual offerings. As much as I liked it, it still feels incredibly and almost shockingly out of place. Imagine Seinfeld or Curb Your Enthusiasm doing something similar!

I'm glad that they did the episode but it also seems like an out of place punctuation mark on what was their most underwhelming and disappointing season yet.

Hopefully their schedules all line up 100% better for season 14 because I don't think they're out of ideas so much as they ran into all kinds of conflicts in getting season 13 done.
 

gutterboy44

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,592
NY
It was a phenomenal finale to the season. I absolutely love what they are doing with these late seasons in the show. Some episodes are misses, but I like that they are really trying to do something new and original and willing to be incredibly sincere and earnest with some bits.

A bit of a sidebar, but related to this post, but I think it is such a fucked notion that drama is the the defacto genre for what the media and award shows consider to be the most impactful telling of the human condition. Truly brilliant comedy and satire are so much harder to pull off and in my opinion much more reflective of what it is to be human. I don't want to derail the thread too much, but just wanted to soap box quickly about how under appreciated I think top notch comedic writing and performances are.
 

Jombie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,392
The show is a shell of what it once was, but that's an amazing scene. I've watched it several times since it aired.
 

gutterboy44

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,592
NY
I think a lot of people don't give this show credit for recovering from the Dayman popularity boom/bust. The show seemingly peaked with the Dayman season, and they did the whole tour of theaters with Dayman stuff and all of a sudden the show had sponsors like Coor's and everything felt contrived and awful in the proceeding seasons. They lost their way and it seemed like it was going to be a classic jump the shark moment and they would be done. They took time, re grouped and did a great job of bringing the show back to what made it great while also opening up to much more risky and "out there" episode story lines that didn't make the mistake of just being a silly premise, but were driven by the core character personalities they developed through the years.

I agree that it feels like Sunny, had a phase where it was only getting worse, but the fact that they recovered, something that almost never happens with comedy shows was wildly impressive. They could have gone the Chapelle Show route where the popularity and hype suffocated it and just quit before it got even worse, but they managed to put out some of their all time best work post Dayman popularity peak. In addition to the this wonderful finale, the Charliework episode from a season or two previous, was probably one of the most expertly written, directed, and acted episode of a comedy show ever.
 

Master Of Illusion

Alt Account
Banned
Mar 18, 2019
856
That's what really made it all the more powerful in retrospect.

That said, even as a massive, massive fan, I would never, ever encourage people to watch the show on the basis of that episode alone. It can't be stated enough that the tone of that scene is just so, so far off the rails from their usual offerings. As much as I liked it, it still feels incredibly and almost shockingly out of place. Imagine Seinfeld or Curb Your Enthusiasm doing something similar!

I'm glad that they did the episode but it also seems like an out of place punctuation mark on what was their most underwhelming and disappointing season yet.

Hopefully their schedules all line up 100% better for season 14 because I don't think they're out of ideas so much as they ran into all kinds of conflicts in getting season 13 done.

This guy gets it.
 

Rellodex

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,160
People always get bent out of shape about the ups and downs of the show but really it's only because so much of it has been so stellar.

I seriously haven't been disappointed by a season (or dare I say an episode) yet.

There are definitely stretches that are worse than others, but absolutely nothing I would ever consider to be bad.