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foggy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,972
Kodaka seems like a lock to win Tournament of Survival tonight since he's BJW champ, but it certainly would be interesting if he took a pinfall in the months before GCW shows up in Japan. It should be a great show tonight. There is no weak spot in that lineup.
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
18,995
Again, you're really quick to defend anything related to HHH and WWE.
Like if you're gonna just freely throw those kinda accusations around, highlight the post.

I'll freely own up to nay posts where i defend the WWE and their Saudi shit, or their independant contractor bullshit.

If you got a screencap of me saying Sasha deserves the run she's gotten and should quit being a baby, go right the fuck ahead and post em.

Or maybe highlight where I said Vince was a hilarious motherfucker for having the Usos be homophobic as shit to the Revival. Clearly I do that all the god damn time like you're suggesting.
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,209
Like if you're gonna just freely throw those kinda accusations around, highlight the post.

I'll freely own up to nay posts where i defend the WWE and their Saudi shit, or their independant contractor bullshit.

If you got a screencap of me saying Sasha deserves the run she's gotten and should quit being a baby, go right the fuck ahead and post em.

Or maybe highlight where I said Vince was a hilarious motherfucker for having the Usos be homophobic as shit to the Revival. Clearly I do that all the god damn time like you're suggesting.

I specifically said HHH and you noted when you do it, that's all

I just have a much higher bar for referring to someone as being spoken to as "highly", especially in the context of how that summary was written up.
 

Woozies

Member
Nov 1, 2017
18,995
Now back to the shit i was talking about before this.

Why is wrestling always such a god damn travesty? I can't even fully back Joey Ryan in his dunking of Cornette cause Cornette fans easily pull up him tweeting the N word and joking about raping pregnant women.

Why is Wrestle Twitter always like this?
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,209
Moxley talking about how there should be no scripts in wrestling is a bit of a hot take. I think when you get to the level of WWE you need some kind of script, or storyboard, or something along those lines. Pairing up people with promo coaches or producers is likely needed for a lot of people because I'm sure not everyone is as creative as Moxley or Janella or Jericho.
 

Sibersk Esto

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Oct 25, 2017
16,488
Moxley talking about how there should be no scripts in wrestling is a bit of a hot take. I think when you get to the level of WWE you need some kind of script, or storyboard, or something along those lines. Pairing up people with promo coaches or producers is likely needed for a lot of people because I'm sure not everyone is as creative as Moxley or Janella or Jericho.
I didn't listen but maybe he meant no word for word scripts and instead just bullet points for everything
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,209
I didn't listen but maybe he meant no word for word scripts and instead just bullet points for everything

He specifically said 'writers' so he probably means the literal script writing. I still think you need them though because again, cutting promos is hard and coming up with stuff aint easy. Maybe they don't write the literal script but could at least offer an improv type approach of "this week continue talking about X and get in at least one comment on Y"
 

foggy

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Oct 25, 2017
12,972
Now back to the shit i was talking about before this.

Why is wrestling always such a god damn travesty? I can't even fully back Joey Ryan in his dunking of Cornette cause Cornette fans easily pull up him tweeting the N word and joking about raping pregnant women.

Why is Wrestle Twitter always like this?

Are there actual links? Because that stuff is very easily faked.
 

Slightconfuse

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,816
D71WcvTVsAAwqxK
 

Sibersk Esto

Changed the hierarchy of thread titles
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Oct 25, 2017
16,488
He specifically said 'writers' so he probably means the literal script writing. I still think you need them though because again, cutting promos is hard and coming up with stuff aint easy. Maybe they don't write the literal script but could at least offer an improv type approach of "this week continue talking about X and get in at least one comment on Y"
What Dean might be referring to is to have bookers, not writers. JR, Sullivan, and Cornette have said the same thing.

