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Kinda Funny |OT| A Baker's Dozen!
- Thread starter Calderc
- Start date
Yeah that's why the Greg and Andrea combo is the worst on KFGD.
I think Andrea has some really questionable takes on a lot of subjects. But I don't want to single her out too much so I'll break it down like this: all the different variations of hosts are willing to call each out and actually debate stuff. But Greg just doesn't seem to want to engage her ever. It probably comes from a good place, from him being aware of how much shit she gets every day for being a woman on the gaming side of youtube. Still, they are charismatic together but when it comes to having discussions on important subjects, they almost always find a way to embarrass themselves.
Honestly, I have kind of disengaged from most KF content lately. They just don't seem informed enough about the games they talk about. And what they have to say about the industry is becoming more and more difficult to listen to because of how incredibly embedded they are with so many companies. I listened to the latest gamescast for the first time in months and the way Tim "advertised" the Days Gone talk felt so weird. "See? We can talk trash about games sometimes. We're not shills!" It felt a bit forced.
I feel bad for adding to the negativity. I really like the crew individually, I've been following Greg for 10+ years at this point. Their content isn't really for me anymore, that's fine. I do hope that they will listen to some of these criticisms a bit and refocus their approach and their content. Even though I do sympathize with the fact that it must be difficult to truly pay attention to it when so many people are shouting at you on the internet.
I think Andrea has some really questionable takes on a lot of subjects. But I don't want to single her out too much so I'll break it down like this: all the different variations of hosts are willing to call each out and actually debate stuff. But Greg just doesn't seem to want to engage her ever. It probably comes from a good place, from him being aware of how much shit she gets every day for being a woman on the gaming side of youtube. Still, they are charismatic together but when it comes to having discussions on important subjects, they almost always find a way to embarrass themselves.
Honestly, I have kind of disengaged from most KF content lately. They just don't seem informed enough about the games they talk about. And what they have to say about the industry is becoming more and more difficult to listen to because of how incredibly embedded they are with so many companies. I listened to the latest gamescast for the first time in months and the way Tim "advertised" the Days Gone talk felt so weird. "See? We can talk trash about games sometimes. We're not shills!" It felt a bit forced.
I feel bad for adding to the negativity. I really like the crew individually, I've been following Greg for 10+ years at this point. Their content isn't really for me anymore, that's fine. I do hope that they will listen to some of these criticisms a bit and refocus their approach and their content. Even though I do sympathize with the fact that it must be difficult to truly pay attention to it when so many people are shouting at you on the internet.
It is really annoying how Gaming side and Etcetera are either at 0 or 100 with nothing in between.
Andrea really needs to apologize and stop doubling down when she is wrong.
Andrea really needs to apologize and stop doubling down when she is wrong.
On the subject of being informed/uninformed: I often wonder whether the "You're wrong" segment has a detrimental effect. For example, if you include the context of the amount of content created/produced, the travelling, business admin not to mention personal lives etc etc - it's got to be hard to keep across the top level of being informed. Especially when you're dealing with stuff which maybe you don't have a lot of time to prepare for ahead of your daily news show because of when the story breaks. (side note - has this lack of being informed coincided with the show being released earlier in the day?)
Where this ties into "You're wrong" is that you have the crutch to fall back on people correcting you. I'm not saying a host might go in deliberately uninformed or anything, just that having this safety net might breed an unintentional complacency - "If I get it wrong, then we have something that'll correct us". Whilst I think that is a really good system to have for accuracy reasons, it doesn't prevent the misinformed discussion or takeaway from a subject - which listeners/viewers may find jarring or unappealing.
Where this ties into "You're wrong" is that you have the crutch to fall back on people correcting you. I'm not saying a host might go in deliberately uninformed or anything, just that having this safety net might breed an unintentional complacency - "If I get it wrong, then we have something that'll correct us". Whilst I think that is a really good system to have for accuracy reasons, it doesn't prevent the misinformed discussion or takeaway from a subject - which listeners/viewers may find jarring or unappealing.
