Kendrick Lamar calls out white fan for rapping n-word onstage with him at concert [Read OP]

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[redacted]

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,042
Well, they both handled that pretty well. With that said, she shouldn't have said it. And if Lamar plans to keep inviting non-black people up to sing, he should probably quickly mention how they should handle the word, because I would expect plenty of fans singing along to have trouble just silencing themselves for one word and continuing on gracefully if they haven't been told what to do.
Yeah I agree with that, but from now on it won't be an issue I imagine considering how this has blown up.
 

torre_avenue

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,067
Behind you.
I like to tell white people that if Eminem didn't have to say the nigga/nigger to have a successful rap career, they don't have to say it either.

Practice some self restraint.
My apologies.

I completely misinterpreted your post.

I interpreted it as “If Eminem could make it big without using the n-word, black rappers don’t need to use it to succeed.”

I’m sorry for the strong remarks.
 
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rjinaz

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,844
I don't see how you can argue that with the number of red stripes in this thread. Unless all those users are trolls, this very much seems like a minefield of a topic.
Well in the literal sense, it is not difficult. You just don't let the word come out of your mouth. The problem isn't that it's difficult, it's just that people want to make it difficult by insisting there are exceptions when they can say it. But that doesn't make it "difficult" not to say the word or understand not to say the word. It's people making it difficult because they want to.
 

Pirateluigi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,977
So the other white people he's called on stage didn't say the n-word before, has he called other white people on stage (I'm sure he has before but I don't know)? Did they just fill in with another word or just skip over it if so?



You might feel that way but others don't. I'm just curious about the context around it all.
He's pulled white people up before and they didn't say it.

It's really not as hard to not say it as people like to pretend it is. Just don't say it. If you're worried about accidentally saying it in public because you say it when you sing along alone.. well don't say it alone. Just don't say it.
 

Doomsayer

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,613
Here is a video of the guy who was on stage before her. Also white. Singing the same song. Didn't say it.

https://twitter.com/juliafreeman98/status/998447068938227712?s=19

As was stated multiple times already, Kendrick does this sometimes at his concert for this song in particular. He doesn't look for white people to trick them into saying it. He will bring up anybody who wants to come up and try to perform the song with him. I think he handled this so incredibly well. If you watch the video, he's sort of joking with her and the crowd. He smiles and hugs her at the end and says "she almost had it."
Yooo, this dude fucking murdered it, lmao.
 
Oct 31, 2017
4,575
Here's what I'm getting:

Even though the song has 14 occurrences of the offensive word in it, as a white Kendrick Lamar fan, you should: A.) Never speak aloud the word in the song, even if you're singing along with it and B.) Assume that you'll be expected to self-censor the word if Kendrick Lamar himself invites you up on stage to sing his song with him.

Because it is now, and always will be, incumbent upon a white person to assume that they will never have license to use that word in any social situation or setting.

That's how this is, correct?
I don't even understand how this is so hard to grasp. Have you been going around rapping aloud to the most hardcore profane horror-core lyrics as loud as possible in public spaces like grocery stores thinking it's fine just because someone else made the song?

yes, even white people have to watch what they say
 

Dark Cloud

Member
Oct 27, 2017
41,510
It feels like Kindergarten class and the teacher has to tell you over and over to not use curse words.

Why some people making this out to be so hard? Just don’t say it.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
21,664
DFW, Texas
It does go to show you though how many people either do say the word or hear others, when their conclusion is "any White person would have said the word under that circumstance". Nah. I would have just blanked it.
Yeah I can't really relate because rap isn't my thing. (Massive classic rock fan) Outside of the major mainstream hits I have never listened to the genre and even then its only been when I am alone listening to the radio or spotify so I have never had to censor myself. (I don't sing out loud to myself) I would like to think I would know better, but in the moment and nervous as hell I could totally understand someone slipping up like she did. The fact she realized what she did and did what she did is a sign to me that she meant no harm. So I am not gonna be as hard on her as other people have been. She messed up bad and owned up to it. Then the artist cut her some slack on top of that. Overall it was a good ending to a potentially bad situation.
 
