I want to play the Yakuza series. Where do I start?

wombleac · Feb 15, 2020

I say start with Kiwami and play from there through 6 then end it with 0. I appreciated Majimas back story so much more doing it that way than I think I would have if I started with 0. Kiwami really isnt that bad and it's only up from there. I'm so jealous OP which ever place you start, awesome series.

Clive · Feb 15, 2020

shadowman16 said:
2 isn't redundant because Kiwami 2 exists. Both have different combat, different side content, different music, heck even the camera angles are different in both games ;)
Plus I could argue combat in 2 is as good as Kiwami 2's if not better in places - more (heat) moves (the number of helper heat moves in Kiwami 2 are noticeably reduced compared to what was included in Kiwami 2) while the difficulty in Kiwami 2 is drastically reduced especially in boss fights which really sucks.

It's redundant until you reach the point where you have played " 0 then 1 + 2 Kiwami, then 3 through 7, Fist of the North Star, Judgement, Dead Souls, Kenzan, and Ishin and still want more". It does nothing important to the characters or overarching plot which isn't in Kiwami 2 and should in my opinion be given the lowest priority together with Yakuza 1 PS2. Kiwami 2 is superior to the version of Yakuza 2 and the one someone should play in 2020. Yakuza 2 is a game to play in 2020 if you've become a ultra-hardcore fan, have played the dozen+ other games and want to see what changed for the upgraded version of the game.

It should maybe be your fourteenth Yakuza game, Kiwami 2 your third. I don't think most should play Yakuza 2 PS2 personally tbh even if "redundant" may be a too strong word. Once you're done with the thirteen other Yakuza games, get some air and play some non-Yakuza classics that you missed out on while playing a thousand hours of one series.

PerrierChaud · Feb 15, 2020

thepenguin55 said:
It's not a bad game by any stretch, it's just a remake of a game that was Yakuza before the series truly discovered what it was.

What?

shadowman16 said:
It does nothing important to the characters or overarching plot which isn't in Kiwami 2 and should in my opinion be given the lowest priority together with Yakuza 1 PS2. Kiwami 2 is superior to the version of Yakuza 2 and the one someone should play in 2020.

It really isn't. Y2 holds up perfectly well to this day. It has a way better overall look (Kiwami 2 greenish-like lighting is a travesty), has the best version of the ending and at least doesn't throw you tons of subpar recycled content that has been done better elsewhere (the cabaret mini-game is perfect in Zero and didn't need to come back again just like the RTS-like battles).

Never thought I'd see comments like "there is no point in playing a PS2 game in 2020" on a so-called gaming enthusiast forum, honestly.

shadowman16 · Feb 15, 2020

Clive said:
It's redundant until you reach the point where you have played " 0 then 1 + 2 Kiwami, then 3 through 7, Fist of the North Star, Judgement, Dead Souls, Kenzan, and Ishin and still want more". It does nothing important to the characters or overarching plot which isn't in Kiwami 2 and should in my opinion be given the lowest priority together with Yakuza 1 PS2. Kiwami 2 is superior to the version of Yakuza 2 and the one someone should play in 2020. Yakuza 2 is a game to play in 2020 if you've become a ultra-hardcore fan, have played the dozen+ other games and want to see what changed for the upgraded version of the game.

It should maybe be your fourteenth Yakuza game, Kiwami 2 your third. I don't think most should play Yakuza 2 PS2 personally tbh even if "redundant" may be a too strong word. Once you're done with the thirteen other Yakuza games, get some air and play some non-Yakuza classics that you missed out on while playing a thousand hours of one series.

Unless your playing on the PC and you've modded the proper music back in, then its not superior. Certain scenes are butchered in the remake thanks to the team licensing SiM's music over the original CKB music and it really takes you out of those scenes (at least it did for me), one character is not so much butchered, but pointlessly harmed in the remake (Takashima magically aging a good 20-40 years just to shoehorn a celebrity appearance in and discredit his entire character identity of being the young and upcoming Omi general/leader, when he's now probably the oldest of the bunch aside from the current boss)

Plus as I already said, and you outright ignored the point that combat in 2 and combat design in general is better in the original. Kiryu's original combat/fighting style is harmed in 2 because its just 6's copy/pasted and improved upon. Several heat moves are still absent, certain Komaki moves are still absent, boss fights and fights in general are complete pushovers in Kiwami 2 compared to 2, which is a pretty damn big deal...

