I never believed that phones are "listening to us" but now I do....

slsk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
65
Protip: If you share an internet connection with others (eg. in your home), and someone searches for *some product* then everybody who uses that connection will see ads for that product. This explains the majority of these cases.
 

Dultimate

Member
Oct 27, 2017
266
What a stupid post

Firstly there's entire communities of people who go out of their way to monitor traffic to and from devices and you can do this yourself. If google or anyone else was doing this it would be hugely HUGELY public because anyone can traffic monitor their own device. I can do it right now.

Secondly Occam's Razor in this scenario is that Advertising algorithms and profiles are incredibly advanced which is public knowledge and so ad targeting is often right on the money.

Thirdly local based auto listen is a feature available with Shazam, Xbox Kinect, Alexa and Google Home devices and everything else and their is a HUGE difference to detecting audio input and running a query search based on that audio or a local command based on audio instructions and "PHONES ARE LISTENING TO US" conspiracy shit
I'm not going to attack you personally and respond by saying what a smug fuck you are but..

You're an example of the type of individual that thinks that just because you know a little bit about a thing (or in some posters case, a lot about something) means you know it ALL. The fact of it is that no matter how smart you think you are there are plenty people smarter than you and Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Facebook have the resources to hire some of the smartest people in the world. Two of those companies have more than 90% of the ad market for the internet and I'm very confident they are spending their billions in revenue on making sure that they can grow that marketshare.

So forgive me if I don't take comfort in smug forum poster Stalker telling me that the algorithm is taking my cousins friend sisters aunt brothers son's search query and using location data blah, blah, blah to send me some fucking ad when I coincidentally JUST fucking had a conversation about the most obscure thing ever (in relation to me). The simple matter is we're walking around with a phones in our pockets that have powerful snapdragon and A4 processors with anywhere from 2 to 12gbs of ram at any and all times. These powerful computers are doing very complex things and listening in our conversations is one of the most basic, which we know they do. The argument is about to what extent.

You don't know what you don't know. Just because I and the posters who are saying it's happening to them can't explain HOW doesn't mean it's not happening. Just because you and the posters who are giving detailed breakdowns of what you THINK is happening is saying something doesn't make it so. That is actually working to the benefit of these companies.
 

Qikz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,881
This is a must to look at: https://support.google.com/websearch/answer/6030020?co=GENIE.Platform=Desktop&hl=en&oco=0

Your phone is usually recording you chattering away in the background, and you can choose to opt out of it. If you've never turned it off, check the clips it has recorded of you.
Well now I feel awful, there's so many recordings of me before I turned this off of telling google to call my Mum, my Mum passed away this January :(
 

Stalker

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,355
I'm not going to attack you personally and respond by saying what a smug fuck you are but..

You're an example of the type of individual that thinks that just because you know a little bit about a thing (or in some posters case, a lot about something) means you know it ALL. The fact of it is that no matter how smart you think you are there are plenty people smarter than you and Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Facebook have the resources to hire some of the smartest people in the world. Two of those companies have more than 90% of the ad market for the internet and I'm very confident they are spending their billions in revenue on making sure that they can grow that marketshare.

So forgive me if I don't take comfort in smug forum poster Stalker telling me that the algorithm is taking my cousins friend sisters aunt brothers son's search query and using location data blah, blah, blah to send me some fucking ad when I coincidentally JUST fucking had a conversation about the most obscure thing ever (in relation to me). The simple matter is we're walking around with a phones in our pockets that have powerful snapdragon and A4 processors with anywhere from 2 to 12gbs of ram at any and all times. These powerful computers are doing very complex things and listening in our conversations is one of the most basic, which we know they do. The argument is about to what extent.

You don't know what you don't know. Just because I and the posters who are saying it's happening to them can't explain HOW doesn't mean it's not happening. Just because you and the posters who are giving detailed breakdowns of what you THINK is happening is saying something doesn't make it so. That is actually working to the benefit of these companies.
You're an example of the type of individual that will ignore logic and reason to further their own opinions. Confirmation Bias at it's finest.

