If you are the type of person who tells others not to improve themselves, stay out of their business and get your own life.

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,337
https://www.vox.com/2019/4/17/18411768/kim-kardashian-lawyer-studying-california-bar-criminal-justice-reform-elle-woods-legally-blonde

Still, Kardashian is making a choice to put in the work to become a better advocate, and she is being criticized for it. In a post on Instagram this week, Kardashian said, “One person actually said I should ‘stay in my lane.”
Last year I registered with the California State Bar to study law. For the next 4 years, a minimum of 18 hours a week is required, I will take written and multiple choice tests monthly. As my first year is almost coming to an end I am preparing for the baby bar, a mini version of the bar, which is required when studying law this way. I’ve seen some comments from people who are saying it’s my privilege or my money that got me here, but that’s not the case. One person actually said I should “stay in my lane.”
Now in both cases this is the exception and not the norm but it is ridiculous how certain people act. If you don't have anything positive to say, you most likely shouldn't be saying it. You definitely shouldn't be saying it to a stranger unless they directly harmed you physically or financially.


Is there anyway to mitigate this toxic behavior on a macro level?
 

Yaboosh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,119
Internet discourse is simply overwhelmingly negative.

Imagine discussions that happen on this forum every day happening in real life. It just wouldn't happen. People are far more mean online in simple discussions.
 

Menelaus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,682
It's not a reach to understand why the reception of Kim entering law in a state where attendance of law school is not required to take the bar exam is being ridiculed.

If she's doing it for the right reasons, good for her. The problem is every single thing she's done for the last decade has been to enrich herself and build her empire.

Acting as if a public celebrity who exists to be seen deserves extra reservation of judgement on one thing and not another is a bit strange.
 
Oct 28, 2017
528
I’m as anti-Kardashian as they come but what she’s doing is great.

These are just people holding onto previous biases.
 
Oct 27, 2017
721
If she has the privilege and resources to be able to execute this successfully, good for her. People don't like the Kardashians in general so their reaction to almost everything they do is negative.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,985
Nottingham, UK
If you don't have anything positive to say, you most likely shouldn't be saying it.
that's a nice platitude, but sometimes you have to be honest with people even if it's negativity
Internet discourse is simply overwhelmingly negative.

Imagine discussions that happen on this forum every day happening in real life. It just wouldn't happen. People are far more mean online in simple discussions.
Mean yes, also honest (or at least hidden behind less layers faux pleasantries)
 

Baconmonk

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
4,418
You won't mitigate this behavior entirely. I've had this sentiment passed on to me about my own self improvement and I'm not remotely famous or wealthy.

Just seems like a solid case of "fuck the haters".
 

Shiny Pokemon Hunter

Alt-account
Banned
Mar 5, 2019
212
People can be so ridiculously petty and nasty out jealousy, envy, ugh fuck em.

Being rich doesn't mean being happy with who you are. Self improvement is a good thing.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,337
It's not a reach to understand why the reception of Kim entering law in a state where attendance of law school is not required to take the bar exam is being ridiculed.

If she's doing it for the right reasons, good for her. The problem is every single thing she's done for the last decade has been to enrich herself and build her empire.

Acting as if a public celebrity who exists to be seen deserves extra reservation of judgement on one thing and not another is a bit strange.
It is a reach because passing the bar exam isn't a cakewalk, you still have to prove yourself every few years you are a lawyer. How she trains herself legally doesn't matter.


It's poor form that you are totally ignoring the author also being subjected to this annoying pettiness and that this behavior isn't uncommon in any workplace. Do you actually talk to your family about work? If you do I bet one of them complained about someone trying to put them in their place while attempting to get a promotion or change departments.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,337
My bad, I have no problem with platitudes really. I was a bit "well actually" without having actually read your sentence fully so yeah my apologies
Thank you for understanding. I was a prickly because I was putting effort in crafting nuance into my post. We both generally agree that people should spend some time building themselves up instead of tearing down others.
 

mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,277
Sometimes people like to bask in and spread their sense that things/themselves won't improve, and this is just not a good place to stay in for too long. Not in terms of venting after a hard day, but actively holding themselves or others back. I think this is more of an internet thing than irl though.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,985
Nottingham, UK
Thank you for understanding. I was a prickly because I was putting effort in crafting nuance into my post. We both generally agree that people should spend some time building themselves up instead of tearing down others.
Yeah crab mentality is a crappy thing, especially amplified through social media

I do get riled up by untapped optimism however, that shit can get delusional sometines
 
Oct 26, 2017
14,920
Weird to use Kim and that article to push this (very valid) message from the OP title. There should be room for Kim (and her family) to use their position and wealth to learn, better themselves and hopefully contribute to society in meaningful ways but it's important to recognize that they are granted a privilege that many do not have. I'd wager that there are many people that are at least as competent as Kim but would never be granted the opportunities she has been given in her life. I hope that she is successful in her endeavors and can do good in the future but it's understandable why people are skeptic given all the nonsense that has come from this family.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,337
Sometimes people like to bask in and spread their sense that things/themselves won't improve, and this is just not a good place to stay in for too long. Not in terms of venting after a hard day, but actively holding themselves or others back. I think this is more of an internet thing than irl though.
It is definitely not an internet thing. A lot of conservative politics in many countries including America is all about putting people in their place and telling them you aren't worthy of higher aspirations.

