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JoJo's Bizarre Adventure ERA |OT| Stand Up and Pose

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
yeah i dunno, it might be literal, but this comes directly after it is given its stats. which i know are bullshit a lot of the time, for sure.

anyways this is still very strong, so maybe that's just what the low end of A-class is supposed to be like? cause one of the first things star platinum ever does is bend prison bars. having only four levels for each stat doesnt allow for a lot of gradation, so its probable we're meant to take that into account.

ah well, its not that important but ive become very interested in the differences between certain translations, often having vastly different implications.
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
yeah i dunno, it might be literal, but this comes directly after it is given its stats. which i know are bullshit a lot of the time, for sure.

anyways this is still very strong, so maybe that's just what the low end of A-class is supposed to be like? cause one of the first things star platinum ever does is bend prison bars.

ah well, its not that important but ive become very interested in the differences between certain translations, often having vastly different implications.
Star platinum is busted. Stone free can mold itself into kevlar-like material so the A is probably related to resistence, but compared to the other non part 3 main Jojo stands it's probably the strongest one of the bunch... I really don't count part 3 in these rankings because all of the main character's stands are only good for punching, therefore they need to be reeeealy strong to not suck, besides Stu Platinum

(i think the rank goes Star Platinum >>Stone free> Crazy D > GE, for punching)
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
Star platinum is busted. Stone free can mold itself into kevlar-like material so the A is probably related to resistence, but compared to the other non part 3 main Jojo stands it's probably the strongest one of the bunch... I really don't count part 3 in these rankings because all of the main character's stands are only good for punching, therefore they need to be reeeealy strong to not suck, besides Stu Platinum

(i think the rank goes Star Platinum >>Stone free> Crazy D > GE, for punching)
hmm, i always thought based on crazy d's first encounter with star platinum and the rat hunting arc (where they're both able to fire ball bearings and bullets with about as much force as each other) implied they were rivals power wise, though sp is a bit stronger and faster.

anyways, i guess part of what led me to be confused is a bit in the jojo wiki where they say sf's punches are meant to be "about as strong as getting hit by a small meteorite" which im assuming is in reference to the planet waves fight, but I don't know if this is ever said explicitly or is an extrapolation by the wiki editor.

I think you're right that the simplest part 3 stands are absurdly fast and strong relative to most stands with a special ability that's immediately apparent. (eg. diavolo is still cautious of Polnareff even though his king crimson is pretty physically strong)

I also think power definitely reflects "toughness" since "persistence" doesn't really seem to be that analog and refers more to the length of an ability's effect or the mental energy it takes to keep a stand manifested.
 
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Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
hmm, i always thought based on crazy d's first encounter with star platinum and the rat hunting arc (where they're both able to fire ball bearings and bullets with about as much force as each other) implied they were rivals power wise, though sp is a bit stronger and faster.

anyways, i guess part of what led me to be confused is a bit in the jojo wiki where they say sf's punches are meant to be "about as strong as getting hit by a small meteorite" which im assuming is in reference to the planet waves fight, but I don't know if this is ever said explicitly or is an extrapolation by the wiki editor.

I think you're right that the simplest part 3 stands are absurdly fast and strong relative to most stands with a special ability that's immediately apparent. (eg. diavolo is still cautious of Polnareff even though his king crimson is pretty physically strong)

I also think power definitely reflects "toughness" since "persistence" doesn't really seem to be that analog and refers more to the length of an ability's effect or the mental energy it takes to keep a stand manifested.
The issue is that a stand power is classified as “destructive power” so A,B, C don’t really mean much...

Ge is wimpy af but it’ll always punch harder than an aerosmith or sex pistols because it’s a power type

Thing is, stone free has always been classified as pretty strong, whereas crazy D and GE were not so much... Iirc CD is a B and GE is a C
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
Without Polnareff, do we think the Part 5 gang would have still been able to defeat Diavolo?
i think no. he wouldn't let himself be cornered again in his weaker form (doppio) and he's just too cautious and meticulous at full strength for their power sets to handle.

they would have faced him all at once, and they would have died, because he'd be confident he could keep any of them from escaping without two of their members.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
No. They’d be picked off one by one and the dream would die before giorno could finish his signature phrase :/

The only hard counter to KC they had was fugone
though that could definitely work against them with the whole 'unable to react to new stimuli' thing in the erased time. fugo could put his viruses somewhere he really doesn't want them, or even accidentally kill himself.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
Brick snake serum
The whole party should carry that along
that is definitely true, there's no reason giorno couldn't do that. but by the same token, wouldnt Diavolo then be able to pick off one of the group and make a serum from their blood?

