Insider: "Xbox Anaconda aims to be the clearly better performing device" compared to PS5

Papacheeks · Apr 19, 2019

DOT_mjo said:
I think it's a foregone conclusion that Xbox will be the more powerful console this generation.

I think the better question is will that yield better results for Xbox in territories they are not popular in. And with Sony's hiatus on E3 actually pay off if they are ramping up first party for launch so as to not have another 2013 launch with very little first party.

I feel that If Sony and MS have their first party out in the wild it will be a more clearer picture of the landscape and see if the more powerful system trumps Sony's First party branding.

Kage Maru · Apr 19, 2019

Thatguy said:
X was a year later than Pro and $100 more. If Nextbox is a year later than PS5 and $100 more then sure it will definitely be noticeably more powerful. If it's day and date with PS5 I don't think they can do it. Sony engineers ran laps around Xbox engineers last gen.

Size comparison:

Xbox power supply had an external brick too. PS4 was internal. But that's not all. Sony beat them on price by $100, and not all that was Kinect. PS4 had a little better RAM, but a little worse CPU and GPU.

So yes theres history of Xbox launching with better CPU/GPU. But last time it was very little and since most used PS4 as lead platform, sometimes PS4 performance was better anyways. But technically Xbox One had the tag "most powerful console" from day 1, going strictly by CPU/GPU numbers. Thats a better comparison than the X since it was release aligned. I think next gen Xbox will probably beat PS in some areas. The 'most powerful' angle got some traction, at least mid gen when people were looking for an upgrade. But I doubt it will be as substantial as the X advantage over Pro if the date and price are close.

As others have pointed out, the GPU was better in the PS4 but there's more to it than that. MS has a tendency to over compensate from past flaws. This can be seen in every generation so far: the OG Xbox was short on bandwidth, so we saw the eDRAM on the 360 providing a large amount of relative bandwidth. The 360 had heating and reliability issues, and that's what lead to the XBO having a massive heat sink and large body to allow for plenty of airflow. Next we saw the XBO being underpowered compared to the PS4, so we got the 1X.

The size of the XBO had nothing to do with engineering skill and everything to do with not having another RROD situation.

bombshell · Apr 19, 2019

cooldawn said:
So Microsoft will be more powerful...based on what?

What other spec CPU can they use to trump PlayStation 5?
What other spec GPU can they use to trump PlayStation 5?
What bespoke SSD will they have to trump PlayStation 5?

I ask all these question because one would think Sony is using the latest technology...so where can Microsoft go to be 'clearly better performing'? Some CPU/GPU/SSD that's unknown right now?

Secret sauce? Something Sony will also have.

I think they'll be about even.

Easy if the two products are not same price.

SuperBoss · Apr 19, 2019

The counter marketing has begun lol

Bruceleeroy · Apr 19, 2019

InfiniDragon said:
Uh...yes? The company that's survived two generations with lower powered hardware simply due to the strength of their franchises and first party games??

Based on that, the person you quoted argued their software is the best of the three going by first party output, and I personally agree.

On topic, I fully believe MS is going to do all they can to have the strongest box this time around as it bit them badly back when Xbone launched. They don't want a repeat of base Xbone vs. base PS4, $599 USD memes be damned.

Nintendo hasn't been at the forefront of software since the SNES imo. Each system has had 2 or 3 games that are the best of the best but they don't have enough sustained hits for me to be anything more than a second tier system.

Panzer Dragoon · Apr 19, 2019

Sub Boss said:
PS4 is better in every way except for CPU (and the difference is not much)

The XBox One base also features a dictated sound chip that doesn't hit the CPU.

Bruceleeroy · Apr 19, 2019

VinFTW said:
did you read the post I replied to? Whats YOUR point?

Sorry Vin I'm on mobile I didn't see the chain of conversation. Please disregard!

HighResTomato · Apr 19, 2019

Diablos said:
Games worth buying it for.

Showing that they can actually do something worthwhile with those studios they're gobbling up.