I'm certainly not suggesting people go out of their way to play 2 over Kiwami 2 because most people probably don't want to get a console they might not already own and ultimately having everything on one platform is a huge draw. But having played both games for 100s of hours I will attest that between what's in both games, and what's changed in original and remake that ultimately 2 is the better version in terms of gameplay and story - unless you like flashy HD graphics and less loading. And since the main story is the same in both, aside from a few moments that the remake botches, 2 still edges it out. What would certainly be nice is getting the HD versions of 1 and 2 released on PS4 as well to complement the remasters, but its very obvious that between Kiwami 1 and 6 and now 7 that they view the Kiwami versions as the cannon versions of the games... which is a pity.

thepenguin55 · Feb 15, 2020

PerrierChaud said:
What?

Yes? If you're going to argue that Kiwami/Yakuza 1 is just as wild, with gameplay that's as deep and varied as the rest of the series then I'd really like to hear this argument. lol. Obviously, Kiwami still resembles the rest of series but the gameplay is much more straightforward and the story and side stories don't escalate to levels of insanity that the rest of the games do. Like I said, Kiwami is a solid game but it's obvious that it's the beginning of the series as this series really escalates everything about itself very quickly with Kiwami 2/Yakuza 2. Which is why I say start with Kiwami, then Zero, Kiwami 2 (watch the recaps of Kiwami & Zero if you need them) and then from Y3 onward you play the series in order. I think there's a pretty natural story/gameplay progression and escalation that way.

stn · Feb 15, 2020

If you can play the original 1 and 2, start with those. I appreciated the stories in Zero a lot more because I already knew the two main characters. Otherwise, you can start with Zero.

CannonFodder52 · Feb 15, 2020

Yakuza 0 or Yakuza 1(PS2)

Yakuza 0 is the safe and broad recommendation I give.
Although If you dig classic games, you could try release order, which is Yakuza 1 on PS2 not Kiwami. Kiwami 1 is after Yakuza 0 by release order.

RochHoch · Feb 15, 2020

People are going to say Zero, but the problem is that Zero is so much better than all of the other games that it makes the others seem very lacking in comparison.

I'd just start with Kiwami.

sunkcostfallacy · Feb 15, 2020

Are there certain Yakuza games that do sidequests better than other installments? I jumped in with Zero and adored it. I'm playing Kiwami now, and while I get that the side quests are the highlight in a Yakuza game (I love them!), playing through the whole series is starting to feel like a daunting time investment. For the purpose of saving hundreds of hours, which games in the series have the BEST sidequests, and which games would I be okay largely plowing through the main story if I'm just short on time?

SlickVic · Feb 15, 2020

I started with 0 then played Kiwami (haven't played the rest of the series yet), and personally I really enjoyed that route.

I posted this before, but I remember when I started with 0, my concern was if I started with the 'best of the series' (I know not everyone agrees with that, but it's just something I heard a lot on the forums), that the rest of the series may not be worth playing. But after playing and enjoying 0 I don't really feel that's the case anymore. I think if 0 is the only game of the series you play, then it's a great example of the appeal and charm of the series while telling a complete (and IMO satisfying) story on its own. But at the same time, I feel 0 also does a good job of setting the stage for Kiwami and presumably the rest of the series. Particularly with character development. I don't want to go into spoilers, but to give more of a concrete example, something like the relation between Kiryu (one of the main protagonists) and Nishiki, I feel I preferred seeing how that developed from 0 to Kiwami. Not sure I would have appreciated it the same way if I had started playing the series from Kiwami and went to 0 afterwards.

Moreover, even though there were probably references to the other games in 0 that I probably missed (that long times fan would get), I never felt like the game expected me to know characters/plot points from the other games to enjoy 0's story.

Golden · Feb 15, 2020

Giever said:
You should start with 0 and, if you enjoy it, suffer through Kiwami. A lot of people bounce off the series going from 0 to Kiwami because 0 is basically the peak and Kiwami is a fancied up version of a game from 2005.

Despite that, I doubt many people would even get into the series at all if they were to start with Kiwami, so I still think it's best to go with 0 first, and, hey, if you don't continue through Kiwami, at least you enjoyed one great game. Plus Kiwami and Kiwami 2 have callbacks integrated to 0 that you wouldn't otherwise really get.