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JDFaulky

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,588
I watched the video of this incident and I cringed so hard when she dropped those n-bombs. It’s like at first she edited herself, then said it sort of quietly like she was testing the waters, then gained the confidence to yell it out all enthusiastically.

As a white dude, I was embarrassed for her. I just don’t see how you could stand 5 feet away from Kendrick Lamar and drop n-bombs in public like it’s nothing. That’s a pretty obvious no-no in my eyes.
 

DigitalOp

Member
Nov 16, 2017
7,823
J.Cole said it best on 1985.

These kids wanna be black and think these songs are how it feels.
That's straight facts right there.


Y'all are really dense, ignorant, or pathetic. Or all 3....

It's a respect thing. It's about fucking respect. We all interact differently with each other out of respect.

Stop being fucking petty.


Do you clowns bow and pretend karate at every Asian person you see?

Do you say Ese and Holmes incessantly when talking to Latin people?

Do you put on a fake accent when you talk to Middle Eastern people?

You don't?

So why does respect take a backseat for Black Americans? We don't want you saying nigga around us. Full Stop. But no, Black Americans don't deserve respect, you're gonna do what you want either way.

You have no respect for us if your going to continuously argue about why it's this way, and what's fair or not.

You don't give a fuck about us or our respect, so why the fuck should we entertain yours?
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,869
So the other white people he's called on stage didn't say the n-word before, has he called other white people on stage (I'm sure he has before but I don't know)? Did they just fill in with another word or just skip over it if so?



You might feel that way but others don't. I'm just curious about the context around it all.
The context is pretty damn simple and straight forward.
 

Commanderbuck

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
670
That's straight facts right there.


Y'all are really dense, ignorant, or pathetic. Or all 3....

It's a respect thing. It's about fucking respect. We all interact differently with each other out of respect.

Stop being fucking petty.


Do you clowns bow and pretend karate at every Asian person you see?

Do you say Ese and Holmes incessantly when talking to Latin people?

Do you put on a fake accent when you talk to Middle Eastern people?

You don't?

So why does respect take a backseat for Black Americans? We don't want you saying nigga around us. Full Stop. But no, Black Americans don't deserve respect, you're gonna do what you want either way.

You have no respect for us if your going to continuously argue about why it's this way, and what's fair or not.

You don't give a fuck about us or our respect, so why the fuck should we entertain yours?
Amen!
 

TerminusFox

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,851
Just reposting this;

How all threads on era about the N word go


1)claim to be an ally for PoC and black folks in the struggle.

2) collectively a good chunk of the people say don’t use the word nigga or bigger in any context.

3) get upset because the people you’re allied with say you can’t use a word that has racist history. “I’m just asking questions/playing devils advocate!!”

4) we PoC get disgusted but not surprised.

5) you insist it’s just a word, and emphasis is placed on us to stop using it so other people can stop using it. Take their que from us I suppose.

6) we point out how white people will use nigger regardless of whether all thirty milllion plus black people in America stop using it

7) repeat step 5

8) Repeat Step 1
 

Deleted member 835

User requested account deletion
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Oct 25, 2017
15,660
Is Brotha is OK to say? That’s my go to since it’s the same number of syllables, fits the rhyme scheme, and has a similar connotation but knowing the black community uses brotha regularly I’ve never been sure if that was OK or not. I like to sing along but want to make sure I’m doing it in an acceptable way.
Yep, bruva, brother, brotha is fine
 

offtopic

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Nov 21, 2017
673
User Banned (1 week): Arguing in bad faith.
It is simple, if you are not black, don't say it. It only becomes "difficult" when certain folks get pressed because black people are telling them they can't say a slur free of consequence.
There is no discussion to be had here.
It is an interesting topic and context does matter. As someone who would never use the word in any normal situation I am pretty sure I would if Alice Walker asked me to read a passage from The Color Purple in front of a group. I would do so knowing that she knows her work, knows what she is asking me to read and would not ask me to alter the power of her art by changing words.
 

torre_avenue

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,067
Behind you.
Mod Edit: Please don't use daily mail as a source for anything.
Publicity stunt?
Wow, who’d have thought Kendrick Lamar masterminded an elaborate plot to become even more famous than he already is, hinging solely on a white lady saying the n-word?

