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hiska-kun

hiska-kun

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,410
Sounds as if Media Create is the discrepancy here? By all accounts Famitsu had it over a million (the same publication this thread is kinda based on)

Dengeki had the first shipment at 1.150.000 units (even higher than Media Create) and the game barely made the million at retail. Meaning that are more than hundred thousands copies on shelves according to this tracker.
 
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Lelouch0612

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,200
I mean, I can quote to you Game Data Library stats of the games that directly preceeded KH3. There was in no way a given that KH3 would have sales nearly matching the other two numbered (without decimals or fractions) titles of the series, especially when you consider the decline of the Playstation home console in Japan.
"Nearly matching" is a big exaggeration. It is 500k behind KH1 and KH2 but it was expected, the PS4 is less popular than the PS2 was.
 
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Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,500
I absolutely don't believe in comments like that, because usually it's just PR bullshit.

It's fine if you don't believe them but why should anyone waste their time entertaining your opinion based off of scrounged together half truths as opposed to a company plainly telling us their expectations were met?

You use incomplete data to make a point but the most plain words that matter you like to ignore. It's baffling.

And for the record just because Ubisoft stated the Division 2 was the biggest game of the year, they also said the game underformed on consoles and met their expectations on PC. Why would you ignore this? Perhaps because it goes against your narrative? Naaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww couldn't be it.
 
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MysticGon

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 31, 2017
7,285
Surprised people are still relitigating FFXV. Gamedatalibrary has it a little above 1 million though



Isn't that predominantly digital though? May not actually chart that high unfortunately

Good point. It's about time Famitsu included digital in these lists so the market doesn't seen so doom and gloom. MHW vinalla did almost a million digital for crying out loud.
 

Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,500
I mean, I can quote to you Game Data Library stats of the games that directly preceeded KH3. There was in no way a given that KH3 would have sales nearly matching the other two numbered (without decimals or fractions) titles of the series, especially when you consider the decline of the Playstation home console in Japan.

There were never any indications that KH3 was going to see a severe decline from the other mainline entries. Obviously we could never know the final turnout until the game released but nothing from retailers or info we were given implied the game would have a dramatically softer launch than the other games.

Which is good. But I mean, its not a surprise, it was never going to flop.

Good point. It's about time Famitsu included digital in these lists so the market doesn't seen so doom and gloom. MHW vinalla did almost a million digital for crying out loud.

When they get actual digital data they will include it. They aren't going to mix estimates with hard tracked data.
 

HaremKing

Banned
Dec 20, 2018
2,416
The handheld non-numbered KH games that still managed to sell 300,000+ copies? KH is a known quantity and the fact that you are arguing that it had a chance to bomb is mind-boggling.
Yokai Watch is a known quantity. Why do you think being a known quantities means anything at all when you're talking about a game releasing almost 15 years after the last 'main' game?
 

Hero

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
You refer to KH3D, right?
It's far lower than previous non-numbered KH games.

Yes, I am aware. BbS was the big one, released on the PSP at the height of the system's popularity. Even if DDD is a drop (zing!), the absolute floor of a single player JRPG series being 300,000 units is still incredible.

Yokai Watch is a known quantity. Why do you think being a known quantities means anything at all when you're talking about a game releasing almost 15 years after the last 'main' game?

Who ever said YW was a known quantity? Level 5 is known for making IPs that sell well in the short term but fizzle out after a few years. Is this ignorance or disingenuousness? I can't tell.
 

Nanashrew

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,328
I'm suprised Tales of Vesperia sold more on PS4 than Switch
That's just how it is. Tales tends to sell the most on Playstation in Japan, while it tends to sell more to a varying degree on Nintendo platforms in the west (when it does actually get Tales games that is). The sales of Tales games on Playstation are no slouch though in the west, if anything the fanbase is strong on both platforms. It's why I believe the series would be best as a multiplatform series from now on to reach everyone as possible.
 

HaremKing

Banned
Dec 20, 2018
2,416
Yes, I am aware. BbS was the big one, released on the PSP at the height of the system's popularity. Even if DDD is a drop (zing!), the absolute floor of a single player JRPG series being 300,000 units is still incredible.



Who ever said YW was a known quantity? Level 5 is known for making IPs that sell well in the short term but fizzle out after a few years. Is this ignorance or disingenuousness? I can't tell.
Let's call it ignorance. Go ahead and name me other Level 5 IPs that sold multi-millions in Japan only to sell much much less just a handful of years later.

My knowledge of Level-5 is admittedly very limited. Inazuma Eleven 2 and 3 both seemed to sell around the same amount but I can't tell what the next 'main' game in that series is as they don't have numbers after that.
 

Nanashrew

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,328
Let's call it ignorance. Go ahead and name me other Level 5 IPs that sold multi-millions in Japan only to sell much much less just a handful of years later.

My knowledge of Level-5 is admittedly very limited. Inazuma Eleven 2 and 3 both seemed to sell around the same amount but I can't tell what the next 'main' game in that series is as they don't have numbers after that.
Level-5 is a studio known for throwing things against the wall and seeing what sticks, and when it does, they milk it dry and start over. Inazuma Eleven, Professor Layton, and Yokai Watch seeing such huge rises in success then rapidly dying in a couple years time is actually the norm for the company.