EDIT: I feel like I should also note that the moment to moment experience of playing these games is really not much like Shenmue at all.

I enjoyed kiwami!

I think it makes sense too start with kiwami, as the games improve from there on.

JustinH · Feb 15, 2020

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I remember references to 0 in Kiwami... I think. 0 makes the most sense to me as a starting point.

Muskieratboi said:
Just... Pace yourself. Being that most of the main games take place entirely within an almost identical town layout (Kamurocho), it helps you get really familiar with the place, but it can lead to burning out easily for some especially with *Eight mainline games* in the series. Savor the games like a fine Yamazaki Whisky. :)

agreed. I actually burned myself out from playing 0, Kiwami, and then going almost straight into Kiwami 2 (had to wait a month for it to release when I started the series). I played it for maybe an hour, and dropped it because I was going through some sever Yakuza burnout and still haven't gone through it yet.

Someday though...

Clive · Feb 15, 2020

shadowman16 said:
Unless your playing on the PC and you've modded the proper music back in, then its not superior. Certain scenes are butchered in the remake, one character is not so much butchered, but harmed in the remake (Takashima magically aging a good 20-40 years just to shoehorn a celebrity appearance in and discredit his entire character identity of being the young and upcoming Omi general/leader, when he's now probably the oldest of the bunch aside from the current boss)

Plus as I already said, and you outright ignored the point that combat in 2 and combat design in general is better in the original. Kiryu's original combat/fighting style is harmed in 2 because its just 6's copy/pasted and improved upon. Several heat moves are still absent, certain Komaki moves are still absent, boss fights and fights in general are complete pushovers in Kiwami 2 compared to 2, which is a pretty damn big deal...

I'm certainly not suggesting people go out of their way to play 2 over Kiwami 2 because most people probably don't want to get a console they might not already own. But having played both games several times over I will attest that between what's in both games, and what's changed in original and remake that ultimately 2 is the better version in terms of gameplay and story - unless you like flashy HD graphics and less loading. And since the main story is the same in both, aside from a few moments that the remake botches, 2 still edges it out.

I tried to replay Yakuza 2 before Kiwami 2 but I found it incredibly jarring compared to the modern games. The way the it loads for a second and then shifts camera angle when going to a new street, save points and just exploring in general felt a bit like a confusing chore. Maybe if you start with 1 or 2 then you will think it's fine but going from Yakuza 0 to the original 1 and 2 is not something I would recommend doing.

I can't really comment on the combat since I haven't finished Yakuza 2 in 10 years and my planned replay ended early because the game feels awful to play compared to the modern games. Sound like the rest of your complaints are pretty nitpicky and not really noticeable unless you thoroughly research the original.

And who does not like graphics in a drama where you can see facial expressions? Enhances the story significantly compared to the stiff faces in the original. Who doesn't like seamless exploration without load times? You act like those are minor things in a drama where 90% of the gameplay is exploration.

bell wood's jet cola · Feb 15, 2020

I don't see any reason to hold Judgment until the end. I think it's a perfect intro to the series if you haven't tried the others. The stakes are much lower since its a brand new story.

Hogendaz85 · Feb 15, 2020

Start with 0 I played it first last year and loved it now I'm playing 6 and plan on kiwami 2 soon I think they can be enjoyed out of order as what I have played of the series is so engaging in their own right

Hogendaz85 · Feb 15, 2020

Jocchan said:
PSA: Starting with Kiwami is not, and never has been, release order.

Kiwami released after Zero, it features content that is a direct sequel to content from Zero, it builds off the difficulty curve of Zero, and is an inferior "first impression" to the series (but still a great game! And the one whose story is the most important for everything that follows, even if you're not planning to play every single entry).
More than a remake of the first game, it is effectively a ~~DLC~~ sequel to Zero which happens to feature the same story as the first game.

If you want to suggest going in release order, then you should suggest people to start from the first PS2 game, which is obsolete and would turn off almost anyone. So what purpose would that serve, exactly?
One can start from whatever they want, going almighty with "always follow release order" while basing it on such a fallacy will never stop being silly to me.

Excellent advice

rpm · Feb 15, 2020

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.

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.

