• Sidebar and Width settings will now no longer reset after 4 hours of inactivity! We have implemented a new system that will remember these preferences on each browser, for both members and guests. This allows you to choose different settings on different devices if you so desire.

Jillian Micheals " Avoid the Keto Diet at all costs" - Offers little evidence and analysis

Oct 27, 2017
669
Why wouldn't you call that menu keto? I'm guessing it's between 20 - 50 net carbs.
Because keto isn't just about carb restriction. Keto entails ketosis, whereby your body preferentially burns fat over carbs.

That menu includes low fat proteins and green vegetables throughout, with a likely low fat greek yogurt as the biggest fat intake. Macro ratios all depend on how the person made their food, but that's probably a lot closer to a 1:1:1 or lean protein heavy if anything for total calories.

The Keto diet most people are doing, much like the Atkins diet before it, is really just a processed carb reduction where depriving themselves of the processed carb. calorie crutch is being replaced by something else. In both cases it's picking something to make the participant feel like they can "cheat" or indulge excessively in one area or another. It is almost always paired with people actually watching what they eat though so surprise surprise, they tend to work because most people eat like shit when they aren't actively monitoring their food intake.

Humans evolved from hunter gatherer societies that lived primarily on fruit, vegetables, nuts, and wild grains. Carbs have always been a core component of the human diet. It also used to be where huge amounts of vitamin demands were met. Fats and proteins from animals meet additional nutrient and vitamin needs, but no one side of the macro triangle is really superior to the other, in the proper form.

If you were to go Atkins and spent all your daily calories chowing down on cheap ass bacon and ripped out McDonalds burger patties you'd probably feel like shit and do substantial damage to your body.

If you do a Keto diet focused around eating tons of processed cheese and other dairy products you'd probably do the same.

Those are the corollaries to what the contemporary western world offers up for carbs. Tons of processed white flour and refined sugar based products.

If instead you get complex carbs from fruit and veg. you'd probably find that carbs aren't the enemy.

Better yet, if people would learn how to make their own breads again, ideally with whole grains and an active culture sponge, they'd probably find that even bread isn't the enemy. People ate carb heavy diets for literally thousands of years without issue when we as a species were 1. more physically active and 2. making most of it at home or getting it from a local baker.

Lastly - anyone claiming that Keto is the reason they lost 25+ pounds in a month are simply wrong. That's not how thermodynamics works. calories in v. calories out. Going Keto might have been part of a massive calorie reduction in your diet, but caloric intake is what controls the body's use of calorie reserves. You can convert an engine to burn an alternative fuell but moving the same size vehicle the same distance is still going to require the same total units of energy. Same goes for the human body. This is basic physics.

And most physicians have consistently agreed for a long time now that losing more than 10% of your body weight in a single week is a bad thing for your body and can lead to serious health issues.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,912
You’re an idiot if you think a diet high in saturated & animal fat is healthy and fruit is not. Keto is stupid and dangerous. You can be shredded and destroying your heart. If you want it, go get it big dog.

I’ll stick to a balanced diet, and just lower my carbohydrate consumption after lunch. I enjoy looking good, but I’m not going to shave 10 years off of my life to do so. Cholesterol is the #1 risk factor for atherosclerosis.
Hey look another hot take that completely misunderstands the entire point of keto but you damn well better make sure you let everyone else know what an idiot they are right?
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
Lastly - anyone claiming that Keto is the reason they lost 25+ pounds in a month are simply wrong. That's not how thermodynamics works. calories in v. calories out. Going Keto might have been part of a massive calorie reduction in your diet, but caloric intake is what controls the body's use of calorie reserves. You can convert an engine to burn an alternative fuell but moving the same size vehicle the same distance is still going to require the same total units of energy. Same goes for the human body. This is basic physics.
This is hot bullshit. Thermodynamics says absolutely nothing about what our bodies will do with the food they intake. Nothing at all.

Our bodies are not internal combustion engines or closed systems.

Yes you need to mobilize fat stores for energy to lose body fat, but that says nothing about what our bodies do with the food we eat.
 
Nov 3, 2017
324
Cool so either I just eat what I want (keeping it within the Keto guidelines) or I have to do a shit ton of work counting my macros. I will take eating till I am full please.

