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Jumpman64

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
550
I always wanted an arcade cabinet in my home and I think I'm finally going to buy one or build it. Where should I look online since there are tons of companies that make Pre-built ones. Also any links to good sites for building my own.

Anyone in here ever built one, would love to see some pics and past building experience if so.
 

Toasty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
332
Sidewinder



I haven't built one before but this Youtuber I've followed for a while put out this 3 part series a while back. Here's the first part.
 
OP
OP
Jumpman64

Jumpman64

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
550
Thanks I'll check out the videos. Appreciate it. I'll report on my progress from time to time as well.
 

senatom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
102
I did this about a year and half ago.

First you want to get an idea of what you want, e.g. do you want a cocktail cabinet, a standing machine, how many players, what size screen.

How handy are you? If very there are plenty of plans around where you can work to or you could even design your own and then make it with MDF. For this I decided I wanted a vewlix clone, and while I am somewhat handy I opted for the wood pre-cut in a flat plack.

Here is what the render of the cabinet I ordered looked like:

untitled.png


When I ordered my flat-pack these are the things I considered and allowed for:
  • Player count (2)
  • Buttons per player and layout (in my case 2 and opted for the vewlix style of layout)
  • Other buttons (4 smaller buttons on the control surface for P1, P2 and aux buttons for start/select etc, while I had another 4 holes cut for 4 buttons underneath)
  • Screen type and size (I based it around a Sony 32" LCD)
  • Speakers (4 holes cut for 4" Car Speakers)
  • Coin door (hole cut to put a working 2P coin door)
  • Holes on rear for fans
  • Hinged door on front to enable easy access to innards
Next you need to work out how you are going to protect the surface of the MDF (loves soaking up moisture). I painted (in a make shift spray booth out of PVC, plastic drop sheets, a couple of cheap fans and some filter material) ever piece with a sealing undercoat and then applied coats of white or black depending on the area (with light sanding in between) before finally coating some of it with clear polyurethane.

Makeshift spray booth:

IMG_0189.jpg


IMG_0198.jpg


As well as painting there are some surfaces that are best finished with vinyl wrap, such as the control surface, this is nice looking hard wearing stuff, the particular one I used was a matte black finish.

So at this point the cabinet itself has been painted, vinyl wrapped, finished and put together. Next part is the innards, I will list again what areas to think of and what I used:

  • Screen (32" Sony HDTV, as this was to be used for both classic and modern games)
  • Speakers (4 x JBL GTO 4" Speakers)
  • Amp, you need something to drive your speakers, for this I used an SMSL Q5, more than enough power and has USB and optical input)
Controls, I will keep this separate as there is a bit to it. Depending on the types of games you will be playing will play a big part into this. Do you prefer Sanwa, or maybe Happ? Do you want an 8 way joystick or just a 4?

  • Joysticks (I went with something a little different here and am using Servostiks, there are a nice little stick which have a motor built in and can change from 4 way to 8 way, you can even set it to change automatically depending on the game, e.g. if I load Pac-Man it will change to 4 way, if I load a fighter it will go to 8 and so on).
  • Buttons, again a personal preference (I am using Sanwa OBSN-30 as my game buttons and for option buttons I am using OBSF-24s). Keep in mind there are screw in and push in buttons, depending on what your control board is made from will depend on which ones you want)
  • Control Board, you need a way to interface the buttons and sticks with the computer/Pi/Console or whatever you're using. I opted to use an IPAC 4, which plugs into my PC via USB. This board has the advantage of macros, so you can hold down a designated special button and then press another button to do function x. For example I have a button combination that will hibernate the machine, another that turns it on, and one for volume up and volume down, the list goes on.
There is a lot of wiring to do, here's a pic of my testing phase, NSFW:

IMG_0229.jpg


The brains, aka the PC:

This is where you need to decide how you are going to run this all, for me I was lucky enough to have recently built a new PC so I had an old PC with a 770 to run in it. From this I run Mame and many other emulators, but I also run Steam, Windows store and other current PC games (e.g. Tekken 7). Now this is where it gets tricky, in order for me to run modern games I need the game to support keyboard input, as the controller I am using is exactly that, a keyboard emulator. This can be tricky with certain games and sometimes you have to use a combination of xbox controller emulators, baked dlls and other hacks to get game x working (this is not a problem with MAME and the like). You can just use an xbox pad innards to achieve this also. So I suggest you think long and hard about what games you want to play.

