-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
If something sells well, why should I discount it?
- Thread starter Kieli
- Start date
It's no worse than the 'Is it worth $60?' threads. Let OP cook.
Nintendo though, is a niche sub-market (even if that sub-market may occasionally be a very large slice of the overall pie).
Microsoft and Sony are trying to eat each other's lunch. They're in direct competition while Nintendo is almost swimming in it's own pool.
I hate to use car analogies since I consider them lazy but in this case, it seems kind of like complaining that Porsche doesn't have as many sales as your local Ford or Honda dealerships.
Just to say, Porsche DOES have sales frequently. There is a 20% off sale right now at the Porsche Houston dealer:
I struggled to decide which 'exotic' brand to use in the example. Use whichever fits the point which I think is obvious. Ferrari, Lambo, Tesla, etc.
All of those have frequent sales. It's not a very good analogy.
Bugatti?
E - it's not a great analogy. most car analogies can be picked apart too easily thats why I usually avoid them.
No, I think it's pretty mysterious. Waking up one day and, apropos of nothing, deciding you're going to tell everyone people that, actually, Nintendo wants you to pay as much as they can realistically charge you for their product, is a weird thing that people do on forums from time to time, and somehow they all gravitate towards the same "businesses exist to make money" line.
The exact same argument can be made in reverse: just because you think they need to, it doesn't mean they actually need to; which is kind of the OP's point.
I don't know, this whole discussion seems like a pointless waste of time, but what else is new. Yes, Nintendo are a business. Yes, it's stupid to discount a product that's selling like hotcakes. No, Nintendo doesn't need anyone defending their honor. Frankly it seems like people care far too much about the commercial / economics side of videogames on Era, especially proportionate to the actual economics knowledge most people have. Everyone is a goddamn armchair analyst.
Sorry, but I really don't think it is, on a forum where folks will regularly defend anti-consumer choices like Sony's (and with the Elite 2, Microsofts) decision not to have removable batteries in their controllers (less options are better because I hate thinking and doing stuff). And that's not to derail with a tangent, people defend all sorts of choices made by companies they prefer. And in some cases there are valid (or at least logical) points.
Nintendo doesn't put stuff on sale as much because their strategy is different than the other two. And they've been around about five times longer combined so, why change what works.
OP
OP
I dunno if it's fair to characterize my posts as hostile. I'm willing to change my mind and people have already brought up good points.
E.g. you can buy used games, so a discount on a console can bring you into the software (even though it doesn't benefit Nintendo)
E.g. licensing, software, ancillary subs (Nintendo/PSN Online, Xbox live) make more money than console hardware
Business want to make more money
Consumers want to spend less money
A never ending battle between two sides in an all out international conflict.
Consumers want to spend less money
A never ending battle between two sides in an all out international conflict.
None of Nintendo's off Zelda/Mario IP sell all that amazing. They just keep the price up artificially to make you think they do. Lol
OP must feel especially smart having come to this profound realization that nobody in the world has ever figured out and now must share with all.
Pokemon, Animal Crossing, Smash, Splatoon don't sell amazing, wuh?
"Artificial Hype"
This is some tinfoil hat shit.
OP
OP
Not every piece of conversation needs to be new or innovative. It's why we both study what's been discovered in the past, but also research that which we don't know.
Sometimes, less than full price is better than absolutely no money at all.
You're either in a position where a product has come to market and underperforms because no one can see the value in it, so you discount to get something instead of nothing (I think this occurred with Battlefield V last year).
OR
You reach saturation with the people who do see the value in it and you start to lower the price (even if only temporarily) to bring in people on the fence.
The Switch Lite IS Nintendo's value proposition for the Switch the way I see it -- it DOES represent the cost cut (but it also comes with feature cuts, like dockability), it just inadvertently also bolsters specific parts of its appeal, like it is an enhanced portable experience thanks to its lighter weight and sturdier construction, so folks who have experienced the Switch already and maybe have decided they value the portable functionality way more find it appealing but maybe not for another $200, hence the ask for a temporary price drop so they can buy in.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I've had a Switch since launch. I PREFER playing docked at home on my big TV, but I end up actually playing in portable far more because I am able to play quite a bit during downtime at work. That's completely a subjective perspective, but it has led to me wanting a Lite just for work and on the go play but I don't want to sell my dockable Switch beacause I absolutely prefer to play docked when I can. I'd love to get a Lite on sale for $150 or so, but it's not urgent... and I kind of hope Nintendo updates their account policy to grant at least two systems FULL DRM rights for digital games by the time I get one -- no online checks on at least two systems would be absolutely perfect. I'm all-digital but I can't connect my Switch to internet at work, so getting the Lite specifically for that would be a bit of a waste actually, and I need my DRM rights to remain full on the home Switch because when I don't take it to work, my partner does play it at home quite a lot.