---
more on topic of the arrow, the more i think of it the more i love it as a plot device. jotaro and dio are larger than life characters, so it makes sense that their ultimate power is just hidden potential. but giorno and bruno are more realistically rendered people, who live in a darker world. diavolo represents those who profit from and enable the structures of society that harmed both of them, and he is literally out of their reach. they have to chase after the ability to change their fate, rather than it being inside them the whole time.

it also works really well with how giorno kind of represents a redeemed version of dio, and bruno a corrupted (but still noble) version of jonathan. part 5 really belongs to both of them, the story of their bond as brothers, mirroring the bittersweet semblance of respect dio and jonathan shared, but actually shining brighter because of it being forged in a darker place.
 
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BinaryPork

Member
Oct 31, 2017
250
that is definitely true, there's no reason giorno couldn't do that. but by the same token, wouldnt Diavolo then be able to pick off one of the group and make a serum from their blood?
Diavolo wouldn’t have access to Gold Experience, which would make that a lot more difficult. He’d have to have Batman level prep time to pull something like that off without access to a Stand user who could do it for him.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
Diavolo wouldn’t have access to Gold Experience, which would make that a lot more difficult. He’d have to have Batman level prep time to pull something like that off without access to a Stand user who could do it for him.
or he could just have his vast organization manufacture a serum through traditional means. given the implications of his level of access it might just take a day.
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
or he could just have his vast organization manufacture a serum through traditional means. given the implications of his level of access it might just take a day.
The virus dies very quickly on sunlight, only way he could steal the serum would be by being at a 2meter range of giorno making the serum... if time works for diavolo during KC that’s pretty impossible oo

Vaccines and serums take time to make, GE’s only worked because the snake was born immune and you can only achieve that theough GE
 

Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,225
So I’m two episodes away from finishing DIU with my gf and I know she’s gonna ask me why Bites the Dust has to work manually in that last scene. All I’ve got for her is “because yes.”
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,735
For those with an American Shonen Jump subscription, the first 37 chapters of Diamond is Unbreakable are now available on the service.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
The virus dies very quickly on sunlight, only way he could steal the serum would be by being at a 2meter range of giorno making the serum... if time works for diavolo during KC that’s pretty impossible oo

Vaccines and serums take time to make, GE’s only worked because the snake was born immune and you can only achieve that theough GE
no, what i was saying is create the serum from the blood of a team bruno member who already immunized themselves.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
So I’m two episodes away from finishing DIU with my gf and I know she’s gonna ask me why Bites the Dust has to work manually in that last scene. All I’ve got for her is “because yes.”
i think the implication is that activating it is always manual. the instance of activation has been shown to be unique, with kira retaining memory of it unlike in other subsequent loops where he needs to figure it out based on context clues.

also he makes reference to the fact that he needs to be in great desperation to activate it at all, which is why he can't just pull the trigger right away.

if you're talking about why specifically it has to be with his thumb, versus it appearing to happen involuntarily and without any specific physical action the first time, the point is he's juicing the system by using that hand motion he already associates with his stand, as well as playing chicken with how close he'll let people get to him. activating it requires him to feel like he's in actual danger, because it's obviously extremely powerful and should therefore have drawbacks or conditions on it. the thumb clicking motion is an action that makes him feel secure and confident and ties into the idea of this being a "bomb" that blows back time, so his finger being broken keeps him from completing the concept in his head and thus prevents the ability from activating.

because if you think about it, if he knows he has this ability, he's not feeling the same level of true fear and desperation he was when it first activated. if he'd survived, activating bites the dust would have become harder and harder every time.

(also very often jojo characters are said to have done something that they're not literally depicted doing in order to mislead the audience or just because it doesn't matter that much. its not unprecedented to say he did involuntarily do the detonation click the first time, off panel)
 
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Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,225
also very often jojo characters are said to have done something that they're not literally depicted doing in order to mislead the audience or just because it doesn't matter that much. its not unprecedented to say he did involuntarily do the detonation click the first time, off panel)
I didn’t consider this. I guess it’s possible he sees the situation that activates it happen through Killer Queen and then pulls the trigger.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
continuing my slow re-read of stone ocean, finished the return of jotaro and Kiss vs Highway to Hell.