AGAIN since you obviously missed it or ignored it because it doesn't support your conspiracy.

PEOPLE MONITOR NETWORK TRAFFIC FOR FUN. If anyone was listening in on you it would be public knowledge because its so easy to monitor network traffic and see exactly EXACTLY what is being sent and to who.

It's likely you're going to come back with some snarky "you don't know what you don't know" nonsense to further your conspiracy but you can't prove this one iota and you know what I can prove.

I can log and trace every single data packet from my phone. I can see exactly down to the individual packet payload what is being transmitted and to who. I can prove no one is listening you can't prove your dystopian fantasy.

Edit:

Oh look an article in which someone tracks his networking traffic

https://www.androidauthority.com/is-your-smartphone-spying-on-you-953309/f

Following my testing, I am confident none of the devices I used are doing anything unusual or malevolent.
 

Nerfgun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,536
Nova Scotia
You're an example of the type of individual that will ignore logic and reason to further their own opinions. Confirmation Bias at it's finest.

AGAIN since you obviously missed it or ignored it because it doesn't support your conspiracy.

PEOPLE MONITOR NETWORK TRAFFIC FOR FUN. If anyone was listening in on you it would be public knowledge because its so easy to monitor network traffic and see exactly EXACTLY what is being sent and to who.

It's likely you're going to come back with some snarky "you don't know what you don't know" nonsense to further your conspiracy but you can't prove this one iota and you know what I can prove.

I can log and trace every single data packet from my phone. I can see exactly down to the individual packet payload what is being transmitted and to who. I can prove no one is listening you can't prove your dystopian fantasy.

Edit:

Oh look an article in which someone tracks his networking traffic

https://www.androidauthority.com/is-your-smartphone-spying-on-you-953309/f
It really is wild how people can be presented hard data but still fall back to “but but but it was CREEPY”

No one is arguing that it isn’t creepy. Like I don’t get why explaining that it’s worse than listening is seen as somehow minimizing. (Or “smug”, wtf)
 

Dultimate

Member
Oct 27, 2017
266
I'll yield.

If and when we do discover that this sort of thing may have been happening and it's explained in a way that makes people go "hmm, I never thought of that", will you all have the courtesy to acknowledge that you were wrong this whole time. I wonder.
 

Stalker

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,355
I'll yield.

If and when we do discover that this sort of thing may have been happening and it's explained in a way that makes people go "hmm, I never thought of that", will you all have the courtesy to acknowledge that you were wrong this whole time. I wonder.
You mean when they invent a way to send data without it being visible.

Magic? Yes, When Magic is discovered I'll acknowledge I was wrong .
 

Railgun

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,549
Australia
Can we ban conspiracy theories like this, these threads do nothing but further spread more misinformation on this and people clearly refuse to listen to reason.
 

OrangeNova

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,859
Canada
I'll yield.

If and when we do discover that this sort of thing may have been happening and it's explained in a way that makes people go "hmm, I never thought of that", will you all have the courtesy to acknowledge that you were wrong this whole time. I wonder.
Yes, but I doubt it'll happen without it being seen immediately through network traffic.

But you set yourself up in a situation in which you never have to admit you're wrong. You're basically saying "I'm not wrong because I don't believe you, but if I'm proven right in the future you're wrong."
 

Stalker

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,355
Yes, but I doubt it'll happen without it being seen immediately through network traffic.

But you set yourself up in a situation in which you never have to admit you're wrong. You're basically saying "I'm not wrong because I don't believe you, but if I'm proven right in the future you're wrong."
And I'm the "smug" one.


 

NekoFever

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,792
I'll yield.

