• The GiftBot 2.0 Launch Giveaway Extravaganza has come to a close with an astounding 8073 games given away to the community by 696 members, a huge success thanks to you! The gifting now continues with more official prizes in the new Gaming Giveaways |OT|. Leftover Steam codes are also being given away to the PC Gaming Era community.

If something sells well, why should I discount it?

catpurrcat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,983
Ok, that's really cool. Gonna be honest, I really don't see why Sony (or EB?) would have discounted it during release week(s), but it's a good thing.
Yeah that was really great of them both. Looking back at my receipt, it was a 10% discount + trade bump up on the old PS4. So like ~$100 bonus. I guess it was slow sales of the Pro at the time? It basically kept me from buying a gaming PC for 2+years lol. (which was my intention that year)

I'll never forget being at the cash register a few years back, and a couple bought a used PS3 + GTAV + some nonense third party controller as a spare. Keep in mind GTAV was already out on PS4/XB1. I asked the supervisor there why someone would pay that much for an old hardware console, do they actually sell well? His response?

"I sell this bundle every single day"

Similarly I mentioned in another thread of a couple of college-aged guys this year buying a USED base model PS4 + used Destiny 2 (keep in mind D2 was going free to play shortly). Actually, they were returning it for the same bundle because the original purchase was defective. The used price versus new was like a $50 difference only. They should have known better, but looking back, I was being way too judgemental, because, there's a big chunk of the population that is extremely price sensitive.
 
OP
OP
Kieli

Kieli

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,250
ah yes a flawless counterargument.

gas companies actually don’t charge enough for gas.
Well, you kinda need gas to get to work or go to the hospital....

If gas companies doubled their prices overnight, most people are going to grumble, but begrudgingly pay it. If you live in a place where there is good transit, then you can fall back to that.

Low key, I want gas companies to keep jacking up prices because that will push peope toward electric and make it more viable. The only thing holding back electric right now is price.
 

Father Kratos

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,183
Hmm, so every non-Nintendo game ever discounted was a bad game. That's why they had to put it on discount.
Btw, I bought botw: explorer's edition from Walmart at $29 last year.
 
OP
OP
Kieli

Kieli

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,250
the hell do gas companies look like? a charity?
?

I mean, gas companies have us by the balls. They can do whatever they want. We are fucked, regardless.

Edit: to add more clarification, suppose all basic food (milk, eggs, potato) magically tripled in price, and everything else increased by 10x, and our salary stayed the same.

We aren't just gonna starve ourselves to death because the deal wasn't good.
 

Josh5890

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,260
If a product is selling well, then generally there is no need to lower your price. You would normally lower the price on a product when
  • You see sales start to dip lower than what is desired.
  • You have a newer product coming out and you need to flush out the old product (moreso if you have a surplus of backstock)
  • Your competitor has a new product that is a direct competition to yours and you wish to stay competitive.
Obviously there are more reasons, but those are the main ones.
 
OP
OP
Kieli

Kieli

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,250
If a product is selling well, then generally there is no need to lower your price. You would normally lower the price on a product when
  • You see sales start to dip lower than what is desired.
  • You have a newer product coming out and you need to flush out the old product (moreso if you have a surplus of backstock)
  • Your competitor has a new product that is a direct competition to yours and you wish to stay competitive.
Obviously there are more reasons, but those are the main ones.
Switch and Switch Lite kinda don't compete with each other the same way PS4 and PS4 Pro don't compete with each other.

I'm not a dad, so I can't comment on what I would do if I saw a Switch bundle with one game vs a PS4 bundle with 3 games. If I were to buy it for my kid, I'd ask them which one they want and get 3 games regardless.

But if my family were struggling for cash, I'd get the PS4 bundle.

^that scenario was brought up by an earlier poster and I found it interesting.
 

Schiaffino

Member
Oct 27, 2017
18
when I buy stuff at full price at release and the company has a sale just a few months after, devaluing their product, I feel taken advantage of.

