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Do you think xbox will be stronger?

  • Yes, definitely stronger.

    Votes: 1,525 37.7%
  • No, PS5 will be stronger.

    Votes: 341 8.4%
  • Not sure honestly.

    Votes: 1,424 35.2%
  • Don't care I'm a PC gamer.

    Votes: 462 11.4%
  • I play switch only lol. Switch port pls

    Votes: 294 7.3%

  • Total voters
    4,046
Status
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JimmyJacking

Member
Oct 28, 2017
414
Love all these "brand power" posts. It's like some of you were born when the PS4 released and don't remember last gen, where the consoles were basically neck and neck. Sony didn't double up on Microsoft at the beginning of this gen because of fucking brand power...lol.

It's also hilariously obtuse to use the X to prove that power doesn't matter. The thing didn't even release until the dust had already settled and people were firmly entrenched into their chosen ecosystem. If the X had been the lauch console you can bet your ass things would have been extremely different.

Anyway, believe what you will, but mulitplats sell consoles every bit as much as exclusives, or more, and having better versions of those will give either company a huge leg up.

I will admit, I haven't read the whole thread front to back, but yeah, there is some insane historical revisionism going on in this thread.

And then get posts like this
Nobody will jump ship abandoning their library..... With backwards compatible the huge majority of Ps4 owners will just upgrade. The US will be neck and neck, but rest of the world will continue Sony dominance. However Microsoft comes in a very healthy and ambitious position through their Windows and XCloud integration focusing in MAU.

As like if no-one left behind their 360 collection or traded it in when they moved to the PS platform.

Edit:

That said, I do agree with going into next next gen, this factor is a lot more important this time round

Time and time again, Era conveniently forgets this or are too caught up with the brand religion they follow to perceive the reality of the video game industry.

This generation changed everything for everyone. Forever.

Network Services dwarfed the revenue income of hardware and peripherals combined last fiscal year and are on a huge rise. Game libraries have become a far more deciding factor on where the masses will go compared to the "most powerful console in the world" marketing tactic.
 
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Arkeband

Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,663
I own a PC and Sony has generally all of the exclusives worth caring about, so if the Xbox 2 or whatever ekes out a few more FPS, who cares, IMO.
 

Arkeband

Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,663

What do you mean "what"? If I want to play God of War, Bloodborne, or virtually any other generation-defining game, I can't get that on xbox, and for any multi-platform game, I have a PC. So the only real selling point for an Anaconda is if I want MS exclusives or want slightly better performance for multiplats than a console I likely won't be buying multiplats on anyway.

The point is, MS's first party catalogue is weak and a powerhouse system will not magically solve that.
 

X-Peaceman-X

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
303
Well that is cool and all.... but that hasn't happened in their worst generation to date. Why was the X so premium priced if they wanted to 'beat down the competition'? Why wasn't it prices like the Pro? Why is the Xbox One All Digital priced so high? If they didn't burn money to beat down the competition this gen they sure as hell aint going to do it In the next.
I'm not so sure about them being willing to "burn money" in an effort to out price Sony but in your examples it wouldn't make much sense to eat cost on those consoles. They clearly know they aren't going to make up a tens of millions console deficit. One X and now One S digital are a marketing strategy and a show of faith that they are all in on being the place where gamers have choice to play however they want.
 

OldDirtyGamer

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,474
I'm not sure what console I'm going to get next gen . Ill probably stick with one .
I think they will both be plenty powerful .

If xbox is surprisingly more powerful that would be a thing to push my decision .
 

X-Peaceman-X

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
303
AMD would literally have to break confidentiality, if they were to sign a contract with Microsoft saying that they will promise to build something superior to what is in Sony's contract.

How do you figure they price out the BOM for Microsoft? How do they inform but not inform Microsoft if Sony alters their specs?

This line of thinking is madness. They can't just wink wink and accidentally build them specs based off of what Sony is getting.
I mean them saying basically here's a blank check we want the best you can provide period in 2020 seems totally plausible. It doesnt at all mean they have to target Sony or say they want better than a competitor.
 

bsigg

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,556
The point is, MS's first party catalogue is weak and a powerhouse system will not magically solve that.

Something that alleviates that is Game Pass. At launch, you'll have access to every MS first party game that is launching on the Scarlett consoles AND all the BC titles from the Xbox One, 360 and OG, for $10. No need to spend another $200-300 in new games at launch.