Though your point is valid on the getting to the weight loss and then leaving the Keto diet. You have to stay on the diet in order to continue seeing the benefits and unlike tracking calories or exercise (which can never match your caloric intake) its easy, and doesn't really require you to do any additional work.
You can't just eat what you want on keto and magically lose weight, but potentially it's more mindless because higher fat foods may satiate you longer causing you to eat less. Also I would imagine your protein intake increases simply because many of the "keto approved" foods tend to have a decent amount of protein.

I don't have the view that keto is bad, but it's not some magic pill. Basically the best diet is the one you can stick with.
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,110
I started Keto last March and have lost 89 lbs. It has been the most sustainable diet for me and now I feel like it's a lifestyle for me rather than a diet.
What are you eating that makes it so you don't get bored? All the people I see that use Keto or low carb complain about the fact that it gets boring.
 
Oct 25, 2017
767
Chicagoland
Because keto isn't just about carb restriction. Keto entails ketosis, whereby your body preferentially burns fat over carbs.

That menu includes low fat proteins and green vegetables throughout, with a likely low fat greek yogurt as the biggest fat intake. Macro ratios all depend on how the person made their food, but that's probably a lot closer to a 1:1:1 or lean protein heavy if anything for total calories.

The Keto diet most people are doing, much like the Atkins diet before it, is really just a processed carb reduction where depriving themselves of the processed carb. calorie crutch is being replaced by something else. In both cases it's picking something to make the participant feel like they can "cheat" or indulge excessively in one area or another. It is almost always paired with people actually watching what they eat though so surprise surprise, they tend to work because most people eat like shit when they aren't actively monitoring their food intake.

Humans evolved from hunter gatherer societies that lived primarily on fruit, vegetables, nuts, and wild grains. Carbs have always been a core component of the human diet. It also used to be where huge amounts of vitamin demands were met. Fats and proteins from animals meet additional nutrient and vitamin needs, but no one side of the macro triangle is really superior to the other, in the proper form.

If you were to go Atkins and spent all your daily calories chowing down on cheap ass bacon and ripped out McDonalds burger patties you'd probably feel like shit and do substantial damage to your body.

If you do a Keto diet focused around eating tons of processed cheese and other dairy products you'd probably do the same.

Those are the corollaries to what the contemporary western world offers up for carbs. Tons of processed white flour and refined sugar based products.

If instead you get complex carbs from fruit and veg. you'd probably find that carbs aren't the enemy.

Better yet, if people would learn how to make their own breads again, ideally with whole grains and an active culture sponge, they'd probably find that even bread isn't the enemy. People ate carb heavy diets for literally thousands of years without issue when we as a species were 1. more physically active and 2. making most of it at home or getting it from a local baker.

Lastly - anyone claiming that Keto is the reason they lost 25+ pounds in a month are simply wrong. That's not how thermodynamics works. calories in v. calories out. Going Keto might have been part of a massive calorie reduction in your diet, but caloric intake is what controls the body's use of calorie reserves. You can convert an engine to burn an alternative fuell but moving the same size vehicle the same distance is still going to require the same total units of energy. Same goes for the human body. This is basic physics.

And most physicians have consistently agreed for a long time now that losing more than 10% of your body weight in a single week is a bad thing for your body and can lead to serious health issues.
A good half of that initial 25 lbs is water being dropped. I'd think an additional 12 from lower calorie intake isn't out of the question. It's not gonna be 25lb per month though.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,968
I can confirm that my LDL is very low. Plan on getting a yearly blood panel to monitor things going forward.



No, being in ketosis in and of itself does not mean you are healthy, but it certainly doesn't mean the contrary either.

Most people are absolutely not depleting their glycogen stores before eating their next carbohydrate heavy meal.
Maybe adults in first world countries, but adults in less developed countries and most playing active children certainly are regularly depleting their glycogen stores. Sedentary American adults are the exception, not the rule.

And there are not really good studies on being in ketosis for a prolonged period of time. But it is possible to go from ketosis to non-diabetic ketoacidosis under certain conditions (although seemingly rare): overall caloric restriction, high physical exertion, dehydration, and/or lactation being the most likely of those conditions.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,791
Because keto isn't just about carb restriction. Keto entails ketosis, whereby your body preferentially burns fat over carbs.