Deleted member 7462 · Feb 15, 2020

I actually say to start with Kiwami and play up to at least Y6 before playing Y0, having done it myself by starting with Y0 and then going forward chronologically. Kiwami is understandably a big step back from 0 in scope, and I think 0's characterization works better from foreknowledge of how the characters act later in the series.

TheChrisGlass · Feb 15, 2020

Start with 3, then 4, then Kiwami 2 and then Kiwami 1. From there, play half of 0, then finish 5 and 6, and then wrap up 0.

/s

rpm · Feb 15, 2020

OP, everyone in this thread has been lying to you, the proper starting point is Yakuza: Dead Souls

Zips · Feb 15, 2020

Anybody suggesting anything other than starting with 0 is a fool. A damned fool, I tells ya!

I never played a Yakuza game before 0 came out. I fell in love with the franchise right then and there.

I will concede that Kiwami 1 is a bit lacking compared to 0 in some aspects but it's still a hell of a game. Kiwami 2 kind of puts back some of those missing pieces from Kiwami 1. But even then you are not going to be disappointed with how much there is to do in any of these games.

LordBaztion · Feb 15, 2020

Glad zero is coming to Gamepass, I'm going to try it there.

VoltySquirrel · Feb 15, 2020

Jocchan said:
PSA: Starting with Kiwami is not, and never has been, release order.

Kiwami released after Zero, it features content that is a direct sequel to content from Zero, it builds off the difficulty curve of Zero, and is an inferior "first impression" to the series (but still a great game! And the one whose story is the most important for everything that follows, even if you're not planning to play every single entry).
More than a remake of the first game, it is effectively a ~~DLC~~ sequel to Zero which happens to feature the same story as the first game.

If you want to suggest going in release order, then you should suggest people to start from the first PS2 game, which is obsolete and would turn off almost anyone. So what purpose would that serve, exactly?
One can start from whatever they want, going almighty with "always follow release order" while basing it on such a fallacy will never stop being silly to me.

I wasn't going high and mighty? Calm down? I'm not a moron, I know Kiwami came out after Zero. I'm just saying what I chose to do. Calm down.

Diablos · Feb 15, 2020

Yakuza 0. If you only ever play one game in the series, play that. It's literally one of the best video games I've ever played.

I wish they'd release it again using the newer graphics seen in the Dragon Engine.

A couple years ago there seemed to be a lot of strong opinions on if people should start with 0 or Kiwami. I have no idea, after playing both, how anyone could suggest Kiwami first.

Jon God · Feb 15, 2020

0 is the best place to start.

dreamfall · Feb 15, 2020

0 is legit the game of the series, right next to the original release of 2 for me. It's a great starting point and as previously mentioned, flawlessly transitions into Kiwami. Kiwami 2 I love because it utilizes major advancements of the Dragon Engine but it'll feel very different from 0 + Kiwami. 3/4/5 even with the Resolution bump and 60fps are going to feel different when fighting! I think with the newer enhanced titles like Kiwami 2, Yakuza 6 and Judgment, the 30fps lock, the weightier feel and the huge improvements to lightning and reflections give the engine and the franchise a different feel. I think 5 is absolutely the most ambitious and gigantic game of the entire series, take some major time to devote to it and just enjoy the huge scope. I can't wait for 7 to come to the West!

I also think 0 holds a special place for so many of us who love the franchise because it was so nice to see these cities that we traversed so many times in all the neon glitter and the brilliant 80's vibe. You may miss out on that feeling, but if you're starting the series - it's such a fun way to kick it off right. The fighting styles of Majima are so expressive and so phenomenal. He's the best!

AwesomeSauce · Feb 16, 2020

I feel you fellow Shenmue fan. I jumped on the Yakuza train when the original PS2 release came out since i heard similarities to them back then.

I think they are very different games, but i still ended up loving Yakuza 1, and 2. Liked 3, but experienced hard burnout on the series after.

My advice is to play the consensus best ones and see if you dig it. I'm actually going to play through Judgement soon. I feel like I'm over the burnout now 😂

Virtua King · Feb 16, 2020

Definitely start with 0 as it's the best game in the series and is the easiest to get into. After that, go into Kiwami 1 since it's tailored to be played after 0, and also because OG Yakuza 1 sucks. Only play that game if you're curious to see the series' humble beginnings and want to hear everyone speak English.

