Kiseki/Trails Community|OT|Familiar faces~, Zemurian places—SPOILERTAGS OR DIE!

CrazyDude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,899
After all, Falcom has always been known for their cutting edge graphics, always chasing the very zenith of modern computer graphics. No idea how this small team keeps pulling of such marvels of photorealism with a complete shoestring budget, you'd reasonable expect that their games would look one or two generations behind modern AAA games.
I just looked it up and they only have 62 employees, I'm surprised they are that small.
 

Naha-

Member
Feb 6, 2019
54
I think I'm at the final Dungeon in Ao no Kiseki...

Man, Pater-Mater death was so depressing. Renne can't catch a break. Also I didn't expect Ian's revelation as the mastermind, like what?
Now I need to prepare for a Boss rush with Arios, Wald, Sigmund, Shirley and Mariabell lol
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
I think I'm at the final Dungeon in Ao no Kiseki...

Man, Pater-Mater death was so depressing. Renne can't catch a break. Also I didn't expect Ian's revelation as the mastermind, like what?
Now I need to prepare for a Boss rush with Arios, Wald, Sigmund, Shirley and Mariabell lol
Good luck. Save your burst orbs.
 

nivorae

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,497
I just looked it up and they only have 62 employees, I'm surprised they are that small.
that's also the largest they have ever been, just two years ago they did not even reach 50 employees.
I think I'm at the final Dungeon in Ao no Kiseki...

Man, Pater-Mater death was so depressing. Renne can't catch a break. Also I didn't expect Ian's revelation as the mastermind, like what?
Now I need to prepare for a Boss rush with Arios, Wald, Sigmund, Shirley and Mariabell lol
you got a whole lot of fun fights ahead of ya
 

Cqef

Member
Oct 27, 2017
158
somewhere in France
Have you considered putting off Cold Steel 3 for a couple of months while you play the past games, instead of resorting to spoil yourself the entire series only to play the latest game on release?
 

Cqef

Member
Oct 27, 2017
158
somewhere in France
I understand how having to catch up to so many long games seems overwhelming and how hard it would be to fit all this gaming time in one's busy schedule, however I'm not entirely sure this series is for you if your only interest is to play the latest game on release all the while having very limited time to play.
 

Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,751
Have you considered putting off Cold Steel 3 for a couple of months while you play the past games, instead of resorting to spoil yourself the entire series only to play the latest game on release?
What? Playing games to enjoy them? Preposterous !
No, I have this list of things I need to cross of. The way you talk you might even think video games are there for you enjoyment.
 

Dougieflesh

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,191
I understand how having to catch up to so many long games seems overwhelming and how hard it would be to fit all this gaming time in one's busy schedule, however I'm not entirely sure this series is for you if your only interest is to play the latest game on release all the while having very limited time to play.
What? I started the series with Cold Steel 1 when it got localized on Vita because I was told that it’s a good point for a beginner. My goal was to play through all the earlier entries this summer because this is now one of my favorite series, but my father was hospitalized. Who are you to gate keep? It’s cool though, don’t even bother responding.
 

Cqef

Member
Oct 27, 2017
158
somewhere in France
What? I started the series with Cold Steel 1 when it got localized on Vita because I was told that it’s a good point for a beginner. My goal was to play through all the earlier entries this summer because this is now one of my favorite series, but my father was hospitalized. Who are you to gate keep? It’s cool though, don’t even bother responding.
Your circumstances and schedule are the only things preventing you to play, not some idiot on a trashy message board. This series expects the players to immerse themselves by investing time into the games, and Cold Steel 3 might just be one of the worst in the series when it comes to relying on previous titles. It is unfortunate for you to have set your sight on such a series when your schedule doesn't allow you to play the games. However, no one is pointing a gun at you to absolutely play Cold Steel 3 on release, so if you're as keen on continuing the series as you say, why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones?
 