That menu includes low fat proteins and green vegetables throughout, with a likely low fat greek yogurt as the biggest fat intake. Macro ratios all depend on how the person made their food, but that's probably a lot closer to a 1:1:1 or lean protein heavy if anything for total calories.
issues.
Eggs, a wad of butter to scramble into them, cheese, avocado, 1-2 chicken thighs worth of meat, 0 sugar salad dressing (ranch), nuts, salmon, full fat Greek yogurt, these are low fat food items to you?
 
Oct 27, 2017
669
This is hot bullshit. Thermodynamics says absolutely nothing about what our bodies will do with the food they intake. Nothing at all.

Our bodies are not internal combustion engines or closed systems.

Yes you need to mobilize fat stores for energy to lose body fat, but that says nothing about what our bodies do with the food we eat.
They aren't closed systems. Neither are combustion engines.

But dietary research dating back decades before Keto was even conceived (as a treatment for epilepsy) has pretty well proven that within the perspectives of the average person, as it pertains to body weight, one calorie is no better than the next. The macro-nutrients associated, etc. might make one feel better and therefore be more actively (and burning more calories) but any claim that "X diet inherently burns more calories" is inherently flawed as calories are a form of energy and energy is either consumed or stored when processed.

There has been no smoking gun revelation that eating more fats makes you have more calorie rich shits for example. There was a product developed not that long ago that achieved that mind you, it was called Olestra, and it was so fucking bad for the body that it didn't make it more than a year on the market, despite major processed food manufacturers basically buying its approval from the FDA.

"Mobilizing fat stores" is being in a calorie deficit. That's it. There is no magic trick to it unless by "mobilize" you mean "surgically remove via scalpel and lipo tube".
 
Oct 25, 2017
448
New Jersey
I've been just counting calories and weighing my food and I've lost like 50 pounds since August, 20 pounds of it being first the first month alone. I am eating whatever I want still and am consistently losing about 1.5 pounds per week without any difficulty and I still get to have soda and bread. I'm eating about 1300 calories a day
 
Oct 27, 2017
669
Eggs, a wad of butter to scramble into them, cheese, avocado, 1-2 chicken thighs worth of meat, 0 sugar salad dressing (ranch), nuts, salmon, full fat Greek yogurt, these are low fat food items to you?
This is full fat greek yogurt:

14 g. protein. 5g. fat. So you're already more than three times upside down on Protein:Fat for Keto.


Free range chicken thighs. 17 g. fat, 19g. protein. So close to neutral, but when Keto says 40% fat as the absolute floor a 50/50 fat/protein ratio sure as hell isn't going to get you there.


Eggs. 5 g. fat, 6 g. protein. Again, not the big fat slant of Keto.


Farmed atlantic salmon. almost a 1:3 fat to protein ratio.


Almonds. 14 g. fat to 6 g. protein. Something actually in the range of what Keto requires. You'd need to eat more almonds by weight than everything else here just to climb back to neutral in a day though.

Again - low carb, low calorie, and using full fat foods that comply with that is not Keto. That isn't going to drive hardly who doesn't have an absolutely massive protein demand into ketosis. It might, maybe, slant slightly in favor of fats over proteins if you just go wild on the butter, cheese and avocados and are super stingy on the greens and veg..

Which is why it would look like a healthy diet to anyone. It avoids processed carbs, commercially fattened meat products, and artificially calorie reduced dairy products (like low fat yogurts).

Keto will get people to lose weight but the last thing it should be confused with is a balanced diet.
 
Oct 29, 2017
3,707
This is hot bullshit. Thermodynamics says absolutely nothing about what our bodies will do with the food they intake. Nothing at all.

Our bodies are not internal combustion engines or closed systems.

Yes you need to mobilize fat stores for energy to lose body fat, but that says nothing about what our bodies do with the food we eat.

 
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
Something actually in the range of what Keto requires. You'd need to eat more almonds by weight than everything else here just to climb back to neutral in a day though.
I believe most recommendations are "fat as a percentage of total calories."
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
1,836
eh,

all diets are kind of bullshit. I mean they can work, but it's hard to keep up with the regimens
I've been just counting calories and weighing my food and I've lost like 50 pounds since August, 20 pounds of it being first the first month alone. I am eating whatever I want still and am consistently losing about 1.5 pounds per week without any difficulty and I still get to have soda and bread. I'm eating about 1300 calories a day
this is it really. there is no secret, all these stupid fad diets like keto or atkins or whatever are missing the point. Eat fewer calories. That's it.