I got to say, the more i re-examine these bookending jotaro segments, the more i appreciate the way he's used here. his insanely powerful ability is used to give him the burden of choice: to see the entire situation and decide what he cares most about attacking/protecting. I'd remarked earlier that i appreciated the symmetry of how pucci beats him both times by exploiting this burden of choice, but this time i caught the literal symmetry in the dialogue: "you were a step behind" vs "two steps. you were two steps behind". (paraphrased) Connected to this is i feel like a really good justification for why Jotaro never seems quite as busted as Dio: he uses his power selflessly. Time Stopping is a selfish concept, but Jotaro always uses it thinking of others.

I adore things like us being led to think jotaro cares more about the pendant than jolyne, presumably because of the arrow shard, but then we learn he cared so much about it because it was the only way she would be able to escape. this entire arc is such a great deconstruction of who jotaro really is, and how heavily his responsibilities weight on him. and of course, Jolyne rising to the challenge of taking his place and all that same weight. "the killer ran inside, not outside" moment is great, as is the jongalli beatdown. Also, people are gonna lose their shit over the dream sequence stuff. peak jojo.

The Kiss and Highway to Hell fight will benefit a lot from animation, Kiss's ability is often difficult to understand without motion. I noticed so many things about what was actually happening in the fight that were unclear on my first go around, like her creating a second nose to breathe when drowning and the fact that mcqueen's heads recombining also ejected his stand ability, letting him safely die.

The very beginning of the arc dealing with Hermes discovering her power is kinda confusing, seemingly jumping to different points in time without clear transitions. it might be partially the translation, but it def needs some reordering and editing. all that said, it's a great fight and a great takedown of a very specific kind of shitty person that exists in versions both less and exactly as extreme.

I cant imagine how bizzare the "give you my panties" moment is going to feel in the show given how tough hermes always seems. speaking of, she needs a really good VA, she's so important for setting the tone.

EDIT: also...


i mean... ok... I'll stop thinking about it lol
 
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Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
WHat the fuck was this chapter
Araki is killing me

Also:
JoJolion |OT| moms are tough
 
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RochHoch

Member
May 22, 2018
5,030
I have so many questions
What the hell even is the Head Doctor? Is he real? What does he have to do with Tsurugi? What's with Tooru? Is it his Stand that's attacking Gappy?

We know that Tsurugi is going to pull through for sure, but at what cost? I guess this is where Norisuke sacrifices himself/sacrificed and ends up in that body bag?

Shit is crazy.
Feels like we're teetering awfully close to the endgame for sure, I really can't wait to see where this goes.
 

RecRoulette

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,500
What the fuck is going on

We've seen the end of the harvest countdown (I think?) and so much shit in this chapter doesn't add up. What an insane chapter

I know Tsurugi isn't gone for good but goddamn that would've been a badass speech to go out on
 
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Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
I still can’t believe
how much stuff Mitsuba’s been doing this saga... it’s like “you thought Caato would be the main mom but it was I, Mitsuba”

I REALLY adore her stand.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
where is kaato anyways? I'm very curious about what her ultimate goals are and which of the three factions she'll be aligned with. I have a feeling that will have to wait until this current situation is dealt with
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
I KNOW WHAT's THE HEAD DOCTOR's POWER
He can control gravity.
He makes the rain super heavy so it hurts josuke
He can make people stumble onto things because they go in their direction
He made the cop super heavy so his weight would hurt Josuke
It all makes sense, it's neo C-moon
 

PMS341

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,145
I KNOW WHAT's THE HEAD DOCTOR's POWER
He can control gravity.
He makes the rain super heavy so it hurts josuke
He can make people stumble onto things because they go in their direction
He made the cop super heavy so his weight would hurt Josuke
It all makes sense, it's neo C-moon
Echoes Act 3 staying alive in Morioh.
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,290
It is crazy how much better Part 8 is compared to the past parts. It is really intense and the mystery is so well done.

So many things have been introduced then left alone for years, only to return later and actually have a use. I am not sure if Araki planned this/didn't forget but so far it has been top notch. There are two characters that we need an update on and I hope they return soon.
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
It is crazy how much better Part 8 is compared to the past parts. It is really intense and the mystery is so well done.

