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Intermittent Fasting OT

Oct 27, 2017
4,587
Not calories as such, but keeping an eye on your macros most definitely is if you're trying to actually be healthy rather than just light.

I'd hate to think what would happen to most people's bodies if they had one massive meal full of carbs with very little fats and protein.
Yeah of course you should definitely have a varied diet, especially if you're doing IF, but again that's very different from calorie counting.
 
Oct 27, 2017
509
Finished 24 hour fast earlier. Just had my meal and with it I allowed myself a 12oz bottle of root beer & 2 single serving chip bags. Still right at my goal for intake which is awesome. It feels good to do these small indulgences with a meal that would normally turn into a binge before if I had say a whole family size bag of chips or a 12 case or 2 liter of pop. Now to start a 16 hour fast I do 16:8 most of the time and do a 24 every few days. It's working well for me.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,499
Alright, last time I tried an extended fast, I went 4 days before social obligations brought me out of it. That was about 4 months ago or so, and I'm ready to give it another shot. Starting today, I'm aiming for 5 days, but if everything still feels alright by Friday, I may go longer (longest I can do is probably 10 days since I'll have Memorial Day Weekend things and will want to break the fast a few days early to be safe).
 
Nov 7, 2017
762
Alright, last time I tried an extended fast, I went 4 days before social obligations brought me out of it. That was about 4 months ago or so, and I'm ready to give it another shot. Starting today, I'm aiming for 5 days, but if everything still feels alright by Friday, I may go longer (longest I can do is probably 10 days since I'll have Memorial Day Weekend things and will want to break the fast a few days early to be safe).
I did a 40 hour dry fast followed by another 24 hours drinking last week. I didn't do it for weight loss reasons but primarily for treating onset of rheumatoid arthritis recently. I went down 6-7 Lbs. Currently doing another dry fast following by water only [probably 3 days total] for dealing with some lower back and sciatic nerve pain. Pain is probably about 80% gone. I'm definitely less hungry when dry fasting.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,472
I did a 40 hour dry fast followed by another 24 hours drinking last week. I didn't do it for weight loss reasons but primarily for treating onset of rheumatoid arthritis recently. I went down 6-7 Lbs. Currently doing another dry fast following by water only [probably 3 days total] for dealing with some lower back and sciatic nerve pain. Pain is probably about 80% gone. I'm definitely less hungry when dry fasting.
Wow, that's a fascinating treatment strategy. Just read an article on it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
509
Currently 16 hours into what was going to just be 16:8 but I think I am going to try and push it to 48 as I've already done just shy of 24 hours not too long ago. I just feel so much more relaxed since starting this and less inflamed overall.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,784
Done 3 days in a row of OMAD, basically eating at the 24h mark. It gets easier and easier to do. I didn't really set out to do OMAD on purpose, its just that I hit the 16 hour mark and I'm still not hungry at all.

I get full with so little food, that I worry I'm not consuming enough calories haha. At least I am making sure to eat healthy foods with greens, fats, proteins, and even some carbs.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
Done 3 days in a row of OMAD, basically eating at the 24h mark. It gets easier and easier to do. I didn't really set out to do OMAD on purpose, its just that I hit the 16 hour mark and I'm still not hungry at all.

I get full with so little food, that I worry I'm not consuming enough calories haha. At least I am making sure to eat healthy foods with greens, fats, proteins, and even some carbs.
Track your calories. I felt frustrated at not losing weight and when I actually track & observe my calories, it magically starts to come off. It's pretty easy to overeat, especially if you are just eyeballing hard to measure stuff. There is such a thing as eating too little, to the point where your body will harshly correct to stop your attempt to rob it of glorious survival fat.
 

FliXFantatier

Master of the Reality Stone
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,170
Los Angeles
So I decided to skip lunch today and fast for two days straight. When I told my wife her eyes rolled to the back of her head, she thinks I am being extreme. I told her occasionally extending the fasting window is perfectly normal. Any good resource I can point her to to prove my point? 😝
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
So I decided to skip lunch today and fast for two days straight. When I told my wife her eyes rolled to the back of her head, she thinks I am being extreme. I told her occasionally extending the fasting window is perfectly normal. Any good resource I can point her to to prove my point? 😝
Nature? Common sense?

Why would we suffer ill effects or drop dead after a few days of not eating? Not a very good survival adaptation.

It's not really a coincidence that rates of obesity skyrocketed when meal timing shifted in the middle of the 20th century.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,833
Normal, but largely pointless. There's very little science behind it having any measurable advantage over daily fasting.

Quite a bit of science behind it harming your progress if you're doing weights / athletic training though.
 

FliXFantatier

Master of the Reality Stone
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,170
Los Angeles
Normal, but largely pointless. There's very little science behind it having any measurable advantage over daily fasting.

Quite a bit of science behind it harming your progress if you're doing weights / athletic training though.
Interesting. Can you point me towards more details, I'd be interested. As a fair few people around here seem to regularly extend their fast I think it would be an interesting topic.
For the most part on a daily basis I do anything between 16:8 and 18:6.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
Normal, but largely pointless. There's very little science behind it having any measurable advantage over daily fasting.

Quite a bit of science behind it harming your progress if you're doing weights / athletic training though.
I train fasted and I'm still consistently adding weight to the bar after about 8 months. Leangains is a thing.

There's also a laundry list of benefits if you do a true longer fast beyond just 72 hours to the point where it's used in clinical settings to treat all kinds of conditions. Under that amount of time, there's not a huge difference beyond the added calorie restriction.

Interesting. Can you point me towards more details, I'd be interested. As a fair few people around here seem to regularly extend their fast I think it would be an interesting topic.
For the most part on a daily basis I do anything between 16:8 and 18:6.
The body has a potent self-repair mechanism called autophagy that only turns on in the complete absence of calories.

Dr. Fung, a nephrologist, has a good article on it here: https://idmprogram.com/fasting-and-autophagy-fasting-25/

You can watch his videos or read his articles on his website. Fung started as a huge skeptic but ended up a believer after seeing results in his patients. He has some good lectures on YT as well.

Highly recommend this one:


Covers caloric deficits and why most people fail on diets
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,833
I train fasted and I'm still consistently adding weight to the bar after about 8 months. Leangains is a thing.
I'm not talking about fasted daily training (which is shit if you need to spend any significant amount of time at high heart rates for what it's worth). I'm talking about doing multiple days of fasting. Your body doesn't have what it needs to properly rebuild your muscles, so you just end up harming your progress.

Also, I added far more weight when I started lifting after my first meal than when I didn't. That's based on the results of about 5 years of lifting (with two of them done fully fasted).

Doing multiple days might be great if you're not working out. It's really not if you are.
 

MarioW

PikPok
Verified
Nov 5, 2017
303
New Zealand
I was wondering if somebody knew what the impact of alcohol was on fasting, specifically vodka and soda water? I'm guessing it breaks the fast, unless there is something different about the calories such a drink contains?

I've been eating (mostly) once a day for the last month with good results, and was curious how a night out on the town factors in. Vodka and soda water is my drink of choice for a number of years when going out to limit overall calorie, sugar, and caffeine intake and keep "water" intake high. But curious how it impacts fasting. Am assuming it turns a 24 hour fast into a 8:16 of sorts.
 
Jan 5, 2019
106
Just started IF OMAD so great to see this thread fresh

Last time was on it lost a shit ton of weight
Gained it back + more but that was slowly overtime.

IF definitely worked so doing it again with more will power.

As said great to see this OT

Hoping to read back through posts again to hear your stories
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
I was wondering if somebody knew what the impact of alcohol was on fasting, specifically vodka and soda water? I'm guessing it breaks the fast, unless there is something different about the calories such a drink contains?

I've been eating (mostly) once a day for the last month with good results, and was curious how a night out on the town factors in. Vodka and soda water is my drink of choice for a number of years when going out to limit overall calorie, sugar, and caffeine intake and keep "water" intake high. But curious how it impacts fasting. Am assuming it turns a 24 hour fast into a 8:16 of sorts.
Anything with calories breaks a fast.

 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
What if you drink during You’re eating window?

Let’s say you’re doing 8:16

You delay the 8 to cover let’s say 8PM > 4AM?

Once you don’t go above your calerie intake.

I’m curious
If you drink during your window then it counts the same as any other calories. It's fine. Just account for it. Not eating at your usual time and waiting to eat/drink when you're out on the town or whatever the case may be is a totally valid strategy. The key is to be flexible.

The 'benefits' of fasting come from lowering your insulin level, which drops depending on the type of diet you eat (lower carb is better), how frequently you eat, if you are exercising, and where you are at on your weight loss journey. Intermittent fasting drops the frequency of meals and adds a period of 'rest' for the body so that insulin levels drop, allowing your body to access fat stores. It's nearly impossible for the body to utilize existing bodyfat when your insulin levels are high.

If you have a bad week diet wise or just feel up to it you can always find a day and not eat that entire day, fasting from one meal to the next. So, for example, Saturday dinner to Monday whenever you usually eat your first meal. In addition to feeling good, you'll bank that day of calories with no real downside. Your metabolism won't drop, you won't lose muscle, you won't keel over and die.
 
Jan 5, 2019
106
If you drink during your window then it counts the same as any other calories. It's fine. Just account for it. Not eating at your usual time and waiting to eat/drink when you're out on the town or whatever the case may be is a totally valid strategy. The key is to be flexible.

The 'benefits' of fasting come from lowering your insulin level, which drops depending on the type of diet you eat (lower carb is better), how frequently you eat, if you are exercising, and where you are at on your weight loss journey. Intermittent fasting drops the frequency of meals and adds a period of 'rest' for the body so that insulin levels drop, allowing your body to access fat stores. It's nearly impossible for the body to utilize existing bodyfat when your insulin levels are high.

If you have a bad week diet wise or just feel up to it you can always find a day and not eat that entire day, fasting from one meal to the next. So, for example, Saturday dinner to Monday whenever you usually eat your first meal. In addition to feeling good, you'll bank that day of calories with no real downside. Your metabolism won't drop, you won't lose muscle, you won't keel over and die.
Nice write up and insight

Thanks for the reply
 

MarioW

PikPok
Verified
Nov 5, 2017
303
New Zealand
Dr. Fung, a nephrologist, has a good article on it here: https://idmprogram.com/fasting-and-autophagy-fasting-25/

You can watch his videos or read his articles on his website. Fung started as a huge skeptic but ended up a believer after seeing results in his patients. He has some good lectures on YT as well.

Highly recommend this one:


Covers caloric deficits and why most people fail on diets
That was a really interesting video, thanks.

A question arising out of that, what are the effects on metabolism after more than a month of OMAD IF and let's say sub 1800 calories daily? The video suggested that metabolism increased very short term, but it wasn't clear on longer term impact on metabolism. Is it recommended over the longer term to mix in days of a full ~2200 calories? Or does the nature of IF mean you never see your metabolism slow down under sustained periods of calorie deficit like you would on a regular diet?
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
That was a really interesting video, thanks.

A question arising out of that, what are the effects on metabolism after more than a month of OMAD IF and let's say sub 1800 calories daily? The video suggested that metabolism increased very short term, but it wasn't clear on longer term impact on metabolism. Is it recommended over the longer term to mix in days of a full ~2200 calories? Or does the nature of IF mean you never see your metabolism slow down under sustained periods of calorie deficit like you would on a regular diet?
IF fights metabolic adaptation to a degree, something continuous caloric restriction suffers from and why most diets fail. But you should probably mix in days where you eat nothing at all and days where you eat over maintenance.

It's counterintuitive, but metabolism actually goes up on a short term fast. It's also why fasts are protein (muscle) sparing by nature. It makes evolutionary sense, as it would be a rather dumb survival adaptation to be lethargic and to have your muscles break down after a day of not eating. You need those things to get food. It also makes perfect sense that the body can adapt to steadily slowing caloric intake but doesn't adapt anywhere near as quickly (or at all) to an intake that varies. The constant availability of food is a relatively recent invention on the timeline of our biology.

I would find a day where you can do a 24 hour fast aka not eating for a day, then put those calories on your workout days or whatever fits best. It's what I'm currently doing. You'll find that you can't really overeat as much as you think, especially if you are still using a feeding window. Meanwhile, you are banking a calorie deficit with the day of not eating.

In IF, this is referred to the Every Other Day diet or Alternate-day fasting. Calorie cycling isn't a new concept but applying it to IF has some promising results.

BBC doc on IF covers it in a section:
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,372
Anyone know how long you need to fast to trigger autophagy, I see differing opinions everywhere?
Only starts around 16 hours, so to reap any daily benefits you'd need to shrink your eating window to as small as possible and/or incorporate a day where you don't eat into your weekly schedule. Autophagy is also fairly picky about even limited calories so you'd need to do water on that day if possible.

On a sidenote, found this handy chart to explain why IF works:


IF will put you in the lower third of the normal range if you are doing 18:6 or better. This is why it's great for fat loss.
 
Oct 27, 2017
871
Thanks for that.

I typically fast 2 days a week from 7am to 7am but am currently trying to go a bit longer - 7am to noon the next day (29 hours), 2.5 hrs to go! While any weight control is appreciated, I'm mostly interested in the effects of Autophagy and how much clearer my mind is/better my brain works.
 
Oct 27, 2017
871
Completely unscientific but I do a crossword every morning and I'm noticeably quicker and more successful the days after fasting.

Does anyone knows what switches Autophagy back off, does it happen as soon as you start eating anything again?
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,784
IF has changed my life.

It is 100% the reason I am losing weight and have been able to have days where I cheat and I still don't go back to gaining it all again like I had in previous diets.