If you want to play more, I'll say that OG Y2 is better than Y1, but it still feels pretty dated. Kiwami 2 is the superior game, and the content that's missing, as well as the music alterations, aren't a big deal. My only warning is that Kiwami 2 uses the same engine as Y6, and so if you're going in numerical order, it's kind of like an odd duck sitting between Y0-Y5.

Micro · Feb 16, 2020

As most have said, start with Zero. Kiwami is much better when you know the history between all the characters established in Zero.

Going back to the PS2 games mostly sucked. Yakuza 2 is okay, but you spend the original game punching the air while everyone just yells "FUCK YOU I'LL FUCKING KILL YOU KAZUMA!" (dubbed only, added a ton of swearing lol). Kiwami is literally a shot-for-shot remake with bonus content and better gameplay. There are things to be said about the more serious tone of the original (due to the added content in Kiwami) and the updated soundtrack, but Kiwami is certainly the best way to experience the story today- ideally after Zero.

Anyway, enjoy OP. I got into this series a few months ago and I'm halfway through Yakuza 4 now. I thought I'd be burnt out but these games are just so good.

shadowman16 said:
Not starting with Dead Souls means you won't understand references in Kiwami though ;)...

Seriously though, Kiwami really does have references to Dead Souls (and Judge Eyes) and fans really should give it a chance. Real Majima is playable as well which is a treat.

No joke, I started with Dead Souls. Majima's introduction is priceless, but I wouldn't recommend anyone ever start with Dead Souls under any circumstance lol. Especially considering it splits-off after Yakuza 4. I'd take it back if I could.

shadowman16 · Feb 16, 2020

Micro said:
No joke, I started with Dead Souls. Majima's introduction is priceless, but I wouldn't recommend anyone ever start with Dead Souls under any circumstance lol. Especially considering it splits-off after Yakuza 4. I'd take it back if I could.

Yakuza Dead Souls is such a weird and wonderful game. Its objectively bad in many key gameplay areas, and its a cheesy zombie plot but its told in that same way that all other Yakuza games are, so the production values on it are pretty decent, especially some of the cinematics - I agree on Majima's intro, its just such a funny way to introduce him into the game, between his plot and Ryuuji's I could easily replay it over and over, including them was the best possible move. Also, Kiryu refusing to use guns initially cracks me up, its the most Kiryu thing possible!

Micro · Feb 16, 2020

shadowman16 said:
Yakuza Dead Souls is such a weird and wonderful game. Its objectively bad in many key gameplay areas, and its a cheesy zombie plot but its told in that same way that all other Yakuza games are, so the production values on it are pretty decent, especially some of the cinematics - I agree on Majima's intro, its just such a funny way to introduce him into the game, between his plot and Ryuuji's I could easily replay it over and over, including them was the best possible move. Also, Kiryu refusing to use guns initially cracks me up, its the most Kiryu thing possible!

I understood that the main games had all those mini games, and if the story/cutscene quality was that good in a poorly received spinoff then the main series would be absolutely killer. I remember being really excited for Zero to come in the mail while playing through it.

The gunplay barely passes as a shooter and felt SUPER janky at times, but the story, characters, and presentation are on par with the main games so it elevates it quite a bit.

I'm hoping to play the other spin-off games after completing Yakuza 6 in the coming weeks/months, and a Dead Souls replay with the proper context is in order for sure. Shame it's stuck on PS3.

shadowman16 · Feb 16, 2020

Micro said:
I understood that the main games had all those mini games, and if the story/cutscene quality was that good in a poorly received spinoff then the main series would be absolutely killer. I remember being really excited for Zero to come in the mail while playing through it.

The gunplay barely passes as a shooter and felt SUPER janky at times, but the story, characters, and presentation are on par with the main games so it elevates it quite a bit.

I'm hoping to play the other spin-off games after completing Yakuza 6 in the coming weeks/months, and a Dead Souls replay with the proper context is in order for sure. Shame it's stuck on PS3.

It feels like a PS2 era shooter, ignoring all the improvements most decent TPS games like Max Payne brought to the genre. Guess I should be thankful its not a cover shooter I guess! (though them ripping out Binary Domains basic shooting mechanics and putting them in Dead Souls would have been appreciated).
Its the frame rate that also hurts the game (well, that and the camera). A remaster (which almost certainly will never happen) would fix that, I'd buy it... it being stuck on the PS3 with Kenzan and the HD collection is the primary reason I keep the PS3 around (Demon Souls being the other). I do really want to replay it at some point though, mainly for the mini games and completion list - I've gotten so much better at the series since Ishin so I reckon I can 100% it.

