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Is Mobile Suit Gundam: Char's Counterattack any good?

mute

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,691
I liked the music and the animation. I didn't really like the mechanical designs coming off of ZZ and the story wasn't that great to me either, based on my impression of the preceding series.

I think it was a similar situation of F91 where they initially had a full series planned but had to cut it short? Might be wrong on that.
 

MechaX

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,234
You should watch 08th MS Team again, because this isn't even remotely true.
Shiro is successful in most of the things that he does, but yeah, he 200% has to work to pull most of his stuff off and it usually feels like Shiro earned his victory (and when Shiro does fuck up, he fucks up big time). I can see where the other person is coming from, but I definitely wouldn’t go as far as to call him a genius character.
 

Vas

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,016
I've been meaning to make a Drake meme with a screenshot of "Char's Counterattack Full Movie" on youtube with Drake shielding his gaze and with a screenshot "Nu Gundam vs. Sazabi" with pleased Drake.

Because every time I feel like watching CCA, I realize all I really want is Nu vs. Sazabi. In fact, the whole movie seems like an advertisement/hype for that fight. The plot is bizarre. I had thought that maybe Char had this plan to unite humanity by creating an existential threat and having Amuro, a true New-Type, defeat him as a symbol for what man can achieve if we work together. Maybe creating a renewed unified human identity free from the Nationalist/Racial theories of Zeon Deikun that drove fanatical and irrational Zeonic terror. And when you saw how Amuro's example when he stood up to the colony drop by himself inspired both Federation Jegans and Zeon Geara Dogas to work together in unity to defy borders to save humanity and push with him, there was something to that.

But, then that last argument happens and nah. Char was apparently sincere with his bullshit plan. And it ends weird. "Lalah was the woman who could have been my mother." "...wut?" ZAPPPP the end.
 

MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,178
You should watch 08th MS Team again, because this isn't even remotely true.
It has been a while since I watched the show, but doesn’t it start with him taking out 2 Zakus in a ball? Lol

I feel like most of the stuff he struggles at is anime style hijinks and other people getting in his way.
 
Oct 27, 2017
15,076
But, then that last argument happens and nah. Char was apparently sincere with his bullshit plan. And it ends weird. "Lalah was the woman who could have been my mother." "...wut?" ZAPPPP the end.
That wasn't really an argument Char was making, more that it was just him bickering at Amuro after losing. The whole conversation before that was how Char keeps manipulating all the people (women) around him instead of treating them with compassion

It has been a while since I watched the show, but doesn’t it start with him taking out 2 Zakus in a ball? Lol

I feel like most of the stuff he struggles at is anime style hijinks and other people getting in his way.
He has his ups and downs in terms of feats. The next episode he gets lost in a jungle and has his Gundam stolen by kids
 

MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,178
That wasn't really an argument Char was making, more that it was just him bickering at Amuro after losing. The whole conversation before that was how Char keeps manipulating all the people (women) around him instead of treating them with compassion


He has his ups and downs in terms of feats. The next episode he gets lost in a jungle and has his Gundam stolen by kids
Who he then makes friends with and has help him take down a heavily fortified base. If I remember right?

I’m not trying to say he’s a terrible character, just that he does kinda fit a shonen trope, even if he’s a bit unique compared to other gundam protags. The above is basically a power of friendship Naruto style move. Heh

The point I was trying to originally make is that on the scale of based Newtype God to line soldier, Kou and his feats are fairly realisitic. I think almost every character except Keith hands him an L at some point.
 
Oct 27, 2017
15,076
Who he then makes friends with and has help him take down a heavily fortified base. If I remember right?
It wasn't a heavily fortified base, It was Zeons occupying a part of the jungle that the guerilla village was in. They agree to help if he gets them out of the area. Not to mention in a later episode he tries to help them, leading to tons of people in their village killed, lots of their village destroyed and him almost being court marshalled.

Again, stuff doesn't always work his way and it's not the "power of friendship" since the guerillas have already been established to hate the Zeon for occupying their village and the surrounding area. You're only remembering the high level things and not the details
 

MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,178
It wasn't a heavily fortified base, It was Zeons occupying a part of the jungle that the guerilla village was in. They agree to help if he gets them out of the area. Not to mention in a later episode he tries to help them, leading to tons of people in their village killed, lots of their village destroyed and him almost being court marshalled.

Again, stuff doesn't always work his way and it's not the "power of friendship" since the guerillas have already been established to hate the Zeon for occupying their village and the surrounding area. You're only remembering the high level things and not the details
I’ve not once said that everything works out for him. That is not a quality necessary for a shonen style protagonist and it’s usually the opposite just like the scenario you mention. I just said that as far as skills and personality, he fits that shonen main character trope pretty perfectly. Unconventional genius who wins against the odds and commands respect as a leader. There’s a reason I put genius in quotes.
 