I prefer Nintendo’s practice because of that. It’s the same with clothes, electronics, everything. I like paying less, but I dislike the practice that makes it feel not worth purchasing something unless it’s on sale
 

jroc74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,103
A sale doesn't have to mean a price cut. Sometime just bundling a game or an eshop gift card is sufficient. Nintendo doesn't exist in a silo, they have competitors. If someone just wants a game console and has no real affinity for any of the platforms, they will look at an ad and see a $200 32GB Switch Lite with no games vs a $200 PS4 Slim 1TB with 3 games. Even if someone preferred the Switch, they might depend on someone else to buy it for them, and that purchaser might do the math and go in the opposite direction. I'm sure many of us have experienced getting the thing we didn't ask for at the holidays just because it was all our parents could afford.
After a robbery, all consoles stolen, that Christmas I got the One S instead of another PS4 because of the deals.

Didn't have the XBO before, a PS4 was stolen.
 

ShadowFox08

Member
Nov 25, 2017
2,122
I've said this many times. While I wish they dropped the price of their 1st party games sooner than later, I really admire Nintendo for not devaluing their games so quickly like the rest of the competition. They're not desperate for sales like Sony, despite Sony selling a ton.

I was a fool to believe in that stupid black Friday Walmart rumor. No way are the switch lite and switch V2 going to be sold at $150 and $200 that soon this year on black Friday.
 

ShadowFox08

Member
Nov 25, 2017
2,122
Every time I see these threads I am confused (less and less each time) that some people put their cheerleading of mega corporations ahead of their own interests.

Congrats on liking Nintendo I guess OP. Hopefully people looking for deals on their products doesn't keep you up too late at night.
I want to pay less for games too like anyone else. I do look for deals online first. But it just feels wrong to me to see quality games that recently came being so heavily discounted by a year's end despite selling so well. I don't like the devaluing at all. Humble bundles and what Sony and Ms does with deep discounts.. Almost disgusts me. Like from a business and creative perspective, so much time and money was out to developing the game, and to devalue a quality $60 game to like half the price by the end of the year is sad.
 

Admiral Woofington

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
10,709
Switch Lite barely came out a month ago. Yet people are wanting BF deals on it? If it sold like crap, sure. But it's not selling like crap.

Same with Nintendo's games. They're evergreen because they don't devalue them AND they're good games.

You know what you're getting your wallet into when you join the Nintendo ecosystem.

Do I want them to discount it? Sure, as a consumer I do.

As a businessman, I want them to sell it for the maximum price that consumers can tolerate.
Do you own Nintendo stock? Then there is no "as a business man" in this sense. We're all part of the business world here, I want discounted games eventually. Nintendo gets away with it because theyve essentially put their foot down and consumers have had to deal with it but there is zero reason you need to argue that you want a product to sell for the maximum cost when you aren't gaining benefits.

Are you glad Apple has a ridiculous premium for their devices they essentially decide on because they can and have a closed market? If someone came to you and said Apple is considering lowering their prices from the get go do you say "no no, they should keep charging the maximum price they can get away with because as a business man I like to see the rich get richer"?
 

Pryme

Member
Aug 23, 2018
2,311
Same with Nintendo's games. They're evergreen because they don't devalue them AND they're good games.
Why should you as a consumer care if their games are ‘evergreen’ unless it’s a game with strong online component?
It’s not just tied to quality, since mediocre fare like 1-2 Switch and MARIO Party still sold for $60.
Plus the re-releases of Wii U games on the switch are still priced at a premium.


As a businessman, I want them to sell it for the maximum price that consumers can tolerate.
Weird thing to say, unless your business is directly with Nintendo.
As a business man, do you also pray fervidly that your local grocery store charges you the maximum prices for fish and milk?
 

MrChillaxx

Member
Jan 13, 2018
81
Still can't help but think this recent narrative (i'd say it started around the DS years?) of Nintendo stuff being SOMEHOW premium is getting absolutely unhealthy for the mental being of some people.