As part of the above you need to decide what O.S. you are using, I just used Windows 10, but that is only the half of it. I wanted my machine to be as if I don't have Windows, and no-one using it would know. It was quite a bit of working using a combination of registry hacks, startup scripts etc to get it there but it can be done. The most important part of this is the dashboard/launcher you use. There are 2 of real note Hyperspin and Launchbox. I decided to use Hyperspin it has a great set of tools and loads of functionality (for instance it will download art, descriptions etc for your game library, it supports every emulator launcher (e.g. Steam) that I have thrown at it, great bit of software, it does however take a great deal of time and patience to get it right and when you do back it up ASAP!

After that there are just fun customisation things to consider, I got decals online for the the P1 P2 and all other options buttons, wired up my coin door and have it working with MAME, some seats, artwork etc, there are so many things you can do. I would have to say this little project was one of the most rewarding things I have done in recent history.

The final product:

IMG_0232.jpg


I am by no means an expert at this, and this is the first and only one I have built, so don't be discouraged at all. Seriously, if I can do it, most people can.
 
Last edited:

Hadok

Member
Feb 14, 2018
5,793
not sure if raspberry pi is the best for emulation.
If you want good emulation with good crt filter,raspberry pi is not enough.
 

JustJavi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,116
New Zealand
not sure if raspberry pi is the best for emulation.
If you want good emulation with good crt filter,raspberry pi is not enough.

I highly disagree with you. A raspberry pi 3 B+ overclocked with a small for fan for cooling will run any mame rom with crt filters with no issues at all. I'll try to remember to post a video of mine when I'm back home.
 

senatom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
102
Good point, a big advantage using a PC with a dedicated GPU, is the scanlines you can generate, e.g. HLSL. Really needed for older games, you can get them looking really nice.
 

Hadok

Member
Feb 14, 2018
5,793
I highly disagree with you. A raspberry pi 3 B+ overclocked with a small for fan for cooling will run any mame rom with crt filters with no issues at all. I'll try to remember to post a video of mine when I'm back home.

oh really?some good filter need some powers....
Also i am sure i've read somewhere(mame forum maybe?) that the cpu in raspberry pi is not the best for perfect emulation.
 

JustJavi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,116
New Zealand
oh really?some good filter need some powers....
Also i am sure i've read somewhere(mame forum maybe?) that the cpu in raspberry pi is not the best for perfect emulation.

Obviously nothing can beat a Pc for emulation, but RaspPs are definitely not as bad as a lot of people make them sound. It depends how much the op is willing to spend.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,038
could you build a cocktail table one that is discreet enough to double as a day to day coffee table?
 
OP
OP
Jumpman64

Jumpman64

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
550
I did this about a year and half ago.

First you want to get an idea of what you want, e.g. do you want a cocktail cabinet, a standing machine, how many players, what size screen.

How handy are you? If very there are plenty of plans around where you can work to or you could even design your own and then make it with MDF. For this I decided I wanted a vewlix clone, and while I am somewhat handy I opted for the wood pre-cut in a flat plack.

Here is what the render of the cabinet I ordered looked like:

untitled.png


When I ordered my flat-pack these are the things I considered and allowed for:
  • Player count (2)
  • Buttons per player and layout (in my case 2 and opted for the vewlix style of layout)
  • Other buttons (4 smaller buttons on the control surface for P1, P2 and aux buttons for start/select etc, while I had another 4 holes cut for 4 buttons underneath)
  • Screen type and size (I based it around a Sony 32" LCD)
  • Speakers (4 holes cut for 4" Car Speakers)
  • Coin door (hole cut to put a working 2P coin door)
  • Holes on rear for fans
  • Hinged door on front to enable easy access to innards
Next you need to work out how you are going to protect the surface of the MDF (loves soaking up moisture). I painted (in a make shift spray booth out of PVC, plastic drop sheets, a couple of cheap fans and some filter material) ever piece with a sealing undercoat and then applied coats of white or black depending on the area (with light sanding in between) before finally coating some of it with clear polyurethane.