If and when we do discover that this sort of thing may have been happening and it's explained in a way that makes people go "hmm, I never thought of that", will you all have the courtesy to acknowledge that you were wrong this whole time. I wonder.
Yes, and I will support every prize in science going to the engineers who worked out how to transmit data undetectably and/or run 24/7 speech analysis on a phone while maintaining a usable battery life, all on consumer hardware and without full access to the OS, and under the noses of the entire security industry.

I am also willing to admit when I was wrong because my opinion isn't based on coincidence, cognitive bias and a gigantic conspiracy theory.

It's also worth pointing out that taking an unfalsifiable position is usually an indication that a belief is not based on evidence. But hey, just accuse everyone else of being the ones who won't acknowledge that they're wrong in the face of evidence.
 

Toddhunter

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,750
I don’t think I needed to add that she turned it on when I gave it to her. Anyone would have understood that.
To be fair, you are talking nonsesnse about a globabl conspiracy around your phone going above and beyond all known technical capability and listening to you to sell you snorkelling equipment.

So yeah, I'm not sure you can be picky about what everyone should understand.
 

zeioIIDX

Member
Nov 25, 2017
484
Wanna know what's fucking scary? A few weeks ago, I was on my HTC Vive playing Rec Room online with my brother who stays in Colorado (I'm in Mississippi). He was using his Oculus Quest. So we're playing online together and talking and the conversation turns to Enter the Dragon, our favorite Bruce Lee film. We start to briefly talk about a character named Bolo, a character who is barely in the film all that much. We continue to play VR for another hour or two.

Fast forward to one day later. I'm browsing the web at work and suddenly, I see one of those ads near the bottom of Yahoo or something, you know...the ones that try to catch your attention with something to make you click on it? The ones that are usually like "Learn how these 3 college students in (insert your state here) made $5,000,000 in 24 hours!". Well this particular ad was about Bolo from Enter the Dragon. It showed a picture of the actor from a scene he graced in Enter the Dragon and the caption said something along the lines of "The actor who played Bolo in Enter the Dragon has not aged well, see what he looks like now!"

I end up calling my brother and telling him about it and he tells me the same exact ad popped up for him too while he was browsing the internet at work. To say I was creeped out at this would be an understatement. Were our VR headsets listening to our conversation the day prior? Were our phones somehow listening to us? There's no WAY that's a coincidence. I'm not buying it.
 

404Ender

Member
Oct 25, 2017
199
I did the ultimate test some weeks ago.

I bought a new phone for my mother and I set it up with a new google account using the WiFi in the restaurant where I was having lunch. There was nothing AT ALL on the phone, no contacts, no apps, no assistants, nothing, only the standard apps you get with a Motorola phone.

As a test, I started talking about going to the lake and getting to do some snorkeling (which I NEVER did and have no plans to as I’m asthmatic. Never ever did I talk about the subject).

I turned off the phone and when I handed it to my mother there were ads for snorkel masks and fins in google chrome.

Sorry, but that’s proof enough for me.
It's summer. You live near a body of water.

Like, do people also forget how normal advertising works? Sometimes I wonder if people get panic attacks from TV commercials.

"Holy shit, remember how we were just talking about wanting to see the new Avengers movie this weekend? I just saw a trailer for it on TV how did they know!?!?"
 

Gorthaur

Member
Oct 28, 2017
149
To be fair, you are talking nonsesnse about a globabl conspiracy around your phone going above and beyond all known technical capability and listening to you to sell you snorkelling equipment.

So yeah, I'm not sure you can be picky about what everyone should understand.
I’m not talking nonsense. It’s a test I did that day, that’s all. That was the result whether you like it or not. I can’t explain how it knew that I talked about snorkeling but it did. Me I don’t use androidand google apps anymore nor social media so I’m not really concerned.
 

scottstephan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
198
The much scarier thing is that they don’t need to listen into you. Based on what we know about data brokerage, heres a possible explanation:

  • Facebook/Google etc. know that you and Person B are home together most often at times when people they know are married at whole together. Statistically, Person b is probably your husband or wife- They’ll have data to solve that. They also probably have public record to confirm this
  • Then y’all were in the exact same small space for some period of time, maybe watching TV maybe just meeting in the kitchen. At any rate, it was a period in which you were likely to talk.
  • Your wife in the next n-time interval then started googling CBD, something she’s never done before. One of your topics, then, was probably CBD (And is anyone else at her work or social group also suddenly googling this? +1!)
  • Your wife has a new interest so the person who bought the ads start serving you, the husband or partner, CBD products to keep the topic alive and/or encourage a purchase
There’s so much you can get from location data, social relationships and large data sets that your phone doesn’t need to listen to you
 

Red

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,205
This reminds me of people who think they have precognition of events when they have a dream about something and it happens some time later.

Let’s be clear. Of course there are apps that listen to you. But they must be granted microphone access, and they typically listen for some trigger word before data is relayed. There is no global conspiracy of IT companies listening in on your private conversations to discover what brand of shoe to sell you online. There are easier, more efficient ways to do that.
 

Roy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,434
This is a must to look at: https://support.google.com/websearch/answer/6030020?co=GENIE.Platform=Desktop&hl=en&oco=0

Your phone is usually recording you chattering away in the background, and you can choose to opt out of it. If you've never turned it off, check the clips it has recorded of you.
I guess all those people who monitor network traffic missed this somehow 😆

Anyway, Facebook’s TOS says it uses your mic whenever it wants and so it seems Google does too.
 

Red

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,205
I guess all those people who monitor network traffic missed this somehow 😆

Anyway, Facebook’s TOS says it uses your mic whenever it wants and so it seems Google does too.
You didn’t open this link.

What's saved in your Voice & Audio Activity
Google records your voice and other audio, plus a few seconds before, when you use audio activations like:

Saying commands like "Ok Google"
Tapping the microphone icon
Your audio is saved to your account only when you're signed in and Voice & Audio Activity is turned on.
 

Kenstar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
890
Earth
the ruinous 5g cancerwaves must be frying the 'phones arent listenting in for ads' sheeple's brains
'but the entire security industry proved' YEAH U KNOW WHOS MOST EXPOSE TO FIVE GEE RADIATION?!?!?!
EXPLOITATIVE VOLATILE EVANGELISTS - NONQUESTIONING UNINTELLIGENT LARPING LOSERS in the SECURITY and ELECTRONICS COMMITTEE AKA EVE-NULLSEC GOONS
Q.E.D
 

CerealKi11a

Member
May 3, 2018
358
I find it hard to believe they’re able to detect every little thing we say when I can barely get any voice assistant to recognize what I’m saying without sounding like I’m giving a clearly enunciated presentation with no microphone to a crowded room.
 

Garrett 2U

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,744
It is really simple. Take a look at the revenue sources for the largest tech companies.

42% of total revenue of the top 5 tech companies comes from advertisement and online retail; 20% of total revenue comes from advertising alone.

These companies are really good as selling us shit. You better believe they have this down to a science. They don’t need to listen to your conversations because they have all the data they need, as other posters have discussed.

These few instances where you realize the system is selling you something are the anomalies. Most of the time this process goes by unnoticed.
 

davepoobond

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,452
www.squackle.com
Yeah they’re listening to you specifically.

Now let’s listen to 100 million peoples audio in real time.

Where are all of the voice analyst jobs that they’re hiring for
 

PKrockin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,911
What's the psychological phenomenon where you remember the hits and forget the misses? This idea of phones listening in on us and giving us ads related to what we're saying is the perfect example of that. Even ad personalization algorithms aside, by chance alone, with how many ads fly through your perception on a daily basis, I'd expect people to witness a highly improbable coincidence on rare occasion.
 

JeTmAn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,556
Yeah they’re listening to you specifically.

Now let’s listen to 100 million peoples audio in real time.

Where are all of the voice analyst jobs that they’re hiring for
1. Those 100 million people already carry supercomputers in their pockets which are more than capable of doing sophisticated audio processing.

