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Iranian military claims to have shot down US spy drone
- Thread starter Ozorov
- Start date
Sorry but no, leaving the Iran nuclear deal has effectively lead to the empowering of the hawks in the country. The U.S. should have known better than to leave a perfectly functional deal which has resulted in Rouhani becoming the laughing stock of the country and the hawks taking over.
That doesn't excuse Iran's behavior, but the country's economy is on the brink of collapse directly because of the U.S. which has clearly lead to the regime becoming desperate. Pretending that the U.S. doesn't have any guilt in this is fucking ridiculous. If we go to war it'll be entirely because our chuckle fuck of a president tore up a perfectly functioning deal that Iran was abiding by according to the IAEA.
It's not just international waters but also international targets.
Norway and Japan had fuck all to do.
Iran is basically blasting non-American ships and American drones because they want to make a huge ruckus but don't have the balls to hit American lives directly.
If only, it highlights how much of an awful and cowardly regime Iran's is. And I say it as somebody who wanted the nuclear deal to remain and hates Trump's guts.
... Our Saudi owners are pleased as their influence and power grows?
There is no good end game, it's just pointless carnage for terrible reasons.
Hopefully it doesn't come to war, is the real hope here.
Your simplistic view of the situation, especially when discussing how a conflict with Iran would go, is kinda telling to be honest.
The US has it's foot stamped down on Iran's throat and you're pretending that has nothing to do with the actions of showing the world if they continue to have their neck being at risk of getting snapped that they aren't going to go down without inflicting maximum pain on all those who watch idly by.
That's the point.
Iran is showing in very clear terms it will go scorched Earth if it's facing imminent collapse.
The goal of the war would likely be to destroy all of Iran's influence in the region. What people fail to realize is that a war with Iran isn't just a war with Iran. If the U.S. starts a military operation against the country, it will become a war that will engulf the entire region.
Israel, and Saudi Arabia in particular would likely engage in military operations to clear Iran's influence in Lebanon, Syria, and Yemen (SA has already been in a war with Yemen for some 5 years). Needless to say there would likely also be a new war even worse than the one that happened in 2006 in Lebanon, and Israeli attacks on Syria would likely intensify and the Syrian government would get involved.
A war with Iran would effectively become a regional conflict that would engulf the entire region, and who knows how the region comes out on the other side.
Is Iran not responsible for their own actions? Yes or no?
Ignoring my posts and trying to reframe everything in your own context isn't going to fly.
But hey, don't blame poor Iran. The US pressure made them do it...
/s
Your posts make it out like Iran is not responsible for their own actions. I didn't ignore your post.
Another thing is there is no international water in strait of Hormuz. Most of it is shared space between Iran and Oman. Ships and planes are allowed to use this shared space under the rules of right of innocent passage if they have their IFF transponders on clearing identifying themselves. Turning of your IFF transponders means you are an intruder. Iranian officials are saying IFF transponders on the drone was off while US is silent on the issue.
I mean, when you post shit like this it's all to blatant what your angle is.
The context of Iran's actions is the US has caused a situation where they have little options remaining in order to remedy and force cooperation for sanction relief.
Your posts are commenting on Iran's aggression without talking about the underlining root cause.
Iran knows that a war with the US would lead to it's utter destruction, yet it's continuing to take actions that would escalate the current situation to where that risk increases. Iran isn't an irrational actor, if they are committing these actions which are inherently aggressive it's because they likely view the current path they are on of inaction unpalatable due to it's likely outcome of the nations collapse or government collapse.
If inaction is no longer tenable and the current actions risk a wider conflict, what does that say about how Iran views it's current situation?
My only angle is that it's ok to not be happy with the US' handling of Iran but also not OK with how Iran is acting. It's OK to not be happy with both.
Old neocons can't get over the 79 revolution and Saudi Arabia among other countries run foreign policy here via money. This time the cut out the middle man and straight up just hand over money directly to trump and his family.
I don't think anyone (who thinks Iran is responsible) is ok with Iran shooting civilian tankers and downing US drones.
That doesn't mean I'm not inherently understanding of the desperation that has been forced on them by the US
This isn't Iraq, where major operations were done within weeks. Iran would make us pay a major toll. Not just in American Lives, but I'm guessing they mess with the oil. Economic hit would be huge.
Bomb iran into oblivion. Continue to sell saudis nuclear tech and be happy you destroyed another muslim country.
Trump wants his "Team America" moment because he thinks it'll make it much tougher to vote him out. He wants to tweet in real time about how we're "winning" and that Americans would be making a YUGE mistake in not giving him a second term because otherwise the Democrats would lose.
That's what is driving all this.
That's what is driving all this.
US is leaving Iran with 2 options, the first one is that Iran does nothing and goes the way of NK where people have been starving to death for decades and probably will be starving to death for the foreseeable future while being totally irrelevant. The second one is to go the way of Iraq with sudden destruction and death of hundreds of thousands in rather short amount of time but then hope for becoming a normal country in a few decades. Iranian leaders are choosing the second one and I think it's the best option Iran has right now.
Iran has little choice than to lash out and make conflict as costly as possible.
The US and it's allies have them cornered and working towards their social and economic collapse for no real reason.
part of me wonders if the U.S. is going to have any self restraint in this situation and just add on more sanctions. Admittedly every time something happens with Iran we all assume the worst, but I guess we'll know within the next 24 hours what the U.S. is going to do.
By the way, anyone who thinks Trump launching a war against Iran would "secure him a second term" needs to get their DISARAYYYY heads out of their ass.
A war with Iran would end Trump, and likely end the GOP. It would make Iraq look like a fucking picnic, not only in terms of the body count but in respect to the absolute economical ramifications Iran could entail to the world. It would be the final chapter in American geopolitical dominance as it needs to spend the rest of it's existence duct taping together an entire region it smashed to pieces, costing trillions and endless political capital.
There is a reason people in the military who know more than us and our armchair breakdowns have always been fighting back against the idea of an armed conflict with Iran.
A war with Iran would end Trump, and likely end the GOP. It would make Iraq look like a fucking picnic, not only in terms of the body count but in respect to the absolute economical ramifications Iran could entail to the world. It would be the final chapter in American geopolitical dominance as it needs to spend the rest of it's existence duct taping together an entire region it smashed to pieces, costing trillions and endless political capital.
There is a reason people in the military who know more than us and our armchair breakdowns have always been fighting back against the idea of an armed conflict with Iran.
Iran can't do shit. The only detterence Iran has is US public and morals stopping US. US has all the incentives to attack Iran. Just bomb us from high altitude to the Stone age.
I think this means yes. During his campaign he said that if he's going to attack Iran, nobody will know beforehand. And I don't think thar Iran would not retaliate. The war is imminent imo.
You're underestimating how important that is.
You should, the Pentagon is probably the only rational actor who has influence left that could be standing between Bolton and right wing lunatics urging Trump to launch strikes.
Remember when the US shot down a plane killing 290 Iranian citizens in 1988 and never apologized. How many American citizens died from this drone getting shot down.
No, that's what is going to happen. Probably English not being my first language made my statement to come out this way.
I mean not even the europeans seem to trust the pentagon which apparently hasn't provided verified proof about last week.
Senior EU aid today:
when the economy crashes if iran retaliates against the oil fields or mines the strait, trump and repubs better own it all
can't believe that it's come to this over some petty shit yet here we are
can't believe that it's come to this over some petty shit yet here we are
Ah, sorry for misreading.
I'm dreading that it's going to happen, I really hope it doesn't but the world has been shooting down those hopes for years now anyway.
All of us shouldn't trust the Pentagon.
I doubt it. Trump is a fucking idiot, but him supposedly not wanting war with Iran is one area I actually believe him.
Doesn't help that they say Iran is lying, we were in international waters, then not take questions. Sounds like a an excuse to declare war because you backed Iran into a corner.
The US, Saudis and UAE have less credibility than Iran at the moment. When you have John Bolton at the helm, who has advocated for war with Iran for decades and is reported as looking for reasons to attack Iran; I find any intel coming from those countries to be highly dubious.
Trump abruptly ending the Iran deal and imposing sanctions is largely responsible for this.
Also I feel like any country should be entitled to shoot drowns down that are spying on them.
John Bolton was specifically brought on for a potential Iran conflict. They want this.
Iran can do plenty, it's already doing a shiton in Yemen, Syria and Iraq, Iranian influence is the greatest threat to the US in the middle east. The Quds force alone made Iraq hell for the occupation forces in Iraq. If the US commits to an all out war with an invasion it will be worse than Vietnam a thousand folds, if it commits to strikes Iran can retaliate by attacking oil tankers, infrastructures, escalating in Yemen, in Iraq, Bahrain which is a majority Shia country with a Sunni dictatorship where the American fifth fleet is located, or destabilize the Saudi eastern Shia regions. Iran isn't just Iran, it's also Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon.
When people ask what can Iran do, I keep reminding them of two things the Karbala raid conducted by the Quds force, and the 2006 Lebanon war.
Trump is an isolationist. That makes him extremely unlikely to want war with anyone. Low oil price and a strong economy is all Trump has going for him, and two of his major running point. That isn't being naive. That is knowing that Trump wants a 2nd presidential term.