Kiseki/Trails Community|OT|Familiar faces~, Zemurian places—SPOILERTAGS OR DIE!

Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
Sooo...

With the CS3 release being close and CS4 probably all but confirmed. When you think we can hear more about the next kiseki title?

YSIX was just released in Japan, an Falcom probably was already working in another title, but sometimes they release a stand alone or spin off between Ys and Kiseki (Tokyo Xanadu, Nayuta)

So for those who are following the Japanese news, what seems to be Falcom future releases?
 

Yunyo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,524
Next kiseki title will 99% likely be given more details at the falcom shareholder meeting. We may see a new website open, or just a title drop with some screenshots. Whether I continue the kiseki series or not depends on how they handle the next game.... though when I write it out like that, it sounds kinda melodramatic... sorry about that.

If I had a guess, the next kiseki title (which will be an intermediary title) will be Falcom's next September game. They're probably going to take two years to develop the first game of the next arc. They wanted to go back to two games per year, but that may just be wishful thinking from Kondo.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
So for those who are following the Japanese news, what seems to be Falcom future releases?
They have already announced the new Kiseki game and showed some screenshots. It will be focused around some unresolved plot lines from Cs4, the screenshots/art show some characters from CS and the Crossbell games (some of them secondary characters like Gaiu's brother or Scarlet). The new MCs from the game seem to be a girl with pink hair and a boy with brown hair.



From the screenshots they shared, it seems to run on the same engine as CsII/IV:


Whether I continue the kiseki series or not depends on how they handle the next game.... though when I write it out like that, it sounds kinda melodramatic... sorry about that.
Was CS IV that bad? I have only played the official English releases, so I've yet to play the new CS games or the Crossbell arc. Currently I plan to play Zero using the fan edit and then Ao, and later the NISA transladed games (I'm sure CS IV will come next year tbh).

I've mostly read positive impressions on the Crossbell saga and CS III, and mixed opinions on IV.
 
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Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
If I had a guess, the next kiseki title (which will be an intermediary title) will be Falcom's next September game. They're probably going to take two years to develop the first game of the next arc. They wanted to go back to two games per year, but that may just be wishful thinking from Kondo.
They have already announced the new Kiseki game and showed some screenshots. It will be focused around some unresolved plot lines from Cs4, the screenshots/art show some characters from CS and the Crossbell games (some of them secondary characters like Gaiu's brother or Scarlet). The new MCs from the game seem to be a girl with pink hair and a boy with brown hair.
Thanks! I wasn't following Japanese news from fear of being spoiled.

So we are having a new title in Erebonia? Maybe it will be like Sky 3. (An epilogue, closing plot threads and teasing for the next titles)

Buut, I have to confess I don't dislike ToCS but I can't wait for the next continent. Erebonia Arc didn't have the best pacing in the story from what I played and hear. So a clean state and New MC can do wonders.

PS: The pink lady... That's Scarlet isnt?
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
PS: The pink lady... That's Scarlet isnt?
No, if you look the Dengeki magazine cover, you'll notice that besides all the characters from older games there's 2 new characters (they're facing backwards):


IIRC the info about the new game and some screenshots was revealed in this magazine, so it's safe to assume that those two will be important characters in the new game.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
Buut, I have to confess I don't dislike ToCS but I can't wait for the next continent. Erebonia Arc didn't have the best pacing in the story from what I played and hear. So a clean state and New MC can do wonders.
I've only played the 2 first games. ToCS was my first Kiseki game, so all the lore etc... was completely new for me and I enjoyed the game a lot. ToCS II felt too long IMO, it has some good developments and some interesting revelations but it feels stretched. What I've heard about ToCS III is mostly praise, and most people that has finished ToCS IV seems to agree that the game tried to do too many things and close too many character arcs, and that it kinds of failed to do it succesfully.
 

Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
I've only played the 2 first games. ToCS was my first Kiseki game, so all the lore etc... was completely new for me and I enjoyed the game a lot. ToCS II felt too long IMO, it has some good developments and some interesting revelations but it feels stretched. What I've heard about ToCS III is mostly praise, and most people that has finished ToCS IV seems to agree that the game tried to do too many things and close too many character arcs, and that it kinds of failed to do it succesfully.
Now I understand, thought the MCs were from the other image.