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Korigama

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,989
Decided to go with Pafdingo for walkthroughs of Zero/Ao myself. Still a pretty sizable time investment though, as the parts that the chapters are split into for the uploads typically average an hour each.
 

Niks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
904
Yeah, pafdingo is the way to go if you want a more in depth walkthrough

Lady's are condensed, but still, her zero summary is 4 hours long. She still has not finished her Ao summary and I don't think she will be able to finish before CS3...
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
Your circumstances and schedule are the only things preventing you to play, not some idiot on a trashy message board. This series expects the players to immerse themselves by investing time into the games, and Cold Steel 3 might just be one of the worst in the series when it comes to relying on previous titles. It is unfortunate for you to have set your sight on such a series when your schedule doesn't allow you to play the games. However, no one is pointing a gun at you to absolutely play Cold Steel 3 on release, so if you're as keen on continuing the series as you say, why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones?
Dude, I just played SC, the third, Zero, and Ao. It took me ~300 hours, and 3 months to finish those four games. It's not a small time investment, and kind of demanding that he put that much time in before he plays CS3 is unfair.
 

Cqef

Member
Oct 27, 2017
158
somewhere in France
Dude, I just played SC, the third, Zero, and Ao. It took me ~300 hours, and 3 months to finish those four games. It's not a small time investment, and kind of demanding that he put that much time in before he plays CS3 is unfair.
Dude, I don't know how you read but nowhere in any of my posts I have blamed him for not making it to CS3's release, nor did I say that he HAD to or SHOULD make it before CS3 launches, I even said I understood how much of an undertaking it could be to catch up.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
Dude, I don't know how you read but nowhere in any of my posts I have blamed him for not making it to CS3's release, nor did I say that he HAD to or SHOULD make it before CS3 launches, I even said I understood how much of an undertaking it could be to catch up.
I didn't say you blamed him for not making it, but I think language like this:


Your circumstances and schedule are the only things preventing you to play, not some idiot on a trashy message board. This series expects the players to immerse themselves by investing time into the games, and Cold Steel 3 might just be one of the worst in the series when it comes to relying on previous titles. It is unfortunate for you to have set your sight on such a series when your schedule doesn't allow you to play the games. However, no one is pointing a gun at you to absolutely play Cold Steel 3 on release, so if you're as keen on continuing the series as you say, why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones?
I mean, looking at your message, it does kind of come off as you saying that he has to do Sky and Zero/Ao before he plays CS3. If you go back and read what I said, I was responding to the part I bolded, where said he should do those games before CS3. I'm sorry if I misread that, but perhaps you can explain how "why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones" doesn't mean that he should play the older games before CS3?
 

Niks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
904
IMO, Anyone can enjoy the trails series as they see fit.

I played FC, SC, CS1 and CS2. After finishing CS2, I was exited to dive into Crossbell to know what was going on over there before CS3.

But.....
I'm a grown ass adult, and as much as I wanted too, I just did not have the time to play the 3rd, Ao and Zero.

So I watched the summaries, and I'm glad I did.

Now I know who Lloyd, Tio, Randy and the gang are, and what the all important chapter 4 of Ao was about. I also know what happened to Renne and her conclusion with Estelle and Joshua, not to mention Kevin and Ries...

All this is IMO is super important for CS3, so yeah, knowing this FAR outweights actually playing those games. Of course, nothing beats actually playing the games, but watching summaries is a fair and valid manner to get up to speed for CS3.
 

nivorae

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,497
Just do whatever floats your boat if you're interested in the series (any series really). You don't see me complaining that the NPC dialogue is a waste of time and resources due to their sheer size either.
 

Erpy

Member
May 31, 2018
826
IMO, Anyone can enjoy the trails series as they see fit.

I played FC, SC, CS1 and CS2. After finishing CS2, I was exited to dive into Crossbell to know what was going on over there before CS3.

But.....
I'm a grown ass adult, and as much as I wanted too, I just did not have the time to play the 3rd, Ao and Zero.

