Judge jails former Army intelligence analyst Chelsea Manning for refusing to testify to a grand jury probing Wikileaks.

[Rilakkuma Fanatic]

I see this claim on donut twitter a lot, yet nobody can show anything close to a credible source on the question. Here's the best example I've found:

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/09/us/obama-russia-election-hack.html

tl;dr: Anonymous "intelligence officials" claims that Russia hacked GOP servers, but no evidence or detail about the nature of the documents presented. No claim that Russia provided those documents to wikileaks (which doesn't look good for your point, friend). Also, fwiw, GOP officials deny their networks were compromised.

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Why did you not post these FOLLOW UP LINKS that acknowledged the NYT fucking up (to put it charitably) with that article?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blog...-the-lead-in-pre-election-russia-trump-story/

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/20/public-editor/trump-russia-fbi-liz-spayd-public-editor.html

 

[Deleted member 3896]

Liberals are mad that Manning attended a party hosted by Mike Cernovich
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/22/chelsea-manning-far-right-trump-gather-intel

It's atrocious for armchair #resisters to pass judgement on somebody (a trans woman no less!) who has endured unbelievable suffering so the rest of us can know just a glimpse of the evil our government does abroad. I can't believe they lack the self awareness of this.

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Wait, what? Trans people can't be terrible people too? Would you give Caitlin Jenner a pass for her shitty politics just because she's trans?

 

[Alucrid]

Wasn't it supposedly opposition research/ also trying to pull a long term friend from the brink? I've seen her involved in left wing circles waaaaay more, including the likes of contrapoints and HBomberguy.

To be fair I don't understand her resistance on being forthright here, but the "have fun rotting in jail" attitude about her is really kind of gross.

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Day 1

After engaging in a group exercise in what these Alt-right members call an "Escape Room" I've found the average intelligence of the group to be below average. We did succeed in escaping after a few key prompts from myself. While posing for a photograph their sign choice provided key insights into their personality. One selected "Winners", perhaps a sign about how they view themselves in the broader political landscape. Another selected "Nailed it" perhaps harkening back to the 2016 election. Lastly a sign that said "I like pie" was chosen. Whether this was an attempt at absurdist humor, as pie was not part of the Escape Room, or a message to their Russian handler I am unsure. Regardless I do plan on retiring to one of their abodes to drink wine and play card games for further research to gain more insight on what this "Alt-right" is.

- Deep State agent Chelsea Manning

 

[TheModestGun]

Opposition research???

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I'm literally just saying what I'd heard in the past.

 

[BringBackSonics]

What the hell are you doing.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

Wait, what? Trans people can't be terrible people too? Would you give Caitlin Jenner a pass for her shitty politics just because she's trans?

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Lol amaZing, isn't it?

 

[Deleted member 19003]

Day 1

After engaging in a group exercise in what these Alt-right members call an "Escape Room" I've found the average intelligence of the group to be below average. We did succeed in escaping after a few key prompts from myself. While posing for a photograph their sign choice provided key insights into their personality. One selected "Winners", perhaps a sign about how they view themselves in the broader political landscape. Another selected "Nailed it" perhaps harkening back to the 2016 election. Lastly a sign that said "I like pie" was chosen. Whether this was an attempt at absurdist humor, as pie was not part of the Escape Room, or a message to their Russian handler I am unsure. Regardless I do plan on retiring to one of their abodes to drink wine and play card games for further research to gain more insight on what this "Alt-right" is.

- Deep State agent Chelsea Manning

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Hahaha

 

[Cat Party]

I don't understand why she is refusing to testify. Is it just an F U to the system for the treatment she received, or does she just still like WL?

 

[Deleted member 4614]

One example: Wikileaks (the organization) never came close to outing Manning as the source of the Iraq War Logs. Even well into her prosecution when her team was basically admitting it, WL would only refer to her as "the alleged source". It would be an incredible betrayal now for her to provide information that would assist the prosecution of Assange (who committed no crime with US jurisdiction).

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Oh my god you're caping for Assange who helped elect Trump. This isn't twenty fucking thirteen

 

[Antrax]

I think, with regard to Wikileaks, that you are oversimplifying a bit. Yes, Wikileaks did well to expose war crimes and rights violations by the American government. But Assange and Wikileaks ultimately became a tool of Putin and the Russians. Assange himself is a bad person too. So there's that.

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Careful, you'll sound like a bootlicking liberal

 

[Diunx]

She basically gave up her life to release video of US helicopters gunning down journalists in Iraq with full audio of the bureaucratic approval of the operation. Immediately, after, the same helicopter gunned down the first responders. Please reconsider your thinking.

