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Israel offensive against Iranian Targets in Syria; F-16 shot down by Syria (MOD EDIT: Read OP)
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a drone can't cross syrian border and enter israel since israel doesn't have a border with syria
and lebonan didn't say it wasn't true, they said israel is using their airspace illegally to lunch attacks on syria. funny how you can use other countries airspace illegally to attack someone who you CLAIM entered your airspace
So much propaganda.
Tell me, if Israel truly wanted peace, why didn't they pursue it before Hamas was created? Before the PLO was created? Or before Hamas was elected in Gaza? There's also no Hamas in the West Bank so where's the peace there? Why didn't Israel pursue a just peace before Palestinian suicide bombings or rocket attacks were even a thing?
The root of the conflict is foreigners invading a country and kicking out the locals, all the while justifying their expulsion of the locals (i.e. ethnic cleansing) under the auspices of more foreign powers that got to decide what would happen in the Middle East, carving out lands that rightfully belonged to the locals and handing them over to largely European migrants to the area. Now, since it is impractical and inhumane to expel people living within Israel for decades (even though the founding Israelis felt no remorse in expelling the residents of Palestine and forcing them into refugee camps or simply killing them), the only solution was a two-state solution, that would have involved a compromise on Jerusalem. That ship has certainly sailed. It's also funny how Israelis like to paint Palestinians as religious zealots yet they refused to budge on the issue of Jerusalem, which the Palestinians were willing to split or even have under international governance.
Because this time a plane got shot down so they have to admit they were bombing in Syria, which is something they haven't done before according to the Al Jazeera journalist.
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You can keep arguing this if you want but legally or illegally Israel controls the Golan heights and its airspace. Even Russia admitted it mistakenly flew into "Israeli airspace" when their drone was shot down there.
no matter what you say, that's not israel. it's syrian land.
and this story was likely nothing. it was just an excuse for them to attack military bases in syria. the iranian government considers the entirety of israel to be illegitimate, not just golan heights, and if their drone was shot down by them they would have protested by now.
agreed 100%. you don't get to be the cause of so much suffering and oppression for the entire region and then blame everyone else claiming you're the only one who wants peace
Lets hope there wont be a new Germany or Italy out if this
User banned (24 hours): Don't use anecdotes to paint millions of people as "harmful". Argue in good faith.
The fact the innocent Palestinians are suffering is unfortunate,it really,really is, but you forgot to mention why those cross checkpoints exists in the first place or should I remind how hundreds of Palestinians entered Israel and exploded on buses,malls and basically anyplace where they knew there will be casualties? regarding the settlements,this is a topic where even in Israel is very controversial and not everyone thinks that what happening now is the right thing to do. but don't give me the Palestinians are innocent and unharmful thing ,where I personally saw a Palestinian pulling a knife and try to butcher an Israeli citizen the just happens to sit next to him on the bus station. or two of you that that broke into a house and butchered the entire family,3 year old baby included. and don't you dare call me a liar like you people always do -I was at the scene shortly after and saw the bodies with my own eyes and I promise you,It wasn't my imagination. and this is my final comment on this thread.
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But it's not me saying it. Go ask pilots from assorted countries whose airspace it is.
you're simplifying and sugar coating the oppression that palestinians are under. they're reduced to second class citizens in their own land. you don't get to justify the oppression of millions of people because you saw someone pull a knife.
i don't really blame you, it's just that the propaganda is so effective that you probably actually believe all this to be true and believe the palestinians are savages (and not people who are rightfully fighting against their oppressors and people who have stolen their lands) and you believe the oppression to be justified. it's really sad that you believe this.
oh and "hundreds of Palestinians entered Israel" is some massive irony
a, not their land, israel doesn't have a border with syria
b, there probably wasn't a drone anyway
c, if there was, and if israel is so protective of their airspace, why are they illegally using lebanese airspace to attack syria when lebanon doesn't want them to? do they ALWAYS get to be the exception to every rule?