As new games come, you can know with confidence you'll have access to everything the revamped Xbox Game Studios is putting out plus whatever 3rd party titles MS gets into the service.
 

headspawn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,608
I mean them saying basically here's a blank check we want the best you can provide period in 2020 seems totally plausible. It doesnt at all mean they have to target Sony or say they want better than a competitor.

Maybe AMD will take that blank check and spend it on Nvidia hardware and we can get something crazy nextgen. :p
 

Mr. Genuine

Member
Mar 23, 2018
1,617
I have a simple, open question:

Has the power difference between the current iterations of Playstation and Xbox ever been significant enough for it to be noteworthy? Sure, you might see a game here or there that people would claim "This couldn't be done on the competition..." (MGS4 with the Blu-Ray, for example), and I'll admit sometimes the occasional third party title (Bayonetta on PS3) can be significantly worse performing than on the other console, but on the whole it sure seems like, from the PS2/OG Xbox generation to the PS4/XB1 generation, both consoles have been more or less the same machine with different branding, and you could more or less play the same exact damn games on one as you could the other.

The point I'm trying to make here is that this talk about power seems like nothing more than empty posturing and rhetoric that never substantiates into anything meaningful in the finished product.

If you want MS exclusives, you go Xbox. If you want Sony exclusives, you go Playstation.

Because they are always the same machine with a different brand.
 

Bradbatross

Member
Mar 17, 2018
14,215
What do you mean "what"? If I want to play God of War, Bloodborne, or virtually any other generation-defining game, I can't get that on xbox, and for any multi-platform game, I have a PC. So the only real selling point for an Anaconda is if I want MS exclusives or want slightly better performance for multiplats than a console I likely won't be buying multiplats on anyway.

The point is, MS's first party catalogue is weak and a powerhouse system will not magically solve that.
Sure, but investing in their first party studios like they've been doing will lol.
 

Miscend

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
265
And the Xbox One X was powerful than the PS4 Pro...
Yeah but that (Xbone X) came out nearly a year later.

If Anaconda and PS5 come out in the same year. The only way Anaconda could be more powerful is if Microsoft are willing to be significantly more expensive at retail.

And to be fair we don't even know the full PS5 specs. I don't think anything is set in stone yet. Sony could always jack up the specs in response to developer feedback. They did that when they doubled RAM in previous generations.
 

OldDirtyGamer

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,474
Something that alleviates that is Game Pass. At launch, you'll have access to every MS first party game that is launching on the Scarlett consoles AND all the BC titles from the Xbox One, 360 and OG, for $10. No need to spend another $200-300 in new games at launch.

As new games come, you can know with confidence you'll have access to everything the revamped Xbox Game Studios is putting out plus whatever 3rd party titles MS gets into the service.

GamePass is wonderful. That's definitely a thing that pushes me to the next Xbox.
 

OldDirtyGamer

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,474
Yeah but that (Xbone X) came out nearly a year later.

If Anaconda and PS5 come out in the same year. The only way Anaconda could be more powerful is if Microsoft are willing to be significantly more expensive at retail.

And to be fair we don't even know the full PS5 specs. I don't think anything is set in stone yet. Sony could always jack up the specs in response to developer feedback. They did that when they doubled RAM in previous generations.
Or they could eat the cost and match Ps5 price, or even cut under. Thats what i think MS needs to do, considering how badly they got beat by Sony this gen.
 

Dark_EMT

Banned
Apr 19, 2018
571
I think that they will be about the same or the PS5 be a little bit more powerful. Unless you can put out great games to take advantage of that hardware and good price, you only have bragging rights.
 

Miscend

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
265
Wasn't that Microsoft who did that from the request of the Gears devs, not Sony?

I wonder if for either platform Microsoft or Sony will resort to eating some of the cost per console early on in the generation.
Microsoft did that with the 360. Its was originally going to have 256MB but the devkits had 512MB in them. Devkits usually have way more RAM than the consumer systems for debug code. So Epic asked Microsoft to match the RAM in the devkits.

As for PS4, Sony confirmed that the original plan was for 4GB of RAM.
https://www.justpushstart.com/2013/09/ps4-originally-4gb-ram/
 

JimmyJacking

Member
Oct 28, 2017
414
Has the power difference between the current iterations of Playstation and Xbox ever been significant enough for it to be noteworthy? ~snip~

Sure, if you don't think the 100pg threads on "GrassGate" wasn't significant in mindshare at the beginning of the gen.

The constant DF videos showcasing the power differences.

Or Sony themselves via god know how many focus groups thinking it was that insignificant that it plastered "most powerful console" on its branding for the 4 and the Pro.
 

tutomos

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,612
If Conda is more expensive than the PS5, you guys can never ever use the war chest argument again.
 