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Yep, I will always see her as a here amd hope that there are more people with her morals and integrity working for these shady intelligencr angencies.

 

[Deleted member 2426]

Lol. Keep defending a neo nazi sympathizer.

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I am not defending anyone. Mostly talking about how you think people deserve to be jailed because of association?????

 

[RailWays]

Not sure why Wikileaks needs defending or was worth caping for.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

Yep, I will always see her as a here amd hope that there are more people with her morals and integrity working for these shady intelligencr angencies.

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Hero for puttin innocent people lives in jeopardy and caping for julian assange and other neo nazis? Lovely.

 

[TheModestGun]

Look if you buy the I hung out and played fun games with a bunch of hate mongers while being a supposedly famous lefty for oppo research...

I think she was probably lonely and she's just not that smart.

That said she refuses to speak ill of Assange and Wikileaks so I also don't trust her much.

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Yeah the fact that she won't be critical of him is a pretty big red flag to me.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

I am not defending anyone. Mostly talking about how you think people deserve to be jailed because of association?????

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Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit i see...

 

[Deleted member 8561]

I am not defending anyone. Mostly talking about how you think people deserve to be jailed because of association?????

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Um, no she deserved to serve jail for the multitude of things she released to Assange. Which were mainly due to her infatuation with him, with the other released contents having nothing to do with revealing the military killing civilians.

 

[Diunx]

Hero for puttin innocent people lives in jeopardy and caping for julian assange and other neo nazis? Lovely.

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Which lives did she put in danger? More cunts killing innocent people overseas? she did an incredibly brave thing and has sacrifice her life for it.

 

[Deleted member 8561]

Which lives did she put in danger? More cunts killing innocent people overseas? she did an incredibly brave thing and has sacrifice her life for it.

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If she actually stopped at the initial video release and didn't keep leaking irrelevant shit that was simply released to do political damage, then you might actually have a point.

But she didn't, and she was stupid and continues to be showing that she is very much in fact, stupid.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

Which lives did she put in danger? More cunts killing innocent people overseas? she did an incredibly brave thing and has sacrifice her life for it.

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Ahhh so any military member deserve to be outed? Lovely. Any person working for our govt oversees deserves to be outed?

 

[thebishop]

That's checkmate

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That story still stands, and the idea that I was being "disingenuous" was based on some hasty, anonymously-sourced tweets from Natasha Bertrand. If the Senate investigation has direct evidence of a conspiracy between Russia and Trump *to influence the 2016 election*, it hasn't come out since.

Also, the kirby avatar characterized that thread as me saying "Trump did nothing wrong". I think an honest reader would have trouble with this bit:

What is the 2020 election going to be like now that Democrats spend 2 years focusing on this conspiracy theory, rather than attacking Trump on his many, many policy failures? Why didn't they build public opposition to the horrific corporate tax cuts? Why aren't they on TV every single day shouting about the ongoing crisis in Puerto Rico? Why did they line up in lockstep support of the coup in Venezeula?

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[BrutalInsane]

If you couldn't see the whole point of Wikileaks, from the beginning, as being a tool to weaken America's standing in the world since it's inception, then boy, do I have a bridge to sell you. I'm not happy with a lot of the things we do in regards to both foreign policy and internally, but as far as I look at it, don't fuck with us.

As for Chelsea, rot in jail, you useful idiot.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

That story still stands, and the idea that I was being "disingenuous" was based on some hasty, anonymously-sourced tweets from Natasha Bertrand. If the Senate investigation has direct evidence of a conspiracy between Russia and Trump *to influence the 2016 election*, it hasn't come out since.

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You have issues. Serious issues.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

That story still stands, and the idea that I was being "disingenuous" was based on some hasty, anonymously-sourced tweets from Natasha Bertrand. If the Senate investigation has direct evidence of a conspiracy between Russia and Trump *to influence the 2016 election*, it hasn't come out since.

Also, the kirby avatar characterized that thread as me saying "Trump did nothing wrong". I think an honest reader would have trouble with this bit:

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LOL the fucking lies. Jesus you're impressive.

 

[Kirblar]

I am not defending anyone. Mostly talking about how you think people deserve to be jailed because of association?????

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She deserves to be jailed here because she has immunity and is still refusing to testify in court. After having a sentence commuted because of poor treatment in prison.

 

[EloKa]

Wikileaks was never bad. it releases accurate, secret information about powerful state and corporate actors in the public interest...