Makeshift spray booth:

IMG_0189.jpg


IMG_0198.jpg


As well as painting there are some surfaces that are best finished with vinyl wrap, such as the control surface, this is nice looking hard wearing stuff, the particular one I used was a matte black finish.

So at this point the cabinet itself has been painted, vinyl wrapped, finished and put together. Next part is the innards, I will list again what areas to think of and what I used:

  • Screen (32" Sony HDTV, as this was to be used for both classic and modern games)
  • Speakers (4 x JBL GTO 4" Speakers)
  • Amp, you need something to drive your speakers, for this I used an SMSL Q5, more than enough power and has USB and optical input)
Controls, I will keep this separate as there is a bit to it. Depending on the types of games you will be playing will play a big part into this. Do you prefer Sanwa, or maybe Happ? Do you want an 8 way joystick or just a 4?

  • Joysticks (I went with something a little different here and am using Servostiks, there are a nice little stick which have a motor built in and can change from 4 way to 8 way, you can even set it to change automatically depending on the game, e.g. if I load Pac-Man it will change to 4 way, if I load a fighter it will go to 8 and so on).
  • Buttons, again a personal preference (I am using Sanwa OBSN-30 as my game buttons and for option buttons I am using OBSF-24s). Keep in mind there are screw in and push in buttons, depending on what your control board is made from will depend on which ones you want)
  • Control Board, you need a way to interface the buttons and sticks with the computer/Pi/Console or whatever you're using. I opted to use an IPAC 4, which plugs into my PC via USB. This board has the advantage of macros, so you can hold down a designated special button and then press another button to do function x. For example I have a button combination that will hibernate the machine, another that turns it on, and one for volume up and volume down, the list goes on.
There is a lot of wiring to do, here's a pic of my testing phase, NSFW:

IMG_0229.jpg


The brains, aka the PC:

This is where you need to decide how you are going to run this all, for me I was lucky enough to have recently built a new PC so I had an old PC with a 770 to run in it. From this I run Mame and many other emulators, but I also run Steam, Windows store and other current PC games (e.g. Tekken 7). Now this is where it gets tricky, in order for me to run modern games I need the game to support keyboard input, as the controller I am using is exactly that, a keyboard emulator. This can be tricky with certain games and sometimes you have to use a combination of xbox controller emulators, baked dlls and other hacks to get game x working (this is not a problem with MAME and the like). You can just use an xbox pad innards to achieve this also. So I suggest you think long and hard about what games you want to play.

As part of the above you need to decide what O.S. you are using, I just used Windows 10, but that is only the half of it. I wanted my machine to be as if I don't have Windows, and no-one using it would know. It was quite a bit of working using a combination of registry hacks, startup scripts etc to get it there but it can be done. The most important part of this is the dashboard/launcher you use. There are 2 of real note Hyperspin and Launchbox. I decided to use Hyperspin it has a great set of tools and loads of functionality (for instance it will download art, descriptions etc for your game library, it supports every emulator launcher (e.g. Steam) that I have thrown at it, great bit of software, it does however take a great deal of time and patience to get it right and when you do back it up ASAP!

After that there are just fun customisation things to consider, I got decals online for the the P1 P2 and all other options buttons, wired up my coin door and have it working with MAME, some seats, artwork etc, there are so many things you can do. I would have to say this little project was one of the most rewarding things I have done in recent history.

The final product:

IMG_0232.jpg


I am by no means an expert at this, and this is the first and only one I have built, so don't be discouraged at all. Seriously, if I can do it, most people can.


Holy crap man that looks amazing. Also I'm subbing to the other thread but should I go with a small custom pc with low range gpu and amd zen so I can get arcade perfect emulation on sf3.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,324
Subbed...

I've been wanting to build a stand up arcade, 2 player for awhile. I like the above Viewlix one but I really want a stand up unit. Is there a similar link to pre-cut pieces like that but for stand up style?
 
Oct 28, 2017
27,090
I'm looking to add a tabletop type machine for my bar and I need it to run off battery power and NOT an outlet. So far I have:

Gamez M155 15.5 screen 720p
(2) 15000mah USB batteries
1 SNES Classic (might do a Pi if I can run it off of DC power)

I don't have a form factor or a housing unit design but I'm getting 11+ hours of continuous play.