Christ, Occam’s Razor, folks. What’s more likely, this being a publicity stunt or just one entitled white lady doing something dumb in public.

But, hey, do your mental gymnastics.
 

nanskee

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,900
"Man down
Where you from, nigga?"
"Fuck who you know, where you from, my nigga?"
"Where your grandma stay, huh, my nigga?"
"This m.A.A.d city I run, my nigga"

what's a nonblack person supposed to say here if they're rapping along. like bleep or pause or what
neighbour https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qt5vWqSFC48

Lol there's plenty of words. Regret posting as I'm basically done with this topic, forever.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
21,664
DFW, Texas
It is an interesting topic and context does matter. As someone who would never use the word in any normal situation I am pretty sure I would if Alice Walker asked me to read a passage from The Color Purple in front of a group. I would do so knowing that she knows her work, knows what she is asking me to read and would not ask me to alter the power of her art by changing words.
People made the same argument in the last thread man. Its not the same.


I think plenty of people here have made that very evident.
 

DigitalOp

Member
Nov 16, 2017
7,823
Holy fuck, this sounds so pompous.

You sound so holier-than-thou with this, and I know it comes from a place of ignorance.
You mad as shit right now that his point was ironclad and has no holes.

So you post this shit that has essentially 0 substance besides "How dare you"

Eminem is a multi award winning artist, an icon to HipHop. He's never had to say the word.

But y'all apparently need to? Because imitating my fav rapper is more important than actually making music?
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,709
I don't see how you can argue that with the number of red stripes in this thread. Unless all those users are trolls, this very much seems like a minefield of a topic.
Hey, guess what. Don't say the word, don't get banned. Don't argue for the use of saying the word, don't get banned. Don't pretend that the moderators are being tyrants for making sure a racist, disgusting word isn't used, don't get banned. Wow, that was easy.
 

BigJeffery

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,338
You mad as shit right now that his point was ironclad and has no holes.

So you post this shit that has essentially 0 substance besides "How dare you"

Eminem is a multi award winning artist, an icon to HipHop. He's never had to say the word.

But y'all apparently need to? Because imitating my fav rapper is more important than actually making music?
Maybe I missed the post in the thread, but did anyone in the thread say that they have to say the n-word because they're trying to be a successful rapper?

I don't think white people should say it, but I also don't think the Eminem argument is very strong.
 

Idolvo

The Fallen
Jan 25, 2018
5,240
"Man down
Where you from, nigga?"
"Fuck who you know, where you from, my nigga?"
"Where your grandma stay, huh, my nigga?"
"This m.A.A.d city I run, my nigga"

what's a nonblack person supposed to say here if they're rapping along. like bleep or pause or what
I guess pause?

Glad I'm not a rap fan lol.

If you are white. Don't use the N word. Even if it's in the lyrics. It really is that simple.
 

torre_avenue

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
10,067
Behind you.
You mad as shit right now that his point was ironclad and has no holes.

So you post this shit that has essentially 0 substance besides "How dare you"

Eminem is a multi award winning artist, an icon to HipHop. He's never had to say the word.

But y'all apparently need to? Because imitating my fav rapper is more important than actually making music?
Oh, I entirely misread that post.

I interpreted it as “Eminem became famous without having to use the n-word, so black rappers don’t need to use it either.”

That’s entirely my bad, sorry.
 

TerminusFox

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,851
The very first thing a white person that wants to say nigga needs to ask themselves is "WHY do I want to say this word? Why does it bother me that I can't say this word?"

Do some introspection for fucks sake.
 

okayfrog

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,968
Hey, guess what. Don't say the word, don't get banned. Don't argue for the use of saying the word, don't get banned. Don't pretend that the moderators are being tyrants for making sure a racist, disgusting word isn't used, don't get banned. Wow, that was easy.
Only one or two people in this thread were actually banned for any of that.

