I still prefer Dark Knight Rises to the majority of Superhero films

[Rum Diet]

But there's only one good Matrix movie.

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actually the whole trilogy is good. Go back and give it another try.

The backlash from the critics because the Wachowskis didn't want to give interviews colored a lot of peoples opinions at the time. Sad part is they didn't want to give interviews because one of them was transitioning at the time. Go figure.

 

[vhoanox]

It was ok but while watching in the theater I was wonder why everyone in this movie acting so stupid. And action is very bad make it very hard to rewatch.

 

[wizard]

I still prefer Batman Begins to all other Batman film.

 

[Conciliator]

I didn't love Dark Knight Rises but it had, like, ideas and a vision to some degree.

Most super-hero movies at this point feel like they're written by a fuckin focus group

 

[Mikebison]

actually the whole trilogy is good. Go back and give it another try.

The backlash from the critics because the Wachowskis didn't want to give interviews colored a lot of peoples opinions at the time. Sad part is they didn't want to give interviews because one of them was transitioning at the time. Go figure.

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No, critical backlash is because 2 and 3 sucked. 2 sucked and 3 super sucked. Turns out they made one of the most important sci fi movies of all time, but couldn't follow it up.

Now I know it was just meant to be one sequel and the studio pressured them for a trilogy. Seen the supercut of 2+3 and it's a little better.

But they still sucked.

 

[Rum Diet]

No, critical backlash is because 2 and 3 sucked. 2 sucked and 3 super sucked. Turns out they made one of the most important sci fi movies of all time, but couldn't follow it up.

Now I know it was just meant to be one sequel and the studio pressured them for a trilogy. Seen the supercut of 2+3 and it's a little better.

But they still sucked.

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What b.s is this?

From every interview i've ever seen with the Wachowskis always had it as a trilogy. And what supercut? No supercut was ever released or shown to anyone.

They did however shoot 2 and 3 as one long movie. That's how they shot it, not as standalone films. A lot of people did have the problem with the pacing, and all that from how they simply cut the one long movie in half.

 

[Conciliator]

I don't want to live in a universe where The Matrix Revolutions is considered to be a good movie

At least Reloaded is kind of insane though. to me, that is worth something.

 

[Mikebison]

What b.s is this?

From every interview i've ever seen with the Wachowskis always had it as a trilogy. And what supercut? No supercut was ever released or shown to anyone.

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Sorry, I should say rumours.

Just YouTube supercuts. People cut out all the shite from 2+3 and make a half decent movie from the leftovers.

 

[Mikebison]

I don't want to live in a universe where The Matrix Revolutions is considered to be a good movie

At least Reloaded is kind of insane though. to me, that is worth something.

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Don't worry, it's not.

 

[Rum Diet]

I don't want to live in a universe where The Matrix Revolutions is considered to be a good movie

At least Reloaded is kind of insane though. to me, that is worth something.

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Like i just said right above your post reloaded/revolutions was shot and made as 1 movie cut in half. They ran into pacing problems and all that when they realized how Revolutions was going to play out. Watching it as one movie however, is actually a different experience.

 

[MilesQ]

I really liked Bane, the rest of the movie wasn't particularly great and the final 20mins are perhaps the worst of any CBM I've seen.

It felt really obvious that Nolan had had enough of Batman and was doing Rises out of contractual obligation. The choreography, the setpieces, the dialogue, cinematography, everything felt half hearted, with only Bane standing out as good, but that's because Hardy really put the work in.

 

[Conciliator]

Like i just said right above your post reloaded/revolutions was shot and made as 1 movie cut in half. They ran into pacing problems and all that when they realized how Revolutions was going to play out. Watching it as one movie however, is actually a different experience.

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Well, OK, that's cool, but the movie I paid a ticket for back in the day was stupid only where it wasn't completely dull.

 

[Rum Diet]

Well, OK, that's cool, but the movie I paid a ticket for back in the day was stupid only where it wasn't completely dull.

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Is that because everything has to have a comedy bit thrown in for you? That's usually what i get from those types of complaints.

 

[MilesQ]

Oh, ok one of the best fight scenes of all time that has been endlessly copied in superhero movies since then was the worst of any CBM you've seen? That's pretty incredible actually. There's more creativity and genuinely jaw dropping gorgeous shots in any Matrix action scene than the entirety of the current crop of CBMs.