Yeah i get it, you wanna feel special, but it's the same videogames you find on other consoles, you aren't DEVALUING (lol) shit. Literally no one who isn't an investor should not give a damn about keeping the prices high because REASONS.

The saying "some people have more money than sense" is evergreen, but unfortunaly some posters also lament povery while preaching this kind of insanity so yeah... that's just messed up.

I've owned every single big N console since the NES (Zelda was the first game i bought with my own money) and the "Nintendo TAX" is some ridicolous bullshit that is putting me off from buying their next consoles if they keep it up tbh. Why should i pay 60€ for Botw after years when i can buy (insert EVERY SINGLE OTHER AAA game on pc/consoles) for 20ish after a few months?

Again, it's blows my mind how people, CONSUMERS, actually preach for high prices. Insane.
 

John Kowalski

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,209
There are a lot of reasons why it should be cheaper to buy, especially because the system is an entry point for other sources of profit. But Nintendo does keep a lot of prestige by not doing sales, which I think is what they're after. Making a cheaper product that is nonetheless not even cheaper during sales is how they're growing their userbase without letting go of being a company who people accept is not someone you should expect sales from.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,823
A very simplistic view on how original prices are set. Though fair point on dropping a price once it has been set (in particular for a new product).
 

____

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,190
Miami, FL
I agree OP.

I also find the “unless you’re a SHAREHOLDER!!” argument hilarious because people make it seem as though buying shares is an impossible task for the elusive rich and famous.

You quite literally go to a website and click “buy” and boom, you’re a shareholder.

I own shares in Nintendo, Microsoft, TenCent, Take Two, Activision and a few others.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,732
From a business perspective you're right. It's why the PS4 hasn't had major price drops yet like the PS1 and PS2 before it. But as a consumer of course I want to bag myself a good deal.
 

Kolibri

Member
Nov 6, 2017
655
I'm lost. What is this thread supposed to be about?
Yeah am also confused.

So what exactly is the intention of this thread? Do you want to hear arguments about why Nintendo should lower their prices for Black Friday? Or even in general?
Obviously they want to make money, I don't think anyone is surprised by that, but what else is there to be said? They want to sell it at the highest possible price, while consumers want the exact opposite. Open door right?
 

Gnorman

Member
Jan 14, 2018
1,737
What's with this narrative that Nintendo games are some how premium and should never be reduced like lesser games from lesser companies?

I make a point of only renting Nintendo games and I've played some really mediocre shit like Yoshis Crafted World and Mario Party.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,400
It's a weird narrative that Nintendo games are of such a quality, such a premium product that they shouldn't be discounted as that would 'devalue'....something. The game? The brand?

It's nonsense. I bought a switch Lite aware that Nintendo would have higher prices for their games but naively I never expected them to be this expensive. Skyrim is still £50 which is nonsense. Are we saying that Skyrim can't be reduced in price because it would de-value Skyrim on Switch or something? I dunno.

It actively discourages me from buying games on Switch, there are loads I'd like but I can't justify dropping that much cash on, say, Skyrim when it's something I've played numerous times before and can be had for a few quid everywhere else. It pushes me towards the second hand market rather than buying new or via the eshop.
 

Drek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
885
Depends on how many Switches and Switch Lites Nintendo can make versus how many more they can sell with a discount, assuming said discount keeps them profitable.

Here's a bit of a math problem for you:
Lets say Nintendo can make Switch Lites for $150 all in after shipping, retail cut, etc..

They sell them at $200. Tie ratio on a new platform is 2-4 games with an effective average of 3 games.

Games are sold at $60, with a $30 profit margin per title after all costs going to Nintendo.

Total average profit per sale would be $140 ($50 for the device and 3x$30 for the games).

At the above in this hypothetical they'd sell 10M units per year lets say (keep the math easy) so $1.4B in profit generated.


Now consider the hypothetical where Nintendo were to sell the Switch Lite at $250, suppressing sales by 25% and tie ratio by 1.