For the record, my posts in this thread aren't meant to be complaints regarding the moderation of this forum and I hope they are not being taken this way. I am merely arguing that due to the large amount of bans in this thread from users who (I personally believe) are not trolls nor racists, that this is definitely a very difficult and touchy subject to discuss on this forum, as others have brought up. I also don't intend to derail so this will be my last post regarding this.
 

carlsojo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,418
San Francisco
I honestly don't know why the thread was reopened. It's either people telling other people not to use the word or people trying to justify context of saying the word. There's no good discussion and there isn't going to be.
 

offtopic

Member
Nov 21, 2017
673
People made the same argument in the last thread man. Its not the same.


I think plenty of people here have made that very evident.
Sorry I came in late and didn't see the last thread.

I was responding to a blanket statement about 'white should people never say that word'. Nothing is ever 'the same' but an artist asking a fan to reproduce their work makes the two cases not all that dissimilar. There are certain other contexts where the use of the word is 'appropriate' (acting, academics).
 

[redacted]

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,042
Whether people don't want to understand the context or don't care doesn't mean it isn't simple as it gets
I want to understand, because to me the context is she was asked to come on stage and sing a song that has the n-word, but not say the n-word, with no one telling her to not sing the n-word but to sing the song that had the n-word in it.

The very first thing a white person that wants to say nigga needs to ask themselves is "WHY do I want to say this word? Why does it bother me that I can't say this word?"

Do some introspection for fucks sake.
Because those are the lyrics to the song I was asked to sing.
 

Kyra

The Eggplant Queen
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Oct 25, 2017
7,302
New York City
Yeah, it's basically required in a movie like that. And the lack of it, even once, is what pulled me out of "IT" because King uses it in his novel to highlight the racism in Derry.
I think at one point we need to have a discussion about this.. Some people may not think is that much of a difference between these situations as they are both portrayal a of art pieces.

And some people may not feel that it should be allowed in films as it puts a hole in don't say it ever.
 

CopperPuppy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,465
Holy fuck, this sounds so pompous.

You sound so holier-than-thou with this, and I know it comes from a place of ignorance.
What the fuck?

How is that coming from a place of ignorance?

Dude is absolutely right, Em became a rap icon and never needed to say it

Get outta here with this "you sound pompous," "you sound holier-than-thou" trash
 

samoyed

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,375
There are certain unspoken rules governing discourse. This is called decorum, or civility, and it is a social contract between people whether strangers or friends.

For example, you generally don’t say “suck my dick” to your parents, professors, or bosses.

When you transgress that contract, and there’s really nothing to stop you from doing so except your own self control, do not be surprised when you’re vilified for it.

Why is there a social contract surrounding n*****?

Because it is a word and words are symbols and it is a symbol of oppression, which carries with it emotional power like a cross, or a swastika. Because of that power, it is used in the creation of art or the study of it to convey certain messages to audiences, in this case, it encapsulates the struggles of the African diaspora.

It’s usage between blacks and by black artists signal a shared struggle due to the social position of blacks in countries over the world. However, when the word is used by white people, it’s rarely evocative of its full meaning. It becomes then a kind of kitsch, an intentional transgression of the norm because some people, particularly youth, love flirting with danger.

And this trivializes and mocks the struggles the word is meant to convey in its reclaimation by the black community.

To add insult to injury, whites, as descendents of the oppressing group have the gall to lecture the oppressed group about how they should and should not feel about their own struggle, even as they perpetuate that oppression explicitly or implicitly by disrespecting the wishes of blacks, mocking them with cockamamie hypotheticals, or putting the onus on them to stop using the symbol of their shared struggle because they deeply want to say n***** with impunity.
 

Nappuccino

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,761
I don't think we should just say whatever word we want ontop--that's basically another example of erasure. Silence or permission to use the word from the artist are the only acceptable things I can think of.

The very first thing a white person that wants to say nigga needs to ask themselves is "WHY do I want to say this word? Why does it bother me that I can't say this word?"

Do some introspection for fucks sake.
It is an odd situation, being pulled on stage. You want to be respectful of the song--but, of course, what is respectful is up for debate.
 