I know Cornette is (rightfully) not seen in any good light right now but this is how he describes the difference

Let's clarify our terms at the start. Pro wrestling doesn't have "writers", it has a BOOKER. "Sports entertainment" has "writers". Since Toots Mondt laid the groundwork for the position of booker back in the 20's and 30's, the booker in wrestling served as the matchmaker, deciding who would wrestle who, who would win, constructed the finishes to lead to rematches if applicable, and set up the "programs", or series of matches between two opponents. He determined the talent roster by hiring and/or firing the wrestlers who wrestled in the particular territory he was booking. As the TV era began, the booker also laid out the TV formats, came up with the angles to be worked, and gave the talent ideas for what to say in their promos.
The promoter, or owner, of the territory the booker was in charge of was the only person the booker answered to. He might have assistants to carry out his instructions, but he had sole control over any decisions relating to talent. If business was good, he stayed in the position. If business was bad, the promoter replaced him. The wrestlers, especially the main event talent, had great leeway in their performance as long as they carried out the booker's basic instructions. The booker gave the finish and any important spot, the rest of the match was up to the talent. The booker told the talent the subject and time of their TV promos, content and delivery was up to talent. As an example, Dusty Rhodes' instructions to me might be, "You've got 3 minutes, you're wrestling the Rock & Roll Express in Charlotte, last show there you interfered with the racket so this time they've asked for a cage match, and it's for the Tag Title. Go sell me some tickets."
If the talent performed the booker's angles, finishes and promos properly while getting their individual personalities and style over, they drew money. If they didn't, they were replaced with someone who did. So, in summation, a booker assembled a crew of wrestlers that he felt were unique, charismatic and talented, gave them direction and a platform on which to get over, built up their won-loss records, and then manipulated them into personal issues or title matches with other stars he felt were compelling enough that fans would pay to see them. The talent did the rest, and that's why main event stars got reputations as being able to "draw money". You often hear these days that "so and so has never drawn any money." In TODAY's environment, few particular talents "draw money", because few are put in positions to do their own thing and prove it's THEM, not the "writing", that people are paying to see.

"Writers" in the way the WWE uses them script out every little detail
 

mattsdl

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,099
Germany
Natsumi/Mizuki final would be awesome. But they wouldn't have Shoko lose clean in the QF would they?
My prediction going in was semi-finals: Yuna Manase vs Natsumi Maki and Yuka Sakazaki vs Mizuki with the final being Natsumi Maki defeating Mizuki.
I don't see why they wouldn't have Shoko lose clean in quarter-finals but who knows.
If you have Mizuki get a win over Shoko but not actually win the tournament you always have an easy title match before the Osaka show where Shoko can get her win back.
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,209
What Dean might be referring to is to have bookers, not writers. JR, Sullivan, and Cornette have said the same thing.

I know Cornette is (rightfully) not seen in any good light right now but this is how he describes the difference



"Writers" in the way the WWE uses them script out every little detail

Yeah I know the difference, and bookers/produces are needed but I still think at the szie of a WWE you need some kind of writing crew. A lot of people just can't cut promos well and need any help they can get.
 

foggy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,972
nah, just screen grabs. which is why I'm back and forth on whether it's real or somebody faking it.

Yeah I'd be inclined to give it more weight if there was context to it. Old tweets don't just magically appear unless there's a link to them or if they were screengrabbed from years back and people were talking about it when it supposedly happened. If it's a "oh hey look what I found!" thing, then I wouldn't give it any sort of weight.
 

Sweeney Swift

User Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,743
#IStandWithTaylor
Bullet points are fine. At some point I think you have to try trusting people enough with their own characters that they can make it work if they have to ad-lib some stuff. Not everyone's going to pull a Cesaro, and even Cesaro should have gotten more chances than one
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,288
One thing I'm not a super fan of is Mox being all gungho as a soldier for AEW. Doesn't seem to fit his character to me. I get promoting the product is good so I hope it was just for DON.
 

Sibersk Esto

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Oct 25, 2017
16,488
Yeah I know the difference, and bookers/produces are needed but I still think at the szie of a WWE you need some kind of writing crew. A lot of people just can't cut promos well and need any help they can get.

Anybody who knows the old booker strategy of "playing to their strengths" would know not to give a weak talker a lot to say, or usually give them a mouthpiece to do it for them. It's really only a problem if it's made into a problem.
 
Oct 26, 2017
10,499
UK
I just want Brian to know that Miyu 100% lost due to a close personal friend choosing not to watch leading to her demotivate.