All we can do is wait and see, I believe if MS leaves those acquired studios be and so their thing they will produce quality content.

Truant · Apr 19, 2019

Good. This is the type of competition I care about. Let both sides sweat.

Braag · Apr 19, 2019

I have a feeling these next gen consoles are going to be expensive.

EightBitNate · Apr 19, 2019

Braag said:
I have a feeling these next gen consoles are going to be expensive.

A penny over $500 is DOA imo. Even Anaconda is going to be unappealing if it's $550 or more.

Kage Maru · Apr 19, 2019

Rumpestump said:
No I choose to argue your comment about why ONLY Xbox was mentioned when speaking of abandoning for PC and multi plats and how YOU did not understand why that was.

Problem is the context surrounding my comment was about console gamers. Why is this so hard to understand? It makes no sense to bring up PC when we're talking about the Xbox being marketed for console gamers. You ignored the entire context and point of my comment. The PC is meaningless for a console gamer that wants to play COD, Cyberpunk, Fortnite, etc. I'm not the one misunderstanding here.

Deleted member 22750 · Apr 19, 2019

man I hope the weaker xbox isn't going to hold the entire generation back

Rikimaru · Apr 19, 2019

Panzer Dragoon said:
The XBox One base also features a dictated sound chip that doesn't hit the CPU.

PS4 has hw audio processing block too.

jroc74 · Apr 19, 2019

Luckydog said:
I love the false narrative that MS has never "won" a generation. Where were people during the wii/360/ps3 era. That somehow people do t remember Wii's collecting dust later in the gen. Or that somehow Sony was a winner because it managed to barely catch up 8/9 years into the gen. The 360 was the de facto machine for the vast majority of people. Games were demo'd on it, journalists did most of their gaming on it, it set the trend for network and online services, the list goes on. Even with RROD people kept buying it because they loved it and no amount of games nearly a decade later cancels that out. Sony did an amazing job with PS4 being focused this gen and they are the de facto machine for games but let's not pretend this was always the case for every gen.

...but the 360 factually didn't win last gen...

The Wii did and the PS3 eventually outsold the 360. You even state this..

What they did was lose momentum. While the PS3 gained massive momentum.

And that was a carry over effect into this gen and this entire generation.

Sony did it off the back of core exclusives and offering services. MS upped their services but still are iffy on exclusives.

Do ppl ever wonder why the XBO started out selling fine then started to lose more ground to the PS4? The launch debacle isn't the only reason for that.

Rikimaru · Apr 19, 2019

PS3 sold better than 360 every year :D US centric forums ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deleted member 30005 · Apr 19, 2019

sam777 said:
I trust Klobrille though

Klobrille's contribution isn't so bold. He is affirming what everyone already knows, that Microsoft is "aiming" to have the most powerful system. Plus he's not framing his information as though it arrived after Mark Cerny's short Wired interview this week.

Ainsley Bowden by contrast is live Tweeting from cloud-cuckoo-land, by stating authoritatively, post Wired interview, that "multiple insiders have now confirmed ... Xbox Anaconda will be more advanced". And instead of calling him out, many people would sooner invent scenarios in which Microsoft could have obtained advanced, final and certain knowledge of Sony's own plans.

Aswitch · Apr 19, 2019

I believe it. I think Xbox can't really afford to be as (significantly) weaker than the PS5 next Gen. I think they're pulling all of the stops to ensure that as what was shown last E3 with the studio pickups. Any brownie points they can earn against the PS5 next gen will only help them.

Kaji AF16 · Apr 19, 2019

Power is not a decisive variable on my purchase decisions, but I do believe they are going to have the strongest local processing hardware. They somewhat promised to regain the power crown as a part of the Xbox ethos. What Sony has leaked about PS5 is not impossible to surpass for a company with the financial muscle of Microsoft.

InfiniDragon · Apr 19, 2019

Bruceleeroy said:
Nintendo hasn't been at the forefront of software since the SNES imo. Each system has had 2 or 3 games that are the best of the best but they don't have enough sustained hits for me to be anything more than a second tier system.