Are those DIY cabinets scalable for different screen sizes?
 
Oct 26, 2017
7,303
Do you really want to build a cabinet? There are tons of existing cabs that might need a new home. Only issue is that all old cabinets use CRT monitors which are prone to eventually fail and can't really be replaced anymore. But it's a really cool feeling to run games off original boards onto an original screen.
 

Suikodan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
858
Do you really want to build a cabinet? There are tons of existing cabs that might need a new home. Only issue is that all old cabinets use CRT monitors which are prone to eventually fail and can't really be replaced anymore. But it's a really cool feeling to run games off original boards onto an original screen.

Honestly, buidling your own cabinet means that you must be very resourceful with plans, cutting and assembling tools and that's *exactly* the part that I'm not. I bought a SF2CE cabinet, removed the board and CRT and replaced it with a PC and LCD screen. Works wonders.
 
OP
OP
Jumpman64

Jumpman64

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
550
Okay what about these guys. They provide a already precut and painted. You can also get them to install custom vinyl. Looks pretty good and not bad pricing wise.

Also check out the bartop version

https://gameroomsolutions.com/product-category/cnc-cabinets/

The full 27 inch came out to 1027 for me with extras and vinyl installed. I would just have assemble wires and get electronics

They also have already built ready to play bartop versions for a little over a thousand
 

RoadDogg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,061
Anyone have any experience with pre-built options? I have been itching to make one for years but everytime I look into it I realize I dont have the time. It gets even more confusing when I consider wanting light gun games to work.
 

DaveB

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,513
New Hampshire, USA
I did this about a year and half ago.

First you want to get an idea of what you want, e.g. do you want a cocktail cabinet, a standing machine, how many players, what size screen.

How handy are you? If very there are plenty of plans around where you can work to or you could even design your own and then make it with MDF. For this I decided I wanted a vewlix clone, and while I am somewhat handy I opted for the wood pre-cut in a flat plack.

Here is what the render of the cabinet I ordered looked like:

untitled.png


When I ordered my flat-pack these are the things I considered and allowed for:
  • Player count (2)
  • Buttons per player and layout (in my case 2 and opted for the vewlix style of layout)
  • Other buttons (4 smaller buttons on the control surface for P1, P2 and aux buttons for start/select etc, while I had another 4 holes cut for 4 buttons underneath)
  • Screen type and size (I based it around a Sony 32" LCD)
  • Speakers (4 holes cut for 4" Car Speakers)
  • Coin door (hole cut to put a working 2P coin door)
  • Holes on rear for fans
  • Hinged door on front to enable easy access to innards
Next you need to work out how you are going to protect the surface of the MDF (loves soaking up moisture). I painted (in a make shift spray booth out of PVC, plastic drop sheets, a couple of cheap fans and some filter material) ever piece with a sealing undercoat and then applied coats of white or black depending on the area (with light sanding in between) before finally coating some of it with clear polyurethane.

Makeshift spray booth:

IMG_0189.jpg


IMG_0198.jpg


As well as painting there are some surfaces that are best finished with vinyl wrap, such as the control surface, this is nice looking hard wearing stuff, the particular one I used was a matte black finish.

So at this point the cabinet itself has been painted, vinyl wrapped, finished and put together. Next part is the innards, I will list again what areas to think of and what I used:

  • Screen (32" Sony HDTV, as this was to be used for both classic and modern games)
  • Speakers (4 x JBL GTO 4" Speakers)
  • Amp, you need something to drive your speakers, for this I used an SMSL Q5, more than enough power and has USB and optical input)
Controls, I will keep this separate as there is a bit to it. Depending on the types of games you will be playing will play a big part into this. Do you prefer Sanwa, or maybe Happ? Do you want an 8 way joystick or just a 4?