So I watched the summaries, and I'm glad I did.

Now I know who Lloyd, Tio, Randy and the gang are, and what the all important chapter 4 of Ao was about. I also know what happened to Renne and her conclusion with Estelle and Joshua, not to mention Kevin and Ries...

All this is IMO is super important for CS3, so yeah, knowing this FAR outweights actually playing those games. Of course, nothing beats actually playing the games, but watching summaries is a fair and valid manner to get up to speed for CS3.
Of course, by doing that you essentially mar the experience of 3 games just to improve the experience of 1.
 

Cqef

Member
Oct 27, 2017
158
somewhere in France
I didn't say you blamed him for not making it, but I think language like this:




I mean, looking at your message, it does kind of come off as you saying that he has to do Sky and Zero/Ao before he plays CS3. If you go back and read what I said, I was responding to the part I bolded, where said he should do those games before CS3. I'm sorry if I misread that, but perhaps you can explain how "why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones" doesn't mean that he should play the older games before CS3?
He should play the older games before CS3, that's exactly what I said, I don't see any ambiguity here, nor why I shouldn't say it.
No one coerces him into doing so, just as no one actually coerces him to play CS3 on release either, hence my extremely oh so outlandish and unthinkable advice.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
Even if I understand that summaries are a good way to get the main story details, I don't quite understand why some people are in a hurry to play CS III at launch and how some players thing that playing Zero-Ao or even the Sora games is "too much time" when CS III + CS IV are too really long games, some people even claim that playing both doing every side content should take almost as long as playing the entire series to this point.

In my case I will wait until the Zero edit to play the Crossbell duology, and then play III when IV is close to be released, as I also think that playing III at launch means waiting a few months to continue what most fans describe as "the biggest cliffhanger in the series".
 
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Arcana Wiz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
38
What? I started the series with Cold Steel 1 when it got localized on Vita because I was told that it’s a good point for a beginner. My goal was to play through all the earlier entries this summer because this is now one of my favorite series, but my father was hospitalized. Who are you to gate keep? It’s cool though, don’t even bother responding.
Everyone is free to enjoy a series the way they want, here some videos that i used to recap the events


(She have a TC and Zero playlist and is currently on Ao)
I honestly dont know any good recap of the first game so you still have find it

Its not the best but you can somewhat understand what happened, if you accept my two cents, Cold Steel 3 doesnt finish the arc, its like Cold Steel 1 or Sky 1 that its like the introduction or the first part of a history, Cold Steel 4 at the best scenario will be a late 2020 game, but it have good chances of being a 2021 games. So if you hurry and spoil everything you still wont have a conclusion this year, which can feel frustating.

And I wish you father condition gets better, or in brasilian "desejo melhoras"
 
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Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
Even if I understand that summaries are a good way to get the main story details, I don't quite understand why some people is in a hurry to play CS III at launch and how some players thing that playing Zero-Ao or even the Sora games is "too much time" when CS III + CS IV are too really long games, some people even claim that playing both doing every side content should take almost as long as playing the entire series to this point.

In my case I will wait until the Zero edit to play the Crossbell duology, and then play III when IV is close to be released, as I also think that playing III at launch means waiting a few months to continue what most fans describe as "the biggest cliffhanger in the series".
I'm not saying people shouldn't play Zero and Ao before playing CS3. I think they should. I'm just not going to tell someone that they have to play all 5 earlier games when I just spent 300 hours and 3-4 months playing 4 of them (and it took me ~60 hours to play FC). As for cliffhangers, remember, people who played FC had to wait years to resolve it's cliffhanger. A few months will seem like nothing in comparison.
 

Dragon1893

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,010
Skipping previous games only to play the new one at launch doesn't make sense to me unless it's one of those cases where the new game is great but the old one is a turd, but to each their own.
It's going to take me at least 6 months until I'm done with Zero and play through Azure, if I'm lucky, but I'd rather experience the games myself instead of watching some video.
But like I said, it's a matter of preference.
 