Suddenly they're making $100 per unit but only $60 on software. Per customer profit is $160, so an increase, but only by $20 (little under 15%) while losing 25% of sales. If the Switch Lite is not production constrained this is a money losing decision.

Now lets try the opposite:
Nintendo sells the Switch Lite for $150, effectively at cost, making no profit on the device.

This drivers sales up 25%. It also drives tie ratio up half a game (so 3.5 per), again hypothetical but picking a balance between people where the $50 reduction on system was the cost difference on buying in and would have a lower tie versus people who were going to spend X and now just buy an extra game. half a game is probably a lower end estimate here when you consider that only the 25% new customers were cost constrained.

So 12.5M units sold, 0 profit from the hardware but 3.5x$30 per on software, so $105 each. Thats about $1.3B. Only $100M off the first pricing structure, but seeding 25% more customers into the market for future software purchases. Of the 25% gained customers (2.5M) if each one buys just 1.3 games on average for the rest of the life of the system they'd make up that $100M.


The notion that products are priced based entirely on what the company can get away with and/or that they're always correct in how they price these things is rather naive. They're in it for profit, sure, but most well ran companies care more about long term profit and sustainability of the business than current year profits.

In Nintendo's case we have a very recent instance with the 3DS where they backtracked on their pricing decision.

This is a pretty common choice for Nintendo really, they're a risk adverse company overall. The way they price software is a great example of this, it isn't conducive to bringing people in who aren't already fans of the IP, and so some of their secondary IPs are profitable but never really grow. One could argue that Fire Emblem found its breakthrough largely thanks to the lower MSRP of 3DS software aligning with some design choices to catch on, as one example.

At the end of the day this is why bundling exists and why Nintendo is likely going to be seling Odyssey and BotW for $40 over Black Friday (Best Buy selling both digitally for that is a pretty massive tell). If you know you have a handful of titles that are so headlining your platform as to be a buy-in difference maker for most people you can use that to seasonally lower the floor for entry. To jump back to the above example, if Odyssey and BotW are together in 50% of all day one Switch purchases (2 of the 3) and at least one is present in 75% you're basically achieving a ~$25 cost reduction for all customers on average by discounting those two games $20 each, and it can be pulled back as soon as the BF window ends.

It has the added benefit of effectively restricting the price break for new entries, as people who are buying say, a Switch Lite, as a second system aren't going to see the same value in a discounted Odyssey/BotW they already own.

Sony has been using their successful first party IPs like this all generation to postpone permanent PS4/PS4 Pro price cuts, using explicit bundles to do so, and in the process really building the visibility of their current gen efforts.

The complaining the OP referred to on here stems from the intend of these kinds of discounts. Most people wanting a Switch Lite BF deal on here are wanting a second system, so a priced break on the two most likely pickups for the system means nothing for them. Meanwhile Nintendo would much, much rather sell that Switch Lite to a new customer as opposed to someone buying a second/third system for portability.

Once you own the platform no one in this industry is trying to sell you a second one. The profit margins versus bill of materials isn't good enough. They'd much rather that discretionary income went to more software.
 

Mokujin

Member
Oct 31, 2017
328
People save money for big sale event days, so the best deals get more of that saved collective cash.

There is also a group of consumers that are on the fence but they will purchase an item if it goes a little cheaper or they get something extra for the same money.

On the Nintendo side they try to make money of every sale but moving more units also means a device in the consumer hands from where they will get a cut on most of the games the consumer gets.

Individual shops have less incentives to discount but moving stock while getting profit is still good and you also get the chance that the consumers that were attracted by the discount will get additional items where the shop margin is healthier.

Just some reasons why it makes sense.
 

Kain

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
2,001
That's such a liberalist thing to say. Deals not only help new customers to jump in the brand but it reinforces brand loyalty for existing customers. Unless you're already blindingly buying everything your favorite company does at whatever price they want. Which seems to be the way for a lot of Nintendo people.
 