You're either in a position where a product has come to market and underperforms because no one can see the value in it, so you discount to get something instead of nothing (I think this occurred with Battlefield V last year).
OR
You reach saturation with the people who do see the value in it and you start to lower the price (even if only temporarily) to bring in people on the fence.
The Switch Lite IS Nintendo's value proposition for the Switch the way I see it -- it DOES represent the cost cut (but it also comes with feature cuts, like dockability), it just inadvertently also bolsters specific parts of its appeal, like it is an enhanced portable experience thanks to its lighter weight and sturdier construction, so folks who have experienced the Switch already and maybe have decided they value the portable functionality way more find it appealing but maybe not for another $200, hence the ask for a temporary price drop so they can buy in.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I've had a Switch since launch. I PREFER playing docked at home on my big TV, but I end up actually playing in portable far more because I am able to play quite a bit during downtime at work. That's completely a subjective perspective, but it has led to me wanting a Lite just for work and on the go play but I don't want to sell my dockable Switch beacause I absolutely prefer to play docked when I can. I'd love to get a Lite on sale for $150 or so, but it's not urgent... and I kind of hope Nintendo updates their account policy to grant at least two systems FULL DRM rights for digital games by the time I get one -- no online checks on at least two systems would be absolutely perfect. I'm all-digital but I can't connect my Switch to internet at work, so getting the Lite specifically for that would be a bit of a waste actually, and I need my DRM rights to remain full on the home Switch because when I don't take it to work, my partner does play it at home quite a lot.
Last edited:
Splatoon will get 10 million soon, AC will easily cross 10 million, Smash is at 15 and Pokemon might get 20 million.
OP
OP
How many titles cross 5 million, let alone 10/20 million. Not very many. Not even from the biggest publishers like Capcom.
If enough people think the Switch Lite (insert any console you want here) is not worth its current price, then the price will come down. Look at the PS Classic. It was a crap product and was discounted to $20. People still weren't biting at that price.
Every game manufacturer and studio discounts their games.
Nintendo is operating on pure greed. The Disney of gaming.
Nintendo is operating on pure greed. The Disney of gaming.
Why do people who clearly have no knowledge of sales ever try to put in their 2 cents like they have an idea of sales?
They all operate on pure greed. Are you serious? Nobody is cutting prices just to be a nice friendly business, it's a calculated move to increase their profits - or in your language, to be as greedy as possible.
Wii U was crap, didnt sell well and the price never really went down.
Between Steam sales and GamePass, the very notion of ever paying $60 for one title is absurd to me. Nintendo can take their evergreen titles and stick 'em where the sun don't shine. I'll keep my PC and Xbox One. I don't need to play games on the crapper that badly.
OP
OP
And yet we have this thread....
PS4 has been selling like hotcakes since it launched...I'm sure Sony didn't mind doing BF deals, OP.
OP
OP
I'm not questioning doing BF sales at all. I'm talking more about the timing of the BF sales. Year 1? Eeeeeh. Year 2? Go for it.
Obviously Switch isn't in its year 1, but the Switch Lite is. But previously, someone said that PS4 Slim and PS4 Pro were discounted in the same year they released. That's news to me (truly didn't know that), and I find it cool.
As an investor in Nintendo, I think the way they manage their properties and software is smart for the most part.
As a consumer, it isn't perfect, but I've found it actually makes me smarter with my purchases so that I don't randomly impulse buy games that I may not ever even get to, like in Humble Bundle or during Steam Sales. I think a lot of publishers have trained consumers in a pavlovian manner to wait for the inevitable price drop a few months after launch and it has caused some software to underperform at times. This is especially the case with games that don't launch in ideal states, just wait for a price drop and future patches before diving in.
