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Isn't unfair for others americans that US people talk about themselves as "the Americans" ?

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Golden_Pigeon

Golden_Pigeon

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Oct 25, 2017
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School-Begins1.jpg


Please take the issue seriously since i think it have serious ramifications, it's not just "a word", i'm not trying to stir up shit about nothing, you can search the issue in spanish there is a lot of people talking about it in South/Central America.

As i already said, my issue is not that you call yourself an American, is that you're not calling me an american and you're referring your country as being "America" and not mine, while i'm American living in America.

First there is the Monroe doctrine, which could be interpreted as a superiority statement and paternalistic attitude to the rests of Amerca and some south americans were really early on wary of this:

At the same time, some people questioned the intentions behind the Monroe Doctrine. Diego Portales, a Chilean businessman and minister, wrote to a friend: "But we have to be very careful: for the Americans of the north [from the United States], the only Americans are themselves".[16]
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Source

There is also the "Big brother" attitude:

The "Big Brother" policy was an extension of the Monroe Doctrine formulated by James G. Blaine in the 1880s that aimed to rally Latin American nations behind US leadership and open their markets to US traders. Blaine served as Secretary of State in 1881 under President James A. Garfield and again from 1889 to 1892 under President Benjamin Harrison. As a part of the policy, Blaine arranged and led the First International Conference of American Statesin 1889.[29]
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This is not also a 19th century issue, the Monroe doctrine was used in the 20th century to justify military occupation and supporting fascist dictatorship during Operation Condor.

For many south and central americans, the fact that people from the US refer themselves as "the americans" is often perceived as arrogance and imperialistic attitude toward them. I'm going to illustrate with some articles, here and here.

I know this issue may sound ridiculous to a lot of you and obtuse, but i think it's not totally innocent that the country who came with the Monroe doctrine call itself "America" and don't have any other word in english for it's own citizen than "americans".


Edit: More article in spanish about the issue, pointing out arrogance and imperialistic attitude in the use of the term "americans" from people of the USA:

An article from the BBC stating we should stop calling Americans "americanos" in spanish.
Another article.
 
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Abstrusity

Abstrusity

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Oct 27, 2017
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Americans was based on the United States of America, not the region. Canadians don't call themselves Americans, they call themselves Canadians. So Americans was shorthand for the country name, which is why everyone else calls us Americans, or "fucking Americans" because we're good in bed, or "phat Americans" because we're so cool or "stupid Americans" 'cause we're dope.
 
Pagusas

Pagusas

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Oct 25, 2017
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Frisco, Tx
Golden_Pigeon said:
I know this issue may sound ridiculous to a lot of you and obtuse, but i think it's not totally innocent that the country who came with the Monroe doctrine call itself "America" and don't have any other word in english for it's own citizen than "americans".
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Isn't "US Citizen" also an official term? Looking it up it seems to suggest so, so how can you say we don't have any other word in English for citizens?

I know when I'm passing through passport checks in international airports I'm asked if I'm a US Citizen, not if I'm an American.
 
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Golden_Pigeon

Golden_Pigeon

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Oct 25, 2017
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lunarworks said:
Well, what else are the going to call themselves? "United States of Americans"?
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I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
 
Strangelove_77

Strangelove_77

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What would the replacement be? United States of Americans or United Statians?
 

darkazcura

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Oct 25, 2017
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Our name is The United States, I have no idea what some expect us to call ourselves otherwise. United States isn't really a name; more of a description.
 
1000% H

1000% H

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Oct 25, 2017
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Golden_Pigeon said:
I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
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It's not called the United States of North America.
 
HStallion

HStallion

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I think it's just a matter of practicality at this point even if there are some less than savory connotations to the term Americans.
 
Strangelove_77

Strangelove_77

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Golden_Pigeon said:
I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
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Are you serious? Like out in public? Where normal people can hear you?
How does go? Do they ever find it confusing?
 