I played the Sky trilogy and saw a little of Zero. So it was impossible to me to not compare Cold Steel with the older entries.

I only played CSI and CS2 too. And like you only heard impressions of the next 2 games. Since I didn't play I can only speculate, but from what I hear the biggest problem is that Cold Steel arc is that it tried to do too much with too many new characters thus not developing some of them and not showing in a believable way their friendship.

What I mean is that in CS2 we always hear about how they were close, but we don't see half the cast interacting with each other ever in CS1 and CS2.

And CS4 have to finish the 12 class VII characters arcs + the 5 new class VII characters + Crossbell and Liberl plot points + Some returning characters + Ouroboros characters and motives + Erebonia Lore and plot points.
Because of this, it all became too much too write making the pacing to suffer, some things being rushed and because we are waiting 10+ years to see the conclusion it doesn't feel as rewarding.

But I have to say it again the CSIV part is only speculation based from what I did hear and playing the first half of the story.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,096
They have already announced the new Kiseki game and showed some screenshots. It will be focused around some unresolved plot lines from Cs4, the screenshots/art show some characters from CS and the Crossbell games (some of them secondary characters like Gaiu's brother or Scarlet). The new MCs from the game seem to be a girl with pink hair and a boy with brown hair.



From the screenshots they shared, it seems to run on the same engine as CsII/IV:



Was CS IV that bad? I have only played the official English releases, so I've yet to play the new CS games or the Crossbell arc. Currently I plan to play Zero using the fan edit and then Ao, and later the NISA transladed games (I'm sure CS IV will come next year tbh).

I've mostly read positive impressions on the Crossbell saga and CS III, and mixed opinions on IV.
I love that Scarlet will be making a reappearance in the next Kiseki game. I really enjoyed her character in CS and was disappointed her arc wasn't expanded upon.
 

PK Gaming

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,022
No, if you look the Dengeki magazine cover, you'll notice that besides all the characters from older games there's 2 new characters (they're facing backwards):


IIRC the info about the new game and some screenshots was revealed in this magazine, so it's safe to assume that those two will be important characters in the new game.
Tangentially related but that piece of art is one of my favorite video game images... ever

So much energy and emotion packed into a single illustration. I haven't even played the Zero games yet, but it makes me feel a certain way
 

Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
No, if you look the Dengeki magazine cover, you'll notice that besides all the characters from older games there's 2 new characters (they're facing backwards):

IIRC the info about the new game and some screenshots was revealed in this magazine, so it's safe to assume that those two will be important characters in the new game.
Now that i'm seeing on the PC i can see that the pink haired MC seems to be holding a giant stuffed bear, maybe a younger girl this time?
Please Falcom, dont make it weird...

And seeing Alisa on this image only makes me realize how little she is involved in the series story or lore compared to the others.
Maybe in ToCS3 and ToCS4 i'll change my opinion but this character really suffered from Falcom chosing to not make a canon pairing.
 

PK Gaming

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,022
And seeing Alisa on this image only makes me realize how little she is involved in the series story or lore compared to the others.
Maybe in ToCS3 and ToCS4 i'll change my opinion but this character really suffered from Falcom chosing to not make a canon pairing.
Her relevancy in the story isn't dependant on whether she's Rean canon romantic partner or not.

But it is undeniable that she becomes less important as the series goes along, with CS1--->CS2 being a steep drop
 

Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
Her relevancy in the story isn't dependant on whether she's Rean canon romantic partner or not.

But it is undeniable that she becomes less important as the series goes along, with CS1--->CS2 being a steep drop
Yes, not that a woman have to be dependant on the MC to be important.
Its just that one of her best scenes is recomforting Rean, and i think that if they went in that route BOTH characters would benefit from a writing viewpoint.

Someone commented earlier that since she is really good with machines, she could be paired with Valimar as a mechanic, researcher or something and that's a good ideia imo.
It would make her be involved into the story and make her have personal motivations instead of just being there
 

PK Gaming

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,022
Waiting for the Geofront translation. I'm so close to experiencing it...