Oh and exercise helps too!
 
Oct 27, 2017
669
A good half of that initial 25 lbs is water being dropped. I'd think an additional 12 from lower calorie intake isn't out of the question. It's not gonna be 25lb per month though.
Sure. But losing 12 pounds of water weight in a month is part of the problem. Rapid weight loss tied to shedding water weight while also metabolizing more body fat is running your kidneys in the red while refusing to top off the oil.

I believe most recommendations are "fat as a percentage of total calories."
Yes, exactly. To cover the fat:protein deficit that diet would require the almonds as a snack to actually outweight the protein heavy meals. That's my point.

Eating a lot of fat while also eating a lot of protein or carbs is not keto.

Eating zero carbs and letting yourself eat whole fat foods is not inherently keto.

Denying both carbs and proteins so that by far the dominant source of calories for your body comes from fats is keto.

Which again brings me back to my original point: people confuse not eating like shit but letting themselves still eat healthy fats as keto and attribute weight loss to "keto" when really they lost weight because they didn't eat like shit.

There are personal demos all over the internet of people eating a fucking snickers bar three times a day, staying below 2000 calories, and losing weight. Does anyone actually think that's healthy? Obviously not. But it will lead to weight loss because at the end of the day fat reserves are controlled by calories in v. calories out over long windows of time.

If Keto is what someone needs to maintain caloric balance that's better than being 20-30% overweight, but lets not run to call the latest carb reduction scheme a truly revolutionary lifestyle that definitely won't have health ramifications. Most diets have their pros and cons for long term health, with the one obvious exception being an overall well balanced diet complete with regular exercise.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
Sure. But losing 12 pounds of water weight in a month is part of the problem. Rapid weight loss tied to shedding water weight while also metabolizing more body fat is running your kidneys in the red while refusing to top off the oil.


Yes, exactly. To cover the fat:protein deficit that diet would require the almonds as a snack to actually outweight the protein heavy meals. That's my point.

Eating a lot of fat while also eating a lot of protein or carbs is not keto.

Eating zero carbs and letting yourself eat whole fat foods is not inherently keto.

Denying both carbs and proteins so that by far the dominant source of calories for your body comes from fats is keto.

Which again brings me back to my original point: people confuse not eating like shit but letting themselves still eat healthy fats as keto and attribute weight loss to "keto" when really they lost weight because they didn't eat like shit.
Ignoring that you conveniently decided not to factor in the butter, the avocado, dressing, or cheese, let's take a single serving from each of those foods you chose to post the nutrition facts for:

It adds up to

450 fat calories (56%)
52 carb calories (6%) <-- and this even included the dietary fiber, which shouldn't actually count
296 protein calories (37%)

Probably looking at 60% or higher fat calories when you factor in the high-fat items you decided to exclude.
 

MrH

Member
Nov 3, 2017
1,636
Just eat less and move more, I don't really believe in these fad diets. If you eat healthy and exercise you'll be fine.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,791
This is full fat greek yogurt:

14 g. protein. 5g. fat. So you're already more than three times upside down on Protein:Fat for Keto.


Free range chicken thighs. 17 g. fat, 19g. protein. So close to neutral, but when Keto says 40% fat as the absolute floor a 50/50 fat/protein ratio sure as hell isn't going to get you there.


Eggs. 5 g. fat, 6 g. protein. Again, not the big fat slant of Keto.


Farmed atlantic salmon. almost a 1:3 fat to protein ratio.


Almonds. 14 g. fat to 6 g. protein. Something actually in the range of what Keto requires. You'd need to eat more almonds by weight than everything else here just to climb back to neutral in a day though.

Again - low carb, low calorie, and using full fat foods that comply with that is not Keto. That isn't going to drive hardly who doesn't have an absolutely massive protein demand into ketosis. It might, maybe, slant slightly in favor of fats over proteins if you just go wild on the butter, cheese and avocados and are super stingy on the greens and veg..

Which is why it would look like a healthy diet to anyone. It avoids processed carbs, commercially fattened meat products, and artificially calorie reduced dairy products (like low fat yogurts).