I'm not even trying to be mean or anything to Level-5 either, that's legitimately how they operate.
 

Hero

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,792
Let's call it ignorance. Go ahead and name me other Level 5 IPs that sold multi-millions in Japan only to sell much much less just a handful of years later.

My knowledge of Level-5 is admittedly very limited. Inazuma Eleven 2 and 3 both seemed to sell around the same amount but I can't tell what the next 'main' game in that series is as they don't have numbers after that.

There aren't many games that sell millions of copies in Japan to begin with to meet your criteria. That has nothing to do with the fact that Level 5 milks the shit out of their properties that go on to have huge declines. Layton, Inazuma Eleven, Ni no Kuni, and now Yokai Watch.
 

Mpl90

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,215
An useful tip for next times Famitsu data via GameDataLibrary are mentioned: general queries on GameDataLibrary return games with LTDs combining retail numbers and digital estimates; however, the console-specific pages (where the search function is available) list games with each row displaying not only the aforementioned retail+digital number, but also retail LTDs and digital LTDs. Again, this might come in handy in future discussions.

Example: https://sites.google.com/site/gamedatalibrary/games-by-platform/playstation-4
 

HaremKing

Banned
Dec 20, 2018
2,416
Level-5 is a studio known for throwing things against the wall and seeing what sticks, and when it does, they milk it dry and start over. Inazuma Eleven, Professor Layton, and Yokai Watch seeing such huge rises in success then rapidly dying in a couple years time is actually the norm for the company.

I'm not even trying to be mean or anything to Level-5 either, that's legitimately how they operate.
Gotcha, I know them more for their contract work personally as their handheld-specific titles never interested me. They did a hell of a job on DQ VIII and IX though.
 

Piston

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,165
The fact that Days Gone is number 15 in Japan is pretty amazing
Most western Sony 1st Party games this gen have sold 100k+. It did better than God of War, but worse than Horizon or Spiderman for example.

Many other western AAA games are also fairly popular in Japan like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Red Dead, Battlefield, etc.
 

IronTed

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jun 6, 2019
1,435
Good point. It's about time Famitsu included digital in these lists so the market doesn't seen so doom and gloom. MHW vinalla did almost a million digital for crying out loud.

Wholeheartedly agree, always want more data after all. Titles like MHW just look so incomplete on the charts.
 

Piston

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,165
Wholeheartedly agree, always want more data after all. Titles like MHW just look so incomplete on the charts.
We have stopped taking into account Famitsu's digital estimates in the sales threads because their methodology is extremely questionable and had large, obvious gaps in its data.
 

Alandring

Banned
Feb 2, 2018
1,841
Switzerland
It's fine if you don't believe them but why should anyone waste their time entertaining your opinion based off of scrounged together half truths as opposed to a company plainly telling us their expectations were met?

You use incomplete data to make a point but the most plain words that matter you like to ignore. It's baffling.
Rankings are made by independent institutes. We can trust them. We don't have numbers, but can use everything we have, make comparisons, etc. This is what people do in the PAL Charts thread, for example.

We can't use because they aren't neutral. They always find a way to show how everything is awesome. If you want another example, read this report from Kotaku about esport.

If publishers said "we expect this game to sell this numbers of copies" and then "it did better than expected", we could use that. But we don't know what they expect, so we can't know if doing better means that the game sells well or not.

And for the record just because Ubisoft stated the Division 2 was the biggest game of the year, they also said the game underformed on consoles and met their expectations on PC. Why would you ignore this? Perhaps because it goes against your narrative? Naaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww couldn't be it.
I used the PR about latest quarter because I saw it on Twitter and it made my angry, because it was a complete bullshit. About your report, we know that The Division 2 did much less than The Division 1. At best, it did half of what The Division 1 did, maybe even more. But they only said that "The Division 2 ended up short of our ambitious expectations on console."

So it means that they expected a huge decline in sales in comparison of The Division 1. It's a normal expectation, because it was predictable that it happens: like Watch Dogs, The Division was a huge commercial success, but the majority of players were disappointed. It didn't affect sales of the first game, but it had an impact on sales of the sequel, even if it was a better game than the first one. So we could say that The Division 2 did as expected, but it doesn't mean it did "well". Even if it was "above expectations", it would have meant that it did less than the first game, which cannot be described as "well".
 

The Struggler

Alt Account
Banned
Jul 3, 2019
739
Most western Sony 1st Party games this gen have sold 100k+. It did better than God of War, but worse than Horizon or Spiderman for example.

Many other western AAA games are also fairly popular in Japan like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Red Dead, Battlefield, etc.
Did not know this but overall more good news for Bend, this game would have made or broke them if it was a flop
 

IronTed

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jun 6, 2019
1,435
We have stopped taking into account Famitsu's digital estimates in the sales threads because their methodology is extremely questionable and had large, obvious gaps in its data.

? I know, and I didn't mean to suggest we should bring those back. I assumed MysticGon was talking about Famitsu getting access to actual, real digital numbers, though perhaps I misinterpreted.
 

Piston

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,165
? I know, and I didn't mean to suggest we should bring those back. I assumed MysticGon was talking about Famitsu getting access to actual, real digital numbers, though perhaps I misinterpreted.
Well yeah, we definitely need actual digital numbers at some point if we want an accurate look at the market anywhere. Who knows if that will ever happen or not.