January Democratic Debate: Des Moines, Iowa, 9PM ET CNN

Jun 20, 2019
934
They have a better reputation than Bernie's does.
Elizabeth Warren allowed Harvard to call her the 350-year-old school’s first Native American faculty member.
No, I'm laughing at your setting up "rules" here. Was that something you were going to apply to everyone or...?
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The Sanders campaign has denied these claims. Who do you believe? Why?
 
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Mercury Fred

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,303
Elizabeth Warren allowed Harvard to call her the 350-year-old school’s first Native American faculty member.

mod edit: we don't allow content from this person

The Sanders campaign has denied these claims. Who do you believe? Why?
Do you believe the Sanders campaign is capable of lying? Why or why not?
 
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ty_hot

Member
Dec 14, 2017
4,048
I cant believe you guys are falling for this. A dispute between Sanders and Warren will only lead to both of them losing votes...

No idea if he said that but if he did I doubt he meant "women are worse", probably something along the lines of "in the current political situation, a woman isn't the best choice". But obviously Sanders cant say that because that is easily twistable even though it can be true.
 
Jun 20, 2019
934
Sanders and his campaign have a pattern of dishonesty, half truths, etc. I also watched Warren's body language tonight when Sanders said he didn't say it. I feel confident in deducing that he lied. Of course it's possible I'm wrong, but it certainly tracks with his history.
So, is the campaign lying about Project Veritas? Does Sanders want to watch Milwaukee burn?
 
Jun 20, 2019
934
You want me to engage you around a video from a right wing propaganda outfit? Lol no
I want you to just be honest here. Do you EVER believe Bernie Sanders? If no, don’t you find that kind of odd?

I don’t even see how I’m putting you on the spot. It should be pretty easy to say “Veritas is full of shit and Sanders is right to deny this tripe”.
 

BoboBrazil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,595
Yes, Warren looks crazy, when her body language when Bernie denied it on stage told you all you need to know about who's telling the truth. How dare her for not shaking his hand after.
 
Jun 20, 2019
934
Huh? Really weird and hyperbolic framing. Between this and trying to use right wing propaganda videos to make your point... Not going to bite on this, sorry. Have a nice night!
It’s helpful to call right wing propaganda videos made-up bullshit. It’s really easy to do. I can do it a dozen times a day. Veritas is full of shit, they’re clearly ratfucking Sanders.

This wasn’t meant to be a big gotcha, it’s honestly bizarre you can’t just say it. It’s easy. Veritas is peddling bullshit about Sanders.
 

Fantastical

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,705
Yes, Warren looks crazy, when her body language when Bernie denied it on stage told you all you need to know about who's telling the truth.
WUHHHHH HE'S DENYING IT!?!?!?! BUT JUST YESTERDAY HE ALSO DENIED IT!?!

Believe Warren if you want but this is silly. She knew the question was coming. She knew exactly what he was going to say.
 

Mercury Fred

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,303
It’s helpful to call right wing propaganda videos made-up bullshit. It’s really easy to do. I can do it a dozen times a day. Veritas is full of shit, they’re clearly ratfucking Sanders.

This wasn’t meant to be a big gotcha, it’s honestly bizarre you can’t just say it. It’s easy. Veritas is peddling bullshit about Sanders.
You gave clicks to Project Veritas apparently in order to set up a literal strawman. Like I said, I'm not playing that game. G'night for real this time :)
 
Jun 20, 2019
934
You gave clicks to Project Veritas apparently in order to set up a literal strawman. Like I said, I'm not playing that game. G'night for real this time :)
It’s not a straw man.

Look. I think Joe Biden is a terrible candidate. I think his campaign lies frequently and about very important things, like his Iraq vote. But if a right-wing smear machine stated that Joe Biden wanted to watch Milwaukee burn it would be exceedingly easy for me to say it’s bullshit and Biden’s team was truthful in their denial.

oh, and to address the actual straw man: I got that link from Google. No clicks.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,982
It's both fascinating and depressing to see how people are driven to take the predictable angle on every single issue w/r/t Bernie. The same characters in every thread taking their place with so much confidence, loaded language and characterizing villains; everything gets filtered through our biases, consciously or not. People will assign gravity or triviality depending on how it affects their candidate or villain of choice. I'm not saying I'm immune from this, to be clear. I feel like I've gotten sucked in lately.

I wonder if the 2020 primary season will be worse than the 2016 one because these divisions and habits seem to be particularly informed by 2016. Everything is so tedious, rooted and unchanging, like ethnic or religious groups that have been at war for centuries.
 

Deleted member 15125

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
417
Because she honestly thought that was her heritage, she wasn't being a con artist.
I agree that she wasn't trying to con anyone but

"No, as I said, these are my family stories. I have lived in a family that has talked about Native Americans, talked about tribes since I had been a little girl," she said. "I still have a picture on my mantel and it is a picture my mother had before that - a picture of my grandfather. And my Aunt Bea has walked by that picture at least a 1,000 times remarked that he - her father, my Papaw -- had high cheek bones like all of the Indians do. Because that is how she saw it and your mother got those same great cheek bones and I didn't. She that thought was the bad deal she had gotten in life."

I don't see how you can just sweep this under the rug.
 

Ichthyosaurus

Banned
Dec 26, 2018
9,375
I agree that she wasn't trying to con anyone but

"No, as I said, these are my family stories. I have lived in a family that has talked about Native Americans, talked about tribes since I had been a little girl," she said. "I still have a picture on my mantel and it is a picture my mother had before that - a picture of my grandfather. And my Aunt Bea has walked by that picture at least a 1,000 times remarked that he - her father, my Papaw -- had high cheek bones like all of the Indians do. Because that is how she saw it and your mother got those same great cheek bones and I didn't. She that thought was the bad deal she had gotten in life."