Dog of Bork

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,994
Texas
I want to pay less for games too like anyone else. I do look for deals online first. But it just feels wrong to me to see quality games that recently came being so heavily discounted by a year's end despite selling so well. I don't like the devaluing at all. Humble bundles and what Sony and Ms does with deep discounts.. Almost disgusts me. Like from a business and creative perspective, so much time and money was out to developing the game, and to devalue a quality $60 game to like half the price by the end of the year is sad.
This warped mindset is exactly what I'm lamenting.

Games are not devalued. The market for those games at their initial price point is saturated, so they target a larger audience with an appropriate price point for them.

This "disgusting" practice has somehow led to incredible performance for many companies.

As a consumer you should never be sad or... Disgusted... about getting a discount. Discounts are not losing a company money, they are a method for that company to sell to a wider audience who was not interested at the original price, which gets said company more money. If anything, folks with an unhealthy focus on corporate wellbeing should cheer when they see discounts a good bit after release.
 

Chronospherics

Games User Researcher
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,272
Brighton
Usually products are discounted despite already selling well, so as to sustain sales momentum.

Also, when selling hardware, there's an incentive to get it into as many people's hands as possible. Plus there's the software-tie ratio to factor in. Increase the price and you might have the system in the hands of less consumers, and you might find that your software tie ratio is impacted too.

Production costs for your hardware also likely reduce over time, so you can keep similar or better margins while continuously reducing the price of the hardware.
 

Kuraudo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
997
I want to pay less for games too like anyone else. I do look for deals online first. But it just feels wrong to me to see quality games that recently came being so heavily discounted by a year's end despite selling so well. I don't like the devaluing at all. Humble bundles and what Sony and Ms does with deep discounts.. Almost disgusts me. Like from a business and creative perspective, so much time and money was out to developing the game, and to devalue a quality $60 game to like half the price by the end of the year is sad.
If you’re disgusted, or almost disgusted, then you should probably reframe your perspective on your hobby.

From a creative perspective it’s not sad at all. Whether you think what you’re creating is art or just entertainment, you should want it to be experienced by as many people as possible.

From a business perspective, you also want to reach as wide a consumer base as possible. If you’ve completely tapped out the audience willing to pay $60 for the product, then it’s good practice to reach out to the audience willing to pay $30 for it. It’s not devaluing the product, it’s finding additional value by opening up a new revenue source when the first source is depleted.
 

bane833

Member
Nov 3, 2017
3,857
I’m fine with paying a premium price for Nintendo products as long as this guarantees quality and keeps this whole Live Service garbage at bay.
 

TitanicFall

Member
Nov 12, 2017
3,088
I’m fine with paying a premium price for Nintendo products as long as this guarantees quality and keeps this whole Live Service garbage at bay.
It doesn't guarantee anything. There are several mediocre games that Nintendo publishes and produces just like any other manufacturer. Games aside, look at hardware problems like bad dpads on the Pro controller and Joycon drift. Don't put Nintendo on a pedestal.
 

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,608
Because discounting a product on the biggest selling day of the year gets more people into your ecosystem? This is not hard to understand.
If you are releasing a product less than 2 months from the holiday season there is no point in offering a discount because if you are meeting your sales expecations in the first week the people who adopt early aren't going to not buy your product.

Now I wonder if people expect the soon to be released 3950X to get a black Friday deal.
 

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,608
People are waiting for BF deals because maybe they feel the product isn’t worth the price..
Nah. Sometimes people think a product is worth the price but since it came out so close to Black Friday they are hoping they can still get a deal. If it doesn't work out those type of people will quickly pick it up in December or January depending on various factors.
 

Gibordep

Member
Nov 1, 2017
610
Reading this topic I discovered that I am playing inferior games on inferior Systems. As I don't know how is playing on a premium system I still having a lot of fun. The other consoles are the entertainment of the poor.
 

inpHilltr8r

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,313
lol at the inability to put yourself into another persons position

op is not a businessman (probs) but is putting themselves into that position to try and understand their reasoning

this is pretty normal stuff if you're not a sociopath

i highly reccomend it

broadens the mind