Yes, not that a woman have to be dependant on the MC to be important.
Its just that one of her best scenes is recomforting Rean, and i think that if they went in that route BOTH characters would benefit from a writing viewpoint.

Someone commented earlier that since she is really good with machines, she could be paired with Valimar as a mechanic, researcher or something and that's a good ideia imo.
It would make her be involved into the story and make her have personal motivations instead of just being there
Oh, I can definitely agree with that. Without getting into spoilers, CSIII & IV do more for her character than 2 did, which needlessly craters her character.

But yeah, I can't help feeling this immense sense of disappointment, that she should have been Rean's partner (like Joshua was to Estelle) instead of just being another face
 

nivorae

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,497
Now that i'm seeing on the PC i can see that the pink haired MC seems to be holding a giant stuffed bear, maybe a younger girl this time?
Please Falcom, dont make it weird...

And seeing Alisa on this image only makes me realize how little she is involved in the series story or lore compared to the others.
Maybe in ToCS3 and ToCS4 i'll change my opinion but this character really suffered from Falcom chosing to not make a canon pairing.
if those two people are who we think they are it'll be very interesting
 

Lozange

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
And take out singa please
Nah from what I hear Singa's gotten pretty good recently, barring the odd misstep. Although he's been showing signs of improvement for a while now.
Also with the current musical situation at Falcom (aka the lack of people there in house), I think soundtracks would just have to have less music without Singa. Which isn't great.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
BTW reviews for Sen III are confirmed to be released Oct 15, some content creators have already confirmed that they have the full game and that the review embargo date is the abovementioned one.

As some of them are big Kiseki fans, we will have a pretty good opinion about the localization quality a week before the game releases.
 

lucancel

Member
Oct 30, 2017
402
Nah from what I hear Singa's gotten pretty good recently, barring the odd misstep. Although he's been showing signs of improvement for a while now.
Also with the current musical situation at Falcom (aka the lack of people there in house), I think soundtracks would just have to have less music without Singa. Which isn't great.
Sen 3+4 ost were weakers than cs1+2
 

CrazyDude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,899
BTW reviews for Sen III are confirmed to be released Oct 15, some content creators have already confirmed that they have the full game and that the review embargo date is the abovementioned one.

As some of them are big Kiseki fans, we will have a pretty good opinion about the localization quality a week before the game releases.
How was the demo?
 

Lozange

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
Sen 3+4 ost were weakers than cs1+2
I'm more talking about Singa's personal progression, since I'm not familiar with CS3/4's ost outside of what's in the demo. (And a lot of what I disliked in the demo wasn't done by Singa anyway lol).
Even just comparing Tokyo Xanadu to Ys VIII, I don't think it's unreasonable to say that there's improvement on display (Iclucian Dance is legit good, fight me!), even if the worst tracks still stand out as being... Different to the rest of the ost. And then apparently there's a lot of good tracks by Singa in Ys IX.
Falcom has bigger musical problems than just "Singa is composing some themes that don't really work". Like all the musicians that have left due to... reasons. Having every track done by the same few people doesn't inspire musical variety, no matter how talented they are, when they're releasing a new game every year.
 

lucancel

Member
Oct 30, 2017
402
It Is sad because their ost were the best out there alongside xbc2 ...
Why did many left falcom jdk? They went somewhere else or was It falcom?
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
It Is sad because their ost were the best out there alongside xbc2 ...
Why did many left falcom jdk? They went somewhere else or was It falcom?
I liked Sora OSTs a lot, Sen OSTs (1 and 2) are good but never felt any song was really strong.

Xc1 and Xc2 have some of the best JRPG (or videogame) OSTs ever, so I don't think we should compare Kiseki OSTs to the work of Yasonuri Mitsuda and ACE+ (amongst others) that are top in the industry.
 

Niks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
904
BTW reviews for Sen III are confirmed to be released Oct 15, some content creators have already confirmed that they have the full game and that the review embargo date is the abovementioned one.

As some of them are big Kiseki fans, we will have a pretty good opinion about the localization quality a week before the game releases.