Keto will get people to lose weight but the last thing it should be confused with is a balanced diet.
Really interesting that you ignored the 50:1 salad dressing, the 120:1 butter in the eggs, the 7:1 avocado, not to mention the oil used in cooking the fish and meat and veggies. And no, I am not stingy with any of it.

Edit: and looking in my fridge right now, I forgot, you can add some servings of 5:1 sour cream with my breakfast.

Anyway, the point of this list wasn't to specifically show exactly what I eat every day, but to get across the variety of food that I eat on the diet overall.
 
Last edited:
Oct 28, 2017
147
One of my friends was having success with keto but ended up with gout even as a young guy, so he had to change things up. I'm not an expert in the field but as far as he explained it, the two things were related in his case.
This is simply not true, gout is caused by urate crystals that deposits in a joint, typically the big toe. The foods that causes urate crystals to form are steak, organ meats and seafood, so unless your friend was consuming tons of these types of food, then it's not related to his "keto" diet.
Here's a link for causes and symptoms of gout : https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/gout/symptoms-causes/syc-20372897
 
Dec 17, 2018
73
Can anyone link to any studies showing yeah or nay for Keto and how they interpret what that means?

Considering doing something Keto like, but I want to know the potential pitfalls and how to avoid?
There is no study of Keto diet and long term health. You are better off going with IF, since this was how human eat pretty much the whole time until industrial revolution.

Or you can take one for the team and volunteer to be a study participant.
 
Nov 16, 2017
255
I think her explanation is pretty fair and I tend to agree with her that the Keto diet isn’t all that great for you.
It's not fair if she misrepresents it. A low carb diet hasn't been all meat, bacon, meat, cheese, and nothing else since the earliest days of Atkins.
 
Last edited:
Oct 28, 2017
147
I think her explanation is pretty fair and I tend to agree with her that the Keto diet isn’t all that great for you.
It's not fair if she misrepresents it. A low carb diet hasn't been all meat, bacon, meat, cheese, and nothing else since the earliest days of Atkins.
I want to second what Spasm mentions here. It is a misrepresentation of our evolution. Humans did not rely on grains and complex carbs as part of our daily diet till the agriculture revolution, and humans during the paleolithic days were heavily reliant on other sources, e.g., fats and proteins from animals and maybe simple carbs from gathering.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,621
It is a bit of a "fad diet". Lots of people at my work doing keto when healthy eating and regular exercise would be fine for them. One of these women passed out and seriously hurt herself on the fall.

I think some people just jump onto whatever the current fad is. Saw the same shit with atkins a few years back.

I understand particular diets might be particularly beneficial for certain people, but I'm totally satisfied (and have had good results) with just eating healthy as much as possible and exercising a few times a week. This is also far more sustainable long term as far as I'm concerned.
 
Oct 29, 2017
3,707
Can someone explain carbs/net carbs etc to me ? Quest pizza says 5 carbs per serving, three servings per pizza, should be a total of 15g. Back of box says 19g carbs, 15g is fiber and two from sugar.
 
Oct 25, 2017
709
This review does a pretty good job of summarizing various findings on low-carb and low-fat diets in patients with type 2 diabetes. Talking specifically of ketogenic diets, they have this to say:

Ketogenic diets have very low amounts of carbohydrates (20–50 g), which come mainly from non-starchy vegetables. Ketosis due to fat lipolysis readily occurs when carbohydrate intake is reduced to less than 50 g/day. VLCKD initially increases total energy expenditure in patients with T2D, but this effect wanes off over time. As explained, people who use VLCKD for weight loss (due its diuretic effect which leads to rapid weight loss) usually have a feeling of satiety caused by ketones. The most common negative adverse effect of such diets is called “keto-flu” which tends to improve spontaneously in few days to weeks after being on such diet. It causes symptoms like lightheadedness, dizziness, fatigue, exercise intolerance, lack of sleep, and constipation. Adherence to VLCKD diets is challenging, and their long-term effects are still lacking in the literature.
I'll say this: the ketogenic diet is a medical treatment, and you should treat it as such. It can have very real side-effects, such as the "keto-flu" mentioned above, that you may or may not be able to tolerate. You are doing something very drastic to your body by going on this diet, and the long-term effects are unknown, although, as the review I linked mentioned, low-carb diets (<40%) and high-carb diets (>70%) were linked to increased mortality among people without diabetes. You will lose weight in the short-term if you stay on the diet, that's pretty much a given, and ketosis will probably increase satiety. Staying on it is super challenging, though, and if you don't stick to it, to the letter, it will not work.