These checkpoints are located in the west bank. How exactly do they affect Israel? Oh that's right, it is because Israel is building settlements there. So you have people that live in the west bank that have to go through this because your goverment is building settlements on an illegal land. I never did say that Palestine doesn't have evil people, because it is the fact that you have people killing people but these happen because of the way your goverment is handling the issue. People become terrorists because your goverment keep building settlements, creating open air prisons. Don't tell me that the Gaza mess isn't a cause in people getting radicalised, don't tell me that Israel building settlements each time a war ended is to create peace. When you box people in then it is likely for someone like Hamas to guide them into commiting terror.
A shame really. I am sure there is many people criticizing the goverment but Israel really nailed how to control the masses and feed them propaganda.
All these proxy wars are just shit. I am sorry for all the people that have their lifes ruined. Just take a look at the results of the "arab spring" and you can guess the outcome of a possible fall of Assad... well, the country is already ruined, but things can always get worse, right?
You're 100% right.
It's truly unbelievable that there's folks on ERA who thinks US/Israel are "the good guys"
I would bet everything that people would love to go back to the way Syria was under Assad. At least it was somewhat safe and much more peaceful.
This all goes back to how the west installed Assad's family into power in Syria. They put such a horrible man into power just because he was friendly to them. And now he murders his civilians and it is a bad look so they wanted to remove him...
... By arming unknown groups who might or might not be ISIS.
What a big mess that people from many decades ago created.
I feel you bro. I get the same sort of urge to post whenever someone goes on a bullshit chat over Cyprus. It's all about the Turkish intervention, the occupation of land, etc. never about our people being herded into ghettos, massacred, having homes and properties seized or burned down. It's never about the Turkish Cypriots wondering if tonight was the night armed greek cypriot militias would smash into their homes or tents ready to fill the bathtub or the fresh grave with the bodies of the entire family. My dad still has issues talking about the absolute monstrosity of a time it was between the 50's and 70's there. Being shot at by grown men as an 8 year old and losing his best friend in that moment is one of the things that sticks with me.
Sorry for going off topic lad, but just wanted to let you know I have solidarity with you.
Can you explain this map to me then?
Even if we, as you say, accept the Golan Heights to be Syrian, you still get a border with Israel on the left. Israel would think of the Golan Heights as theirs, so they would draw the border with Syria on the right side. Either way, you have a border. Or are you thinking of the Golan Heights as no man's land?
I am not attacking you here, I really want to understand the point you are making, and looking at the maps, I just don't see it.
Thanks, I really appreciate it.
I wish people would look at these issues and learn from them. But I guess humanity it self is a egoistical being. Some might evolve above that but you will always have egoistic people that won't care as long as they have it good.
Humanity and issues don't really matter, the united states will never not support Israel because of its strategic value.
the western meddling created pretty much every single problem that middle east has or had.
creation of israel
the invasion of afghanistan and iraq led to the creation of isis
their support of rebels in the syrian civil war led to the destruction of the country and the civil war becoming this big and disastrous
their meddling in iran's government led to the coup d'etat and the overthrowing of mosadegh wich led to the iranian revolution
them supporting the saudi government led to them easily exporting their wahhabi values to most arab countries
and many more examples. nothing good has come out of western meddling in middle east
the golan heights aren't under the control of syria, and are occupied. my point in replying to the poster who said "out border with syria" was that what you consider to be your border is actually stolen land and not yours. obviously had the golan heights not been stolen and occupied there would be a border between the two countries.Can you explain this map to me then?
Even if we, as you say, accept the Golan Heights to be Syrian, you still get a border with Israel on the left. Israel would think of the Golan Heights as theirs, so they would draw the border with Syria on the right side. Either way, you have a border. Or are you thinking of the Golan Heights as no man's land?
I am not attacking you here, I really want to understand the point you are making, and looking at the maps, I just don't see it.
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Not sure what you mean with "your border" ;) I'm not Israeli or Syrian, so I don't really have a stake in this, just wanted to understand your point. In essence, you are saying there is no legitimate border between them. Which is a point I can appreciate, even if doesn't have much to do with the Realpolitik that actually drives most of the middle east.