2. Sending back a list of discovered keywords takes a trivial amount of bandwidth, no human analysis required.

BTW, how long was the government spying on everyone before Snowden blew the whistle?
 

Dultimate

Member
Oct 27, 2017
266
1. Those 100 million people already carry supercomputers in their pockets which are more than capable of doing sophisticated audio processing.

2. Sending back a list of discovered keywords takes a trivial amount of bandwidth, no human analysis required.

BTW, how long was the government spying on everyone before Snowden blew the whistle?
Thank you bruh.

If it was so fucking easy to discover shit why did it take Snowden to tell us all the shady shit the government is doing and all the companies they're in bed with that allowed them to do it?

Now everyone is a genius because they know shit after the fact.

This is what I mean by not knowing what you don't know.

People are acting as if we're saying they are RECORDING each and everything we're saying when in fact we are saying they are LISTENING to what you're saying. Listening for key words just like ”ok Google".
 

Kenstar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
890
Earth
1. Those 100 million people already carry supercomputers in their pockets which are more than capable of doing sophisticated audio processing.

2. Sending back a list of discovered keywords takes a trivial amount of bandwidth, no human analysis required.

BTW, how long was the government spying on everyone before Snowden blew the whistle?
having voice analysis running all the time is a noticable battery drain and people (including me) disable google assistant voice command feature to save some life

also the US government was spying and keeping all the info to itself, a harder concept to prove vs 'i talk about cats and see a petco ad sometimes', very easy to prove and yet the most we ever get are people talking about that one time
it'd be a constant, obvious thing to everyone and wouldn't magically not work when empirically tested

maybe they only turn it on on people who are metadata profiled to be conspiracy theorists, because no one will listen to their wild claims?
 

FaceHugger

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,941
Let us know how it goes!
So far nothing. I openly discussed buying tampons for several minutes with my phone unlocked, then again with the Amazon app open, and then asked OK Google where I can buy tampons. Nada. Surprising, because the last time I merely stepped foot in a Journey's for two minutes every webpage I went to for a week was running an ad for sneakers and / or a Journey's.
 

Red

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,205
People are acting as if we're saying they are RECORDING each and everything we're saying when in fact we are saying they are LISTENING to what you're saying. Listening for key words just like ”ok Google".
Come on now. Everyone knows this. It’s self-evident. You’re either being disingenuous or you have missed the point entirely.
 

Nerfgun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,536
Nova Scotia
1. Those 100 million people already carry supercomputers in their pockets which are more than capable of doing sophisticated audio processing.

2. Sending back a list of discovered keywords takes a trivial amount of bandwidth, no human analysis required.

BTW, how long was the government spying on everyone before Snowden blew the whistle?
It sucks when people don’t read the fucking thread. This has all been answered.

Snowden has nothing to do with what we’re discussing by the way
 

LL_Decitrig

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,834
Sunderland
Or how to detect it and break it down as it goes through your internet connections?
Again, it's really difficult to tell whether the "phone as mic" proponents are being serious or have simply gone full tinfoil hat. Yes, it's easy to monitor network communications.

And to summarise: if somebody decided to use voice to text as a way to drive advertising, that would be doing it the hard way. They already know far more about you than even you know. Machine learning is very powerful, and far more frightening in so many ways than the idea that we could make it all okay by simply putting an on-off switch on our telephone microphone.
 

Deleted member 36493

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Dec 19, 2017
4,981
A lot of my friends have reported getting “hot singles in your area” emails while I’m hanging out with them
 

Ominym

Member
Oct 25, 2017
648
This topic always drives even normally level headed people insane.

You’re not that unique as a person, ad networks are incredibly sophisticated, it would be the White Hat Hacker find of the decade if it was happening, recency bias and ad blindness are a thing, the amount of qualitative data needed to be parsed would be staggering. The list goes on.

TL;DR it ain’t happening.