Astraer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
318
So look ahead at the main characters in CS III, are there any standout party members? I kind of had the same go to party in CS I and II when given the choice. I heard Break Orders are stupidly powerful however.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
I'm not saying people shouldn't play Zero and Ao before playing CS3. I think they should. I'm just not going to tell someone that they have to play all 5 earlier games when I just spent 300 hours and 3-4 months playing 4 of them (and it took me ~60 hours to play FC).
This I agree, as I've said before "scaring" the players who want to start with Sen III is not the best way to increase the number of Kiseki fans, my post was aimed to the poster who seems to have played Sora 1-2 and Sen 1-2 and wants to jump directly to Sen 3, if you are already into the series I would advise to complete the other 3 games before Sen 3. The games are looooong and slooooow and most of the fun comes to understand some small details like NPC sidequests that carry from older games.

Either way I hope that Sen III comes to PC sooner than later (I'll play the game on the Ps4), this way we will have a platform with all the games and new fans will be able to experience the full series easily. I also hope the reviews in 5 days are good and the new localization is good enough to make players eager to know the full story, I think that Kiseki is too obscure and underapreciated considering that the story is far far better than what most of bigger JRPG offer.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
This I agree, as I've said before "scaring" the players who want to start with Sen III is not the best way to increase the number of Kiseki fans, my post was aimed to the poster who seems to have played Sora 1-2 and Sen 1-2 and wants to jump directly to Sen 3, if you are already into the series I would advise to complete the other 3 games before Sen 3. The games are looooong and slooooow and most of the fun comes to understand some small details like NPC sidequests that carry from older games.

Either way I hope that Sen III comes to PC sooner than later (I'll play the game on the Ps4), this way we will have a platform with all the games and new fans will be able to experience the full series easily. I also hope the reviews in 5 days are good and the new localization is good enough to make players eager to know the full story, I think that Kiseki is too obscure and underapreciated considering that the story is far far better than what most of bigger JRPG offer.
I guess I can agree with waiting if you've already played 4/7ths of the games. I was arguing that someone who came into the series with CS1 and played both CS1 and 2, and wants to continue with 3, they can. I do agree that playing Zero and Ao will immensely increase their appreciation of CS3, but if they want to want to move directly to CS, they can.

I absolutely hope CS3(and 4) come to the PC, because you're right, it'd be great if fans had a platform to get and play all the games (even if getting Zero and Ao requires a bit of effort, Ao more than Zero). I think you're right that this game is criminally underrated, considering the scope and ambition of the story telling. There's not another company who's trying to tell such an expansive storyline, over multiple games, and I'm glad I picked up on this series. Hopefully, with the psp and vita dead, the series will move to home consoles, and with backwards compatibility becoming the norm, if falcom ports trails 1-3 and zero/ao to the PS4, future fans will be able to play the whole series on the ps5 and 6, when they finalllly finish the series.
 

Lozange

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
Typically, whenever I recommend the release order for playing these games, it's not normally out of a sense of "you won't understand what's going on", Because in all but extreme cases, that's false. It's easy to just ignore words you don't understand, and as long as you start at the beginning of an arc, you'll at the very least understand that arc's story. There'll be references you miss, some characters you might not be as emotionally invested in, but if your goal is to just play that arc, a bit more investment isn't worth hundreds of hours of JRPG.
...Even if ____ from a previous trails game shows up at some point and goes "WOW THIS REMINDS ME OF WHEN I ____ IN THE LOCATION ____", thus making you feel very alienated.

Really the real reasons to care are that
A) all the Trails games (I've played) are good, and I'd argue the best game isn't *that* much better than the worst one
B) Once you're in to Trails (read: reached the end of a game and realised that all the build up is in fact going somewhere), there's not much reason to not go in release order as much as possible.
and
C) Previous games will suffer more if you've gotten used to the QoL changes of future games, and if you've already been spoiled on the general plot beats.