  • Joysticks (I went with something a little different here and am using Servostiks, there are a nice little stick which have a motor built in and can change from 4 way to 8 way, you can even set it to change automatically depending on the game, e.g. if I load Pac-Man it will change to 4 way, if I load a fighter it will go to 8 and so on).
  • Buttons, again a personal preference (I am using Sanwa OBSN-30 as my game buttons and for option buttons I am using OBSF-24s). Keep in mind there are screw in and push in buttons, depending on what your control board is made from will depend on which ones you want)
  • Control Board, you need a way to interface the buttons and sticks with the computer/Pi/Console or whatever you're using. I opted to use an IPAC 4, which plugs into my PC via USB. This board has the advantage of macros, so you can hold down a designated special button and then press another button to do function x. For example I have a button combination that will hibernate the machine, another that turns it on, and one for volume up and volume down, the list goes on.
There is a lot of wiring to do, here's a pic of my testing phase, NSFW:

IMG_0229.jpg


The brains, aka the PC:

This is where you need to decide how you are going to run this all, for me I was lucky enough to have recently built a new PC so I had an old PC with a 770 to run in it. From this I run Mame and many other emulators, but I also run Steam, Windows store and other current PC games (e.g. Tekken 7). Now this is where it gets tricky, in order for me to run modern games I need the game to support keyboard input, as the controller I am using is exactly that, a keyboard emulator. This can be tricky with certain games and sometimes you have to use a combination of xbox controller emulators, baked dlls and other hacks to get game x working (this is not a problem with MAME and the like). You can just use an xbox pad innards to achieve this also. So I suggest you think long and hard about what games you want to play.

As part of the above you need to decide what O.S. you are using, I just used Windows 10, but that is only the half of it. I wanted my machine to be as if I don't have Windows, and no-one using it would know. It was quite a bit of working using a combination of registry hacks, startup scripts etc to get it there but it can be done. The most important part of this is the dashboard/launcher you use. There are 2 of real note Hyperspin and Launchbox. I decided to use Hyperspin it has a great set of tools and loads of functionality (for instance it will download art, descriptions etc for your game library, it supports every emulator launcher (e.g. Steam) that I have thrown at it, great bit of software, it does however take a great deal of time and patience to get it right and when you do back it up ASAP!

After that there are just fun customisation things to consider, I got decals online for the the P1 P2 and all other options buttons, wired up my coin door and have it working with MAME, some seats, artwork etc, there are so many things you can do. I would have to say this little project was one of the most rewarding things I have done in recent history.

The final product:

IMG_0232.jpg


I am by no means an expert at this, and this is the first and only one I have built, so don't be discouraged at all. Seriously, if I can do it, most people can.
That is amazing! How much was the kit and where did you order it from?
 

senatom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
102
That is amazing! How much was the kit and where did you order it from?

Yes please fill us in on where you bought the precut material

I bought it through a place called ArcadeWorx, they are fantastic to deal with, open to customizing it how you see fit (I had it cut for the perfect size of my TV, my choice of buttons/joystick, coin door, fans etc). I paid around $600 for this, it was shipped to me in a flat pack (thnk Ikea) with all the required screws and assembly pieces, as well as instructions. The downside here though, I and this business are in Australia. ArcadeWorx would probably ship overseas but it would cost a small fortune, the weight of all this MDF would probably be 80+KG (~200lb) However when I was looking there was a reputable dealer in the US that offered a similar cabinethere.

Trust me I would use a CRT if they didn't weigh hundreds of pounds lol

On that note, what is a good monitor to use for arcade classics. I'm guessing an SPS 1080p monitor with low response time. Maybe one of the evo endorsed monitors?

I would have also used a CRT (in fact I had one at the time which was around the size I wanted to use (32"), never mind it weighed 100KG (220lb) haha. In the end I went for a TV which had a very low input lag and very high refresh rate (both important for older games especially). You can buy LCDs with the weird refresh rates that are the same/similar for the arcade cabinets but they aren't cheap. In the end I am extremely happy with the Sony LCD TV, once you get the scan lines right it looks amazing, and not too far off a CRT (yes a CRT is much for the classic games, but it has been so long since I have seen one that these feel the same). I would like to upgrade the TV at some point to a 32" 4K computer monitor if only for even higher res scan lines (and it won't hurt new games either).
 
Last edited:

SephLuis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,343
Hopefully you can create an amazin arcade machine.

Looking forward to see the eventual results.
 

MagnusGman

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,041
Dallas
This thread might come in handy.