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Only if they deem that releasing this information would fit their narrative.
You can't praise them for releasing Intel on the one side while they are also holding back / censoring / deleting intel on purpose if it doesn't fit their Concept on the other side.
WL started strong and had a bigger drop than Anthem. It became just another propaganda machine.

 

[Alavard]

It's atrocious for armchair #resisters to pass judgement on somebody (a trans woman no less!)...

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Trying to weaponize the fact that someone is trans to win an argument is transphobia. Fuck off. The fact that's she trans is not a prop for you to use.

 

[excelsiorlef]

It's atrocious for armchair #resisters to pass judgement on somebody (a trans woman no less!)

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I'm a trans woman

You passed judgment on me.

Shame

 

[thebishop]

Oh my god you're caping for Assange who helped elect Trump. This isn't twenty fucking thirteen

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Where was Chelsea Manning in 2016?? Oh right. On a fucking hunger strike to get gender transition surgery. Maybe she has different concerns than you:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-winning-battle-for-gender-transition-surgery

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

Trying to weaponize the fact that someone is trans to win an argument is transphobia. Fuck off. The fact that's she trans is not a prop for you to use.

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Right?

 

[Alucrid]

I'm a trans woman

You passed judgment on me.

Shame

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actual photograph of their arm(less) chair

 

[Deleted member 8777]

If you couldn't see the whole point of Wikileaks, from the beginning, as being a tool to weaken America's standing in the world since it's inception, then boy, do I have a bridge to sell you. I'm not happy with a lot of the things we do in regards to both foreign policy and internally, but as far as I look at it, don't fuck with us.

As for Chelsea, rot in jail, you useful idiot.

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this level of jingoism is not normal

 

[Deleted member 3896]

Trying to weaponize the fact that someone is trans to win an argument is transphobia. Fuck off. The fact that's she trans is not a prop for you to use.

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I'm a trans woman

You passed judgment on me.

Shame

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Yep. It's despicable to see people use this angle to suit an agenda. Her being trans should have nothing to do with this conversation.

 

[thebishop]

Only if they deem that releasing this information would fit their narrative.
You can't praise them for releasing Intel on the one side while they are also holding back / censoring / deleting intel on purpose if it doesn't fit their Concept on the other side.
WL started strong and had a bigger drop than Anthem. It became just another propaganda machine.

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There's no credible claim that Wikileaks had GOP emails comparable to the DNC leaks and chose not to release them. If it was actually true, I would have a problem with it.

 

[Hoot]

On the one hand, I am no fan of some of Chelsea's past actions and her stupid af stint with alt right people

On the other, i'm not gonna rejoice that a trans woman who already got detained and tortured in the past is going back into jail. Considering the state of the US judicial system and its current government, I'm not gonna pretend this is a "good" thing

 

[Kirblar]

this level of jingoism is not normal

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That's not jingoism, Wikileaks has been a tool of Russian intelligence to tear everyone else down, including the US.

 

[LinktothePastGOAT]

On the one hand, I am no fan of some of Chelsea's past actions and her stupid af stint with alt right people

On the other, i'm not gonna rejoice that a trans woman who already got detained and tortured in the past is going back into jail. Considering the state of the US judicial system and its current government, I'm not gonna pretend this is a "good" thing

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And if she killed someone would you still feel this way?? Her being trans has nothing to do with her being punished for breaking the law. Jesus.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

Once upon a time, liberals cared about a free press. Now only socialists do.

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I see your week long ban didn't stop you from being disingenuous as fuck.

 

[Hoot]

And if she killed someone would you still feel this way?? Her being trans has nothing to do with her being punished for breaking the law. Jesus.

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Did she kill anyone ?

I don't tihnk i'm saying something controversial by not being a fan of her while also thinking that her treatment in the past by the US judiciary system was HIGHLY questionable, to put it in extremely mild terms

 

[Enzom21]

Yep. It's despicable to see people use this angle to suit an agenda. Her being trans should have nothing to do with this conversation.

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The people who pull that shit usually don't really care about the people/groups they try to use to push their agenda.

 

[HammerOfThor]

Wow you guys can be weird af here at times.

For some reason, you see Manning as some white night far-left warrior who'll save you all from the evil American fascist right. So when she is associated with people who are alt-right and racists, ITS OKAY! You can't blame her for that, it's them not her! And even though she literally broke the law and put many innocent people's lives at risk.

But fucking hang Chris Pratt for attending a Church that's anti-gay. After all, if he goes to that Church he must be anti-gay too!