JustinH

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,398

Miscend

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
265
Or they could eat the cost and match Ps5 price, or even cut under. Thats what i think MS needs to do, considering how badly they got beat by Sony this gen.
I don't think they'd be willing to take any more major losses with the Xbox hardware division. That's why Microsoft is increasingly trying to offer gaming as a service that you can stream to any device. And they are also increasing their presence in PC gaming which is massive now.
 

Kage Maru

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,804
Most games being the same "to the naked eye" actually doesn't matter a lot. People will often gravitate to what they believe to be better, even if they wouldn't pass a blind test between the differences. It wasn't how 900p games looked on XB1 that was the main issue in regards to power, it was that the PS4 was constantly cited as being the better performer for these same titles. People will then opt for what's consistently portrayed as the "better" device even if they never see the differences head-to-head for themselves.


Of course, this isn't to suggest that more powerful hardware is the alpha and omega of console success, as that's clearly and demonstrably not true. Had XB1 and PS4 had the same specs, PS4 would have almost certainly ran away with the generation on price. Had they been the same price, PS4 would have run away with the generation on power. Now, had they been the same price and the same power... MS likely would have held onto the markets they once had (primarily US+UK) but still been outsold globally due to brand awareness. If they had been more powerful at the same price, then they likely would have made some gains in other (non-JP) markets.

It's easy to just say "power doesn't win a console generation", but the truth is that there's no single thing that ever does, as much as those that state "software decides the winner" like to believe. For practically every example people provide of a console that won a generation whilst not being the strongest, there's pretty much also a direct competitor console where its perceived lack of power sealed its fate. The Saturn whilst similar to XB1 in regards to launch stupidity was harmed just as much by the constant citations of it not having the 3D performance to compete with the PS1. Dreamcast's momentum was shutdown almost immediately by a bunch of PS2 tech demos and claims of pushing 66m polygons, etc. A large part of why the strongest console of a generation doesn't typically win is due to factors that either put it outside of direct competition like the Wii (or potentially Switch), or because the strongest console launches into a generation that is already decided (OG Xbox/Gamecube, Xbox One X). Software is also clearly not the silver bullet that guarantees success, because Nintendo's output across every console since the N64 has by and large been the same, but to very different levels of success for their respective platforms.

Good post. Anyone who wants to say that power doesn't matter should read this.
 

statham

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,449
FloRida
a
I think that they will be about the same or the PS5 be a little bit more powerful. Unless you can put out great games to take advantage of that hardware and good price, you only have bragging rights.
what if Xbox is indeed more powerful by 30% and puts out great games? AND at the same price? Crazy right? but very possible, new studios are hungry. MS is Hungry.
 

Dark_EMT

Banned
Apr 19, 2018
571
a

what if Xbox is indeed more powerful by 30% and puts out great games? AND at the same price? Crazy right? but very possible, new studios are hungry. MS is Hungry.
Then it will come down to the exclusives. But the Xbox will look very good at the same price and more powerful than the ps5. I can see it being a tight race.
 

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
I've found myself happier to stay out of battles that stem from tribal allegiances here...but quick question.

Does talking about power of consoles somehow negate importance of content? I don't remember seeing that in the OP. Doesn't seem to directly relate to this topic. Of course content is king. Power can make content a little better...as can convenience. As can controllers. This was a thread talking about power diff in consoles. Not whether it would change the console wars. Not whether that negated the importance of exclusives. Just about the power.

Personally I'm curious how scalable ray tracing and next gen physics will be and whether there will be notable differences in those things based on the power. What will the power difference mean on multiplats. 900P to 1080P did matter in 2013. Until we see what he power difference impacts (or doesn't impact) hard to say whether it will be meaningful to the gaming enthusiast.
 

Mr. Genuine

Member
Mar 23, 2018
1,617
Yes
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-resolutiongate-the-fallout

Power like games has always been important in the beginning of generations . No need to randomly downplay it.

This one opinion piece is supposed to be enough to prove that the slight power difference between the Xbox One and PS4 is what made the PS4 sell more?

The conversations I heard in the real world about XBox One vs PS4 had everything to do with used games and DRM and never once did I hear anyone say "Resolutiongate" (nor was I even aware that this "gate" occured).

Sure, if you don't think the 100pg threads on "GrassGate" wasn't significant in mindshare at the beginning of the gen.

The constant DF videos showcasing the power differences.