ShortNasty

ShortNasty

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Dec 15, 2017
1,008
I don't think anyone would argue that your examples are wrong or incorrect. Anyone even remotely familiar with the Monroe Doctrine or manifest destiny should rightly recognize them as damaging trash. I personally use "American" because its easier when people ask me, but if someone questions/corrects me on it I don't get bothered in the slightest. Its become a useful shorthand, although I could get behind "Statizen". Also, I have noticed that I more cognizant of the strangeness when I'm speaking to someone else from the hemisphere.
 
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Golden_Pigeon

Golden_Pigeon

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Bump since it was reponed at the end. RIP for two other threads.


Strangelove77 said:
Are you serious? Like out in public? Where normal people can hear you?
How does go? Do they ever find it confusing?
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Normal people ? Yes. Actually where i live everybody speak spanish so i just say "estadounidense" and not "americanos". In French, i say "étasunien". So it's not like it's impossible to make a word for it in english.
 
Brakke

Brakke

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Oct 27, 2017
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You should call everyone from USA "Yankee" because it'll solve your problem of a term without "America" and it'll piss off Southerners to boot.
 
Aiii

Aiii

何これ
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Oct 24, 2017
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I am from The Netherlands. Or Holland depending on who you ask. I am however not a Netherlander, nor a Hollander. I am a Dutchman, even if I wouldn't identify as a man, or simply Dutch.

Dutch, of course, is a bastardization of Deutsch, from Deutschland, better known as Germany.

Nobody needs to make a thread as to why is Dutch call ourselves Dutch, despite not being entitled to Germany as a country. I have yet to meet a German person that would tell me it is unfair we call ourselves Dutch.

Language is a funny thing, people have explained to you that the United States of America has citizens called Americans, it is neither unfair nor dumb that they are called that. It is just a name.
 
KillLaCam

KillLaCam

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There's 2 continents with America in the name. I feel like it'd be worse to try to generalize 2 whole continents with one word instead of letting 1 country use to word. Plus they're the only one with America in the name lol


But yeah everyone knows the Monroe Doctrine is mostly a negative. It's not secret or anything, they even teach about that in the south.

Even the few people that think the Monroe Doctrine is a good thing, aren't thinking about South America when they they're calling themselves Americans. Their thinking of the name United States of America lol. It's been called America for like 200 years, I'm sure there could have been arrogance about the name back then. But no, it's just a name now
 
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Deleted member 43

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Golden_Pigeon said:
I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
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It was also the "first" independent country on the continent (after colonization), so it makes sense it was named as such.
 
Dyle

Dyle

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Oct 25, 2017
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Language develops organically and often results in similar unintentional exclusions or assumptions. At this point it's too late to turn back the vocabulary, since "American" or its equivalent, is recognized first and foremost as referring to the United States in every language and every country. Is it right or ideal? No probably not, but good luck forcing a term into existence to replace it.

Personally I prefer to say "I'm from the States" over simply "American" but that's more an issue of my own sense of national identity and is linguistically not ideal.
 

Deleted member 3208

Oct 25, 2017
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Here in a Latin American country we have people who call gringos as "Americanos". I always try to correct them saying they should be called Estadounidense in Spanish. The same when they call them Norteamericanos, it is wrong too since they are forgetting Canada and Mexico. Sadly, the same can't be said in English.

KillLaCam said:
There's 2 continents with America in the name. I feel like it'd be worse to try to generalize 2 whole continents with one word instead of letting 1 country use to word. Plus they're the only one with America in the name lol
[/QUOTE
In Latin American schools it is taught that there is only one continent divided in four regions: North, Central, South and the Caribbean Islands.
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Cocolina

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I like to live in The United States of North America

Everything free in The United States of North America
 
darkhunger

darkhunger

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USA
Golden_Pigeon said:
I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
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The name came before the imperialism though.

And technically Columbia/Colombia refers to the entire New World too and there's a country that named itself that so we aren't the only ones to do that...

Linkark07 said:
Here in a Latin American country we have people who call gringos as "Americanos". I always try to correct them saying they should be called Estadounidense in Spanish. The same when they call them Norteamericanos, it is wrong too since they are forgetting Canada and Mexico. Sadly, the same can't be said in English.
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In English, it's pretty clear - America is the country, Americas are the continents, and North/South America denote the individual continents. Unfortunately we're called Americans because we gave ourselves the same name as the continents, but considering we were the first independent country on the continents, our founding fathers probably didn't really think about the fact that there would be other countries here.
 