Well trusting in them and supporting them after Colin was a big mistake it seems. I'm out. This whole thing made me feel like shit and seeing how some people have defended this garbage especially knowing how the rabbit hole goes starting with people like them not hard condemning shittyness is just heart breaking(people need to learn on how radicalization works).
Yeah I'm not sure a Resetera angry mob was the best way to resolve this... I hope they're able to be receptive to the criticism and respond accordingly instead of dismissing it as "resetera being resetera". Lots of people definitely going overboard in that thread.
Yeah, maybe Lebguns can request for the thread to be closed now?
It's the type of thread where there'll be a substantial amount of people who will read the topic header, bounce in with a take and that's that - rather than listen to the content. Ironically, somewhat uninformed.
To me, it highlights the dangers of trying to deal with this sort of subject in a show like Games Daily whilst being under-informed. The show's structure doesn't help either because they tend to try and keep the duration of the show somewhat tighter these days.
I'm surprised at Greg's response being called out - it seems fairly clear to me that he takes responsibility for the lack of clarity and the OP getting something different from what he was intending. Yet folk seem pretty intent on suggesting he's passing the blame onto the OP. which isn't the case at all as far as I could tell.
This will be a rough spell for him/them, but I expect a longer, thought out and genuine response taking ownership of everything will be forthcoming today. This whole thing is unfortunate, but should probably be an eye opener. I think one of the posts from a mod in there re: assuming your previous stances serving as a testament, was salient. It's the type of environment where one day of simply being less stringent in calling something out/shutting down shitty comments is negative.
To me, it highlights the dangers of trying to deal with this sort of subject in a show like Games Daily whilst being under-informed. The show's structure doesn't help either because they tend to try and keep the duration of the show somewhat tighter these days.
I'm surprised at Greg's response being called out - it seems fairly clear to me that he takes responsibility for the lack of clarity and the OP getting something different from what he was intending. Yet folk seem pretty intent on suggesting he's passing the blame onto the OP. which isn't the case at all as far as I could tell.
This will be a rough spell for him/them, but I expect a longer, thought out and genuine response taking ownership of everything will be forthcoming today. This whole thing is unfortunate, but should probably be an eye opener. I think one of the posts from a mod in there re: assuming your previous stances serving as a testament, was salient. It's the type of environment where one day of simply being less stringent in calling something out/shutting down shitty comments is negative.
Yep this has definitely happened in the thread. You can tell which people genuinely know their content and those who's last touchstone for KF was the Colin incident; all that "no wonder he was friends with Colin for so long" stuff makes it obvious.
I don't disagree that they needed to be called out over this, and there are definitely some valid and worthwhile points being raised, but saying they should be banned from Era or the entire company should be folded is hardly constructive criticism is it?
Interestingly someone made a post on the subreddit about the Era thread and most of the responses were also calling them out on the KFGD segment. I would have thought that community would be a lot more lenient on those sorts of things.
Because he doesn't deserve the heat he's getting in that topic. I agree Andrea was being a little odd that segment but Greg is the exact opposite of what people paint him as in that topic.
I really hope he doesn't feel bad because of it
BUT WAIT I READ ON REDDIT THAT YOU ARE ALWAYS OVERLY NEGATIVE! WHAT IS THIS!?
Name a more iconic duo than ResetEra reading headline and ignoring the actual content.
Tbh it normally is imo, and I was kind of surprised seeing the comments this morning too. Usually I stay on this OT because I feel like the posters in here are more critical on the team for the right reasons, as opposed to the subreddit where everyone's just super laxed on giving them any critique.
This is a byproduct of standing by Andrea no matter what. It was inevitable she was going to cross the line whether it be by stanning for some corporate micro transaction mess, anti-consumerism, or afraid of getting on anyone's bad side. She is incapable of being wrong, and it sucks to see Greg lumped in with her
I barely listen to KFGD (the only KF content I still consume once in a while) but after the anthem discussion I don't even bother if Andrea is on.
This was inevitable.
When you focus more and more on things other than what you are supposed to talk on a daily gaming podcast, you refuse to take stands, you refuse to tell you co-hosts they are wrong, you keep talking about being positive as a defense mechanism for not engaging in deep discussions, you are less and less informed about the industry, you only seem to care about not burning bridges for future business collaborations, I feel it was just a matter of time
Step one: either get rid of Andrea or keep her in check.