The spinoffs are well worth playing. Both samurai games rock, and once you've finished the main series you'll really appreciate Ishin more just for all the call backs in the cast and soundtrack. Kenzan is older but still great fun (its next on my list to replay once I'm done with 7)
The PSP games are sorta the black sheep of the series. They don't really get much representation despite being damn good. They have completely different combat systems to the main series, and in several ways are sorta better, especially for 1 on 1 boss encounters. The second PSP game is one of my most favourite entries in the series, such a shame they never left Japan.

Vex · Feb 16, 2020

Yakuza. Where should i start with these games?

Title says it all. I've always been curious about this game series but never bought a single game. Went to wikipedia and i was completely lost. Main series, spinoffs, rereleases, remakes, etc... The series started on the PS2 but i don't want to go that far behind. Nor PS3. Is it possible to...

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I want to play Yakuza, where should I start and what do I need?

So the more I read about the Yakuza series, the more I think its a game series I'd love. But I have no clue where to start this late into it. Anyone have any suggestions on where I should start? Is there a good entry point for the plot, or do I need to start at the very first game? If the...

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I want to jump into the Yakuza series. What's the right order?

I saw that Yakuza 0 is on PSN for super cheap and wanted to jump in the series. I know almost nothing about the series just that there's like 8 games. A few questions Are they big story games? Should I play in order starting with Yakuza 0? If I'm not big into open world games can I just focus...

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Alright Era, it's finally time to get into the Yakuza series. Where do I start?

Yakuza is a series that I've always wanted to play but very ashamedly so never did because there was always something I prioritized over it. Anyways, this is my situation: - My only console (or at least console that has Yakuza games available) is the PS4 - I already have Kiwami from PS+ but...

www.resetera.com

How should I tackle getting into the Yakuza series?

So, I currently own Kiwami and Zero, and I see Kiwami 2 and 6 on sale at Best Buy and am considering just grabbing them (though less 100% there.) I also apparently have 4 and Dead Souls digitally. So my two questions are where should I start (/which order should I play them in general), and...

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Maybe we should start a "Where do I start thread?" Or maybe..... Hmmmm...

Yakuza Community |OT| Complete Global Saturation

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Son of Sparda said:
There are so many games in the series! Where do I even begin? What's a Kiwami?

There are indeed a large number of entries in the series, but fret not, as the play order is actually very simple. For those that prefer simplicity, just go in this order:

Yakuza 0 > Kiwami 1 > Kiwami 2 > 3 > 4 > 5 > 6.

And for those that prefer a more in-depth explanation as to why this is the order:

First, play Yakuza 0. It's a prequel to the entire series, set in the year 1988, and available for both the PS4 and PC. It's generally agreed upon that, for new fans only just beginning their Yakuza journey, it's best to start with not only a more recent, more accessible title than the original PS2 games, but also the one set chronologically before all other events of the following six games. This title will give you a very well-rounded look at the characters and universe of the Yakuza series, and you need no prior context for anything. Enjoy!

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Eureka!!

You're welcome, OP. ;P

AllMight1 · Feb 16, 2020

Acquiescence said:
Definitely NOT Yakuza 0.

I hate so much everyone telling him to start on Zero.

Then he'll start a thread on Resetera about how he's hella confused about characters doing a 180 degree turn on Kiwami 1.

aisback · Feb 16, 2020

Start with 0.

Think of 0 like a stand alone game and the rest of the series like a spiritual successor.

PerrierChaud · Feb 16, 2020

Clive said:
I tried to replay Yakuza 2 before Kiwami 2 but I found it incredibly jarring compared to the modern games. The way the it loads for a second and then shifts camera angle when going to a new street, save points and just exploring in general felt a bit like a confusing chore. Maybe if you start with 1 or 2 then you will think it's fine but going from Yakuza 0 to the original 1 and 2 is not something I would recommend doing.

I can't really comment on the combat since I haven't finished Yakuza 2 in 10 years and my planned replay ended early because the game feels awful to play compared to the modern games. Sound like the rest of your complaints are pretty nitpicky and not really noticeable unless you thoroughly research the original.