That's cool if they don't do it for you, but they do for a lot of folks, that's why they can go their own way and still do well because people will absolutely buy their games. If Sony or MS tried the same thing to have a less graphically advanced machine and sell on the strength of their franchises they'd be hosed.

Hell, that's kinda what early Xbone was, a weaker machine (obviously not to the level of a Switch mind you) that MS believed they could still make it on brand strength. We know how that worked out for them, haha.

Weltall Zero · Apr 19, 2019

I don't understand the obsession for developing the most powerful console. Time and again it has been proven to be a non-dominant strategy.

chrisPjelly · Apr 19, 2019

While I'm not that interest in the power wars anymore, it's always good to see competition in this industry. Sony and Microsoft are going to push each other into having pretty damn powerful consoles. Hopefully the late additions won't lead to BS like the RROD.

Bruceleeroy · Apr 19, 2019

InfiniDragon said:
That's cool if they don't do it for you, but they do for a lot of folks, that's why they can go their own way and still do well because people will absolutely buy their games. If Sony or MS tried the same thing to have a less graphically advanced machine and sell on the strength of their franchises they'd be hosed.

Hell, that's kinda what early Xbone was, a weaker machine (obviously not to the level of a Switch mind you) that MS believed they could still make it on brand strength. We know how that worked out for them, haha.

Yeah definitely true.

Deleted member 50658 · Apr 19, 2019

Kage Maru said:
Problem is the context surrounding my comment was about console gamers. Why is this so hard to understand? It makes no sense to bring up PC when we're talking about the Xbox being marketed for console gamers. You ignored the entire context and point of my comment. The PC is meaningless for a console gamer that wants to play COD, Cyberpunk, Fortnite, etc. I'm not the one misunderstanding here.

Because YOU said you think it is a tired message and YOU did not understand why XBox was singled out speaking of abandoning it for PC. Like is is it really so hard to understand that if you just consider yourself a gamer (notice that I did not put a consoles or PC before the word since those are the ones making the comments you don't understand not "console" gamers) that already owns or are thinking of perhaps switching or including PC from consoles Xbox literally gives zero incentive to why not and also picking up another or more console besides that PC instead if you got the means for it since they give you more content.

YOU did not understand why and I simply tried to answered that question.

The Xbox is literally the only platform (probably the first?) that will now start a new generation of consoles without exclusives tied to it and with PC having the most and tons that never release on Xbox does that make it easier for you to understand why some have no incentive to buy one if PC gaming is anywhere on their radar.

Pasha · Apr 19, 2019

Thatguy said:
X was a year later than Pro and $100 more. If Nextbox is a year later than PS5 and $100 more then sure it will definitely be noticeably more powerful. If it's day and date with PS5 I don't think they can do it. Sony engineers ran laps around Xbox engineers last gen.

Size comparison:

Xbox power supply had an external brick too. PS4 was internal. But that's not all. Sony beat them on price by $100, and not all that was Kinect. PS4 had a little better RAM, but a little worse CPU and GPU.

So yes theres history of Xbox launching with better CPU/GPU. But last time it was very little and since most used PS4 as lead platform, sometimes PS4 performance was better anyways. But technically Xbox One had the tag "most powerful console" from day 1, going strictly by CPU/GPU numbers. Thats a better comparison than the X since it was release aligned. I think next gen Xbox will probably beat PS in some areas. The 'most powerful' angle got some traction, at least mid gen when people were looking for an upgrade. But I doubt it will be as substantial as the X advantage over Pro if the date and price are close.

OK couple of things, the Original Xbox One did not have a better GPU/CPU, the CPU was pretty much the same although with slightly higher clock, while the GPU was worse.

The other thing is that I'm just confused as to why some people talk about the one year difference as though it matters somehow. Both PS4 Pro and Xbox One X have GPUs that are made on the same 16nm silicone process, and use the same architecture from AMD. There was really nothing stopping Sony from releasing the PS4 Pro with the same spec CPU/GPU combo as the one in the XBX. It's really weird seeing people talk about a year difference as though technology just magically gets better with time.