Will be interesting to see if any reviewers mention "the need" to play crossbell or liberl arcs, to "fully" enjoy the game.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
Or even the previous Cold Steel games. Remember, Cold Steel III features a handful of new leads and is therefore a good jump-in point. /s
Even if I agree that III is not the place to start... I can't blame NISA or Falcom at all for saying such things.

I mean, try to imagine being the marketing whoever of a company that is trying to sell a game that is the 8th entry in a highly-interconnected series. Not only you don't get anything when the older entries sell copies (NISA only gets money when the Ps3/Vita versions of CSI and II sell games in Europe) but you're "scaring" potential buyers as they will think that a huge time investment is needed to play the game in optimal conditions (which is totally true, you'll need hundreds of hours).

What I mean is, new users in the playerbase is a good thing, who knows, maybe a decent % will play the entire series if they like CS III, and is a better option than the games only selling to the already consolidated fanbase. I know that "CS III is the place to start" is not true at all, but as someone who played CS I on PC as his first Kiseki game, I can understand people that don't feel like playing 5 PSX-looking games and 2 PsVita-looking games and will give a chance to III only because it looks nicer. I never thought I'd play Sora when the games were released, and now the Trilogy are some of my favorite games ever.
 

Erpy

Member
May 31, 2018
826
The difference is that Cold Steel I WAS specifically designed as a relatively safe jump-in point, whereas Cold Steel III was decidedly not.

I don't think Falcom ever marketted CSIII as a starting point since they made money when people bought the first two games and even made those PS4 ports of CSI and CSII in order to make it easier for PS4-owners to at least start at the beginning of the arc.

It's not that I don't get WHY NISA would pretend there to be no need to play the other games first, I just think shame would dictate them to at least be somewhat evasive about it instead of...you know...just lie about it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
299
Even if I agree that III is not the place to start... I can't blame NISA or Falcom at all for saying such things.

I mean, try to imagine being the marketing whoever of a company that is trying to sell a game that is the 8th entry in a highly-interconnected series. Not only you don't get anything when the older entries sell copies (NISA only gets money when the Ps3/Vita versions of CSI and II sell games in Europe) but you're "scaring" potential buyers as they will think that a huge time investment is needed to play the game in optimal conditions (which is totally true, you'll need hundreds of hours).

What I mean is, new users in the playerbase is a good thing, who knows, maybe a decent % will play the entire series if they like CS III, and is a better option than the games only selling to the already consolidated fanbase. I know that "CS III is the place to start" is not true at all, but as someone who played CS I on PC as his first Kiseki game, I can understand people that don't feel like playing 5 PSX-looking games and 2 PsVita-looking games and will give a chance to III only because it looks nicer. I never thought I'd play Sora when the games were released, and now the Trilogy are some of my favorite games ever.
Don't forget of those 5 older games 2 of them aren't even available in English. It really is a super weird situation to navigate for NISA. They obviously want to grow the series here and that means marketing CS3, at least a bit, as a good jumping on point for people even though it's absolutely not. Even for people who are already into the series CS3 is a somewhat difficult sell because it incorporates so many characters from the series that isn't out here. I don't envy them!
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
Don't forget of those 5 older games 2 of them aren't even available in English. It really is a super weird situation to navigate for NISA. They obviously want to grow the series here and that means marketing CS3, at least a bit, as a good jumping on point for people even though it's absolutely not. Even for people who are already into the series CS3 is a somewhat difficult sell because it incorporates so many characters from the series that isn't out here. I don't envy them!
Yep it's a complicated situation for them. I think we should be grateful that they have decided to work on Kiseki, we don't know if losing Falcom games was really the reason XSEED "changed" recently or how they would have faced CS III localization. I personally am grateful both to them and the Geofront team (and the original translators of course), as I love kiseki and even if topping what XSEED did with the series seems hard I really want to play all the games in english even if this means not having the same crazy quality localization.

It's not that I don't get WHY NISA would pretend there to be no need to play the other games first, I just think shame would dictate them to at least be somewhat evasive about it instead of...you know...just lie about it.
I know, but as the kind of people that will be interested in the game will easily find that the two first games were released this year on the same system, I don't think the misleading marketing will have any harmful effect to the games, if something it will increase the fanbase. And tbh there's hardly an optimal solution to the problem. Being evasive always look like PR BS so it's not really a better option in this case IMO.
 