As a consumer, it isn't perfect, but I've found it actually makes me smarter with my purchases so that I don't randomly impulse buy games that I may not ever even get to, like in Humble Bundle or during Steam Sales. I think a lot of publishers have trained consumers in a pavlovian manner to wait for the inevitable price drop a few months after launch and it has caused some software to underperform at times. This is especially the case with games that don't launch in ideal states, just wait for a price drop and future patches before diving in.
Since they aren't a charity, they don't need your ax, so to speak.
People can ask for companies to sell shit at whatever price they want. The companies won't get their feelings hurt if they can't accommodate some people because, as you say, they are not your friend.
OP
OP
Agree with you 100%. It's why I chose the word "tolerate" very deliberately in the OP. It's inherently fuzzy. What I can tolerate in terms of cost to purchase is very different than someone else. I'm the type of consumer that doesn't mind paying $500-600 bucks for a console because I want the best components.
That's very different than the type of consumer who is waiting for a BF to nab a console.
Okay, but your OP is also explicitly trying to call out people who don't tolerate the price offered.
I wanted to try the Switch and the Fire Emblem game. Had a look - Nintendo had an offer where you got a 50 quid coupon for their store - basically a 50 quid discount if you want to look at it like that. So Fire Emblem cost me 10 quid. Then because I have over 1000 hours in Civ 6 on PC I really wanted to see what it played like on the Switch. Again - they had a sale of like 25% off or so?? I forget exactly, and I bought that. That is all the games I have for my Switch. Which is fine as I knew Nintendo don't drop prices of their big games. If they did I would dabble a bit more on Switch but BOTW is still full price when I peruse the shelves at my local game shop. Even the second-hand ones are only 5 quid less. So in principle, you are right - if people buy shit at full price then no need to drop the price. Simple. If they did, however, I would be tempted to try out some of them on occasion. I knew that going in though so not salty they don't. Get that paper Nintendo.
A sale doesn't have to mean a price cut. Sometime just bundling a game or an eshop gift card is sufficient. Nintendo doesn't exist in a silo, they have competitors. If someone just wants a game console and has no real affinity for any of the platforms, they will look at an ad and see a $200 32GB Switch Lite with no games vs a $200 PS4 Slim 1TB with 3 games. Even if someone preferred the Switch, they might depend on someone else to buy it for them, and that purchaser might do the math and go in the opposite direction. I'm sure many of us have experienced getting the thing we didn't ask for at the holidays just because it was all our parents could afford.
OP
OP
True, but I mean in the sense that if you can't tolerate a price, you either need to wait (more than 1 month for a coveted/well-performing product) or you simply don't buy it.
The 1 month is arbitrary, but I feel like it's a short enough time within the overall lifespan of a console that if you were the sort of "deals-seeking" consumer, you would have cultivated more patience than this. This might be controversial, but it's like having your cake and eating it too.
Edit: This is going to be a bad analogy. Feel free to rip on me.
But it's like lining up for Popeye's Chicken Sandwiches day 1 of re-launch and then either (1) complaining about the line or (2) getting angry that they're sold out. Let's be real, what are you (not you specifically, I mean in general) expecting?
If that's the case the why do consoles continue to sell each month without price drops? New games are released, people may not be able to afford it one month, their maybbe a holiday (Birthday, Christmas, etc...), or many number of other reasons why someone may not buy a console one month and buy it the next without a price drop.
Fairly certain the intent of posts like that are to state that they probably won't be buying it due to the lack of any deals.
I mean, this is it.
Not sure what else you really need to discuss.
We're consumers, not a businessmen, and even businessmen are consumers, unless they actually work for the company, and even then, they get employee discounts on products. Would you tell that employee to not use their employee discount because they already know how good the product is, and pay full price for the game or system?
It's not about whether or not it's worth it, it's about whether or not you can get a deal on it. Part of the thrill sometimes as a consumer is knowing you got a deal, not just that you were able to maximize the amount you spent for a nice quality product. While that may work for certain things, it doesn't mean it should apply to all things, and every time.