And who does not like graphics in a drama where you can see facial expressions? Enhances the story significantly compared to the stiff faces in the original. Who doesn't like seamless exploration without load times? You act like those are minor things in a drama where 90% of the gameplay is exploration.

Better music and combat is "nitpicking" lmao
What's truly jarring is Kiwami 2 having detailed 3D models while keeping the exact same cutscene staging as Y2 thus resulting in a weird and off-putting direction
Kiwami 2 is the Star Wars Special Edition of Y2 don't @ me

Clive · Feb 16, 2020

PerrierChaud said:
Better music and combat is "nitpicking" lmao
What's truly jarring is Kiwami 2 having detailed 3D models while keeping the exact same cutscene staging as Y2 thus resulting in a weird and off-putting direction
Kiwami 2 is the Star Wars Special Edition of Y2 don't @ me

Who even said that better combat was nitpicking? I said I couldn't comment on it and didn't. Not that the combat even was better in the original from the chapters I replayed recently. Better music is nitpicking in this case. Better character models being a bad thing is downright redacted.

I absolutely detest having discussions with old school fans about remakes because of the nitpicking through nostalgia goggles compared to the bigger picture so I'm going to bow out of continuing this one. Playing Yakuza 1 and 2 on the PS2 is in my opinion pointless in 2020 because you can get the story of them from the better Kiwami remakes.

shadowman16 · Feb 16, 2020

PerrierChaud said:
Better music and combat is "nitpicking" lmao

Tell me about it! Waste of time talking to people like that when one of the main changes, which makes up most of the gameplay is apparently "nitpicking". You know, the core gameplay the series is based around... Its a pretty huge difference that completely changes how many big bosses play (and boy do I love several of the boss fights in 2). And while I like the physics based combat that Kiwami 2 has, on reflection (and briefly replaying parts of 2 last year) I realise I deeply prefer the original combat especially the bit where bosses don't basically die to a single heat move anymore (kinda takes the epicness out of the penultimate boss battle when he goes down quicker than his goons...
I suppose it could be nitpicking me complain about the Tiger Drop being super duper nerfed in Kiwami 2 (and 6), but I'd still contend that's a pretty massive change when that move is a central pillar of the series (that even the devs acknowledged, hence why Judge Eyes return it to its former glory).

As for the music, I do wonder if some people realise just how much of Yakuza 2's soundtrack was outright cut from Kiwami 2. 2 had several battle themes, some playing for distinct side stories or boss encounters and some of these are completely cut and replaced with the normal (boss) fight theme, which sucks :( That said, I can't complain about a couple of boss music changes, as I really do love some of the new themes as well. And again, the swapping of music in certain cutscenes isn't nitpicking when it drastically reduces the tone of said cutscene all so the studio could shill SiM music...

That said, boy I do love nitpicking, so here's an actual good example of just that in an early boss fight (Kiwami 2 on top, 2HD below):

The floor... this is an actual example that doesn't affect the gameplay. But damn do I miss the reflective effect on the PS2 marble floor. Looks so nice, while Kiwami 2's looks pretty... bland? I'm sure such a shiny floor is unrealistic, but I sure know which of the two looks way nicer.

PerrierChaud · Feb 16, 2020

shadowman16 said:
That said, boy I do love nitpicking, so here's an actual good example of just that in an early boss fight (Kiwami 2 on top, 2HD below):

The floor... this is an actual example that doesn't affect the gameplay. But damn do I miss the reflective effect on the PS2 marble floor. Looks so nice, while Kiwami 2's looks pretty... bland? I'm sure such a shiny floor is unrealistic, but I sure know which of the two looks way nicer.

Man almost every part of the presentation looks way better in Y2, from the color palette to that setting—reminds me of Gans' Crying Freeman movie for some reason. That video makes me want to get the HD remaster on PS3 even though I only have extremely basic japanese knowledge.

shadowman16 · Feb 16, 2020

PerrierChaud said:
Man almost every part of the presentation looks way better in Y2, from the color palette to that setting—reminds me of Gans' Crying Freeman movie for some reason. That video makes me want to get the HD remaster on PS3 even though I only have extremely basic japanese knowledge.

The HD collection is well worth the purchase. I have to use a guide for it anyway (those damn side story fail states is something that annoys me in the early games) but with the small tweaks they make to the game over the PS2 version, its easily the best way to play the original version of 2 these days if you can.