It's absurd how it was first the British and French that decided that the Golan Heights should be Syrian (and the British got something else in return), and then after Six Day War and Yom Kippur War, Isreal took it, essentially as a buffer zone, and now to built illegal settlements in. So much killing for a few imaginary lines in the sand. Then again, that also summarizes most of human history, I guess.
this is concerncing.
As it just allow Russia to test there Anti Air systems on "American" vehicles, and appears to have been successful
As it just allow Russia to test there Anti Air systems on "American" vehicles, and appears to have been successful
replying to that poster. i meant his imagined border, not yours
the sad thing is it's not just a few people who think this way, it's the huge percentage of israel's population
i refuse to believe all these people are evil or inherently mean spirited, it's just that the zionist propaganda is so effective, and probably repeated to them since childhood, that they genuinely believe in this bs. their defense always comes off as cult like and the result of propaganda. the defense never seems genuine and from the heart, it's always repeating some bullet points like the PR team of a large corporation. anything anti israel will have comments calling people bigots and anti-semites, using the word "peace" and reciting selective and bogus history
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You sound like either a coward or don't know what you are talking about. Scared of being banned because you can't say what you really want? lol.
You tried to say that isreal did not start the 6 day war AND taking the Golan heights is fine because it was a war, which you blamed on the arabs btw,
Your right to harass, detain, bomb, poison, murder and run off innocent civilians?
You have no right.
This situation is terrifying because Israel will just use this situation to 'get even'. When will this stop?
funny how you don't hear "WMD" anymore, i wonder why they stopped using it
The first time I read the post and replied to it those words somehow slipped but reading it again...
The second U.S. foreign policy in Syria became to remain there forever and wipe out any Iranian influence (In other words to overthrow Assad) in the country this clash was inevitable.
Israel can only violate Syrian airspace enough times until the Syrians retaliate and they've been violating Syrian airspace since this bloody war started. How the Syrian government responds to the Israeli bombings that just happened in retaliation will likely decide if Israel will go all in on this war or not.
Israel can only violate Syrian airspace enough times until the Syrians retaliate and they've been violating Syrian airspace since this bloody war started. How the Syrian government responds to the Israeli bombings that just happened in retaliation will likely decide if Israel will go all in on this war or not.
It's scary because Everytime I read it.......I think of comments like "every illegal/legal from South the boarder are gang members or rapist" or all black people are dangerous and evil because "they rape white women, take drugs, and are thugs".
They were in a foreign/hostile territory conducting an act of war (against another state). These things happen unfortunately.
Seriously.
I don't even understand how this is controversial in any way. Israel flies to bomb sovereign country. Sovereign country or its allies shoot down plane. That's exactly what's supposed to happen. And I am rather pro-Israel generally.
let what slide? israel has been constantly invading the airspace and bombing in syria. this isn't something new
and "godspeed IDF" is the most disgusting combination of words i've heard in a while
No, but Russia knows it will destroy the Israeli airforce. And pretend they didn't do it.
If this is true, it's going to make this situation worse.
Russia stationed an (maybe more than one) S400 on the border to Israel?
Wow, they take their job as the big brother pretty serious.
No sympathy for Israel at all. Only speaks to their blood thirst for responding to a drone with a massive air raid....then acting like the victim that one of their planes got shot down. Netanyahu has one of the most warped world view's of any world leader today.
Everything what needs to be said in practically any thread about Israel.
Btw Israel is calling for the UN Safety Council...LMAO they're literally acting like a spoiled child.
And the regime killing thousands of people before any western intervention whatsoever ? If Obama had maintained his red line, Russia wouldn't have intervened and Syria would be a very different place today.
The reason of the Syrian war is simple: Assad didn't want to loose grip on his power, so he called up on the Hezbollah, Iran and Russia to save his throne against the majority of his own people.
As horrible as saying "Godspeed anti-aircraft artillery. Find your mark!"
Iirc. They've got a few that we know of installed. And it has pretty significant range. Not sure if it's directly on the border.
It actually covers *half* of Israeli airspace.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/israels-air-superiority-in-syria-clouded-by-russian-s-400/
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