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Jonathan Hickman's X-Men |OT| Adaptation or Dominance(Open Spoilers, Gambit is the Witness)

How should we tag spoilers?

  • Day of release spoilers are fine

    Votes: 109 51.7%
  • Give each issue a one week spoiler tag

    Votes: 65 30.8%
  • sPoiLEr tAGs fOR eVerYThinG

    Votes: 14 6.6%
  • No spoiler tags at all-even for speculation

    Votes: 23 10.9%

  • Total voters
    211
  • Poll closed .

jon bones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,932
NYC
Was just going to post that picture. If you’ve read Hickman’s last marvel run, you know to not read too much into the cover art for the first issue.
 

Stantastic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,600
I wonder, so one of Moiras earliest lives, 2nd or 3rd i think, ended in a bizzarely abrupt manner.
she had just learned about Xavier and was going to meet him for the first time only for the plane to crash on the way there.
Yall think there might be some greater significance to that? It just strikes me as a really wierd cut off to throw in there as it is.
 

SamAlbro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,569
The big thing confusing me is how time works with Moira being reincarnated.

Is she born in say 74, and when she dies she is reincarnated back in 74? As that's how I read it.

I get the sliding timeline and Marvels timeline is just confusing, but yeah
Given that she has a son with reality warping powers, maybe it's a version of that?

Subconscious reality warping powers that set a "Save State" when she was in the womb, and when she dies, she resets the entire universe to her save state. So it could end up not being time travel, but reseting the universe itself.
 

LiQuid!

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,802
The very last panel of POX 1, where the librarian or whoever that is says "hope to god they never have dominion again" are those supposed to be 2 humans or 2 mutants in there?

One of the friends I convinced to read this had a lot of trouble making it through POX 1. It is very info dumpy and hard to follow, so I get it, but I've assured him he will get a change of perspective after HOX 2.
 

Lashes2ashes

Member
Dec 18, 2017
228
Roseburg Oregon
The very last panel of POX 1, where the librarian or whoever that is says "hope to god they never have dominion again" are those supposed to be 2 humans or 2 mutants in there?

One of the friends I convinced to read this had a lot of trouble making it through POX 1. It is very info dumpy and hard to follow, so I get it, but I've assured him he will get a change of perspective after HOX 2.
Those were humans.
 

Lashley

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,902
The very last panel of POX 1, where the librarian or whoever that is says "hope to god they never have dominion again" are those supposed to be 2 humans or 2 mutants in there?

One of the friends I convinced to read this had a lot of trouble making it through POX 1. It is very info dumpy and hard to follow, so I get it, but I've assured him he will get a change of perspective after HOX 2.
Humans, but they looked like cavemen, so obviously some shenanigans to stop them from being dominant.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,405
That X-Men image has me wondering if they'll finally retcon Brian Braddock into being a mutant like they did for both his siblings?
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,780
That X-Men image has me wondering if they'll finally retcon Brian Braddock into being a mutant like they did for both his siblings?
Somethings happening to Brian, since iirc either the Excalibur solicit or the writers themselves said at SDCC that Betsy is taking up the mantle from him rather than just joining the CBC.
 

SamAlbro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,569
That X-Men image has me wondering if they'll finally retcon Brian Braddock into being a mutant like they did for both his siblings?
I'm kind of wondering if we'll see a bunch of non-mutant, powered X-characters (like Sinister and Juggernaut) wind up getting retconned into being mutants.

The X-Men Evolution version of Juggernaut had a dormant mutation that he awakened with mysticism, so paths like that could get a bunch of mutates from the mutant world crossed over.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,405
I'm kind of wondering if we'll see a bunch of non-mutant, powered X-characters (like Sinister and Juggernaut) wind up getting retconned into being mutants.

The X-Men Evolution version of Juggernaut had a dormant mutation that he awakened with mysticism, so paths like that could get a bunch of mutates from the mutant world crossed over.
Sinister is likely imo but I'd say Juggernaut probably isn't. Hickman's mutants only mantra makes me think most characters he's touching on directly (and in that image) will probably be retconned into mutants if they aren't already. In that X-Men image it's really just Brian and Corsair though.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,127
So I’ve been making y way through jon bones recommended reading and finished House of M (just the main arc, no tie ins). Even though I knew the premise of the story it still had a wtf finish for me. The HOX/POX stuff is beginning to get more clear regarding theories. Just excited now to get to messiah saga and get more context on wtf is going on.
 

bardo

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
2,655
Cross-posting from the Comics-Era Off-topic thread:

PoX #2: Light summary stuff
Fills in some gaps about Rasputin's (and maybe Mystique's) mission; locks some players in place and introduces some very big players previously hinted at; sets the stage for a great battle; then cosmic weirdness at the end. Interesting charts/graphs/exposition--though I'll be damned to see all the connections.


And can we get that Putri image as a poster, Marvel? Thx!
 

Mudcrab

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
1,844
So based on solicits for the next couple of months we know that Krakoa is still going to be a thing for the foreseeable future, and the roles the various teams have in their new books sound like fun.

X-Force being the CIA of Krakoa and The Hellfire Trading Company being responsible for trade with the outside world are great premises full of potential.

I just don't know about those creative teams.
 

bardo

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
2,655
So based on solicits for the next couple of months we know that Krakoa is still going to be a thing for the foreseeable future, and the roles the various teams have in their new books sound like fun.

X-Force being the CIA of Krakoa and The Hellfire Trading Company being responsible for trade with the outside world are great premises full of potential.