Enzom21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,989
So the other white people he's called on stage didn't say the n-word before, has he called other white people on stage (I'm sure he has before but I don't know)? Did they just fill in with another word or just skip over it if so?



You might feel that way but others don't. I'm just curious about the context around it all.
What is your goal with these questions? What are you trying to learn/understand?
It seems you have an opinion about what happened and the use of the word but you're asking questions instead of expressing it.
These discussions would probably go a lot smother if people would actually get to the point they are attempting to make.
So what is your goal with this discussion?

--
By the way, non-black PoC don't have a "nigga pass".
 

the_wart

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,521
Assuming that you are entitled or obliged insight into a marginalized culture or group simply because you're curious is a part of privilege. If nobody within that marginalized culture or group wants to put in the effort to teach you or feels that you need to know anything beyond "here's what you do/don't say," then that's their decision to make, not yours.
If someone lays out sweeping edicts about prohibited behavior across a wide variety of different contexts and then refuses to explain or argue for them, then they shouldn't be surprised if they are not taken seriously. Maybe I missed it, but I have not seen any actual arguments in this thread as to why saying the n-word in the context of a quotation from a song is somehow commensurate to using it unprompted in a normal conversation. Are white people supposed to pretend the word doesn't exist? What purpose is that supposed to serve? If a white scholar were doing their doctorate in linguistics on the usage of the n-word, would you insist that never actually write or say the word? Why?

I have no problem with what Kendrick Lamar did in this context -- I can't say I'm convinced of the logic behind it but it was a respectful interaction. But the reactions in this thread are pretty damn inexplicable to me.
 

Gordon Shumway

Self-Requested Ban
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Oct 25, 2017
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Why don't you just post the actual point you're trying to make and save all some time here. Do you want a pass because you have been called it twice?
Charlie Sheen used to call Denise Richards a nigger, should she get a pass too?
lol WHAT? This was a thing? Was he has about Undercover Brother?
I dont know why is it so hard for some of you not to say a word. Especially a word that wouldn't even come up in regular conversation. Can you control yourself in what you say at work? With family? With kids? Why is it so hard for some of you?
Heh..you sure about that?
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,869
I want to understand, because to me the context is she was asked to come on stage and sing a song that has the n-word, but not say the n-word, with no one telling her to not sing the n-word but to sing the song that had the n-word in it.
As a non black person don't say the word. It's simple as that. Being in ther song lyrics doesn't somehow negate everything awful about that word as used by everyone who isn't black.

If someone lays out sweeping edicts about prohibited behavior across a wide variety of different contexts and then refuses to explain or argue for them, then they shouldn't be surprised if they are not taken seriously. Maybe I missed it, but I have not seen any actual arguments in this thread as to why saying the n-word in the context of a quotation from a song is somehow commensurate to using it unprompted in a normal conversation. Are white people supposed to pretend the word doesn't exist? What purpose is that supposed to serve? If a white scholar were doing their doctorate in linguistics on the usage of the n-word, would you insist that never actually write or say the word? Why?

I have no problem with what Kendrick Lamar did in this context -- I can't say I'm convinced of the logic behind it but it was a respectful interaction. But the reactions in this thread are pretty damn inexplicable to me.
I'd say the same thing to you. This shit isn't rocket science
 

Brinbe

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
21,129
Terana
Had the same convo on this with my white roommate and similar to him, a lot of white ppl just don't fucking get it at all. It doesn't matter if you're just trying to rhyme along. Just don't fucking say it. How's that a hard social cue to learn and use?

And I've said it before in other threads, even as a Filipino, I'll never use that word because i have enough respect for my close black friends/family to just fucking know better. And i have absolutely zero inclination to ever say it at all.

And I've said this before, but i cringe to all hell when i see Asians say it to so freely.
 

Pirateluigi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,977
I want to understand, because to me the context is she was asked to come on stage and sing a song that has the n-word, but not say the n-word, with no one telling her to not sing the n-word but to sing the song that had the n-word in it.



Because those are the lyrics to the song I was asked to sing.
You just omit the word. If you're old enough to go to the concert, you're old enough to know not to say that word if you're white. No one should have to tell her in advance.

This really isn't complicated.
 
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