Step two: either do a daily gamin news podcast or don't. if you can't keep up and have serious discussions it's ok to just admit it and either bring on people that can do that or do something else
I honestly think Greg is a good person and I hope he can see what is happening, why and try to implement needed changes
oh, that thread is disgusting
This was inevitable.
When you focus more and more on things other than what you are supposed to talk on a daily gaming podcast, you refuse to take stands, you refuse to tell you co-hosts they are wrong, you keep talking about being positive as a defense mechanism for not engaging in deep discussions, you are less and less informed about the industry, you only seem to care about not burning bridges for future business collaborations, I feel it was just a matter of time
Step one: either get rid of Andrea or keep her in check.
Step two: either do a daily gamin news podcast or don't. if you can't keep up and have serious discussions it's ok to just admit it and either bring on people that can do that or do something else
I honestly think Greg is a good person and I hope he can see what is happening, why and try to implement needed changes
oh, that thread is disgusting
OP
OP
This is another situation of absolutely shitty timing for Greg, just like the Colin thing when it blew up and they immediately left for PAX. If he could address this on KFGD today he could go some way to appeasing this and making a further statement, but no of course he has to be in LA for Borderlands.
if they didn't bother talking about topics they don't know anything / enough about, this would have all been avoided.
But then you'd get people complaining that they aren't discussing the big news stories of the week.
They should just really do a bit more research once the news list locked in but before going live.
I think they said all the shows were being done later due to the Borderlands stream? I can't remember.
They can still discuss the big news stories and research beforehand. Everyone else manages it.
Problem is they do the news show so early in the day. What other daily video game news show is out there that they have to compete with? They have all the time needed to do some research and react accordingly. There is no rush I don't think?
With that said, I wonder how the team of Gary and Fran would have handled that days topic. I'm assuming they would have been more self aware? I like Gary and Fran so I maybe bias on the matter though.
Yeah, that's the thing. He is less informed than the other hosts about the current videogame industry (not saying that as an insult) but he would have understood the news story instantly, said "well, good on Microsoft and fuck Notch" and that would have been that.
What I don't understand is how/why Greg understood that MS was essentially banning Notch (my reading of it as well), yet Andrea was so flabbergasted that Greg read it that way. I'm pretty sure she was one of the few that read it the way she did. I mean, it's pretty cut and dry.
Taking a bit of a detour here, but does anyone find Tim's "I only like games if they offer me the quickest way through the story possible" stance really fucking dumb? Today on Gamescast he basically said he only likes games where he can beat the story as quickly as possible, and being able to "mainline" Horizon is the only reason he liked that game. It genuinely sounds like he doesn't enjoy the act of playing video games, and based on the fact he plays like 1 new thing per month it wouldn't surprise me if that was actually true.
It's becoming almost impossible to listen to these guys. Greg only like GAAS games or Ubisoft checklist games, Tim plays nothing and seemingly barely likes video games, and Fran couldn't properly describe a video game experience if his life depended on it. The other periphery members who occasionally jump on Gamescast like Andy, Barrett, Joey, Kevin barely play anything, so they can't even cover it all up with their experiences. I listen to Kinda Funny and then go off and listen to Kotaku's Splitscreen or Waypoint Radio (who often talk about games I couldn't care less about), and the experience is just so much more enjoyable. It's night and day.
It's becoming almost impossible to listen to these guys. Greg only like GAAS games or Ubisoft checklist games, Tim plays nothing and seemingly barely likes video games, and Fran couldn't properly describe a video game experience if his life depended on it. The other periphery members who occasionally jump on Gamescast like Andy, Barrett, Joey, Kevin barely play anything, so they can't even cover it all up with their experiences. I listen to Kinda Funny and then go off and listen to Kotaku's Splitscreen or Waypoint Radio (who often talk about games I couldn't care less about), and the experience is just so much more enjoyable. It's night and day.