Is that because everything has to have a comedy bit thrown in for you? That's usually what i get from those types of complaints.

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The final confrontation between Bane/Batman was awful. It was so poorly shot compared to their first encounter.

 

[Conciliator]

Is that because everything has to have a comedy bit thrown in for you? That's usually what i get from those types of complaints.

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you caught me dog I thought they replaced Keanu Reeves with Sandler, I was super disappointed

 

[Rum Diet]

The final confrontation between Bane/Batman was awful. It was so poorly shot compared to their first encounter.

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I edited it. Sorry, it's late and i thought you were talking about Bane from Matrix Revolutions lol.
I read it wrong.

you caught me dog I thought they replaced Keanu Reeves with Sandler, I was super disappointed

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Dull and stupid to me sounds like you needed some of that Marvel template magic. My bad.

 

[MilesQ]

I edited it. Sorry, it's late and i thought you were talking about Bane from Matrix Revolutions lol.
I read it wrong.

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No worries my dude. For what it's worth, I love that final confrontation in Revolutions. Yes it was over the top and veered too much into anime style combat, but it was still cool as fuck to see them go all out.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

That final battle in Matrix Revolutions was the best live action DBZ sequence we had until Man of Steel, also a better movie than TDK Rises.

When Bane punches that column, man.. oof

 

[Fady]

It was, to me, an incredibly satisfying conclusion to my favorite film trilogy. While it doesn't reach the incredible heights of Batman Begins and especially The Dark Knight, it comes full circle with the plot and i appreciated that. A severely underrated film IMO. Well said Bruceleeroy

 

[earthsucks]

worst of the trilogy, but i still enjoyed it and typically have zero interest in anything remotely superhero related.

 

[Timothy]

I liked Bane a lot. And for me that is incredibly important. A strong villain.

Unlike in.... Every single Marvel movie and the DCEU I actually feel a threat. Intensity when Bane is around.

The closest any other superhero movie gets from either of the other two major franchises is Loki but he's not really full villain (nor is he threatening but more of a funny cool guy).

Don't know why this one element can't be replicated in any other superhero movie post 2008 aside from Nolan films.

 

[rancey]

batman's always been the only superhero shit i can really tolerate. something about it just works. it's kind of hard to fuck up, nolan's movies are how to do it well, but not the best, excluding the joker stuff which is really the best possible version of that kind of character. there's a reason heath ledger got so much applause for that performance. i'd love to see more authorial takes on it in the future.

but it's really all about the dark knight for me. rises is all right, i mean it's still got some cool stuff in it, but bane as a villain, eh.

i kind of wish it was just one move in the dark knight. then you could just say 'this is a good movie'. the series thing kind of dilutes it cos the other two aren't as good.

 

[zoukka]

Yeah even the worst Nolan output destroys 99% of the superhero genre. It's just a horrid genre, what can I say.

 

[Skiptastic]

It's a great movie. You are not insane.

 

[nekkid]

Revolutions was great because the battle for the dock was a hundred times better than the slap-fighting that took up most of the rest of the trilogy.

Those fights were an utterly pointless waste of screen time for the most part, where nobody seemed to come off particularly bad nor definitively win from them.

 

[The Almighty Tria]

Haha, what?
The Joker destroys/turns Dent. He turns Batman into a villain to the public at large. He undermines the police force.

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• He destroys/turns Dent. But no one knows about it but a couple of dudes. Everyone else sees him as hero.
• Turns Batman into a villain, but simultaneously ends all crime in Gotham which means Batman isn't even needed anymore (this is if you're putting the sequel into the equation).

Then the rest all he did was blow up a few things (with no casualties) and not accomplish a whole lot but scare people. He was a wonderfully acted, and Ledger deserves all the awards in the world, but his character is pretty underwhelming and disappointing.

Compared to Bane? Man, Joker is a chump. Joker pretty much just amounted to killing some dude's girlfriend, ending all crime in Gotham, and causing a whole lot of property damage.

 

[shinra-bansho]

I originally read this as The Dark Knight, and agreed. And then realised it was about The Dark Knight Rises, and am less in agreement, although it is better than many modern comic films. It has a lot of issues.

Also, the reason the villain sucks in a bunch of comic book movies is often because a) the villain is actually just not very interesting in the source material anyway, and/or b) the actor isn't great.

C.f. Ian McKellen's Magneto. Or... Michael Fassbender's Magneto.