Or Sony themselves via god know how many focus groups thinking it was that insignificant that it plastered "most powerful console" on its branding for the 4 and the Pro.

Neogaf/Resetera threads cannot be used as an accurate representation of the "common man".

I never watched those Digital Foundry videos, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say the people watching those kinds of things are hardcore enthusiasts and their audience aren't nearly big enough to make the difference in the console marketplace.

Of course Sony are going to tout their console as more powerful. It's their job to market their product. My point is that talk of "power" is nothing more than empty marketing rhetoric.

The PS2 outsold the Xbox because of the very well regarded brand name, coming out first, and already having a large array of third party support built in the PS1 days. But the Xbox was "more powerful".

The Xbox 360 outsold the PS3 (in North America, at least) because it was significantly cheaper, had a much better online service, and had more or less the same third party games you could play elsewhere. But the PS3 was "more powerful"

The PS4 outsold the Xbox One because of MS' terrible DRM messaging and the PS4 being significantly cheaper. I guess this is the one time the "more powerful" console won.

The "weaker" console won 2/3 generations. That tells me what matters more than anything else is value and software. That would make sense because, again, the Playstation and Xbox are always equal machines with different branding.
 

Ascenion

Prophet of Truth - One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,095
Mecklenburg-Strelitz
Time and time again, Era conveniently forgets this or are too caught up with the brand religion they follow to perceive the reality of the video game industry.

This generation changed everything for everyone. Forever.

Network Services dwarfed the revenue income of hardware and peripherals combined last fiscal year and are on a huge rise. Game libraries have become a far more deciding factor on where the masses will go compared to the "most powerful console in the world" marketing tactic.

I'd say this coming generation is the change. Yes digital has grown but not enough to lock people into ecosystems. Especially casuals that buy yearly titles that don't actually care about playing them much the following year. Free to play titles can easily do cross progression and quite frankly I think MS is in a position to offer you your PS4 or Xbox One library on gamepass in all truth. Once the new consoles drop, I imagine Gamepass will get a swath of Xbox One titles, that are no longer relevant unless they get Xbox Next versions
 

Deleted member 19533

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,873
Wasn't that Microsoft who did that from the request of the Gears devs, not Sony?

I wonder if for either platform Microsoft or Sony will resort to eating some of the cost per console early on in the generation.
Sony made the decision last second IIRC, right before going on stage. It surprised a lot of the devs that were present.
 

Wet Jimmy

Member
Nov 11, 2017
809
If Phil Spencer's continuing talk / philosophy around gaming and accessibility is also combined with a continuation of Microsoft providing the most powerful console hardware, I'll be very pleased and will happily pay the price asked.

I really just hope all future consoles are available in White from day one...
 

OldDirtyGamer

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,474
I don't think they'd be willing to take any more major losses with the Xbox hardware division. That's why Microsoft is increasingly trying to offer gaming as a service that you can stream to any device. And they are also increasing their presence in PC gaming which is massive now.

XBL + GP + whatever it may cost to stream games if that becomes its own service could easily make more money than the hardware loss.

It should be interesting to see.
 
Oct 31, 2017
3,287
Devs were pretty sure of PS4's specs too until Sony doubled the RAM at the last minute. Nothing is set in stone and I don't believe rumors from supposed insiders. I'll only trust my own eyes when both consoles are revealed. Even if it turns out the next Xbox is more powerful it means nothing for me as a PC gamer, I don't buy consoles for power.
 

Melchiah

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,190
Helsinki, Finland
I suppose the idea is that they expect Microsoft to sell at a loss to build market-share. I doubt they'd do that. Or that they get better prices than Sony, which is weird. I agree that it'll be hard to beat PS5 at the same pricepoint. They may prioritise differently, say if Xbox doesn't go with a fancy-pants storage solution they can spend more on processing. But would they? Time will tell.

Both parties could sell at loss like before. All the talk about Microsoft's war chest ignores how Sony also has an incentive to secure their greatly profitable digital marketplace. If both are willing to sell at a premium price, and/or take a loss, there's a slim chance of either one going much above the other in the same time frame. Resources spent on a better cooling will be away from elsewhere, and they probably can't go above a certain wattage threshold. It's possible, that XB4 could be slightly more powerful than PS5, but not as much as XBX was compared to Pro.

Both will be using SSD as well, including Lockhart, so their budget is similar in that regard.
 

Doctor_Thomas

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,651
I honestly don't think there's going to be any difference.

I dare say if there are differences, they'll be balanced in other places.
 
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