This was precisely the reason I actively went and sought out and found Frame Trap by Easy Allies in 2017. It's nothing new, they're just getting worse and worse. Don't know the last Gamescast I even listened to at this point. Awful podcast imo.
That thread has certainly gone out of hand, but I think closing it would reinforce that it's ok to handwave people who support bigotry and hate. At best, it got Greg to take a look at it, and granted there were a lot of amazing in-depth posts from many users, especially a lot of you in this community thread, that I believe added value and pointed out the problems. At worst, it brought out all these people with sharpened knives with Greg Miller's name on them.
Honestly, all it would have needed. This is what was utterly disheartening to me. How do you read tweets from someone saying "being white is ok" and a story about a man paying 2 people to hold a sign that says "death to all Jews" and not come down hard on that?
Side note: seeing how many people have gotten banned on that thread for downplaying racist behavior is also appalling. We have a problem in this forum, and we lean pretty left. This is all the more reason influencers need to step up.
All anyone had to do is say "fuck X, Y, Z and good on Microsoft" and leave it at that.
Considering these people are in both content creation and the gaming industry, they should be aware of what is happening in their industry. Its like Sway in the Morning or The Breakfast Club being utterly unaware of R Kelly's situation. You might not give a shit about R Kelly but you at the very least know for a fact that he's a complete trashbag. Andrea's doubling down is utterly bizarre because why would anyone take this stand when you should have a rough idea of what is going on.
Maybe I'm alone here but the fact that the thread in the base Gaming Forum has shit Greg did 7 years ago under a microscope is so lame. I am sure he regrets doing it and has apologized since. How is it relevant to the discussion on Minecraft?
I don't think so. It's gone over 30 pages now and off the rails.
That's the typical pattern whenever a public figure has made a mistake or a perceived mistake. People will dig up anything else they can find to try and character assassinate that person. It's not limited to this forum or anything, it's just something that happens on the internet these days.
I feel like that thread has focused way too much on Greg and not enough on Andrea; in my opinion her side of the conversation was a lot worse. I guess it's because this forum is more aware of Greg and would probably expect better of him?
I have problems with the whole bringing up seven year old videos thing. Similarly I saw someone suggest Greg's content should be blacklisted, which is laughable tbh. If you did that to everyone who dropped the ball with a wishy-washy statement you'd be blacklisting a lot of people. That's not excusing it, it's simply saying it's not an effective method of enforcing accountability.
This whole thing isn't going to go away until either responds in a more in depth fashion - on camera, via responding to the thread or something on twitter - IMO they need to anyway.
This whole thing isn't going to go away until either responds in a more in depth fashion - on camera, via responding to the thread or something on twitter - IMO they need to anyway.
That other thread has become a joke. Comparing Greg-fucking-Miller of all people to a Nazi... This has spiraled out way harder than it ever should have.
EDIT: I'm a dumbass and misintepreted the post I was referencing. Still though, this whole situation is just sad.
EDIT: I'm a dumbass and misintepreted the post I was referencing. Still though, this whole situation is just sad.
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It's spiralled out of control - unfortunate that the thread has coincided with them all doing the Borderlands event. I imagine we'd have had a further response if that weren't the case.
The whole situation is probably going to be an educational process of sorts, which can only be a good thing in the long run.
For some reason your post reminded me of how befuddled I was when gamescast first started. They had the two biggest people in PlayStation media during the ps3 generation, doing a podcast hosted by someone who didn't play the biggest PlayStation 3 series (uncharted) for 10 months, until November 2015. That's crazy to me. You know 99% of fans are coming over from podcast beyond. And your hosting what could be your biggest show and you don't brush up on the biggest series beforehand?
That's been kinda funny's gaming content for me since the beginning. There are clearly things they can probably do/play to improve their shows but they just refuse to because they're their own bosses.
If I wasn't so in love with the goldfarb+clements era of beyond I would have stopped checking in KF periodically to see if things had improved years ago.
Lots of post cherry picking from people complaining in here(people getting upset about some of the worst post and trying to justify closing the thread based on that without acknowledging a ton of people having made legit points that should be taken seriously) but at this point that's just expected. Tribalism in full force again.
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