Oct 27, 2017
15,076
I’ve not once said that everything works out for him. That is not a quality necessary for a shonen style protagonist and it’s usually the opposite just like the scenario you mention. I just said that as far as skills and personality, he fits that shonen main character trope pretty perfectly. Unconventional genius who wins against the odds and commands respect as a leader.
He's never portrayed as a genius and there are logical reasons for what you mentioned. The only bullshit "shonen" moment was in the first episode where his Ball wasn't destroyed by the Zaku. He only gained his team's respect by proving himself to be a competent leader, and he still had no respect from the higher ups (considering they almost court marshalled him and had a contingency plans because they assumed he'd defect). The beginning few episodes were literally his team actively clowning on him because of his constant fuckups and ineptitude
 

Effect

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,225
People loved Quattro in Z and it made a lot of people forget that Char was a monster. I'm not one of those people and CCA is awesome. You should watch it. I think that it's a good ending to their rivalry.
This. It really is interesting to see how some people have allowed Char in Zeta Gundam to fool them. Forgetting all the stuff he does in the original series. Hell he does some shady stuff in Z too. What he does in CCA is right in line. Man is a monster and you're not suppose to cheer for and he's shown as the monster he is. I do think some people don't like that. Looking back on Z I see a man biding his time until he could get back in a position of power and when he does CCA happens and all his worse aspects go unchecked.

I understand Char is one of the more popular characters in Gundam and anime but at times I think for the wrong reasons. He's not suppose to be looked at positively.

I think CCA is worth watching to see the end of the Amuro/Char rivalry. What happens to close out the Federation/Zeon wars. You have stuff in Unicorn Gundam but this really is the big end of things. The animation is really nice. It's not my favorite Gundam production though. I wish we could have gotten another series to end things instead of a film but it is what it is.
 
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MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,178
He's never portrayed as a genius and there are logical reasons for what you mentioned. The only bullshit "shonen" moment was in the first episode where his Ball wasn't destroyed by the Zaku. He only gained his team's respect by proving himself to be a competent leader, and he still had no respect from the higher ups (considering they almost court marshalled him and had a contingency plans because they assumed he'd defect). The beginning few episodes were literally his team actively clowning on him because of his constant fuckups and ineptitude
Because this is never a thing that happens to shonen main characters...

I am not saying any of this is a bad thing or that he hasn’t earned his feats. You’re putting a lot of words into my mouth. I was specifically talking about his skills and abilities. He’s not a Newtype but he is still an incredible tactician and fighter. He’s a really well done shonen hero! But he still fits a pretty common trope.
 

Neophant

Member
Oct 25, 2017
409
I find Char's Counterattack to be very re-watchable. It's an interesting conclusion to the plot threads and rivalry between Amuro and Char set up all the way back in 0079. It's not the greatest story of the UC Gundam canon, but it's definitely still one of the best looking. I think it's worth watching for the Gundam fights and score alone.
 

RangerBAD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
719
Shiro is a guy who doesn't want to fight. He's also older than most Gundam pilots, so he's more developed as a person. His own ethics don't mesh with the military's. That's part of the conflict he has.
 

CoolestSpot

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,387
Just watched this. It was beautifully animated.

For the rest?

WHAT THE FUCK IS QUESS

THE STORY IS ALMOST GREAT, I'M FINE WITH CHAR SWITCHING THOUGH I WISH WE GOT TO SEE HIS TURNING POINT AND FULL SWITCH BACK, BUT QUESS?

SHE JOINS THE EARTH BOMB SQUAD TO SAY FUCK YOU TO DADDY, AND STEALS A GUNDAM TO KILL THE WOMAN WHO MIGHT GET THE DICK SHE WANTS BEFORE HER, THAT SHE HAS CONNECTION TO BECAUSE OF HER "NEWTYPE"
 

CoolestSpot

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,387
Like fuck this movie.

Fuck it.

WHY IS QUESS HERE, WHY DO THESE KIDS GET SO MUCH OF THE SCREENTIME AND ADDED TO THE END OF THIS ARC?
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,473
Florida
Just watched this. It was beautifully animated.

For the rest?

WHAT THE FUCK IS QUESS

THE STORY IS ALMOST GREAT, I'M FINE WITH CHAR SWITCHING THOUGH I WISH WE GOT TO SEE HIS TURNING POINT AND FULL SWITCH BACK, BUT QUESS?

SHE JOINS THE EARTH BOMB SQUAD TO SAY FUCK YOU TO DADDY, AND STEALS A GUNDAM TO KILL THE WOMAN WHO MIGHT GET THE DICK SHE WANTS BEFORE HER, THAT SHE HAS CONNECTION TO BECAUSE OF HER "NEWTYPE"
Like fuck this movie.

Fuck it.

WHY IS QUESS HERE, WHY DO THESE KIDS GET SO MUCH OF THE SCREENTIME AND ADDED TO THE END OF THIS ARC?
Definitely sums up the Char's Counterattack experience.
 

Saturday

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
225
I mean it ain't gundam unless there's angsty teenagers doing questionable things

*side eyes at Hathaway*
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,560
Like fuck this movie.

Fuck it.