 

[jey_16]

At least when I walked out of the theatre I felt like I had an experience with TDKR.

Walking out after watching a MCU movie leaves me feeling like I just watched some Family Guy right before sleep.

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Damn son

 

[138]

I'd want to read a graphic novel version of it, or maybe play a video game. There's too many aspects that land poorly or seem hokey. Batman visible in flashes of light while dodging bullets in a dark tunnel should be awesome, but it looks silly here. The fight choreography, some of the delivery and the pacing might be more palatable for me in a different form.

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Recommended reading, then. Entire scenes were lifted out of The Dark Knight Returns, it seems.

also...

 

[Rare Opiums]

If you said The Dark Knight I would have agreed but The Dark Knight Rises?.....yeah no.

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Yeah OP. I thought everyone agree that TDK is the best CBM.

 

[Deleted member 2254]

At least when I walked out of the theatre I felt like I had an experience with TDKR.

Walking out after watching a MCU movie leaves me feeling like I just watched some Family Guy right before sleep.

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At least with Family Guy they dare being unpredictable. Just like superhero movies, they all end on "and everything is back to normal", but at least the ride can have some unexpected twists and turns. Can't really say the same about most superhero movies. Now the good guys win on Earth. Now they win in space. Now they close a portal and win. Now they blow up the evil planet and win. Yay?

 

[emir]

Originally the Rises's story was different, a Joker and Harley movie were considered. Shortly after the Heath Ledger (Rip) incident, a new script, new characters was brought. And of course, some problems appeared. The choreography on Rises were bad, everybody accepts this. But according to a standard superhero film, Rises is a movie that doesn't use much CGI and is shots in large, real sets. Also brought many memorable iconic scenes and the most realistic Bane version.

It was more valuable than all the current DCEU shits.

 

[catashtrophe]

Dark Knight Rises is a great film and I definitely agree with most of what the OP says.

For me the only movies I put ahead of it (other than the other 2 Batman movies) is Logan and Dofp

Might re-watch watch the Batman trilogy this weekend

 

[JehutyRunner]

I will die on this hill with you, friend. The Dark Knight Rises gets a lot more shit than it deserves. And whilst there are flaws with it for sure - dear god, Marion Colitard at the end (you know that bit) - it's still a marvelous movie. Definitely in my top three DC movies alongside The Dark Knight and Wonder Woman.

 

[Alexandros]

Lots of flaws and more than a little disappointing after the fantastic TDK but TDKR is still a fascinating movie. Marvel's best movies have surpassed it but I would rather rewatch TDKR than Dr Strange or GOTG 2, even though I'm a massive Marvel fan.

 

[VAD]

Rises was a good movie until the Talia reveal.

 

[TheBeardedOne]

Maybe I really should go back and rewatch it. I've only seen it once, and my friend had made me a couple of drinks beforehand. I always hated watching big movies while drinking, but he'd always put them on.

 

[BlueJay]

Agreed, I found it to be a great movie.

It's still the weakest entry and largely disappointing compared to its predecessors. But upon revisiting it and viewing it in the context of its place in the trilogy, it's actuallly a damn fine ending.

Granted, the movie was not only a major commercial success, but a critical hit with both reviewers and audiences. It's only the hardcore internet fan base that paints the picture that it's a "bad movie".

 

[Wigdogger]

Can't agree.

The entire Nolan take on Bruce Wayne was about him wanting to move on from Batman; his entire goal is to put things right so Batman isn't required. For Bruce, being Batman and everything he had given up WAS the cost. Since Wayne's arc in The Dark Knight was all about his sacrifices to begin with, it would be both cynical and repetitive to end on his death. That's not how Nolan wanted to end that franchise and, frankly, it's the more novel approach to ending Batman to give him a happy-ish ending, as opposed to the Batman-till-death approach all post-Miller writers have taken.

There are far bigger issues with that film the ending. I was relieved they weren't being so obvious and gross about it.

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I can appreciate that. Fair point about the majority of writers going down that path. I would still argue that TDKR rushes the ending that it does have, and I have little emotional investment in the journey he takes at the end, where he ends up, or who he ends up with. I think earlier moments in the film sabotage that for me as well.

 

[Bruceleeroy]

I will die on this hill with you, friend. The Dark Knight Rises gets a lot more shit than it deserves. And whilst there are flaws with it for sure - dear god, Marion Colitard at the end (you know that bit) - it's still a marvelous movie. Definitely in my top three DC movies alongside The Dark Knight and Wonder Woman.