Either stick with guilt by association or don't, flip-flopping depending on the person to fit your political beliefs is weak.

 

[Deleted member 4614]

Where was Chelsea Manning in 2016?? Oh right. On a fucking hunger strike to get gender transition surgery. Maybe she has different concerns than you:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-winning-battle-for-gender-transition-surgery

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I did not say anything about Manning.

I said you were stanning for Assange and that Assange helped elect Trump. Your attempt to pivot the conversation speaks volumes.

 

[pigeon]

Wikileaks is a Russian cutout and Chelsea Manning palling around with Nazis was pretty suspect but you still can't get around the fact that she was imprisoned and tortured by the United States government for years and that's actually quite bad, so if she is not inclined to cooperate with the American legal system after that I'm not sure how much I can blame her.

There's no particular question that the judge has the authority to jail her for contempt, but it doesn't mean it's necessarily the right thing to do.

 

[Deleted member 8777]

That's not jingoism, Wikileaks has been a tool of Russian intelligence to tear everyone else down, including the US.

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it's exactly jingoism. "don't fuck with us", "rot in jail", it's not normal nor healthy to be this nationalistic

 

[Alucrid]

Wow you guys can be weird af here at times.

For some reason, you see Manning as some white night far-left warrior who'll save you all from the evil American fascist right. So when she is associated with people who are alt-right and racists, ITS OKAY! You can't blame her for that, it's them not her! And even though she literally broke the law and put many innocent people's lives at risk.

But fucking hang Chris Pratt for attending a Church that's anti-gay. After all, if he goes to that Church he must be anti-gay too!

Either stick with guilt by association or don't, flip-flopping depending on the person to fit your political beliefs is weak.

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can you be more specific than youse guys

 

[Deleted member 283]

Wow you guys can be weird af here at times.

For some reason, you see Manning as some white night far-left warrior who'll save you all from the evil American fascist right. So when she is associated with people who are alt-right and racists, ITS OKAY! You can't blame her for that, it's them not her! And even though she literally broke the law and put many innocent people's lives at risk.

But fucking hang Chris Pratt for attending a Church that's anti-gay. After all, if he goes to that Church he must be anti-gay too!

Either stick with guilt by association or don't, flip-flopping depending on the person to fit your political beliefs is weak.

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Hint: It's likely not the same people doing those things. Unless you have specific examples, that would be the easiest resolution to this seeming contradiction, as it often is.

 

[thebishop]

Why did you not post these FOLLOW UP LINKS that acknowledged the NYT fucking up (to put it charitably) with that article?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blog...-the-lead-in-pre-election-russia-trump-story/

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/20/public-editor/trump-russia-fbi-liz-spayd-public-editor.html

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Neither of those links is relevant to the the point:
1. Did Russia hack GOP documents in addition to DNC emails? (anonymous officials in my link suggest yes)
2. Did Russia provide those documents to wikileaks (nothing I've seen suggests this, even anonymously and evidence-free)
3. Did Wikileaks choose not to release GOP-incriminating documents they had in their possession? (see #2)

 

[BrutalInsane]

this level of jingoism is not normal

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OK. If you couldn't see, even ten years ago, that Wikileaks was only attacking 'Western' interests, than I got nothing else to say. There's nothing jingoistic about not wanting any outside entity to fuck with your own country, and at the same time wanting your own country to stop messing about in other's affairs, end the drone program, etc. Sorry, I'm not a masochist that believes 'well we did it to them, it's only fair they do it to us.'

 

[mael]

Where was Chelsea Manning in 2016?? Oh right. On a fucking hunger strike to get gender transition surgery. Maybe she has different concerns than you:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-winning-battle-for-gender-transition-surgery

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Manning being transgender is not a prop for you to use to win an argument.

 

[Stinkles]

If you want to discuss WL's approach to publishing mostly unredacted archives, we could probably find a lot of agreement. I'm mixed on the question, but mostly agree with Glenn Greenwald's criticisms of WL. But if you want to act like there weren't dozens of extremely accurate and newsworthy stories in the DNC/Podesta archive, it makes me doubt your intellectual honesty.

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But this thread is about Chelsea Manning refusing to testify about (if we're generous to her) what we now know to be a direct and aggressive cutout of the Russian government and its targeted attacks on our democratic institutions.

Nobody is subpoenaing her about her gender or hunger strike. If she still has loyalty to wikileaks then I suggest that's an objective problem under the law. None of this will have any effect on extant whistleblower content.

Michael Jackson was also a fantastic dancer but I feel different about him now than I did in 1987.