Luckily for both ladies their exposure to this pervasive problem was a lot more limited according to their accounts.
 

Deception

Member
Nov 15, 2017
6,011
Weird to use Kim and that article to push this (very valid) message from the OP title. There should be room for Kim (and her family) to use their position and wealth to learn, better themselves and hopefully contribute to society in meaningful ways but it's important to recognize that they are granted a privilege that many do not have. I'd wager that there are many people that are at least as competent as Kim but would never be granted the opportunities she has been given in her life. I hope that she is successful in her endeavors and can do good in the future but it's understandable why people are skeptic given all the nonsense that has come from this family.
I understand what you are saying and I agree since Kim is at the extreme end of privilege, but with that being said, this can apply to any person who may access to certain resources that others do not. I'm sure I have been granted certain opportunities that others have not but does that mean that I should be content with where I am currently and not strive for improvement? Obviously not and I think that what the OP is trying to get at and I agree.

For example, I had people resent me during my time in uni because they felt that they could have gone to college and got a degree if they had the same resources that I did (not realizing that I took on enormous debt and was working constantly to support my studies), some even going as far as to actively put me down and tell me that pursuing a degree was a waste of time and I would never find a job. Plenty of people will come at you with their perceived notion of how much you should succeed based on their own failures/short-comings not realizing the amount of work it takes to get to that point. Those type of people are the same type bringing down Kim and honestly, they can kick rocks.
 
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Oct 26, 2017
14,920
I understand what you are saying and I agree since Kim is at the extreme end of privilege, but with that being said, this can apply to any person who may access to certain resources that others do not. I'm sure I have been granted certain opportunities that others have not but does that mean that I should be content with where I am currently and not strive for improvement? Obviously not and I think that what the OP is trying to get at and I agree.
Oh I definitely agree with OP's statement, I just don't think that this is the field this battle should be fought on. There's plenty of reason to be critical and suspicious of Kim and the rest of the Kardashians, it muddies the waters.
 

LiK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,462
People like to shit on people to make themselves feel better cuz they’re so miserable. I ignore those people. Keep them out of your life IRL and on social media. Not worth the aggravation.
 

GeminiX7

Member
Feb 6, 2019
494
Weird to use Kim and that article to push this (very valid) message from the OP title. There should be room for Kim (and her family) to use their position and wealth to learn, better themselves and hopefully contribute to society in meaningful ways but it's important to recognize that they are granted a privilege that many do not have. I'd wager that there are many people that are at least as competent as Kim but would never be granted the opportunities she has been given in her life. I hope that she is successful in her endeavors and can do good in the future but it's understandable why people are skeptic given all the nonsense that has come from this family.
Hit the nail on the head for me.
 

GeminiX7

Member
Feb 6, 2019
494
I understand what you are saying and I agree since Kim is at the extreme end of privilege, but with that being said, this can apply to any person who may access to certain resources that others do not. I'm sure I have been granted certain opportunities that others have not but does that mean that I should be content with where I am currently and not strive for improvement? Obviously not and I think that what the OP is trying to get at and I agree.

For example, I had people resent me during my time in uni because they felt that they could have gone to college and got a degree if they had the same resources that I did (not realizing that I took on enormous debt and was working constantly to support my studies), some even going as far as to actively put me down and tell me that pursuing a degree was a waste of time and I would never find a job. Plenty of people will come at you with their perceived notion of how much you should succeed based on their own failures/short-comings not realizing the amount of work it takes to get to that point. Those type of people are the same type bringing down Kim and honestly, they can kick rocks.
100% agree with your overall point, but the Kardashians are kind of a bad example, as they haven't just wielded their privilege like a cudgel to make a name for themselves, but have pretty much banked on the idea that it is JUST that privilege that is driving them. When a large part of your claim to fame and (more) fortune is showing the world how out of touch you are with the rest of working society and that your life is almost entirely extravagant leisure and opportunities poured in your lap with the only hardships largely being contrived and over-dramatized in public for the sake of entertainment, you are rightly going to get some side eye when you use that same privilege for a goal that is at best a good venture for self improvement and finding a new career and at worst the new promotion for another nonsense spectacle.

This isn't so much "crabs in a barrel" as it is "person who's made a career as a reality show star not being taken seriously".
 

Deception

Member
Nov 15, 2017
6,011
Oh I definitely agree with OP's statement, I just don't think that this is the field this battle should be fought on. There's plenty of reason to be critical and suspicious of Kim and the rest of the Kardashians, it muddies the waters.
100% agree with your overall point, but the Kardashians are kind of a bad example, as they haven't just wielded their privilege like a cudgel to make a name for themselves, but have pretty much banked on the idea that it is JUST that privilege that is driving them. When a large part of your claim to fame and (more) fortune is showing the world how out of touch you are with the rest of working society and that your life is almost entirely extravagant leisure and opportunities poured in your lap with the only hardships largely being contrived and over-dramatized in public for the sake of entertainment, you are rightly going to get some side eye when you use that same privilege for a goal that is at best a good venture for self improvement and finding a new career and at worst the new promotion for another nonsense spectacle.