I just don't know about those creative teams.
I'm worried about that, as well. Hopefully, Hickman's vision/strong-arming will keep the quality up.
 

Christian

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,127
So based on solicits for the next couple of months we know that Krakoa is still going to be a thing for the foreseeable future, and the roles the various teams have in their new books sound like fun.

X-Force being the CIA of Krakoa and The Hellfire Trading Company being responsible for trade with the outside world are great premises full of potential.

I just don't know about those creative teams.
What creative team are you worried about? Duggan has been in a bit of a slump, but he seems hyped to be writing a book as part of this, and he was always super reliable.

Tini Howard is really great. Bryan Hill is great.

Hickman is Hickgawd.

Brisson is solid, I’ve liked way more of his stuff than disliked it. So that leaves Percy as the odd man out. Who are you especially concerned with?
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,780
No Rosenberg, Bunn, nobodies like Guggenheim, writers you don’t even remember exist like Hopeless.

This is honestly a solid slate, especially with Hickman at the masthead, getting Marvel to stop being so precious with the brand and let the writers actually write something that’s more than just a derivative throwback. Those kind of constraints can and have tanked runs from pretty celebrated writers.
 

SaintBowWow

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,366
Hickman's doing New Mutants too? I thought he was just writing the main book so this is great news. Going by his past Marvel runs I'd think it would be required reading, similar to Fantastic Four/FF and Avengers/New Avengers.
 

Pachimari

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,620
So wait, I thought x0, x1 and x2 were understood as Year 1, Year 10 and Year 100. But PoX #2 makes me think it’s Moira timeline 10, timeline 1, timeline 2 etc, right?

Is it understood as this or the other?

x0: Year 1
x1: Year 10
x2: Year 100
x3: Year 1000

or

x0: timeline 10
x1: timeline 1
x2: timeline 2
x3: timeline 3

So x0: Year 10 would be Year 10 of timeline 10?
 
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Pachimari

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,620
This is correct. All of this is happening on Moira 10 as far as we know right now.
Okay, good to know.

Just finished PoX #2 and this has been the most confusing of the four issues so far to me. The whole nimbus thing especially. I guess it’s just a universal mind that learns in its orbit. Master molds too. Guess these created sentinels in past comic book runs and ultimately created Nimrod the Lesser which is why the Asteroid K mutant leaders wants to destroy it with the data they got from the usb stick.

I kind of feel like it would be a good idea to read through Hickman’s Marvel Saga run to get a better grasp on the Marvel universe which could ultimately make me understand his X-Men better going forward?
 
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ibrahima

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,335
I kind of feel like it would be a good idea to read through Hickman’s Marvel Saga run to get a better grasp on the Marvel universe which could ultimately make me understand his X-Men better going forward?
I would say they are pretty separate at the moment. The main thing from the first issue that calls back to his work on Avengers and Fantastic Four was how Orchis have an amount of Stark and Richards tech from those earlier stories.

The exposition pieces cover that for the most part, it doesn't really matter how that stuff ended up where it is, just that it is being used to make Sentinels now.

The other main thing that will probably be a focal point is Reed's son, but again the first issue gave you the important details (omega level mutant who is on the side of humanity).

His earlier work is generally excellent, read it for that reason rather than needing to fill in any gaps.
 

bardo

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
2,655
What creative team are you worried about? Duggan has been in a bit of a slump, but he seems hyped to be writing a book as part of this, and he was always super reliable.

Tini Howard is really great. Bryan Hill is great.

Hickman is Hickgawd.

Brisson is solid, I’ve liked way more of his stuff than disliked it. So that leaves Percy as the odd man out. Who are you especially concerned with?
I should have worded it better--I don't know those creative teams. And, yes, I have been living under a rock.
 

kakistocrats

Member
Oct 29, 2017
73
What I got from the issue is that the future timeline stuff we're seeing is all Moira IX. What it seems like is that Moira IX is still alive in the future scenes and that the events being depicted will somehow wrap back around and feed into the present-day stuff, which is Moira X's timeline. On the graph of Moira's lifetimes in Hox 2, there's a period in one of her lives where the graph says she was in a coma. During that period of her life, the solid line representing her lifetime on the graph becomes a line of chevrons. The same thing happens to Moira IX's life after the beginning of the apocalypse war, and the line of chevrons just continues on endlessly. The graph doesn't tell us how Moira IX's life ends, implying that it may have continued on very far into the future.

So, in chronological order, the ongoing plotlines would be in this order:

Year 100: Apocalypse, Wolverine, and the chimera mutants struggle against Nimrod in the future. Moira IX is somehow alive.
Year 1000: The librarian asks the Phalanx for Ascension. Moira IX is somehow still alive.
Year 1: Moira IX has died, we are now seeing Moira X. Whatever happens in the far future of Year 1000 is now part of Moira X's memories.
Year 10: The present day stuff with Cyclops and Maker Prof is leading to a different future than the one depicted in Year 100 and 1000 because Moira IX was alive during those futures so that Moira X could use whatever knowledge she gained during Moira IX's lifetime to change things.

HoX and PoX will likely conclude with the future depicted in Year 100 and Year 1000 being averted by the actions of Moira X and her associates in the present day of Year 10, leaving the future a blank slate for the X-Books as they finally break free of the endless cycle of inevitable dystopian futures they've been caught in for all 10 of Moira's lifetimes so far.
 

Proteus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,675
Toronto
So basically in a thousand years the mutants themselves are going through their own evolutionary process into a technospecies and are now requesting Ascension by the Phalanx?

Am I understanding that correctly?