If someone wants to start with CS3? Go ahead, why not. They should at least play CS1 and CS2, and ideally they should play Sky too, and if they hate fun they'll wait along with me for the Crossbell fantranslations to be in a good state. And I'll let them know this so that they can make an informed decision. But hey, I don't care. They'll realise their mistake later figure out what they want to do eventually. They can't say they weren't informed. And if they have fun, that's good!
 

SenseiX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
934
Why did Arios lie about killing Guy? The murder weapon was a gun according to Nielsen and I'm half sure Arios doesn't use guns. I'm 90% sure Dudley is on Crois's payroll from what I've seen so there's a good chance it's him.
 
Oct 27, 2017
299
Your circumstances and schedule are the only things preventing you to play, not some idiot on a trashy message board. This series expects the players to immerse themselves by investing time into the games, and Cold Steel 3 might just be one of the worst in the series when it comes to relying on previous titles. It is unfortunate for you to have set your sight on such a series when your schedule doesn't allow you to play the games. However, no one is pointing a gun at you to absolutely play Cold Steel 3 on release, so if you're as keen on continuing the series as you say, why not use the time you initially made around CS3's release to actually play some of the older ones?
This is top 5 wild ass Kiseki fan posts.
 

hans_castorp

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,082
I can understand skipping older games when they have aged badly or aren't that good to begin with.
But skipping Ao or The 3rd which are arguably the pinnacle of the series, sounds like a terrible idea.
Don't be in such a rush to play the new entries, enjoy the journey and take your time. The Crossbell games aren't that long to begin with if you don't care about optional NPC dialogue.
 

Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,751
Dude, I just played SC, the third, Zero, and Ao. It took me ~300 hours, and 3 months to finish those four games. It's not a small time investment, and kind of demanding that he put that much time in before he plays CS3 is unfair.
How is telling people that you get more fun by spending those 300 hours (which are also fun if you like this series) before playing CS3 unfair?
I'll concede the point that anyone asking for videos summaries in order to play the 8th game of a series as their first game is already well aware of what they are doing, but this is an OT of fans of the series, and it's normal that you'll get some comments about how your choice might not be very wise.
If I go to a message board for pizza enthusiasts, and ask for the best recipe for Pineapple Pizza, I could hardly act surprised that some people on said site would question the life choices that led me to that point. It comes with the territory
 
Oct 27, 2017
299
I'll concede the point that anyone asking for videos summaries in order to play the 8th game of a series as their first game
Where are you getting this, no one said that? That poster said they started with Cold Steel 1. It only follows that they'd be more excited to jump into the sequel to the sub-series that they started with and are most invested in. Yes, even if they would get more out of it by waiting for what would probably be months and spending a lot of time going through the rest of the series first.
 

Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,751
Where are you getting this, no one said that? That poster said they started with Cold Steel 1. It only follows that they'd be more excited to jump into the sequel to the sub-series that they started with and are most invested in. Yes, even if they would get more out of it by waiting for what would probably be months and spending a lot of time going through the rest of the series first.
Oh, sorry, totally missed that. Still, my point mostly stands. CS3 and CS4 to a larger extend (from what I gather from people that played it) , really need the Sky and Crossbell games, and wanting to skip 5 games, consisting of two entire arcs, just for one game, will get comments on how it might not be super wise to do that. Because, it's not.
That's not unfair, it's just pointing out what seems obvious to fans of the series
 

Dougieflesh

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,191
Everyone is free to enjoy a series the way they want, here some videos that i used to recap the events


(She have a TC and Zero playlist and is currently on Ao)
I honestly dont know any good recap of the first game so you still have find it

Its not the best but you can somewhat understand what happened, if you accept my two cents, Cold Steel 3 doesnt finish the arc, its like Cold Steel 1 or Sky 1 that its like the introduction or the first part of a history, Cold Steel 4 at the best scenario will be a late 2020 game, but it have good chances of being a 2021 games. So if you hurry and spoil everything you still wont have a conclusion this year, which can feel frustating.