Redfox088 · Apr 19, 2019

If both home consoles are atleast as efficient as cerny claims and use the low load times approach I see this as more of an issue for Stadia then to one another.

flyingman · Apr 19, 2019

Redfox088 said:
If both home consoles are atleast as efficient as cerny claims and use the low load times approach I see this as more of an issue for Stadia then to one another.

Stadia has more issue about Google convincing people to port their highly customized , years of experience onWindows games to port Linux.

I have very big doubts unless they found a solution to this. Microsoft cloud is easy by using just xbone and probably next console weak version for streaming.
PS has consoles

no way even google convince every developer or even big ones to make linux ports. No FIFA = you already lost in europe(for stadia)

funky · Apr 19, 2019

I am very curious how the low power and premium xbox's will co exist

The X and the base XB1 coexist but the base console is barely hanging onto this generation recently.

If Lockheart is 4tb as is rumored but targets 1080p only and the Premium Sku is basically a XB1X style keap over that and is in the 12-15tflop range and both have the exact same CPU I guess it could work out ok? Slightly different ram cofigs on both too I would guess.

tapedeck · Apr 19, 2019

HellofaMouse said:
people who want cutting edge gaming + people who arent interested in pcs.

i bet thats a small ass venn diagram

Well I'm certainly in that category so that's one.

Kage Maru · Apr 19, 2019

Rumpestump said:
Because YOU said you think it is a tired message and YOU did not understand why XBox was singled out speaking of abandoning it for PC. Like is is it really so hard to understand that if you just consider yourself a gamer (notice that I did not put a consoles or PC before the word since those are the ones making the comments you don't understand not "console" gamers) that already owns or are thinking of perhaps switching or including PC from consoles Xbox literally gives zero incentive to why not and also picking up another or more console besides that PC instead if you got the means for it since they give you more content.

YOU did not understand why and I simply tried to answered that question.

The Xbox is literally the only platform (probably the first?) that will now start a new generation of consoles without exclusives tied to it and with PC having the most and tons that never release on Xbox does that make it easier for you to understand why some have no incentive to buy one if PC gaming is anywhere on their radar.

So what you're saying is you want to ignore context just to downplay the relevancy of the system. It's not like I only focused on console gamers to knock PC gamers, I'm a PC gamer. It just makes most sense to point to console gamers when someone says they don't understand who the Xbox is supposed to be for. So your comments still don't make sense in context to what I was saying.

Edit: btw I understand why a PC gamer wouldn't be interested in a Xbox. MS already has them in their ecosystem, so the work there is already done. That still has nothing to do with my original point though.

Drek · Apr 19, 2019

Pasha said:
OK couple of things, the Original Xbox One did not have a better GPU/CPU, the CPU was pretty much the same although with slightly higher clock, while the GPU was worse.

The other thing is that I'm just confused as to why some people talk about the one year difference as though it matters somehow. Both PS4 Pro and Xbox One X have GPUs that are made on the same 16nm silicone process, and use the same architecture from AMD. There was really nothing stopping Sony from releasing the PS4 Pro with the same spec CPU/GPU combo as the one in the XBX. It's really weird seeing people talk about a year difference as though technology just magically gets better with time.

Process yield rates get better, that directly controls price for mainstream products. Failure rates on production is paired with R&D for the primary drivers in the cost to produce processors if I recall correctly.

Then you also simply have a refinement in technology. 16nm dies today fit a lot more transistors than hundreds of nm dies years ago. There is a constant creep forward.

So waiting an extra year is a pretty meaningful gain in terms of what a fixed product can put in the box.

I doubt we'll see a major horsepower to dollar disparity between the two like we did this past generation. Both are focused on gaming as the primary device function, both are working with AMD. If MS wants to bookend Sony with a high and low end or match the PS5 with their base and offer a premium out of the gate I don't see it being that big of a deal in the end as without having the high end priced out of market viability it isn't going to be a game changer in terms of performance. Even if they did it would still be constrained by a need for third parties to service the lower powered consoles, both Sony's and their own.