Dooble · Feb 16, 2020

Personally I feel like there was no need to do "Kiwami" anyways and just focus on getting western localizations out even faster.

The series regularly remakes itself anyway (play one Yakuza - you played them all to some extent) - I enjoy the original iterations as period piece for 2005 and 2006 in game design for the studio, much like 2016 for Yakuza 6 and 2018 for Judgment.

Jocchan · Feb 16, 2020

VoltySquirrel said:
I wasn't going high and mighty? Calm down? I'm not a moron, I know Kiwami came out after Zero. I'm just saying what I chose to do. Calm down.

Apologies if my post came off too harsh, it wasn't meant to.

You wouldn't believe how many posts I have seen suggesting to play Kiwami first (which I don't consider ideal but is still a solid choice to me, so I wasn't calling you on that), and motivating that argument with "you always follow release order". Which is pretty much going against their own advice.

Anyway, going by your reply, I guess you weren't really claiming that, so I shouldn't have quoted you.

FallenGrace · Feb 16, 2020

Dooble said:
Personally I feel like there was no need to do "Kiwami" anyways and just focus on getting western localizations out even faster.

The series regularly remakes itself anyway (play one Yakuza - you played them all to some extent) - I enjoy the original iterations as period piece for 2005 and 2006 in game design for the studio, much like 2016 for Yakuza 6 and 2018 for Judgment.

You know I'm pretty sure it was done to get new people into the series, at least Kiwami 2 was, I heard the first was being done secretly on the side to zero. And it makes sense as it got me into them, I would have played no further than zero if I didn't have the Kiwami games and then the remaster collection.

If anything their success have fueled faster westernisations and even a dub of Judgement for those who wanted it....

Dooble · Feb 16, 2020

FallenGrace said:
You know I'm pretty sure it was done to get new people into the series, at least Kiwami 2 was, I heard the first was being done secretly on the side to zero. And it makes sense as it got me into them, I would have played no further than zero if I didn't have the Kiwami games and then the remaster collection.

If anything their success have fueled faster westernisations and even a dub of Judgement for those who wanted it....

They already had HD remakes of 1&2 made on PS3. Could of just taken those on put them on PS4.

FallenGrace · Feb 16, 2020

Dooble said:
They already had HD remakes of 1&2 made on PS3. Could of just taken those on put them on PS4.

Which wouldn't have had the same effect. As I stated, they have helped bring Yakuza to a wider audience off the success of Zero.

There was a time I understand that there was a concern that Y5 wouldn't get a release at all then you got Zero, Kiwami, Kiwami 2, Song of Life and Judgement in the space of a couple of years and you don't think that's fast enough? lol.

Dooble · Feb 16, 2020

FallenGrace said:
Which wouldn't have had the same effect. As I stated, they have helped bring Yakuza to a wider audience off the success of Zero.

There was a time I understand that there was a concern that Y5 wouldn't get a release at all then you got Zero, Kiwami, Kiwami 2, Song of Life and Judgement in the space of a couple of years and you don't think that's fast enough? lol.

The Asian region got the games faster than we did. Also perhaps EFIGS translations going back to Zero.

Or even better - put resources to games other than Yakuza at the studio (Monkey Ball).

Swift_Gamer · Feb 16, 2020

This is not star Wars or kingdom hearts, so just play chronologically.

FallenGrace · Feb 16, 2020

Dooble said:
The Asian region got the games faster than we did. Also perhaps EFIGS translations going back to Zero.

Or even better - put resources to games other than Yakuza at the studio (Monkey Ball).

OK.....I see talking about this is a waste of time.

Eppcetera · Feb 16, 2020

Just start with 0. Don't listen to people saying to start with Kiwami, as most of the content added to the remake of the first game changes the game into a sequel to Yakuza 0.

While I think it's problematic that Yakuza 0 is the best game in the series (at least, of those that I've played thus far), which means that the other games will not reach the same heights, I don't that issue is great enough to warrant starting with Kiwami--the later games are still great, if not as good as 0. I can understand the argument for starting with the original PS2 games and playing the series in release order, but that option is so much less convenient that I don't think it's worth it for most people (even for people like me who still own a PS2, it's harder and more expensive to buy Yakuza 1 and 2 than it is to buy the Kiwami remakes).

I want to play the Yakuza series. Where do I start?

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