This isn't so much "crabs in a barrel" as it is "person who's made a career as a reality show star not being taken seriously".
Seems we all agree and while I will also agree it is valid to be skeptical of Kim's intentions, if her intentions are pure and coming from a good place then good for her and I wish her the best of luck. If you read her full post it seems that they are yet people will continue to tell her to "stay in lane" by virtue of her fame.
 

LakeEarth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,861
Ontario
There are two types of people. Those who build, and those who tear down. The latter are the types that will never be remembered.
 

GeminiX7

Member
Feb 6, 2019
494
Seems we all agree and while I will also agree it is valid to be skeptical of Kim's intentions, if her intentions are pure and coming from a good place then good for her and I wish her the best of luck. If you read her full post it seems that they are yet people will continue to tell her to "stay in lane" by virtue of her fame.
Thats fair enough. Were she just about anyone else, even another wealthy person or celebrity, I'd give her the benefit of doubt, but I can definitely understand the skepticism. That said, if she passes the bar, and serves the public is some capacity, I would be more than happy to take my skepticism back and congratulate her.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,817
I don't think Kim needs people defending her from the equivalent of a gnat. People act terrible online because it isn't real life. Turns out you can just ignore it all.
 

Bob Beat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,151
This is an interesting approach. Some of us are pessimistic. There aren't a lot of parallels to normal people. I see the Kardashians market a lot of things, including Pepsi to a line of police in an ad. I see Kim directly interact with Trump, whom I consider a bad actor on justice reform.

So I do find myself incredulous that she wants to be a lawyer. Without going to law school. She could learn a law and still not understand it. And maybe I don't fully know what her future is but I know a few things. One is to not hire a lawyer who hasn't been to law school. Sure, there could be one who's amazing but I'm not going to risk it.

Again, there's no parallels between normal people and being doubted and what's going on with Kim. That's why the writer decided to focus on drawing a parallel between Kim and a fictitious movie.

This is article seems closer to not wanting any criticism by making bad equivalences.
 

Fuhgeddit

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,096
People like to shit on people to make themselves feel better cuz they’re so miserable. I ignore those people. Keep them out of your life IRL and on social media. Not worth the aggravation.
Basically this. I was insulted so much when I left for a new company and I'm just so happy that's over.
 
OP
OP
mutantmagnet

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,337
100% agree with your overall point, but the Kardashians are kind of a bad example, as they haven't just wielded their privilege like a cudgel to make a name for themselves, but have pretty much banked on the idea that it is JUST that privilege that is driving them. When a large part of your claim to fame and (more) fortune is showing the world how out of touch you are with the rest of working society and that your life is almost entirely extravagant leisure and opportunities poured in your lap with the only hardships largely being contrived and over-dramatized in public for the sake of entertainment, you are rightly going to get some side eye when you use that same privilege for a goal that is at best a good venture for self improvement and finding a new career and at worst the new promotion for another nonsense spectacle.

This isn't so much "crabs in a barrel" as it is "person who's made a career as a reality show star not being taken seriously".
Kim rose to fame off of a sex tape. Considering the huge stigma women have to deal concerning sex in general, her ability to rise off of that takes gumption.

There are two types of people. Those who build, and those who tear down. The latter are the types that will never be remembered.
Trump will be remembered :p


Again, there's no parallels between normal people and being doubted and what's going on with Kim. That's why the writer decided to focus on drawing a parallel between Kim and a fictitious movie.
And the author's own life experiences which I quoted.
 

GeminiX7

Member
Feb 6, 2019
494
Kim rose to fame off of a sex tape. Considering the huge stigma women have to deal concerning sex in general, her ability to rise off of that takes gumption.
Eh, that's what got her initially in the spotlight, but it's her family's wealth that prompted and maintained a reality show that kept her family in the spotlight. And I would say that the method of her "rise" is more detrimental to dealing with the stigma in the future rather than her "rising above " it. She got recognition for having a sex tape being released and used it to... show how pampered and leisurely her life is while having business and entertainment opportunities brought to her and her family members on the kind of whim and frequency that is usually reserved for sitcom characters(which is a staple of reality shows that always makes my eyes roll hard enough to scrape my retina).

Like I said, in most cases, if you told me "Woman who became infamous for having a sex tape revealed goes into law", it would be seen as a positive regardless of how much money her family makes or anything else. But when that same person is pretty much known for having a show where every few episodes they decide to become "fashion designers" or "event planners" or nutritionists and in general treat careers like costumes to try on and pretend to do for a few hours/episodes in between jet-setting or having inane, scripted arguments, I can see why people at the least give her a bit of side-eye. She shouldn't be shit on or anything, I don't think it's that serious, but I 100% understand the skepticism.

EDIT: I have not seen the extent of the negative comments. I get people being skeptical but I in no way agree with any sort of outright harassment.