At least on the retail GPU front AMD's best value propositions fall firmly in the mid-market range as well, so lobbing out a $600+ system to service high end is likely going to see less power per dollar given AMD's own track record.

This could be a valid play by MS in a few scenarios. If 8K was really going to take off and their top tier would be the only true 8K capable system for example, but that seems unlikely on both fronts. If there was some kind of home "hub" element where the top end would be able to connect to low cost child devices for in-home multi-room streaming using Azure/XCloud but with the home unit as kind of a local relay point to allow low latency gameplay on multiple sets at once as another, though that would be a pretty complex feature to both design and market.

Unless MS is planning to write off a huge subsidy for customers (very unlikely) the only thing I'm really wondering about here is if their base model will be at parity with the PS5 or come in below as a low cost option. If the later that'll be bad for everyone as games will be built around a weaker baseline.

Also I suspect that Sony's "SSD" solution is some kind of NVMe front end cache system that results in superior load buffering. I'd be shocked if they really think throwing a 1TB SSD in these systems that can't be replaced or expanded is going to go over well with consumers.

Curufinwe · Apr 19, 2019

Thatguy said:
Xbox power supply had an external brick too. PS4 was internal. But that's not all. Sony beat them on price by $100, and not all that was Kinect. PS4 had a little better RAM, but a little worse CPU and GPU.

So yes theres history of Xbox launching with better CPU/GPU. But last time it was very little and since most used PS4 as lead platform, sometimes PS4 performance was better anyways. But technically Xbox One had the tag "most powerful console" from day 1, going strictly by CPU/GPU numbers. Thats a better comparison than the X since it was release aligned.

You've got your facts hopelessly wrong.

PS4 was 1.8 TF, Xbone was 1.3.

ImaginaShawn · Apr 19, 2019

tapedeck said:
Well I'm certainly in that category so that's one.

Add me to that.

Deleted member 50658 · Apr 19, 2019

Kage Maru said:
So what you're saying is you want to ignore context just to downplay the relevancy of the system. It's not like I only focused on console gamers to knock PC gamers, I'm a PC gamer. It just makes most sense to point to console gamers when someone says they don't understand who the Xbox is supposed to be for. So your comments still don't make sense in context to what I was saying.

"There are countless games that releases on both console and PC but only with the Xbox does the console become irrelevant for some reason."

Those were your words. See the for some reason part? That to me was you questioning how that was and an answer I tried to provide.

You think "console gamers" are the ones saying the Xbox is irrelevant? "Console gamers" that say that they see no reason in buying the next Xbox. Do you think they speak for everyone or simply themselves and from their perspective?

Menx64 · Apr 19, 2019

Wouldnot be better if both consoles are closer in specs? I mean for gamers.

riotous · Apr 19, 2019

Menx64 said:
Wouldnot be better if both consoles are closer in specs? I mean for gamers.

For sure as long as both are pushing the envelope and priced well.

Kage Maru · Apr 19, 2019

Rumpestump said:
"There are countless games that releases on both console and PC but only with the Xbox does the console become irrelevant for some reason."

Those were your words. See the for some reason part? That to me was you questioning how that was and an answer I tried to provide.

You think "console gamers" are the ones saying the Xbox is irrelevant? "Console gamers" that say that they see no reason in buying the next Xbox. Do you think they speak for everyone or simply themselves and from their perspective?

That part was more rhetorical and not a genuine question on my part. I know why some people like to talk about Xbox games landing on the PC as if it's a negative. It's narrow-minded and ignorant.

ShapeDePapa · Apr 19, 2019

EightBitNate said:
A penny over $500 is DOA imo. Even Anaconda is going to be unappealing if it's $550 or more.

Maybe they'll finally have a subsidised console too have a more appealing option?