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Steel

Steel

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Satuprinssi said:
You don't have names for people coming from certain states? Europeans are also German, French, Italian, etc.
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A state in the U.S. isn't the same as the country. It's like referring to Germans only by province instead of country. There's certainly a conceit in the name of the U.S. originally, but that's how it is.
 
kmfdmpig

kmfdmpig

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I had a long post written up, but it was lost in the void when this was locked and then reopened.
The vast majority of people in the world understand that American = people from the US. They also understand that North America = Canada, the US, Mexico, and Central America and that The Americas = North and South America.

Whether it's fair that "Americans" is monopolized by a single country within the Americas is a valid argument, but it's the reality and at this point it's so ingrained that even if there were a lot of people who really cared to change it (I suspect that there aren't) it's not something that will change for a long time.
 
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Golden_Pigeon

Golden_Pigeon

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Matt said:
It was also the "first" independent country on the continent (after colonization), so it makes sense it was named as such.
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I can see that but i don't think it's necesarilly an explanation. I don't think other country just drop the name because the US used it before, maybe like most independance movement, they thought they would lead a continental rise against colonial powe in the whole americas ?
 
Madness

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For many south and central americans, the fact that people from the US refer themselves as "the americans" is often perceived as arrogance and imperialistic attitude toward them.
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I mean the examples are a slate article and what seems to be a wordpress site. I don't buy for 'many' that it is arrogance or that they hate Americans have co-opted the term American. The US has been around as country for over 240+ years now. Terms like Latin America were only adopted centuries later to denote how they were related to the 'Americas' but different through those who spoke the closer to latin languages like french and spanish.

The term 'native americans' was givrn to show who was here prior and is native or indigenous to the continent. I think the time has long gone for anyone else to consider saying they are American. Case in point Brazilians, Cubans, Mexican, Canadian, there isn't widespread sentiment to go hey wait we could technically be called Americans too.
 
RM8

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It sucks but America doesn't have a name. Canada or Mexico are distinctive names, while the US had to adopt the name of the entire continent. As I said before, it'd be similar to China being named "United Regions of Asia" instead of China - it'd be dumb. But such is life, people will not stop calling it America anytime soon.

 
Chojin

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Oct 26, 2017
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Its unfair South Africans call themselves Africans when theres a whole continent.

Also theres two Congos. Congolese people should stop being so selfish.

Central African Republic(ans?) Shouldn't monopolize Africa.

Don't get me started on Guineans!
 
Westbahnhof

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Is it so hard to add two letters and refer to yourself as "US American" when talking in an international context? I often found it pretty confusing, because Canadians, for example, are obviously Americans as well.
In German, when referring to people from the US, the term "U.S.-Amerikaner" is not uncommon. Calling yourself simply "American" reeks of exceptionalism, idk.
 

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Golden_Pigeon said:
I can see that but i don't think it's necesarilly an explanation. I don't think other country just drop the name because the US used it before, maybe like most independance movement, they thought they would lead a continental rise against colonial powe in the whole americas ?
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It's a perfect explanation. Most nations of Europe were simply named after their location, and the US followed that naming pattern.

There is no conspiracy here.
 
The Adder

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Other North and South American countries don't have 'America' in the name of their nations.
 
blinky

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The name of the country is "United States of America." That's where the "America" in "American" comes from. It's not an attempt to claim the whole hemisphere. It literally just stems naturally from the name of the country.
 
Wafflinson

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Golden_Pigeon said:
I use "Statians" or "Usans", the issue is also USA being called "America". Like people saying to you "here in America" while i'm also in the Americas !
I mean, is it by pure luck that the most imperialistic country in the region called himself after the whole continent ? Everyother country is called after the founder or by an indigenous name.
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I refuse to believe that anyone uses those in real life. Sounds so dumb.
 

Deleted member 29676

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Metafilter often uses "USians" but really no other people refer to themselves as their continent name as their primary designation.

If I met someone from Vladivostok who described themsef as Asian before Russian i'd be really surprised.
 
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