Also, the market isn't just set by the publishers and developers, but when we're talking retail, they set the prices, and they can honestly care less most of the time whether or not it's about maximizing the dollar to quality of the product, but dollar to quantity of the product. When they put systems on sale, and sometimes it's at a loss, they do that for a reason. They're not profiting on the system, as the profit margin on gaming consoles are garbage, but the profit margin on accessories, games, and everything else that is a peripheral to the system is where they make their money. Businesses know if they cut the price down on the console, they would be losing money, but they also know that's exactly what the consumer wants, and as such, they meet those demands in hopes of making profit off the other items that sell at a higher margin.
This is such a weird thread.
There is absolutely nothing Nintendo does that Sony or xbox don't, yet they drop prices on their consoles and games, as well as 3rd parties.
There is absolutely nothing Nintendo does that Sony or xbox don't, yet they drop prices on their consoles and games, as well as 3rd parties.
OP
OP
Sorry, I'm having a hard time parsing the second sentence. Do you mean that Nintendo also drops prices like Sony/Xbox?
No I mean Sony / MS drop prices as well as 3rd parties, whilst offering the same if not more than Nintendo.
I don't understand people who defend faceless corporations like this. They really, really don't care about you despite what the PR tells you.
OP
OP
I think we're saying the same thing. Corporations are nobodies' friend. There's no reason to support/defend a company unless you get paid by them to do so (for the record, I do not get paid by Nintendo).
That being said, I'm a filthy hypocrite because FromSoftware and Supergiant Games has my full, blind support on whatever game they make.
I mean I don't really care what Nintendo wants to do. I do what I want to do, and tolerate what I want to tolerate when it comes to corporations.
It's all a matter of what people will tolerate.
We tolerate Walmart not hiring any fucking cashiers and forcing us to stand in lines so that they can save money on payroll despite making billionsl because they sell us cheap shit.
We tolerate Blizzard being shills for oppressive governments because we want to play Overwatch 2.
We tolerate Nintendo making us pay 60 dollars for a port of a 7 year old game like Donkey Kong because we want to play Donkey Kong on our Switch....
It might not be something we want to admit, but there it is.
Nintendo does the things it does because we let them haha.
It's all a matter of what people will tolerate.
We tolerate Walmart not hiring any fucking cashiers and forcing us to stand in lines so that they can save money on payroll despite making billionsl because they sell us cheap shit.
We tolerate Blizzard being shills for oppressive governments because we want to play Overwatch 2.
We tolerate Nintendo making us pay 60 dollars for a port of a 7 year old game like Donkey Kong because we want to play Donkey Kong on our Switch....
It might not be something we want to admit, but there it is.
Nintendo does the things it does because we let them haha.
Honestly, I wasn't even thinking about any of those when I was thinking of Nintendo IP that stay full price, but aren't exactly world beaters.
This board is obsessed with hype and who should have it. Nintendo is actively making an economic decision to keep their IP associated value high for all titles regardless of their sales by maintaining original MSRPs for their titles.
That decision is specifically made to make you think of greater value with relation to Nintendo titles. It is specifically why they also don't just farm out their IP to everyone to make games.
But I mean, maybe I'm just a Nintendo hater and not mostly saying Nintendo keeps their prices high to make you think highly of them even though we all know Metroid, Star Fox, Kirby, Yoshi, Toad, Peach, Paper Mario, and ever more have never been evergreen titles.
Precisely.
Cord cutting cable tv wasn't necessarily because cable was bad, but there's like a dozen better entertainment alternatives (YT, gaming, twitch, etc) that all use the TV.
My circle of friends won't even come near a Switch because of the software pricing. They all have the money, but for 2 free hours a day, they're going to pick up the cheaper PS4 every time. Load up on 5-10 games under $30 on black friday-Xmas annually, rinse and repeat.
One guy bought a Switch at launch and has all of 3 games.
Pokemon is literally the higest grossing media franchise of all rime.
Smash Ultimate is the best selling fighting of all time.
That term really doesn't mean much when those games are selling as well as they are.
Nintendo games have extremely long shelf lives because of the high quality of their games. Many people buy Nintendo systems just for the first party. Why would they slash the price when they're selling as well as they are? They have zero incentive to do so.
You can easily see this with Mario Kart Wii. It's still somehow fucking selling and making them profit 11 years after release.
Nintendo has evergreen titles and non evergreen titles. That's not being contested. Just the first titles you listed are absolutely evergreen and the sales numbers/NPD/Media Create prove that.