I don't see how you can just sweep this under the rug.
I'm not. It was a huge mistake and something she needed atone for. There's a difference between that and being a con artist.
 

xenocide

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,035
I would say this topic has gone off the rails, but where we’re at currently there are no rails for miles.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,982
It’s helpful to call right wing propaganda videos made-up bullshit. It’s really easy to do. I can do it a dozen times a day. Veritas is full of shit, they’re clearly ratfucking Sanders.

This wasn’t meant to be a big gotcha, it’s honestly bizarre you can’t just say it. It’s easy. Veritas is peddling bullshit about Sanders.
What's the point, though?
 

saenima

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,776
I watched Sanders' body language and think he's a good boy who deserves many votes. You can't argue with that. I'm an expert.
 

Barzul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,147
Sander’s fan boys are drumming up the same tunes from 2016. Makes it harder to back him over even someone like Biden. Just way too rabid online. People will make decisions based on stuff like that, I don’t know if it’s enough to make a dent electorally but it might be.

I really felt that John Legend tweet.
 

woman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,916
Atlanta
I want you to just be honest here. Do you EVER believe Bernie Sanders? If no, don’t you find that kind of odd?

I don’t even see how I’m putting you on the spot. It should be pretty easy to say “Veritas is full of shit and Sanders is right to deny this tripe”.
Huh? Really weird and hyperbolic framing. Between this and trying to use right wing propaganda videos to make your point... Not going to bite on this, sorry. Have a nice night!
Extremely revealing interaction here. Good work, Wilf Netherton.
 

Zombegoast

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,394
CNN continues to be the worst by not providing the debate on YouTube.

I guess Pete did good according to them.
 

cnorwood

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,777
Sander’s fan boys are drumming up the same tunes from 2016. Makes it harder to back him over even someone like Biden. Just way too rabid online. People will make decisions based on stuff like that, I don’t know if it’s enough to make a dent electorally but it might be.

I really felt that John Legend tweet.
Well hopefully most people vote based on policies not personality
 

Violater

Member
Nov 19, 2017
424
Lol man these purity tests.
That they are all politicians and will lie is a given.
That their lies will never rise to the levels of the current administration should make us consider, is this where the collective energy is best spent?
 

Seattle6418

Member
Oct 25, 2017
340
Brasília Brazil
It's both fascinating and depressing to see how people are driven to take the predictable angle on every single issue w/r/t Bernie. The same characters in every thread taking their place with so much confidence, loaded language and characterizing villains; everything gets filtered through our biases, consciously or not. People will assign gravity or triviality depending on how it affects their candidate or villain of choice. I'm not saying I'm immune from this, to be clear. I feel like I've gotten sucked in lately.

I wonder if the 2020 primary season will be worse than the 2016 one because these divisions and habits seem to be particularly informed by 2016. Everything is so tedious, rooted and unchanging, like ethnic or religious groups that have been at war for centuries.
The good thing about it is that after a while, we all know who is who and where they are coming from.
 

Brock Reiher

Member
Oct 25, 2017
36,266
Honestly between The Fight™, Pete's general ickyness, and the shit Trump has been doing, Biden is looking like the unity candidate he's always claimed to be.

Also in the general, even the most die-hard conspiracy theorists probably would admit he's unlikely to secretly assassinate his own ambassador, which I don't think is something you could have said for Clinton unfortunately.
 

Violater

Member
Nov 19, 2017
424
ke AOC said, it's calling giving a damn
That's a BS catch all response, also AOC while being an energetic liberal lightening rod she is human, i.e. not always right or perfect. Tied of people holding her up as the standard bearer for democracy, let her do the job for a couple more years at least.
Back on topic, not every single thing perceived as a misdeed rises to the level where we need to cancel someone.
 

Tiger Priest

Member
Oct 24, 2017
334
New York, NY
Honestly between The Fight™, Pete's general ickyness, and the shit Trump has been doing, Biden is looking like the unity candidate he's always claimed to be.

Also in the general, even the most die-hard conspiracy theorists probably would admit he's unlikely to secretly assassinate his own ambassador, which I don't think is something you could have said for Clinton unfortunately.
Are you insinuating that Hillary WOULD have secretly assassinated her own ambassador?
 

Brock Reiher

Member
Oct 25, 2017
36,266
Are you insinuating that Hillary WOULD have secretly assassinated her own ambassador?
I'm saying that conspiracy theorists would definitely believe that she would, and a lot of independents probably wouldn't bat an eye. She already had Benghazi at that point as baggage.

Giant Douche vs Turd Sandwich and all that jazz

Edit: To be clear, I think an advantage that Joe has over Trump vs Hillary is that he's less vulnerable to the "they're both just as bad" kind of stuff because he doesn't have quite the same history of smear campaigns that Hillary did.
 
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Gashprex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
315
Warren and Pete solid, Bernie was poor IMO (gee thanks for awkward clarification on beating an incumbent) and Biden continued to Luigi his way to the nomination.
 
OP
OP
Wraith

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
3,683
Thanks mods for removing that dumb Project Veritas link.

Nobody should be giving anything from Project Veritas the time of day - they are far right scammers, has been proven over and over again. If you see the names Project Veritas/James O'Keefe, Dinesh D'Souza or Jacob Wohl, you can safely ignore anything they're trying to push. It's pretty much guaranteed to be fraud, based on their past behavior.
 
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