And I wish you father condition gets better, or in brasilian "desejo melhoras"
Thanks for the videos, and thank you Arcana Wiz for the well wishes to my Father. I think people are misunderstanding my situation a little. I beat CS1-2 and had plans to do the whole series over the summer like I previously stated so that I could retain all the info. I got about 20 hours into the first Trails in the Sky game until my gameplay time got cut short for the entire summer until like two weeks ago. CS3 is my most anticipated game of the Fall, i'm not just jumping into the latest game.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
Oh, sorry, totally missed that. Still, my point mostly stands. CS3 and CS4 to a larger extend (from what I gather from people that played it) , really need the Sky and Crossbell games, and wanting to skip 5 games, consisting of two entire arcs, just for one game, will get comments on how it might not be super wise to do that. Because, it's not.
That's not unfair, it's just pointing out what seems obvious to fans of the series
See, the thing is, I would never tell someone to watch videos instead of playing the games. I think people should play Zero and Ao before CS3. But I'm also not going to tell someone who's excited to play CS3 and wants to watch video summaries of Zero and Ao that he has to spend 350+ hours playing the 5 previous games they missed. They said they want to play CS3 when it releases in less than 2 week, so I'm going to help them do what they've said they're comfortable with, watching video summaries. And I agree, CS3 is *NOT* the place to start playing, no matter what NSIA says. But that's they're on fault for taking over the license of a series that was half published by another company. I don't feel much sympathy for them.
 

Chaosblade

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,077
Kind of related to the current discussion, I'm really curious to see how reviews for CS3 turn out. Because I fully anticipate that only a handful of reviewers will have actually played both of the two prior Cold Steel games, and nearly none of them will have played the entire series. Both SC and CS2 got some middling reviews from people that hadn't played the first games IIRC, and CS3 seems like it's going to leave even more people feeling even more lost.

It would be kind of funny if NISA stresses to reviewers that they should have a good understanding of the series going in and possibly provide some resources or recommendations for that, but does the exact opposite for their customers.
 

Korigama

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,989
I wish I would bother listening to gaming journalist reviews for any JRPGs, Trails or otherwise (not that it's the only genre where I distrust their opinions). Pretty much a given that most will be going in blind, either way.
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
8,498
Barcelona
Kind of related to the current discussion, I'm really curious to see how reviews for CS3 turn out. Because I fully anticipate that only a handful of reviewers will have actually played both of the two prior Cold Steel games, and nearly none of them will have played the entire series. Both SC and CS2 got some middling reviews from people that hadn't played the first games IIRC, and CS3 seems like it's going to leave even more people feeling even more lost.

It would be kind of funny if NISA stresses to reviewers that they should have a good understanding of the series going in and possibly provide some resources or recommendations for that, but does the exact opposite for their customers.
I don't expect that many reviews, considering that the game is long and not that popular. I also expect most of the reviewers playing half the game or so and doing a vague review just to publish it on time.

As some of the prominent Falcom english Youtubers or reddit posters have already confirmed that have received codes or even completed the game, I think that this will be enough for me, but I agree that even if reviews from the big websites will be kind of useless for this game (more than usual I mean) they will influence some potential buyers, so let's hope the reviews are positive.
 

Niks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
904
I kinda expect that NISA kindly asked reviewers to remind readers that CS3 is a good place to start....but yeah cant see that happening.



On other news, I have this song on repeat constantly... send help

 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,871
While I'd imagine NISA would want to, she's a Full Timer at Nexon now, probably making far more money than she ever did at XSEED or on-contract for NISA.
Oh, well, good for her, then. I'm happy she's got a good job, and while I'd love to see her help on CS4, that's way more important.

(as an aside, I thought nexon was going out of business?)