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atlans89

Member
Oct 25, 2017
226
Kondo expected newer game will spark interest to play older games. It may work for some, or not. It's a wishful thinking after all. Tbh, I don't want to force playing everything in order as a way to gatekeep new players from being interested in Falcom games.
 
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Korigama

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,989
I've actually been quite surprised by how extensive NISA's merchandising efforts for CS III have been (not a compliment in any way, simply an observation).
Fine IMO. Translation feels good and the only error I spotted was a craft that had some wrong description text. Played in japanese though, I don't know how the english voices are. The new battle UI feels fast and responsive, and load times from field to battle are non-existent.
The English voice acting (which was all I used) was equivalent to the previous games, a non-issue. There were occasional typos/grammatical errors in the summary/lore segments accessible from the main menu.
I liked Sora OSTs a lot, Sen OSTs (1 and 2) are good but never felt any song was really strong.

Xc1 and Xc2 have some of the best JRPG (or videogame) OSTs ever, so I don't think we should compare Kiseki OSTs to the work of Yasonuri Mitsuda and ACE+ (amongst others) that are top in the industry.
Personally, I consider Cold Steel I and II OSTs superior to what Sky had (Zero and Ao also being better), not that I dislike Sky's music. Couldn't disagree more with feeling that no song was ever strong.

Xenoblade 1 very much had an exceptional soundtrack, yet I also don't consider it to be in some untouchable JRPG music realm beyond the best that Trails has to offer. Haven't played Xenoblade 2 or bothered listening to any of its soundtrack.
Don't forget of those 5 older games 2 of them aren't even available in English. It really is a super weird situation to navigate for NISA. They obviously want to grow the series here and that means marketing CS3, at least a bit, as a good jumping on point for people even though it's absolutely not. Even for people who are already into the series CS3 is a somewhat difficult sell because it incorporates so many characters from the series that isn't out here. I don't envy them!
Falcom's continued insistence upon not letting localization partners touch their games until they launch in Japan is yet another reason why I can't really take their desire to grow in the West seriously. There's nothing normal about turnarounds this lengthy for overseas releases of JRPGs in today's market, and the amount of work that goes into preparing an English release of a Trails game is all the more reason why it makes no sense not to have the teams entrusted to their localizations be involved earlier. I'm not particularly convinced that we'll even see CS IV before early 2021, and that was with CS II under XSeed being less than a year after CS I.
 
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Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
There were occasional typos/grammatical errors in the summary/lore segments accessible from the main menu.
Didn't read any of the extra material as I've played all the previous localized games, but it's a shame tbh.

Haven't played Xenoblade 2 or bothered listening to any of its soundtrack.
I strongly recommend playing the game, not only I think is one of the best recent JRPGs, but it has the best recent OST.

I'm not particularly convinced that we'll even see CS IV before early 2021, and that was with CS II under XSeed being less than a year after CS I.
Any specific reason to this? NISA has more resources than XSeed no doubt, work on CS III has already been finished as review copies have been already delivered (unless they launch a day 1 patch correcting some things) and there's a high chance the translation team has been working on the script for a while.
 

Korigama

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,989
Didn't read any of the extra material as I've played all the previous localized games, but it's a shame tbh.
Indeed. It's largely minor, but it's not something that should've been the case for a professionally-localized product all the same.
I strongly recommend playing the game, not only I think is one of the best recent JRPGs, but it has the best recent OST.
I've been more interested in it compared to Xenoblade X (of which only the OST was of interest to me), so it's likely that I'll pick it up once I have a Switch.
Any specific reason to this? NISA has more resources than XSeed no doubt, work on CS III has already been finished as review copies have been already delivered (unless they launch a day 1 patch correcting some things) and there's a high chance the translation team has been working on the script for a while.
Not much other than lowering my expectations. If I were to be more optimistic, then I could picture late 2020 at the earliest if the transition between work on III and IV happened as quickly as moving from CS I to II.