My prediction going in was semi-finals: Yuna Manase vs Natsumi Maki and Yuka Sakazaki vs Mizuki with the final being Natsumi Maki defeating Mizuki.
I don't see why they wouldn't have Shoko lose clean in quarter-finals but who knows.
If you have Mizuki get a win over Shoko but not actually win the tournament you always have an easy title match before the Osaka show where Shoko can get her win back.

Just look at Miyu last year. She was a much stronger champ than Shoko is at this point and they had her lose to Nodoka. A part of my thinks that Miu could be pulling another big upset simply because of the work she's been putting in this year.

Anyway Matt, you're cancelled for suggesting we won't get to see Rika vs Mizuki in the semis or finals.
 

mattsdl

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,099
Germany
I just want Brian to know that Miyu 100% lost due to a close personal friend choosing not to watch leading to her demotivate.



Just look at Miyu last year. She was a much stronger champ than Shoko is at this point and they had her lose to Nodoka. A part of my thinks that Miu could be pulling another big upset simply because of the work she's been putting in this year.

Anyway Matt, you're cancelled for suggesting we won't get to see Rika vs Mizuki in the semis or finals.
Yuna's motivated going into the tournament because of all the attention her Ganbare match got, sorry, she's going to beat Rika next week.
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,209
One thing I'm not a super fan of is Mox being all gungho as a soldier for AEW. Doesn't seem to fit his character to me. I get promoting the product is good so I hope it was just for DON.

I think he is just energized and excited again. In the Jericho interview he said how he was indifferent about signing with another coproation. I wouldn't be surprised if the stability of WWE is something he came to enjoy from all of it, versus needing to manage so many bookings.
 

Sibersk Esto

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Oct 25, 2017
16,488
I want a 100% in kayfabe wrestling podcast interview someday
 

Brian_FETO

The Million Post Man
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,825
Kodaka seems like a lock to win Tournament of Survival tonight since he's BJW champ, but it certainly would be interesting if he took a pinfall in the months before GCW shows up in Japan. It should be a great show tonight. There is no weak spot in that lineup.
So like I thought they'd do some title change shenanigans in the lead up to GCW Japan but I keep forgetting that they're partnered with FREEDOMS out there, not with BJW

Granted it's not like they don't already have Takeda working both, but I think any real interpromotional crossover would be them

Though you then get into Gage showing up in Big Japan and oh baby
 

foggy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,972
So like I thought they'd do some title change shenanigans in the lead up to GCW Japan but I keep forgetting that they're partnered with FREEDOMS out there, not with BJW

Granted it's not like they don't already have Takeda working both, but I think any real interpromotional crossover would be them

Though you then get into Gage showing up in Big Japan and oh baby

Yeah, my thinking is Freedoms is basically running logistics for them and offering their limited roster, but BJW has been pretty generous with its talent for some time so I'm at least open to the possibility of some shenanigans tonight.

In any case, it's gonna be fucking wild. Colon/Sakuda is going to be some violent gremlin shit, Veidt is going to get eviscerated by Kodaka, Lloyd and Sasuke are going to get up to some outrageous fuckery, and the king will do some gross stuff with G Raver.
 

Brian_FETO

The Million Post Man
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Oct 25, 2017
19,825
Yeah, my thinking is Freedoms is basically running logistics for them and offering their limited roster, but BJW has been pretty generous with its talent for some time so I'm at least open to the possibility of some shenanigans tonight.

In any case, it's gonna be fucking wild. Colon/Sakuda is going to be some violent gremlin shit, Veidt is going to get eviscerated by Kodaka, Lloyd and Sasuke are going to get up to some outrageous fuckery, and the king will do some gross stuff with G Raver.
I hope Kodaka comes to play with Orin

I kinda worry that match will disappoint because Orin's matches in Chicago have been long, super bloody, tons of crazy spots, etc. That Raver/Kodaka match in Chicago was fun but really didn't have many tubes or anything. Couple of panes in the corner but that was it

Of course, there's always the very likely possibility that Orin just says "look man you don't have to do shit i'll just dive into a mess of glass and you don't have to catch me
 

Flammable D

Member
Oct 30, 2017
15,205
if we're making OTs about old stuff no-one gives a shit about anymore i should get like 3 more britwres OTs
 
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