WHY IS QUESS HERE, WHY DO THESE KIDS GET SO MUCH OF THE SCREENTIME AND ADDED TO THE END OF THIS ARC?
Quess's last name is fucking "Pariah" let that sink in, she's poison. This also leads into the new Hathaway's Flash movie being made. Quess is shit. I don't even think the Quess stuff would've happened if Char didn't go out of his way to manipulate him and Ginnei even got dragged into it if I remember right.
 

less

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,647
I enjoyed the hell out of this movie when I saw it a few years back. Of course the OST was a fairly big part of that!
 

CoolestSpot

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,387
Quess's last name is fucking "Pariah" let that sink in, she's poison. This also leads into the new Hathaway's Flash movie being made. Quess is shit. I don't even think the Quess stuff would've happened if Char didn't go out of his way to manipulate him and Ginnei even got dragged into it if I remember right.
also half this movie is dedicated to who Quess wants to bang, other people trying to bang her, and people being upset they think that those people might want to bang her

What a way to end the Amuro/Char arc
 

zerocypher

Member
Oct 27, 2017
131
Like everyone says: great mecha designs, good fights, conclusion to a iconic rivalry, and fuck Quess

Do fans love Hathaway's Flash so much they forget how immature Hathaway is in CCA?
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,560
also half this movie is dedicated to who Quess wants to bang, other people trying to bang her, and people being upset they think that those people might want to bang her

What a way to end the Amuro/Char arc
Amuro and Char arguing about how they wanted Lalah to be their mother is an ultimate fuck you to their character development.
Like everyone says: great mecha designs, good fights, conclusion to a iconic rivalry, and fuck Quess

Do fans love Hathaway's Flash so much they forget how immature Hathaway is in CCA?
People like Hathaway's Flash because they know how it ends.
 

CoolestSpot

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
15,387
I'd honestly hope they remake Char's Counterattack and just remove Quess and adjust the story (like giving Char another asteroid cause...??)
 
Oct 8, 2019
198
Quess is probably one of the worst characters in the history of anime.

As for the movie itself its gave the perfect wrap up to the Earth Federation vs Zeon conflict so naturally they just kept making more making the film ultimately kind of useless.

Cool mechas and its the only movie I know of in which a train full of Neo Nazis sing a song about how they want to make the Earth uninhabitable using an accordion.

 

RedSwirl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,799
If you're into 80's action anime, Char's Counterattack is top-tier for that era visually. I watched it last year and it still looks great.

I guess the plot is take-it-or-leave it. A lot of people don't seem to like what they did with the characters but I was generally fine with it.

ZZ is one of those things where I still don't know if I legitimately like, or if Stockholm syndrome just kicked in at the halfway mark.
I actually skipped ZZ. I heard it wasn't as good as Zeta, or was just too much of a tonal whiplash after Zeta. Do I really need to go back and catch it?
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,560
If you're into 80's action anime, Char's Counterattack is top-tier for that era visually. I watched it last year and it still looks great.
So is Macross Do You Remember Love, but dear god do I like it a lot less than the TV series. Also ZZ isn't really that bad, it's just has a poor beginning. Like the first 15 or so eps just feel like not a Gundam series, but it gets better though.
 

andymcc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,950
Columbus, OH
ZZ rules. I used to always talk shit about it but I appreciate individual episodes of it over anything in Z— even if Z is overall better.
 

Gundam

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,630
If you're into 80's action anime, Char's Counterattack is top-tier for that era visually. I watched it last year and it still looks great.

I guess the plot is take-it-or-leave it. A lot of people don't seem to like what they did with the characters but I was generally fine with it.



I actually skipped ZZ. I heard it wasn't as good as Zeta, or was just too much of a tonal whiplash after Zeta. Do I really need to go back and catch it?
I don’t think it’s as good as Zeta for a lot of reasons, but it does some cool stuff. The first 10 episodes are the biggest hurdle in the show, but the worst episodes are two different sets of two-parter stories, one in each half of the show.

It has its fans though. I say give it a shot, but I don’t know how much you really miss. I guess it informs some of Unicorn a little more and it’s Universal Century stuff that feels connected to everything else vs things later down the the line like Victory or F91 where they may as well be AU stuff.
 
Oct 27, 2017
15,076
I do love the Gundam Evolve episode where there was an alternate take on Quess' end in CCA. Plus it has my favorite track from the whole series
 

SkyOdin

Member
Apr 21, 2018
1,234
If you're into 80's action anime, Char's Counterattack is top-tier for that era visually. I watched it last year and it still looks great.

I guess the plot is take-it-or-leave it. A lot of people don't seem to like what they did with the characters but I was generally fine with it.



I actually skipped ZZ. I heard it wasn't as good as Zeta, or was just too much of a tonal whiplash after Zeta. Do I really need to go back and catch it?
You should watch ZZ. I enjoyed it a lot. In particular, Judau is probably the best protagonist from the big UC shows. I also don't think it is possible to understand Bright Noa as a character if you don't see his character arc in ZZ. It is his biggest role other than the original Gundam, and is a complete rejection of his younger "Bright slap" incarnation.
 
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