So many things have been introduced then left alone for years, only to return later and actually have a use. I am not sure if Araki planned this/didn't forget but so far it has been top notch. There are two characters that we need an update on and I hope they return soon.
hell yeah... SBR got me worried for a lot of things and i thought i was going to drop jojo all along since it wasn't getting as good as i thought of part 5... so seeign how well Jojolion's been built really makes me want to see where this goes.... and that maybe we get a part 9 lol
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,290
hell yeah... SBR got me worried for a lot of things and i thought i was going to drop jojo all along since it wasn't getting as good as i thought of part 5... so seeign how well Jojolion's been built really makes me want to see where this goes.... and that maybe we get a part 9 lol
I liked SBR overall but I can't really say I didn't find it to be worse the more time goes by.
The Lucy stuff in particular is the biggest reason for that.

As for part 9, it makes me wonder if that will ever happen. I hope that if it does, that they have another female Jojo or atleast twins with one of them being a girl.
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
I liked SBR overall but I can't really say I didn't find it to be worse the more time goes by.
The Lucy stuff in particular is the biggest reason for that.

As for part 9, it makes me wonder if that will ever happen. I hope that if it does, that they have another female Jojo or atleast twins with one of them being a girl.
kinda gave up on another female jojo but when you've got women like Mitsuba and Yasuho showing up I think we're heading in a good way, I had zero expectations for Mitsuba being more than a housewive and now she's just stealing the scene, she's very skilled with her stand and a great mother and I hope she won't get Lucy'd...

I really hope Kyo, Daiya and Haato come back too, and i'm curious to see what Kaato can do.

Female characters aside, I just adore this saga's structure and themes, even if e never get a "traditional" Jojo main villain, this whole family feud is already worth the story
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,290
kinda gave up on another female jojo but when you've got women like Mitsuba and Yasuho showing up I think we're heading in a good way, I had zero expectations for Mitsuba being more than a housewive and now she's just stealing the scene, she's very skilled with her stand and a great mother and I hope she won't get Lucy'd...

I really hope Kyo, Daiya and Haato come back too, and i'm curious to see what Kaato can do.

Female characters aside, I just adore this saga's structure and themes, even if e never get a "traditional" Jojo main villain, this whole family feud is already worth the story
Mitsuba was just fantastic. I love how she only had a cameo at the start and then returned out of nowhere and was shown to be a badass in just a couple of chapters. Araki have come a long way from how his characters were in the first four parts.

Kyo and Karera in particular are my biggest worries for this part. Especially Kyo as she just disapeared.
 

Mariip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,236
Mitsuba was just fantastic. I love how she only had a cameo at the start and then returned out of nowhere and was shown to be a badass in just a couple of chapters. Araki have come a long way from how his characters were in the first four parts.

Kyo and Karera in particular are my biggest worries for this part. Especially Kyo as she just disapeared.
yeah... I wished they appeared a bit more, and also that more women showed up, the fights against kyo and daiya were so good, aside from that creepyness from daiya's

I love how the characters can just come back at any time, part 4 had that potential but it mostly kept it to a minimum, but 8 can do a lot more since it's gonna be bigger @[email protected]
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,290
yeah... I wished they appeared a bit more, and also that more women showed up, the fights against kyo and daiya were so good, aside from that creepyness from daiya's

I love how the characters can just come back at any time, part 4 had that potential but it mostly kept it to a minimum, but 8 can do a lot more since it's gonna be bigger @[email protected]
Hopefully we hear something soon. Knowing how this chapter ended, it would be a good reason for Kyo to return so hopefully Araki gives us a bone.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
the way i see it
the cop fell backwards away from josuke, then all of a sudden he was directly over him. i would call that "space manipulation" more than gravity. also the fact that raindrops and such impact harmlessly like you'd expect unless they're hitting their target makes me doubt that as well, and think of it more as "conditional force multiplication"

About Jojolion as a whole, I do love the whole tone and mystery thus far. this is doing a great job highlighting the bizzareness of this particular stand user.
 

Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,225
My only complaint is that Gappy has gotten a lot more plain since the beginning of JoJolion. He was a lot more fun at the start of the series. It’s hard to even place a personality on him atm.
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,428
My only complaint is that Gappy has gotten a lot more plain since the beginning of JoJolion. He was a lot more fun at the start of the series. It’s hard to even place a personality on him atm.
i think he's remained consistently inscrutable throughout tbh, he's always had that quality to him despite his many quirks. he's also had to deal with a lot of questioning his identity and if he is even really his own person. plus this has just been an exceptionally harried couple of weeks for him