Do not approach this thing lightly, and if you are a type 1 diabetic, absolutely do not do this.

I would say it's best to find a "diet" that works for your lifestyle, something that is sustainable throughout your life.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,791
Can someone explain carbs/net carbs etc to me ? Quest pizza says 5 carbs per serving, three servings per pizza, should be a total of 15g. Back of box says 19g carbs, 15g is fiber and two from sugar.
Long story short is that you subtract the fiber from the total carbs, because the fiber isn't absorbed into your body.
 
Oct 27, 2017
882
Jillian Michaels is very much about eating what you like in moderation and with some thinking behind it, and exercising. She’s an amazing personal (DVD lol) trainer. She posts a lot on Instagram about eating sweets because today is cheat day, and the like.

She’s also experienced with losing weight.

And yeah, lowering carbs in general is good because it forces you to eat healthier, but she’s just about balance and moderation and exercise. 🤷🏻‍♀️ Personally, I do eat lower carbs because if I say “let’s do carbs”, all I do is eat bread and then sugar crash lol.

I dunno, I’m biased when it comes to her anyway, I own all her DVDs and I lost a bunch of weight while working out with them. She’s a cool person.
 
Oct 29, 2017
828
USA
Some people are taking this a little to matter of fact. As a diet plan I feel you have to do what works for you, everyone's body is different and reacts so to different eating habits( I hate the word diet). See a doctor, make realistic safe goals, move, and be healthy. I eat Keto and do intermittent fasting, I eat lots of vegetables, I enjoy some berries and enjoy my bacon and eggs every morning with a nice Lunch/Dinner. I'm never starving and smash out some amazing Lifting+Cardio workouts, it works for me and there isn't much Jillian can say to make me believe otherwise. Just like any meal plan you can eat the right way or the wrong way, If your eating Keto Quest bars and low carb processed food your going to have the same problems as a bad standard american diet. There isn't one correct answer for every body.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,773
Sunderland
Keto's pretty good. You can lose like 5 lbs in one week even while drinking a ton of water. And you feel full. I went on it after the holidays and got super thin. But I started getting like crows feet and stuff even though I was drinking a lot of water. Got off of it and my face looks a little better. idk What was going on - I was eating vitamins.
Why is nearly everybody in this thread using loss of weight as an absolute measure of health? Surely I'm not the only person of mature years who has never followed weight loss as a goal but is still active and healthy.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,773
Sunderland
I started Keto last March and have lost 89 lbs. It has been the most sustainable diet for me and now I feel like it's a lifestyle for me rather than a diet.
If you lost 89lb (40Kg for fuck's sake) and are not dead, you were probably morbidly obese to begin with. If your physician ordered this diet, good for them and well done to you. If you just randomly lost that amount of weight without medical supervision, please see a real doctor as soon as possible. You are probably rather ill.
 
Oct 28, 2017
190
If you lost 89lb (40Kg for fuck's sake) and are not dead, you were probably morbidly obese to begin with. If your physician ordered this diet, good for them and well done to you. If you just randomly lost that amount of weight without medical supervision, please see a real doctor as soon as possible. You are probably rather ill.

If they followed the diet to the letter, they are not ill. They will be perfectly fine. This is speaking from experience and also talking to my cardiologist and my own doctors after following the diet for years now.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
If you lost 89lb (40Kg for fuck's sake) and are not dead, you were probably morbidly obese to begin with. If your physician ordered this diet, good for them and well done to you. If you just randomly lost that amount of weight without medical supervision, please see a real doctor as soon as possible. You are probably rather ill.
What kind of nonsense is this? I lost around 80 lbs. in under a year when I first started restricting carbs, too.

His weight loss was not "random." It was intentional. Losing that weight is not something that requires medical supervision for fuck's sake. Most of America could probably stand to lose the same amount if not much more.