Jroc · Apr 19, 2019

I wouldn't use the PS4 vs Xbox One as proof of Sony's engineering superiority. The Xbox One was initially designed to be a cable box that would run 24/7 and never get loud. That combined with RROD PTSD is the reason why the thing was so massive compared to the PS4. As for the power gap, Mattrick-era Microsoft thought they had things in the bag so they opted to maximize the profit margins on each console. Sony was selling the PS4 at a slight loss whereas Microsoft was initially getting something like $30 from every XB1 sale. Kinect 2.0 also ate up a chunk of the engineering budget.

Thatguy · Apr 19, 2019

Curufinwe said:
You've got your facts hopelessly wrong.

PS4 was 1.8 TF, Xbone was 1.3.

I used Wikipedia...I have failed

CasualsareFilth · Apr 19, 2019

Well it might be more powerful but 'the clearly better performing device'? That's another story.

Hucast · Apr 19, 2019

CasualsareFilth said:
Well it might be more powerful but 'the clearly better performing device'? That's another story.

I've read this a couple of times. What does this actually mean?

Shpeshal Nick · Apr 19, 2019

Would you look at that.

Seems power matters again lol.

CasualsareFilth · Apr 19, 2019

Hucast said:
I've read this a couple of times. What does this actually mean?

Well clearly better suggests a lot more powerful, but from what I've been reading Sony's specs are already very impressive, so how great is this next Xbox supposed to be, and what it's gonna cost?

SPDIF · Apr 19, 2019

Nitro said:
Klobrille's contribution isn't so bold. He is affirming what everyone already knows, that Microsoft is "aiming" to have the most powerful system. Plus he's not framing his information as though it arrived after Mark Cerny's short Wired interview this week.

Ainsley Bowden by contrast is live Tweeting from cloud-cuckoo-land, by stating authoritatively, post Wired interview, that "multiple insiders have now confirmed ... Xbox Anaconda will be more advanced". And instead of calling him out, many people would sooner invent scenarios in which Microsoft could have obtained advanced, final and certain knowledge of Sony's own plans.

Well if it changes anything for you we also have hmqgg, who is an insider verified by ZhugeEX, corroborating Klobrille's claims.

hmqgg said:
Anaconda, the flagship in the market, titled "Best Performance".

Detective said:
Best performance as more powerful or * Balanced*

hmqgg said:
More powerful.

I'm surprised his posts aren't in the OP considering they appear within a couple of pages of Klobrille's.

Rosol · Apr 19, 2019

All we know is MS clearly wants us to go tell our friends 'MS's new console will be better than PS5'

DukeBlueBall · Apr 19, 2019

SPDIF said:
Well if it changes anything for you we also have hmqgg, who is an insider verified by ZhugeEX, corroborating Klobrille's claims.

I'm surprised his posts aren't in the OP considering they appear within a couple of pages of Klobrille's.

This is way way less reliable than the Durango / Orbis posts that had Durango being much better than the PS4 with 2GB ram and no HDD.
Also less reliable than Sweetvar, and one insider who said MS went batshit insane with specs.

SPDIF · Apr 19, 2019

DukeBlueBall said:
This is way way less reliable than the Durango / Orbis posts that had Durango being much better than the PS4 with 2GB ram and no HDD.
Also less reliable than Sweetvar, and one insider who said MS went batshit insane with specs.

Why?

Rosol · Apr 19, 2019

Menx64 said:
Wouldnot be better if both consoles are closer in specs? I mean for gamers.

It would be, but Lockheart is a huge downside for most of us and will anchor next gen to lower spec.

Iwao · Apr 19, 2019

Seganomics said:
The difference between base and high end on Xbox next gen isnt going to be the same difference at all.

Anaconda is surely going to have.a GPU of around 14TF.

Correct me if this is wrong, but isn't the Lockhart rumoured to have 4TF as the lower end model?

Insider: "Xbox Anaconda aims to be the clearly better performing device" compared to PS5

Do you think xbox will be stronger?

Yes, definitely stronger.

No, PS5 will be stronger.

Not sure honestly.

Don't care I'm a PC gamer.

I play switch only lol. Switch port pls

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