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Haha I appreciate it bro. You are all welcome to have your final resting place here with me

 

[Lurcharound]

Well, even with its flaws it's still a better film - in terms of overall directing, acting and thematic intent - than most other Superhero films so why wouldn't you?

 

[LionPride]

Yeah OP. I thought everyone agree that TDK is the best CBM.

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Begins is better

 

[Servbot24]

No question. Better than almost every Marvel and DC movie.

 

[Captain of Industry]

I remember leaving the theater slightly disappointed when I saw it the first time. I liked it a lot more the second time I watched it. That whole trilogy is awesome.

 

[Bawsto]

Bruce in the pitt working up the strength to get out while Gotham crumbles. The music - CHANTING RISE - That gives me chills every time.

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Effective scene if you give none of the prior proceedings thought and let music sway you. A described absolute pit of despair filled in actuality with supportive characters and really no barrier to escape except for a difficult climb, which is seemingly no issue for a man who had a broken back that had it fixed with a quick adjustment and dangling rest.

The absurdity of the situation is anything but engrossing. Certainly not moving, but laughable. The film very much comes across as Nolan being creatively exhaustive, because BB and DK are incredibly thoughtful by comparison.

 

[Pooh]

• He destroys/turns Dent. But no one knows about it but a couple of dudes. Everyone else sees him as hero.
• Turns Batman into a villain, but simultaneously ends all crime in Gotham which means Batman isn't even needed anymore (this is if you're putting the sequel into the equation).

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It means that Dent is gone, though, Gotham's "White Knight." His fall results in Batman having to be turned into a villain and the city is forced to move on without Dent. They made the best of a terrible situation but it's still a terrible situation for Gotham. I'm not really considering the sequel mostly because I don't think it makes sense to when considering a movie in its own context.

Then the rest all he did was blow up a few things (with no casualties) and not accomplish a whole lot but scare people. He was a wonderfully acted, and Ledger deserves all the awards in the world, but his character is pretty underwhelming and disappointing.

Compared to Bane? Man, Joker is a chump. Joker pretty much just amounted to killing some dude's girlfriend, ending all crime in Gotham, and causing a whole lot of property damage.

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He killed one of the (apparently) few actually honest lawyers in the city, and was *this* close to succeeding at his plan. He gets a bunch of cops killed, turns cops against each other, and blows up a bunch of hospitals. He literally terrorizes the city, even if a ton of people don't necessarily die. I don't think that makes him a bad villain, it makes Batman a hero.

I don't think a villain has to kill a ton of people to be a good villain. I think that the Joker is a far more interesting villain that also serves to show Batman's heroism than, say, Zod in the Supes movie. I mean, millions die in that movie, but that really only makes Superman seem less heroic than he should.

 

[Forkball]

It's hard to follow up The Dark Knight, but TDKR is a good movie. It has a unique premise, a compelling villain, and wraps up franchise without abandoning its themes. That said there are definitely some strange plot decisions. They did not need to bring back the League of Shadows nor put Batman in a big hole. I feel like they completely overthought the basic concept of "Army conquers Gotham and Batman comes out of retirement to fight them off" and made things more complicated than they should have been.

 

[overcast]

Yeah I agree with you. It's more engrossing with all of its issues and bloat than almost every Marvel flick for me.

 

[wachie]

I may have said in the previous forum that TDKR is better than 95% of super-hero films and I now realize that was incorrect, it's actually better than 99% of them.

I did a re-watch of both TDK and TDKR and I feel that TDKR is actually better of the two. Here's why:

• It has a lot of complex themes and new characters
• Quite a lot of timelines and passage of time is also varied.
• The film has a lot of expectations to wrap things up, something that TDK didn't have the burden and it does so in the most satisfying manner.
• Quite a lot of symbolism for example the pit young Bruce falls in BB, old Bruce is fighting to get out of in TDKR.
• TDK OST was great but I've grown to like TDKR OST even more, and last but not the least ...
• TDKR focusses more on Bruce while TDK I feel was a villain (Joker) driven movie.

 

[Deleted member 11995]

...Am I crazy guys?

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Not at all. TDKR is a damn good film. To me it's crazy that you have to ask the question.

I honestly think Nolan's entire Batman trilogy stands head and shoulders above almost all the other superhero stuff we get these days.