Why is nearly everybody in this thread using loss of weight as an absolute measure of health? Surely I'm not the only person of mature years who has never followed weight loss as a goal but is still active and healthy.
I don't think anyone is using it as an absolute measure, but overweight is easily one of the biggest health issues in America and the majority of the country is suffering from it and associated illnesses to some degree.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,773
Sunderland
If they followed the diet to the letter, they are not ill. They will be perfectly fine. This is speaking from experience and also talking to my cardiologist and my own doctors after following the diet for years now.
That's cultish nonsense. There is no such thing as a diet that must be followed "to the letter." Eat well and you'll thrive. If you're able to eat bread, for instance, eat it when you like. It's lovely stuff and you will enjoy life. If you're unable to eat bread, find alternatives but please don't pretend that bread is horrible just because it doesn't work for you.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,773
Sunderland
What kind of nonsense is this? I lost around 80 lbs. in under a year when I first started restricting carbs, too.
In total I probably weigh around 160lb. It's considered normal for a man in my country. Now try to explain how it would be good for me, as a healthy person, to lose half of my weight.

Even for somebody twice my weight, how could losing 25% of one's body weight be considered healthy?
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
In total I probably weigh around 160lb. It's considered normal for a man in my country. Now try to explain how it would be good for me, as a healthy person, to lose half of my weight.

Even for somebody twice my weight, how could losing 25% of one's body weight be considered healthy?
Why do you think this is about 160 lb. healthy adult men who have no problem with their weight going out and losing 80 lbs.? Did you even spend more than a second thinking about that post before your wrote it?

If you weigh 320 lbs. when you should be 160, then yes, dropping 25% of your body weight is a smart idea. Dropping 50% of your body weight would also be a good idea.
 
Oct 29, 2017
3,707
In total I probably weigh around 160lb. It's considered normal for a man in my country. Now try to explain how it would be good for me, as a healthy person, to lose half of my weight.

Even for somebody twice my weight, how could losing 25% of one's body weight be considered healthy?
You dont need to lose weight. Someone who weighs 320 pounds does.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,027
If you reach your target weight goal, what is the reason to keep your body in constant ketosis?
I stay low carb (never tracked ketosis or not) because it's easy and I feel good on it. I don't suffer from any of the issues that I once did (frequent colds, stomach trouble, head aches, lethargy, poor sleep, dry skin, etc. etc.) and I'm not constantly hungry and tired. It's just simple and normal to me now and I can stay lean all year around without issue. I still drink beer every once in a while or maybe have a slice of cake or some other carby thing at rare special events, but generally, it's low-carb all the time for me and I have no intention to change it.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,338
I stay low carb (never tracked ketosis or not) because it's easy and I feel good on it. I don't suffer from any of the issues that I once did (frequent colds, stomach trouble, head aches, lethargy, poor sleep, dry skin, etc. etc.) and I'm not constantly hungry and tired. It's just simple and normal to me now and I can stay lean all year around without issue. I still drink beer every once in a while or maybe have a slice of cake or some other carby thing at rare special events, but generally, it's low-carb all the time for me and I have no intention to change it.
Wouldn't it be more logical to assume that the health issues you just stated were related to your weight pre-diet and probably aren't cured specifically because of keto?
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,122
I posted about how Harvard Health updated their status on fats and carbohydrates
https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/the-truth-about-fats-bad-and-good

The keto people who replace all carbs with unhealthy fats are being dangerous. Keto followers, please be mindful of the fats you eat.

But my biochemistry professors were never a fan of the ketosis diet long term. There are bacteria in your gut microbiome that rely on a variety of complex carbohydrates to survive, and we know now that gut microbiome can influence everything from metabolism, to neurological disease, to immunology. It's not a good idea to starve yourself of either fats, carbs, or protein.

I've been doing it or something close to it for coming on 8 years now. The healthiest I've ever been in my whole life.

Carbs are completely unessential and more often than not simply harmful if you aren't highly active and eat them daily/as a part of every meal.



This is a strawman. No one can eat that much without feeling disgusting.
We're still learning about biochemistry and systems biology of the human body. It's probably too generalizing to declare that all carbs are unnecessary just because the body has a biochemical pathway to synthesize glucose when it has no other choice. Chemistry in the body is more than just the metabolism to store fat. There are microbiology and inflammatory pathways that are important to keep in mind long term.