After months of campaigning to the leadership in my company, we got the cautious go ahead to aquire a few cabinets for an arcade in the office. (We deal with some heavy psychological material under NDA)

Now I have a pressing need to learn how to repair and maintain cabinets.

I would definitely appreciate pointers on the subject!
 

japtor

Member
Jan 19, 2018
1,142
This thread might come in handy.

After months of campaigning to the leadership in my company, we got the cautious go ahead to aquire a few cabinets for an arcade in the office. (We deal with some heavy psychological material under NDA)

Now I have a pressing need to learn how to repair and maintain cabinets.

I would definitely appreciate pointers on the subject!
What type of cabs and what condition are they in? What games will you be running? If they're older and crap is broken and/or you want to run non arcade boards it might be easier to convert them into PC/console cabs.
 

Nightfall

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,959
Germany
I also built an arcade cabinet over the last... I guess 9 months? My dad and me finished it yesterday and I couldn't be more proud.
Also posted it over here
If you have any questions I'd be happy to help.

0SpMBBY.png
 

belinho3

Member
Dec 30, 2017
65
Can't make a thread, so I'll bump this one, sorry.

Hey guys,

Just as an introductory note, consider me a complete amateur in every aspect of pc building, woodworking, etc. And English is not my first tongue, so some terms or definitions may be off.

Despite that, after seeing stuff like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TR0iq8nHwk, I thought that with a couple of changes I could make a really good machine.



So I decided to study some guides to try and replicate one the way I wanted. Long story short, I have so many questions, and its hard to find any kind of tutorial for a 2 monitor bartop. I wont go to the woodwork part, just the electronics.

The plan:

-Use PC parts

-Two 13-15" 4:3 displays, ideally borderless (frameless), like the one I´ve shown.

-1 or 2 mono speakers (no stereo because it would be reversed for one of the players)

-Coin acceptor and tray

-NO EXTENSION CORDS (try to connect monitos and speakers to mb if possible, like the Pandora boxes)

After seeing some Pandora box's kits (again, not knowing anything about pc components and whatnot) it seemed easy. Connect stuff to the motherboard, power and signal (monitors and speakers). Apparently not so

Challenges:

-Connecting 2 monitors to motherboard. I can´t even find displays according to my initial expectations. Its either 7"widescreen, or with huge bezels. Besides that, is it possible to connect 2 monitors to a motherboard? Do I need an LCD board, or that's just for touchscreen? Can the power be provided by the motherboard, or do I need a different power supply?

-Speakers. Can I connect 2 speakers to the motherboard, power and signal? Like I said, I guess it will have to be mono sound, can I do it? 1 or 2 speakers? How can I add volume controls?

-Can I connect player 2 monitor and speaker to the same "power line", so that if its only one person playing, the 2nd screen and sound is off?

-Inside space and heating. Im guessing in order to keep the build small, things will need to be efficiently and tightly positioned, and im imagining this thing will heat quite a bit, especially between the two monitors. Where would I need to add a fan? Near monitors, motherboard? Can the main power supply just face down?

There's more stuff, this is just the things im finding really hard to understand.

The last couple of days really left me demotivated, feels like i´m running in circles, can´t find answers to my questions, and writing all this stuff down makes it seem impossible for me to accomplish. I think the goal I set is really not attainable

Anyway, I'll wait for your replys, hopefully its easier than im thinking
 

Barrel Cannon

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
9,290
belinho3 I've yet to make my own arcade yet but I can definitely speak to the screens. You are better off going with widescreen displays and just cropping around the screen Acquiring good 4:3 LCDs is gonna be a pain in the ass to do. I wanted to go that route for some console related stuff 3-4 years back and gave up because I couldn't find anything good and just went with CRTs(which won't work for this project without taking up a ton of space). I wish you the best of luck in finding some good 4:3 screens if you do go that route. Do your research and try to make sure they don't have heavy ghosting
 

trevofour

Member
Oct 26, 2017
486
joisey
I would avoid Pandora's Box due to performance hiccups, and go with a cheap PC with a Mame front end. You can also bypass building the cabinet itself and check out Xtension Arcade cabs if you have a bigger budget and want to avoid the stress.

edit: I'm a doof and didn't read the entire bumped post
 
Last edited: