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Is Kojima the M. Night Shyamalan of the gaming industry?
- Thread starter AuthenticM
- Start date
Nope just young at heart. I loved The Village by the way.
Your evidence didn't fulfill the claim I asked to be proved. It's also possible to not be the person making the initial claim and still move goalposts.
The claim was that people were declaring it GOTY before playing it, that post wasn't an example of that.
admittedly haven't played death stranding yet but kojima is more consistent than m night and snyder both
MGS4 was one of his few missteps
MGS4 was one of his few missteps
he's...J.J Abrams
let's pretend I didn't pick this at random and instead had some logic behind this choice
let's pretend I didn't pick this at random and instead had some logic behind this choice
Yup. Kojima stories without sensible checks in place is usually an incoherent mess of little value. DS is his latest work of shite, narratively speaking.
Absolutely true.
For what it's worth I liked MGS4 because, while imperfect, it had a lot of heart and we had the benefit of knowing all the characters pretty well by that point. Everything since then has been a sharp plunge downhill. The story and writing in Death Stranding is just awful, really, and when people argue otherwise I kind of wonder what the frame of reference is for good writing is at that point.
I think Kojima is a much more successful game developer than Shyamalan is a filmmaker. However, I think they both shit on their otherwise virtuous talents by insisting on attempting to create intricate and complex narratives which invariably end up feeling grotesquely sophomoric and messy. The worst part is that they come off as thinking their work is mature and advanced, but (especially in Kojima's case) the end result just feels like a nerdy outsider teen's pathos-ridden world view.
If either of them stopped focusing on their own self-satisfaction and actually put the art first, they could probably create something truly great, instead of a string of flawed diamonds in Kojima's case and a bucket of outright failures in Shyamalan's case (Unbreakable was awesome though.)
If either of them stopped focusing on their own self-satisfaction and actually put the art first, they could probably create something truly great, instead of a string of flawed diamonds in Kojima's case and a bucket of outright failures in Shyamalan's case (Unbreakable was awesome though.)
So a thread saying the game sounds like a GOTY before it released and is closed because it wasn't out and such threads are premature.... doesn't fit your criteria of people declaring it GOTY before playing it?
THAT sounds like moving goalposts.
tons of people call all sorts of games GOTY before they come out, I'm sure there have been plenty for FF7 and Cyberpunk both
Calling FF7 remake, Cyberpunk 2077, TLOU II and BotW 2 GOTY before playing them is fine.
But calling a Kojima game GOTY prior to release means you are a blind Kojima cult fanboy. And will be used as justification for all the Kojima hate. /s
Lol you dudes swear an industry without Kojima would be a good thing.
He's making great games still, and has been for decades.
Death Stranding is a GOTY level game.
I'm glad Kojima is still around to make something so unique and unlike anything else, despite whatever "flaws" he might have.
He's making great games still, and has been for decades.
Death Stranding is a GOTY level game.
I'm glad Kojima is still around to make something so unique and unlike anything else, despite whatever "flaws" he might have.
No...
Different field and all that. Kojima game is still well received, M. Night... not so much
Different field and all that. Kojima game is still well received, M. Night... not so much
I don't like either's work and I don't get this one. Until Kojima finally tries his hands at a Hollywood movie and it's an inevitable shitshow, they have nothing alike at all.
It's more "a bit less aggravating" than anything else tbh
This is the take I was looking for!
But really it's been stated a bunch in thread already that comparing across mediums doesn't hold up. Von Trier doesn't have genre-defining gameplay to fall back on when his narrative misses the mark.
Lol, as if the hate of two of those people isn't incredibly justified. I don't like Kojima's games or the ridiculous praise he gets, but putting him on the same level as Trump is certainly a take.
A bad one.
So they're similar because you liked their earlier work in two very different mediums? Its a pretty tenuous connection
Out of every Kojima game ever release this is the most divisive for sure online, but nuance debates about video games is out of the window once any online personality inject their criticism into a product, and with Kojima a lot of pundits have used terms like "walking simulator", or "film director" wannabe. People really don't even notice they're parroting the same shit everyone else is.
Now I've also engaged with people who have legitimately played and not like the game, but it hasn't devolve into bullshit reductionist premise when we talk about why the design/story/etc isn't up to par.
And maybe anecdotal evidence but my younger cousins and nephews seem to be all on the "this game is a walking simulator with anime story" talking point.
That's pretty on point I think, but Kojima's gameplay always ropes me in no matter what he does I always have fun playing them.
Of course I always thought the stories were dogshit, just highly produced cinematic cutscenes and expository bullshit since the 3D era and it's always glorious to have that train wreck wrapped around a good playing game.
Maybe it's just me, but I swear people who thinks that there are this HUGE contingent of people hell-bent on hating Kojima in here is just.... exaggerating things?
Trump is obviously far more hated here. But Kojima is at least as hated as Musk here, and even more hated than Pewdiepie, Mitch McConnell, etc. Seeing the obsessed level of hatred that is rampant on this forum over the last year has been bewildering to see.
Both the Dunkey Death Stranding thread and this one seemed to pull a fair share of people with tickets for the hate train.
So, maybe?
The Visit was a real good "horror" movie and came as a surprise. Split was also good too.
There definitely has been here on ERA. Way more than you'd think for a game designer who's output for the past 20 years is generally considered to be extremely high quality.
You couldn't go in a DS thread pre-release without seeing multiple "words and deeds!" shitposts, comments about how he's up his own ass, how he'd be a terrible filmmaker etc.
I don't know what it is. Maybe it's MGSV really souring people, maybe it's console wars due to DS being a PS exclusive or maybe it's sexualization being a more called out topic these days (which makes sense, and DS shows a ton of improvement from him there anyway). Not sure, but it's totally bizarre.
paws up dog i'm gunning for you for the mere insinuation bang bang bang
Nah, George changed movie industry, Kojima hasn't come anywhere near the impact he made with his work. Nobody knows Kojima outside of nerdom, everyone has some inkling of laser swords and golden c3po.
Any story/cinematic game you love that came out after MG/MGS probably wouldn't have been the same without it
Kojima is the Nicolas Winding Refn of the gaming industry. His stuff is visually stunning but the writing is always hit or miss. Neon Demon and Drive were amazing. Only God Forgives and Too Old to Die Young were such a slog to get through.
Industry influence is not judged by popularity or how many people know. It's about how much your work affects and changes the work in the same industry, and no matter what you think of Lucas or Kojima they are both legends of changing their respective fields in multiple ways.
I feel kind of the opposite. Kojima may be a hack, but you have to get up very early in the morning to be a bigger hack than Shyamalan. Hell, if anything, the OP calling his first three movies "amazing" is being too charitable.
Yup, Kojima is a brilliant designer. The man knows gameplay and what feels good. Upgrades truly feel meaningful, and that sense of progression is really there.